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London buses carry "Praise Allah"?

Just weeks after Christian slogans were banned on buses.

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Our civilization teaches tolerance

It didn't teach much tolerance when it intolerated Christian slogans on London buses a few weeks ago.

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It didn't teach much tolerance when it intolerated Christian slogans on London buses a few weeks ago.

You keep saying christian slogans in a generic sense. What exactly was banned? I mean anti gay messages on public property isnt exactly acceptable in the 21st century is it? Are you sure it was ALL christian slogans which were banned, and i think more to the point are you sure there wasnt an attempt to strike a balance with those christians who wanted to print those slogans?

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You keep saying christian slogans in a generic sense. What exactly was banned? I mean anti gay messages on public property isnt exactly acceptable in the 21st century is it? Are you sure it was ALL christian slogans which were banned, and i think more to the point are you sure there wasnt an attempt to strike a balance with those christians who wanted to print those slogans?

Christians believe homosexuality is wrong, no matter what century it is.

The Mohammedans can get away with burning poppies and abusing British soldiers yet Christians in a Christian country aren't allowed to practice their religion by denouncing the sinful abhorrence of homosexuality because it might "offend" the thin-skinned PC Brigade.

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Christians believe homosexuality is wrong, no matter what century it is.

The Mohammedans can get away with burning poppies and abusing British soldiers yet Christians in a Christian country aren't allowed to practice their religion by denouncing the sinful abhorrence of homosexuality because it might "offend" the thin-skinned PC Brigade.

I understand christians believe homosexuality is wrong. Ironically it is just the muslims who agree with them.

So based on your answer , yes the christians wanted offensive slogans while the muslims just wanted praise allah. .....so who is the savage here?

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I understand christians believe homosexuality is wrong. Ironically it is just the muslims who agree with them.

So based on your answer , yes the christians wanted offensive slogans while the muslims just wanted praise allah. .....so who is the savage here?

I find Mohammedan slogans on British buses to be offensive. And Mohammedan anti-gay slogans would be perfectly allowed on British buses because, as Mohammedans, they can say and do what they like, unlike Christians, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs etc. It's one rule for the Mohammedans and another for everybody else.

Anyway, just because somebody finds something "offensive" doesn't mean they're right.

Edited by Black Monk
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I find Muslim slogans on British buses to be offensive. And Mohammedan anti-gay slogans on buses would be perfectly allowed on British buses because, as Mohammedans, they can say and do what they like, unlike Christians, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs etc.

Anyway, just because somebody finds something "offensive" doesn't mean they're right.

The fact that you're racist is pretty well just your problem. The fact that you're convinced the Muslims would be granted the right to be openly bigoted to the gay population is an argument youve crafted , executed and lost within your own mind. Stop being angry about fictional scenarios.

No just because someone finds something offensive doesnt mean theyre right. Hence the reason Christians cant go around placing anti gay slogans wherever they want.

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LOL you are absolutely delusional. Your responses are proof perfect that the military industrial complex's fear mongering and programming have worked.

I only rely on the MIC for a paycheck and that’s it. I use my eyes and my intellect in studying religion and history to be aware and understand the situation. Something that you have proved time and time again to be lacking in. You’re a perfect shill for Islam.

The facts are that toddlers killed more Americans than islamic terrorists last year.

That’s really non-sequitur. That’s kind of disingenuous don’t you think and crass on your part. What about all the people killed by Islamic terrorists? Or don’t those that are not Americans count? I’m only considering San Berdoo, so you’re telling us that toddlers killed more than 14 people in this country last year, I’d first have to ask how they did that? I am not aware of very many toddlers bent on world domination.

It is clear that YOU have already SUBMITTED to the terrorists by allowing them to dominate your way of life,

Really? I believe I have stood up to it. That is clear. I refuse to let it control my life. Now I admit that I am fascinated by it; that is why I study it. Because I call it out doesn’t mean I am cowering to it. By treating it lightly as if it doesn’t exist, you are the one submitting to it. I don’t expect you to understand that.

by allowing them to alter the very meaning of what it is to be an American.

You are reaching aren’t you? Do you not understand what is going on? You act as if you don’t. Ok, you got me. In your mind, what is the meaning of what it is to be an American?

We are not meant to live in fear and hate and the evidence conclusively shows that the response GREATLY outweighs the threat.

The response never outweighs the threat. The threat will always be there. Being American doesn’t mean to ignore the threat. We just can’t ignore it and hope it goes away. Doing so is living in fear. Americans stand up to the fear and hate. Americans call the threat for what it is. That is what we do!

This is the reality we live in , the playbook was layed out long before you or I were alive:

Yes, it is the reality we live in, when are you going to wake up? The playbook was put into motion about 1400 years ago.

Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger." - Hermann Goering 1946

You’ll pull out any excuse not to accept what is transpiring before your nose. The point of history is to learn from it and not make the same mistakes, of which the very mistakes you are making. Nazi Germany invented enemies. With Islam, we don’t have to invent them. Instead of paying attention the Nazi history, perhaps you should pay attention to Islamic history.

As for the MSM siding with Obama , July 2nd 2013 the law against the US Government using propaganda on its own people was repealed. They're all on the same team , democrats - republicans - "journalists"-politicians, theyre all owned by the same people.

The Republicans on your list are RINOs – the Establishment. They are all owned by Soros. No doubt the government uses propaganda against the people. It’s clear Obama tries his best. But there are two sides to this. While you are so worried about propaganda coming from the government, centuries old techniques are being used against this nation (primarily Europe for now).

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Hahahaha my god youre a hoot, I have met some quirky extreme individuals in my time.. but you take the cake. You should start asking money for this comedy you keep lavishing us with.

You are a blind idiot aren’t you?

Basmalla is derived from Bismillah, which simply means 'In Name of G*d..' you deluded, fearful, hateful human being.

That’s not all Basmalla means. It usually also includes the phase “Allah the merciful”. It usually refers to the first non numbered ayah in the majority of surahs. It is sort of a short prayer to invoke the blessings of Allah. You could have just stated that Bismallah means in the name of GOD. But you had to go on and profess your ignorance and spew your hatred. Who’s deluded?

I truely hope some day you will see the error, self defeat in your state of fear, hate.

Well, I certainly hope you will see the error of your beliefs. Where do I express a state of fear and hate? I don’t. Because I speak out, because I am critical of the faith is not an indication of fear and hate. I had hoped you would have figured that out by now?? Because you haven’t is an indication that you only seek to hate and fear. You’re afraid that I am right.

It might be a Muslim saving your life, caring for you when no one else does (as has happened with mirror images of your train of thought; ex Syria / ISIS militants treated in European hospitals), or simply a moment of spiritual clarity send by Almighty G*d..

Talk about delusional. What does this have to do with anything?

“The Messenger of Allah said that Jesus was handed by his mother Mary over to a school in order that he might be taught. [The teacher] said to him: ‘Write “Bism (In the name of)”.’ And Jesus said to him: ‘What is “Bism”?’ The teacher said: ‘I do not know.’ Jesus said: ‘The “Ba” is Baha’u'llah (the glory of Allah), the “Sin” is His Sana’ (radiance), and the “Mim” is His Mamlakah (sovereignty).”

This is from the Hadiths and this is where the concept of “Mercy” comes from. So WTF?? You go through this attack only to end up supporting what I said. You are just a hatemonger.

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I only rely on the MIC for a paycheck and that's it. I use my eyes and my intellect in studying religion and history to be aware and understand the situation. Something that you have proved time and time again to be lacking in. You're a perfect shill for Islam.

That's really non-sequitur. That's kind of disingenuous don't you think and crass on your part. What about all the people killed by Islamic terrorists? Or don't those that are not Americans count? I'm only considering San Berdoo, so you're telling us that toddlers killed more than 14 people in this country last year, I'd first have to ask how they did that? I am not aware of very many toddlers bent on world domination.

Facts are not on your side : http://www.snopes.co...ans-terrorists/

Really? I believe I have stood up to it. That is clear. I refuse to let it control my life. Now I admit that I am fascinated by it; that is why I study it. Because I call it out doesn't mean I am cowering to it. By treating it lightly as if it doesn't exist, you are the one submitting to it. I don't expect you to understand that.

Of course you think you're "standing up to " islam. You think hate ignorance and violence make you strong. Its kinda become the American way thanks to post 9/11 programming - especially with those who make their living via the MIC.

The response never outweighs the threat. The threat will always be there. Being American doesn't mean to ignore the threat. We just can't ignore it and hope it goes away. Doing so is living in fear. Americans stand up to the fear and hate. Americans call the threat for what it is. That is what we do!

No the people who make money off of our fear call the shots. They're also coincidentally the ones who are inventing and arming these supposed enemies. Im sure youve seen the pics of Mccain hanging out with the ISIS leaders and Turkey buying oil from ISIS. Its a giant scam so they can take money from the American people - and whomever else they can I suppose.

You'll pull out any excuse not to accept what is transpiring before your nose. The point of history is to learn from it and not make the same mistakes, of which the very mistakes you are making. Nazi Germany invented enemies. With Islam, we don't have to invent them. Instead of paying attention the Nazi history, perhaps you should pay attention to Islamic history.

Ill refer you back to Mccain with ISIS and the toddlers killing more americans than terrorists point I made above. Recognizing a threat for what it is , minor, does not mean I dont know my history, actually quite the opposite.

The Republicans on your list are RINOs – the Establishment. They are all owned by Soros. No doubt the government uses propaganda against the people. It's clear Obama tries his best. But there are two sides to this. While you are so worried about propaganda coming from the government, centuries old techniques are being used against this nation (primarily Europe for now).

I dont even know what to make of this last post. You seem to be saying that there is a "true" republican savior out there somewhere so dont worry about government propaganda because of something some islamic did somewhere in europe?

Edited by Farmer77
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After the demonstration, how many go back home and write about the corruptness of the non-believer and the superiority of Sharia law? How many head back out looking for Western women to prey on? How many continue plotting the next terrorist attack?

You make that claim, you back it up. Or just admit you're prejudiced about a massive varied group based on the actions of a few.

"Islam means peace" – No it doesn't. It really means 'Submission" and I suppose that that is a form of peace.

The original root has a number of meanings including both peace and submission. And you claim others are disingenuous...

"Terrorism has no religion" – That's funny since ISIS follows in the footsteps of Mohammed.

Mohammed and the Qur'an expressly forbid the use of violence against civilians. To claim ISIS follow his example is either ignorant or deliberately dishonest.

"Islam respects other faiths" – So that's why Mohammed destroyed all the pagan idols in the Kaaba. Islam only tolerates (as best as it can) a few religions provided they bend to Islamic sensibilities. It is not tolerant of them.

Agreed. That was Mohammad's response to the breaking of a treaty by the tribe who previously controlled Mecca. He also gave polytheists a grace period to complete their pilgrimages without threat. Even after that was up, they were to be escorted to a place of safety if they asked for it. That's quite tolerant by 7th century standards.

I would be interested to know which parts of the Qur'an you think condone terrorism or other actions of extremists. The most common ones are usually misquoted or out of context.

You claim to be educated on early Islam and Islamic scripture. Your arguments show either that is a lie, you are deliberately editing it to serve an agenda or, hopefully, you just misunderstood it and are willing to learn. I have a feeling we can rule one of those out in this thread.

Christians believe homosexuality is wrong, no matter what century it is.

The Mohammedans can get away with burning poppies and abusing British soldiers yet Christians in a Christian country aren't allowed to practice their religion by denouncing the sinful abhorrence of homosexuality because it might "offend" the thin-skinned PC Brigade.

I find it offensive that you think you can speak for all Christians. Please point me to the verses where Christ condemns homosexuality. And yes I want words recorded as spoken by Christ. i.e. the one CHRISTians follow. Perhaps you should rename yourselves Biblicans. But that sounds like you work in a library.

I find Mohammedan slogans on British buses to be offensive. And Mohammedan anti-gay slogans would be perfectly allowed on British buses because, as Mohammedans, they can say and do what they like, unlike Christians, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs etc. It's one rule for the Mohammedans and another for everybody else.

Anyway, just because somebody finds something "offensive" doesn't mean they're right.

I find your claim to speak for all Christians and refusal to use the words Islam or Muslim offensive but apparently I can't get you banned from talking. We all have little disappointments in life. I will however, refer to you as a Biblican from now.

Edited by Setton
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Didn't Trump actually say this 'banning Muslims' thing about the un-vetted refugees coming from Syria/Iraq (because we don't know who could be ISIS operatives)? Honestly, I can't see Trump wanting to ban the King of Jordan or Mayor Kahn...that would be stupid/silly even for Mr Trump.

I agree. The issue is that these countries where Muslims are migrating from (Syria, Jordan, Egypt) etc do not have as advanced record keeping as the West does. There is no possible way to vet people entering our country. We have an obligation first and foremost to protect our citizens. However, should we be able to come up with a system of vetting these refugees, we must admit them, only if temporarily. I wish Trump would articulate it better but this is his position. He has said it more than once, we cannot admit people we know little about.

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I agree. The issue is that these countries where Muslims are migrating from (Syria, Jordan, Egypt) etc do not have as advanced record keeping as the West does. There is no possible way to vet people entering our country. We have an obligation first and foremost to protect our citizens. However, should we be able to come up with a system of vetting these refugees, we must admit them, only if temporarily. I wish Trump would articulate it better but this is his position. He has said it more than once, we cannot admit people we know little about.

There is a system in place, and its pretty dang comprehensive : https://www.whitehou...y-united-states Definitely easier for a potential terrorist to just get a VISA than to enter through the refugee vetting process.

The real problem with banning muslims from entering is that in their religion it is permitted to lie to unbelievers to achieve their goals soooo theyd simply have to say , no im not muslim.

Edited by Farmer77
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The real problem with banning muslims from entering is that in their religion it is permitted to lie to unbelievers to achieve their goals soooo theyd simply have to say , no im not muslim.

re underlined -

wow ---you're admitting that....that touches on the root of the problem regarding the West and Islam -

so in theory Sadiq Khan could be pretending to be supportive of British society and wanting to represent everyone - but his actual goal could be something different -

like promoting Islam at the higher levels of government -??

:P

.

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re underlined -

wow ---you're admitting that....that touches on the root of the problem regarding the West and Islam -

so in theory Sadiq Khan could be pretending to be supportive of British society and wanting to represent everyone - but his actual goal could be something different -

like promoting Islam at the higher levels of government -??

:P

.

Absolutely ....although im not sure why you're saying im "admitting that". Im not muslim nor am i an apologist for them my apologies if I have given that impression.

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Absolutely ....although im not sure why you're saying im "admitting that". Im not muslim nor am i an apologist for them my apologies if I have given that impression.

ok ---

edit - just popped back to look at your posts again and you have given that impression - IMO - that's why I reacted like I did --

.

Edited by bee
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Facts are not on your side : 
http://www.snopes.co...ans-terrorists/

I think you need to review your facts in the future.  Snopes even confirms 
that only 2 people were killed by toddlers while 19 people were killed by terrorists.  The thing is, is that more will die at the hands of Islamic terrorists.  Also, those killed by toddlers are more than likely due to accident.  I am not that aware of that many people that are accidently killed by terrorists.


Of course you think you're "standing up to " islam. You think hate 
ignorance and violence make you strong. Its kinda become the American 
way thanks to post 9/11 programming - especially with those who make 
their living via the MIC.

No, I don’t think hate, ignorance, and violence makes me strong.  I know 
that awareness, vigilance, and understanding does.  9/11 was a serious dose of reprogramming.  It took us out of the Cold War mentality.  At least it should have.  Some people like you are still stuck there.  You don’t realize that as times change so do new threats appear.  You just didn’t understand Eisenhower’s message that the MIC *IS* an integral part of the American way.


No the people who make money off of our fear call the shots. They're 
also coincidentally the ones who are inventing and arming these supposed 
enemies.

TPTB are the ones that call the shots.  Is everyone on the take?  Probably not.  But to call this Islamic threat as something totally made up is the ultimate of ignorance.  You just ignore 1400 years of history on a feeling of yours?  If you don’t think this is serious, I’d hate to see what you would really call serious.


Im sure youve seen the pics of Mccain hanging out with the ISIS leaders 
and Turkey buying oil from ISIS. Its a giant scam so they can take money 
from the American people - and whomever else they can I suppose.


No, I have not seen those pictures.  Do you have a link?  It's true that ISIS gets the oil out through Turkey's Black Market but the US doesn't buy oil that way.  40% comes from Canada then it drops significantly to 11% from Saudi Arabia.  Then from Mexico and Venezuela.


Ill refer you back to Mccain with ISIS and the toddlers killing more 
americans than terrorists point I made above. Recognizing a threat for 
what it is , minor, does not mean I dont know my history, actually quite 
the opposite.


Your data about toddlers and McCain is nonsensical.  The Quraysh also took the threat lightly.  If you know your history as you claim, you have not proved it.  What is your proof that Islam is not the threat it has been for 1400 years?


I dont even know what to make of this last post. You seem to be saying 
that there is a "true" republican savior out there somewhere so dont 
worry about government propaganda because of something some islamic did 
somewhere in europe?


I was just trying to make sense of your last paragraph.  You seem to be saying that the entire government is corrupt and misleads the people.  I can assure you that is not the case.  Many in the government are loyal to this nation and you'll find them in the MIC.  The solution to our problem is good Conservative leadership.  Not just one person but it will start with just one and that will allow others to step forward without worry about repercussions from the Left.  The only caveat will be if this leadership will be truely Conservative or corrupt?  Now, Besides and beyond all of that, there is a greater and external threat.  It too is ideological.  But where good leadership can control Progressivism, it will take great vigilance to control Islam.  That means every Muslim is on the hook.  That is not out of fear or hate, but forcing responsibility where it belongs.

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18 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

 

 

I think you need to review your facts in the future.  Snopes even confirms 

that only 2 people were killed by toddlers while 19 people were killed by terrorists.  The thing is, is that more will die at the hands of Islamic terrorists.  Also, those killed by toddlers are more than likely due to accident.  I am not that aware of that many people that are accidently killed by terrorists.

 

Reread the link thats 21 people killed by toddlers NOT 2 

No, I don’t think hate, ignorance, and violence makes me strong.  I know 

that awareness, vigilance, and understanding does.  9/11 was a serious dose of reprogramming.  It took us out of the Cold War mentality.  At least it should have.  Some people like you are still stuck there.  You don’t realize that as times change so do new threats appear.  You just didn’t understand Eisenhower’s message that the MIC *IS* an integral part of the American way.

No you seem to be the only human on earth who doesnt think Eisenhowers message was a warning. 

 

TPTB are the ones that call the shots.  Is everyone on the take?  Probably not.  But to call this Islamic threat as something totally made up is the ultimate of ignorance.  You just ignore 1400 years of history on a feeling of yours?  If you don’t think this is serious, I’d hate to see what you would really call serious.

Im not calling the islamic threat totally made up.Sure there are islamic terrorists, as you point out there have been for a thousand years. Im calling ISIS made up , im calling this panic and fear the media is feeding us made up. Im calling the war on terror made up. 

No, I have not seen those pictures.  Do you have a link?  It's true that ISIS gets the oil out through Turkey's Black Market but the US doesn't buy oil that way.  40% comes from Canada then it drops significantly to 11% from Saudi Arabia.  Then from Mexico and Venezuela.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/did-john-mccain-meet-with-abu-bakral-baghdadi-the-alleged-head-of-the-islamic-state-isis-isil-daesh/5498177

Your data about toddlers and McCain is nonsensical.  The Quraysh also took the threat lightly.  If you know your history as you claim, you have not proved it.  What is your proof that Islam is not the threat it has been for 1400 years?

My claim is that Islam is exactly the same threat it has been for 1400 years! Thats what ive been saying all along. For 200 of those years this nation did not need to be a warrior nation because of islam. Only when the cold war waned and the MIC needed a new enemy did Islamic terrorism become the panic that it is today. That could be coincidence but I've seen and been involved with too much to believe that. 

I was just trying to make sense of your last paragraph.  You seem to be saying that the entire government is corrupt and misleads the people.  I can assure you that is not the case.  Many in the government are loyal to this nation and you'll find them in the MIC.  The solution to our problem is good Conservative leadership.  Not just one person but it will start with just one and that will allow others to step forward without worry about repercussions from the Left.  The only caveat will be if this leadership will be truely Conservative or corrupt?  Now, Besides and beyond all of that, there is a greater and external threat.  It too is ideological.  But where good leadership can control Progressivism, it will take great vigilance to control Islam.  That means every Muslim is on the hook.  That is not out of fear or hate, but forcing responsibility where it belongs.

 

Edited by Farmer77
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You make that claim, you back it up. Or just admit you're prejudiced 
about a massive varied group based on the actions of a few.


If you have eyes and if you know history, the claim is already backed up.  If you've spent any time reading my posts, you'd know that I am the furthest from being prejudiced.  I base my claims on the facts.  Being prejudiced has nothing to do with it.  It's not about the actions of a few either.  It's about the ideology that all Muslims are programmed with.  Some will follow the path of Salafism and others will be Apostates.


The original root has a number of meanings including both peace and 
submission. And you claim others are disingenuous...


If you paid any attention, I basically stated that.  The point being that it has both meanings, however, most people don't consider the two meanings as compatable.  That's part of what sends up red flags.


Mohammed and the Qur'an expressly forbid the use of violence against 
civilians. To claim ISIS follow his example is either ignorant or 
deliberately dishonest.


Well first, I would ask you what definition of "civilian" you are using?  To claim ISIS is following his example is completely factual and to deny that is deliberately dishonest.  You need to come up with a better excuse.


Agreed. That was Mohammad's response to the breaking of a treaty by the 
tribe who previously controlled Mecca. He also gave polytheists a grace 
period to complete their pilgrimages without threat. Even after that was 
up, they were to be escorted to a place of safety if they asked for it. 
That's quite tolerant by 7th century standards.


I would have to disagree.  He and his followers were destroying idols well before the Hijrah.  Then again after Mecca had been conquered.  When Mohammed had entered Mecca, immunity was given the pagans.  It wasn't until some point after the Battle of Tabuk, that Allah revoked immunity.  It had nothing to do with Mohammed's responce to a broken treaty.


I would be interested to know which parts of the Qur'an you think 
condone terrorism or other actions of extremists. The most common ones 
are usually misquoted or out of context.


Well, we would have a difficult time finding ayahs that codone terrorism, but the Quran is full of references on how to treat the non-believer (how to purify the land).  We could go on ad naseum (not misquoting or out of context).  Lists have been compiled here many times.  I.E. anything I list, you will dismiss as being misquoted or out of context.  So, to save time, I'll have you answer a question.  Can you tell me the differences between the two concepts of dar al-Islam and dar al-Harb?  With focus on if Muslims think that those non-Muslims that inhabit dar al-Harb are innocent?  Your reaction will be interesting.


You claim to be educated on early Islam and Islamic scripture. Your 
arguments show either that is a lie, you are deliberately editing it to 
serve an agenda or, hopefully, you just misunderstood it and are willing 
to learn. I have a feeling we can rule one of those out in this thread.


Yes, I claim to be somewhat educated, but I am still learning, but you are dead wrong anyway.  I have not seen any evidence to the contrary to what I state.  All I get out of those like you are just claims that I've misquoted or taken out of context sans any evidence.  What is presented as evidence is easily debunked.  I continually seek for that evidence but I really don't believe it exists.  I seek an honest answer of which none will come.  

Edited by RavenHawk
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On 5/22/2016 at 6:59 PM, bee said:

 

Farmer77 said:

Absolutely ....although im not sure why you're saying im "admitting that". Im not muslim nor am i an apologist for them my apologies if I have given that impression.

ok ---

edit - just popped back to look at your posts again and you have given that impression - IMO - that's why I reacted like I did --

.

I can definitely see how my posts might lead one to think that. I'm simply a big fan of the truth. Nowhere will you ever find me saying Islam doesnt have the ability for horrendous actions built into the religion and nowhere will you find me justifying the actions of Islamic terrorists. Now I will argue at times that some terrorists wouldn't be terrorists if not for US aid  (look at the first WTC bombing and ISIS as an example of that) and I most definitely argue that our response to terrorism is wildly out of proportion to the real threat that exists but a threat does exist. 

Edited by Farmer77
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22 hours ago, Farmer77 said:


Reread the link thats 21 people killed by toddlers NOT 2 


You are missing the point.  Accidental deaths are not in the realm of premeditated murder for the purpose of terrorism.  That stat has no meaning here.  And the two killed by toddlers were not based on a doctrine that the toddler is superior to the parent (asuming those were the two deaths).  The 19 Americans killed were non-believers.  If any of them were Muslim then they died as a martyr or kafir.


No you seem to be the only human on earth who doesnt think Eisenhowers message was a warning. 


Never said it wasn't a warning but I don't cherry-pick what I want out of it and ignore the rest.  It is not only a warning of the potential abuses (potential is the operative) but also a warning to not vilify a foundational institution of the people and this nation.


Im not calling the islamic threat totally made up. Sure there are islamic terrorists, as you point out there have been for a thousand years. Im calling ISIS made up , im calling this panic and fear the media is feeding us made up. Im calling the war on terror made up. 


The group is transitory but it is trying to be legitimate, so no, it is not made up.  I'll agree that it may have found its beginning in Qatar and Saudi Arabian backing and evolved out of al Qaeda.  There are hundreds of such Salafist groups that form, hang around, or fold.  But none of them are made up because their foundation is solid in Islam.


I'm not totally dismissing this but my first impression was that it was a fake.  It appears to be a concoction with a little touch of truth thrown in.  I plan on looking more into this.  I am aware that McCain had traveled to Syria and that there was some story of him meeting al-Baghdadi but it had been debunked.  The picture with him in a  meeting showing al-Baghdadi looks to be a photoshop creation.  I'm seeing my Syrian friend on Friday.  I plan on bringing this up with him then.  From our previous conversations, I have no doubt that a battle is raging  within our own government.  Although I must admit that it's not very clear who is on what side, but my guess is that whichever side the MIC is on is the right side.  Primarily because the MIC contains patriots, not robots.  I work with many.


My claim is that Islam is exactly the same threat it has been for 1400 years!  Thats what ive been saying all along. 


Then we should be in 100% agreement.  Islam has been a threat from that very first time the followers of Mohammed threaten worshipers in the Kaaba.


For 200 of those years this nation did not need to be a warrior nation because of islam. 


This nation has always been a warrior nation and Islam had a part in it.  Between 1783 and 1815, Islam attacked this nation and we fought back.  That interaction is what defined who we are after the Constitution.


Only when the cold war waned and the MIC needed a new enemy did Islamic terrorism become the panic that it is today. That could be coincidence but I've seen and been involved with too much to believe that. 


First of all, there is no panic.  Don't confuse that with urgency.  Secondly, I find coincidence is like *******s - everyone has one.  In otherwords, coincidences occure on a regular basis.  Islam has always been there; it has been overshadowed of late by Nazism and Communisim.  Today our greatest internal threat is Socialism and our greatest external threat is Islam.  And if we survive both of these, there will be new threats that will take their place.  That is the cycle.  As long as we are a nation, we will always be confronted by new challenges.

Edited by RavenHawk
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