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Magic users infected by Christianity?


J. K.

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Some Christians think that being involved with witches or magic users can have a negative effect on their spiritual condition. I wondered if the opposite were true. Magic users, do you think that being around Christians can have a negative impact on your spiritual activity?

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I think we always have an impact on others and they on us. To what degree and whether it's negative or positive is down to the individual. But by "magic users" are you referring to pagans?

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No it doesn't, spell work is a personal thing. Of course, if someone is being disruptive while you're working is it.

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I don't think being around Christians in general has any impact on practitioners. As in if they are at a dinner party together, it won't jinx anyones juju. I've known of some Christians that feel it is not good-and its a super tiny minority by far. But usually practitioners don't feel anything negative about mingling with Christians.

However, and sheesh isn't there always a however with me...

I think that some Christians may may have a negative impact on some magic users. Sometimes folks are rather brow-beating in their commentary, and this can have a negative impact regardless on the two people involved. So yes, this can include a combination of Christian having negative impact on a magic user. This is probably most typical when it occurs between family members, like when a parent disapproves of a child's practices.

Occasionally, magic users do things in public that may be negatively commented on. And this is in specific moment only. Like if a group of pagans are doing a sunset ritual, and a person going by talks smack about it- and yep, this can include a Christian talking the smack. I actually saw that happen once, in the free parking lot at a Renaissance festival.

Personally, I've never been impacted by such a thing. I'm steady enough in my faith and what I do that none of that stuff has an affect on me. Whatever, you got your faith, and I got mine. With most of the practitioners I know, it's mostly the same thing. While there can be a negative impact in a way, it usually has no impact on the actual spiritual activities of the practitioner.

An interesting thing to note IMO... some of these stances and opinions seem to change a bit when it comes to holy ground. People that wouldn't seem to normally care sometimes get a bit more jittery or edgy when it comes to holy ground. Like if a practitioner has a holy area that they don't want polluted by negativity about the holy ground from anyone, Christians included. A few practitioners I know don't like being in churches for services because they feel it throws them off, or I guess in a way makes them uncomfortable.

Edited by rashore
grammar fix
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I think we always have an impact on others and they on us. To what degree and whether it's negative or positive is down to the individual. But by "magic users" are you referring to pagans?

I'm not singling out pagans. I'm trying to refer to anyone who casts spells, manipulates energy, or interacts with the spiritual world and possesses a non-Christian worldview.

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Depends on how stealth you are about it. I basically got the stink eye from my younger cousin when he found out I practice magic. Some Christians thought it interesting, others basically banished me from a church I was attending, for fear of the devil I suppose.

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Some Christians think that being involved with witches or magic users can have a negative effect on their spiritual condition. I wondered if the opposite were true. Magic users, do you think that being around Christians can have a negative impact on your spiritual activity?

depending on what sort of Christian, it can have a negative impact on anything.

You do realise that the whole roots of western magic used to be part of Christianity, dont you ?

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I'm not singling out pagans. I'm trying to refer to anyone who casts spells, manipulates energy, or interacts with the spiritual world and possesses a non-Christian worldview.

If you are going to get into deeper magic (say a bit deeper than 'candle magic ' or any pop variety about today ) it should open up your psyche a bit.

If you have negative implants in there ( put in by you or others) of guilt, sin and a need for redemption (Classic Christian themes) then one could be effected in an averse way, if one does not know how to deal with that.

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If you are going to get into deeper magic (say a bit deeper than 'candle magic ' or any pop variety about today ) it should open up your psyche a bit.

If you have negative implants in there ( put in by you or others) of guilt, sin and a need for redemption (Classic Christian themes) then one could be effected in an averse way, if one does not know how to deal with that.

Yep, yep, and yep!

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depending on what sort of Christian, it can have a negative impact on anything.

You do realise that the whole roots of western magic used to be part of Christianity, dont you ?

My timeline on that and your timeline would be a bit different, but that would be for a totally different discussion.

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Some Christians think that being involved with witches or magic users can have a negative effect on their spiritual condition. I wondered if the opposite were true. Magic users, do you think that being around Christians can have a negative impact on your spiritual activity?

I remember reading a book I had purchased years ago, that equated what was considered as white magic, akin to Christianity. I think this was considered as a way of comparing.

No it doesn't, spell work is a personal thing. Of course, if someone is being disruptive while you're working is it.

Could anyone consider casting a spell the same thing as praying? I hope I don't offend with this question.
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Could anyone consider casting a spell the same thing as praying? I hope I don't offend with this question.

There is no difference other than how it's done. To be honest all rituals are for inducing a specific state of mind that is basically a form of self-hypnosis. So the idea of Christians (or other abrahamic faiths) affecting the aspiring magician is only true to an extent. Because introducing even the slightest doubt can hinder the 'manifestation' process. It's kinda like telling a highly intelligent person with low confidence that they are stupid. With enough repetition they will believe it and change accordingly.

Prayer, spell work, sigils, even creative visualization alter the mind of the practitioner.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_visualization

Which is why you can imagine vividly various ideas, some naughty :whistle: or nice :yes: even negative :cry: and they will affect you in some manner. Spend some time each day imagining an pumpkin pie, all that goes with it. The smell, taste, texture, everything. How long will it be before you react to the mental stimuli, and how long will it be before you go the store and buy one? This is basically how magick works. The most powerful magician on earth is the Media.

Casting a spell for something you want and you'll see guide post to it everywhere, can create false memories of it, and even be motivated enough to take actions in accordance with your will.

Doubt also works this way. Fear can manifest in dream and/or hallucinations. Seeing ghost everywhere and demons in everything.

Magick is the art and science of manipulating consciousness. We all do this to on another all the time. It's only when we put of mental barriers that we can block the subtle affects of the words and imagines that surround us.

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I remember reading a book I had purchased years ago, that equated what was considered as white magic, akin to Christianity. I think this was considered as a way of comparing.

Could anyone consider casting a spell the same thing as praying? I hope I don't offend with this question.

Yes and no. A personal spell and a prayer are pretty much the same thing, just a different format really. So for instance, a person saying a quick spell for luck in the morning isn't that different than praying for a lucky day.

But some spell casting is beyond the simplicity of prayer. A more formal and bigger cast is more ritualistic in format, and can get into kinship with the more formal mass- both are rituals. For instance, a babies naming can br fairly formal spell casting, and church christenings also can have a formal ritual.

I'm a person that is of the mind that some Christian masses are incredibly powerful spell casting. Taking communion can be awe inspiring, and some of the high masses out of the orthodox Catholic Church are honestly divine.

On a humbler level, church services and spell casting can be very similar. Lighting of candles, cleansing with incense, inviting whatever spirit to be there,help, ect.... Actual activity of the spell cast or service, and then closing down the gathering with good wishes. Snuff the incense, put out the candles.

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My timeline on that and your timeline would be a bit different, but that would be for a totally different discussion.

actually it goes to the heart of the question you asked .

the answer, essentially and simply is ; "depends" and " for who ? " . Without addressing what I bought up, and what leads on from that is not addressing the 'depends' or the individual in question .

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depending on what sort of Christian, it can have a negative impact on anything.

You do realise that the whole roots of western magic used to be part of Christianity, dont you ?

Okay, how does that influence how you would answer my original question?

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I used to know a number of people who thought I was not Christian for the sole reason that I played Dungeons and Dragons, which involves Magic. The same people said that Poke'mon was Satanic, and watching Harry Potter movies would send you to Hell. Fortunately these people all clashed with the "normal" Christians and were forced to move on relatively quickly. I suspect that they are all out there in one ultra fundamentalist church somewhere, not watching TV or videos, or using the internet, or reading books, or listening to music, or dancing. All of which send you to Hell apparently. 

I've never known anyone who claimed to be a user of magic in real life. Though I did know a guy who was a follower of Thor, and would go leave token objects in the oak woods near his home. 

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On ‎23‎/‎05‎/‎2016 at 0:08 AM, J. K. said:

depending on what sort of Christian, it can have a negative impact on anything.

You do realise that the whole roots of western magic used to be part of Christianity, dont you ?

Okay, how does that influence how you would answer my original question?

 

 

This one  " Magic users, do you think that being around Christians can have a negative impact on your spiritual activity? "  ?

 

If you have an idea that magic must be opposed to Christianity, then you have set up an adversarial position in your psyche, so yes, being around similar Christians  ( that is - those that think magic and Christianity must be in opposition).   This is a rather modern and ill-informed opinion.

 

Some one that has studied magic a bit more extensively will realise in the past, it was done under the 'auspices' of Christianity. The magician's authority and ability to command spirits was due to his Christianity, his power came from God through him ... if he was pure and worthy.  Many rites entailed a prepetory period of fasting and praying.

Its quiet clear and obvious in the actual texts ... one of the classic examples is in 'The Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage' .

 

People , both Christian and non- Christian, that are educated and understand this should not have a problem with either subject , and in such company, no , being around them would NOT have a negative impact on either's practice.

 

Its different if one is talking about the 'old style'  'satanic' witches  and modern magical systems that are opposed to Christianity philosophically, or religion generally.

 

If you are seriously interested in  finding out ore about this I can supply an easy on line reading reference .

 

(Yes, I do realise that many modern Christians  do not accept nor have a clue about this - even though it is part of their own history. )

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Part of my magical training was to look at the Book of Psalm and see which ones would be useful for spells or actually were spells.  Being Christianity has it roots founded in Judaism, which has a long magical tradition in the Kabbalah.  I don't understand why Christianity wouldn't follow suit. Turning wine into blood and crackers into flesh looks like magic to me. 

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1 minute ago, GreenmansGod said:

 Turning wine into blood and crackers into flesh looks like magic to me. 

Even if it just a metaphor. It's the power of suggestion and those sneaky sorcerers who can get you to buy something you don't want, dangerous mages. lol

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18 minutes ago, GreenmansGod said:

Part of my magical training was to look at the Book of Psalm and see which ones would be useful for spells or actually were spells.  Being Christianity has it roots founded in Judaism, which has a long magical tradition in the Kabbalah.  I don't understand why Christianity wouldn't follow suit. Turning wine into blood and crackers into flesh looks like magic to me. 

Exactly!

Magick users need not be infected by christianity. It's the orthodoxy they should scorn, in this case it was the Roman Catholic Church, who in the name of christianity, has stamped down 'heretics' throughout history. Now that they have lost their hold over law & order in much of the Western world, it shouldn't be a concern unless they are eventually replaced by some other orthodoxy, who will seek to prevent the individual from seeking truths.

Edited by TruthSeeker_
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6 hours ago, TruthSeeker_ said:

Exactly!

Magick users need not be infected by christianity. It's the orthodoxy they should scorn, in this case it was the Roman Catholic Church, who in the name of christianity, has stamped down 'heretics' throughout history. Now that they have lost their hold over law & order in much of the Western world, it shouldn't be a concern unless they are eventually replaced by some other orthodoxy, who will seek to prevent the individual from seeking truths.

You got to understand, with me, it is all the same.  Catholicism thru fundamental christianity isn't all that much different. They all come from the same book and cast of characters.  They all have their dogma, which appears to me, to have a mandate to impose it on everyone for their own "good".  

Having been out on a full moon and while some "good" folk drive by on the road past  our ritual ground firing guns and yelling can be disrupting to any spell.  

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Maybe it wasn't magic users who infected Christianity.  Maybe it was the other way around.

Doug

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both ( magic and religion )  have gone hand in hand since year X

 

 the  division is a recent phenomena

 

Edited by back to earth
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 Magic has been around a lot longer than Abrahamic religions.  Humans been trying to control nature with some sort of magic practice for a long time. I bet it came into being about same time cave art started.  

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