Why do you Believe?

[SHaYap]

In my case I'd rather render that anon existentialist quote as ~

" Just because we're having a good time, doesn't mean we're all doomed "

~

[An Urban Leg3nd]

On 6/25/2016 at 11:23 AM, XenoFish said:

I'm putting this here instead of the skepticism section. Because I am honestly curious why you believe what you believe. At one time I had faith in a lot of things. That mix of curiosity and desire. Wishful belief if you want to call it that. Now, I find there is nothing spiritual to believe in and I just want to know the motivation you have for your spiritual beliefs. What does it do for you? Does it satisfy some emotional or social need for you? Please explain this to me.

 

Well,...it's a long story. I'll keep it straight to the point rather or not you believe me or not. I use to be a devout Christian. I use to believe in God. I use to love God, and Jesus and all of what Christianity entailed. I use to read the bible daily,...and pray for what amounted to hours. I honestly wanted a relationship with God, so I prayed often. I had what I would consider "conversations" with God. I included him into my daily life. It was very one sided for a long time,...but I still believed. I felt like if God is real, hey,...he can talk back so why not talk to him. I had a hatred for Satan; read alot about him and the whole Illuminati circle and the mere thought of him disgusted me. I thought "evil spirits" and Satan and God all were real, but I had no real evidence or contact with any of them. But deep down, since I was a little kid I always believed there was a spirit world. After my brother's death, I had what you would call a "spiritual experience" for several nights in a row at around the same time throughout the night until I told other members of the family. I was sitting down at my desk in one of my rooms, at the age of about 18 or 19. I forgot which. But I was an atheist during the time. So I was sitting at the desk browsing the internet when I noticed an orange ball of light which was actually hovering over my right shoulder. The ball of light was not extremely bright but it was bright enough to emit some light from it which I seen in the corner of my eyes. When your reading on the internet, you think it's just you and the computer and that your alone. I seen this light on my shoulder hovering there,...I didn't get excited but was more or less like "wow what is this". I didn't turn and make direct eye contact with this ball of light, but it was there. So after seeing it for a few seconds, I then decided to turn to my right side and look at it. I turn my head to look at it, and thats when I actually saw this ball of orange light directly. When I seen it, it knew I had seen it and then moved casually into the brick wall next to me. It was translucent. It went through the brick wall, but when it went through the brick wall it caused a "flash" to occur which lite up the entire room as if someone had taken a picture with a camera; that type of flash. So the whole room lit up and I was then excited, and did not know what to think or what I even saw. I kept the experience to myself,...until it happened again another night, exactly the same way, at around the same time. I sat there and browsed the internet and the ball of light appeared again and did exactly what it did the night previously. I was very excited that it happened a second time. It happened a few times during that week, to the point where I was expecting it to happen when 11pm night time came. I was anticipating this "ball of orange light" to show up. And for one last time, it did. And each time it did exactly the same thing, hovered over my shoulder as if it was with me and just watching me do what I was doing on the computer,  almost as if we were spending time together until I make eye contact and seen it, to which it then always "darted" into the brick wall next to me lighting the whole room up. It was pretty incredible, to say the least. I was an atheist back then, I didn't believe in any God or gods, or Satan, or any of that, but I definitely had a spiritual experience. It was something which reaffirmed what I had already knew instinctively as a kid, ...that a spirit world parallel to this one, actually exists. I just always believed that one existed, even though I didn't have absolute proof. I "felt" it existed so I always believed it,...but  I didn't believe in God or Satan though. Anyway,...that experience gave me more than enough reason to believe that life exists after death and that when people die, they go somewhere else, they don't just not exist anymore like many atheist think. It was definitely something which gave me hope.

Fast forward years later, Im 25 or so, I met this girl who was also a unbeliever like myself. We dated for over 5 years,...I then at some point started to smoke marijuana. This is when things, get very strange, and things in life take a step up a notch. When I began smoking marijuana I began having these "spiritual experiences" again. While under the influence of marijuana I began to channel "spirits" of some sort which actually spoke through me. It's hard to digest, but it happened to me, and I'll tell you all about it. It started when one night I was actually high and just feeling good and relaxed. I started to hear voices which were speaking to me, and I didn't even realize it. The voice I first heard told me to stop going to see the drug dealer I was going to see to get my weed from because he was "the devil". His name was Nick. The message said "Nick is the devil". I heard what was being said, I then thought on it and took heed and immediately stopped going to get weed from this guy. Next thing you know, a few weeks later I heard from my cuz that the guy we both use to get marijuana from got busted for selling to an undercover cop. He's now in jail. They gave him I think 10 years or so. Think about that, if I kept going see this guy I could have potentially been caught up with him and what he was doing, and I could have been in jail with him. Intetresting. That was one thing. Later as I said, I channeled spirits which spoke through me. This was before I even knew what channelling was. I believe that when you do alchohol or any sort of drugs, or thing that makes you not sober, it gives a spirit a chance to enter your body. Thats why its important to stay sober minds, so you wont be influenced by these things. This is a pretty incredible story, but Im telling you, it really happened. It happened, broad as the light of day,..but at night. So, I had left over marijuana I bought from the guy Nick who went to jail. I smoked it again. I then go in my bedroom, and immediately starts to hear voices again. I thought I was talking to "God", because the voice sounded deep, but it also sounded demonic. I was confused by it, cause Ive never heard voices before. But to make a long story, kinda short but not entirely,...I was high off this weed, and hearing voices, I then walked in front of the mirror to which I cannot explain what happened next expect that I channeled some sort of satanic spirit which spoke through me. I stood in front of the mirror, high, I was high but I was conscious of what was going on, but I was not entirely in control of myself, I then spoke verbally but it didn't sound like me,  it sounded like a demon of some sort talking through me but trying to relay a message to me in the mirror but through my own mouth. He said through my own voice " you actually think I came here alone!?" I looked in the mirror and said this but it was not in my own voice, it sounded different. The voice sound like a rotten but sniveling coward type of person, but it wasn't me. I heard what the voice said through me in the mirror, I just watched and listened. I was watching through the inside out. The voice then told me, "go get the gun and kill Cordney".

Cordney was my girlfriend and soon to be fiancee at the time. I heard what the voice said to me and I immediately rejected it. She was in the bed sleep the whole time this altercation was going on by the way. It happened in front of the bed where she slept silently as I fought with these voices. I rejected what these voices were telling me though, and I began to curse these voices and call them demons and spoke against them. The voices made me look myself in the eyes in the mirror and it then began speaking through my own mouth again. It told me some things in the mirror about my future and myself. I listened and then, immediately after it said what it had to say, I apparently "snapped out of it" and the voices went away and there was only silence ..and my sleeping girlfriend. As soon as she awoke, I told her what happened and then confessed to her that I'd been using marijuana in the past. I then quit smoking and she then began to tell me that she thought the whole experience was generated by "God" and that she wanted me to come to church with her. She use to be an atheist, but apparently changed her mind without telling me. I agreed to go with her though. It was the worst decision I ever made. My life was better as an atheist until all of this "spirit" stuff started happening. She thought the voices were from the devil and that there was a spiritual battle for my soul going on. I believed that part about the spiritual battle, but the part about who the voices were from is another story. I then later became a "born again" Christian for the first time, and for a long time felt "alive" and somewhat "stronger". I saw people differently. I look at people wholesomely. I use to watch pornography, so I had the mind of a guy,...you know? I thought about girls! When Christianity came, I quit thinking about those things tho. That was temperary though. But things went from bad to worst after that. At a certain point in the future I began hearing voices again,...but this time it was the worst I've experienced. Those same band of spirits and voices I heard while under the influence of marijuana in the past years, I heard once again but then as a Christian. Those same exact voices from years ago. This time, they were louder and brought pain with them. I kept it to myself, but people noticed my behavior changed. The voices hollered and screamed in my ears to the point where my ears turned red in pain. My literal body was stricken with pain. The voices were loud, satanic and overbearingly evil. But they screamed so loud, I can't explain it, I felt the screaming so loud it actually hurt my body as if a shockwave or something was hitting me from the noise. It put me in pain day and night, for over 24 hours a day. I tried working but the voices were so loud. Ruining any social interaction I tried to have with my customers or anyone else. It got so bad, people noticed something wasnt right with me. I was in so much pain I started taking longer lunches because I would lay in my car and just cover my ears because of the screaming. Nothing worked. They kept telling me evil negative things and to quit my job. I had a brand new car, and a fiancee, I couldn't quit my livelihood! I fought these voices day in and day out, but they spoke when I tried to speak with other people. Imagine that, ...its hell. As I walked around they cursed at me and said all manner of negative things. I didnt believe them because I knew they were satanic. The origin of these voices were evil. It was obvious. I kept my full-time job as long as I could, but these voices would not stop. I prayed day and night, and the only thing that would happen was when I prayed to God, the voices would get silent as if they were watching me pray. That's the only time of silence I had. After I came out of prayer they roared, all day and night. Listen, ...my body was in pain. That's how loud these things were. My physical body ached as they roared and hollered in my ear. I even had terrible nightmares.I use to wake up in a panic because something use to choke me in my sleep,...all while being accompanied by a demonic dream. I was fighting something, ...and it was totally evil. It was not just some chemical imbalance or mental disorder. I went to the hospital muliple times for having literally attacks from these voices. Feeling as if something was touching and fondling my body, private parts. It was miserable. I tried everything. I took medication and was even admitted for evaIuation. They had no explantion for what I was going through. They determinted that I was totally sane, but was just experiencing something doctors could not explain. I told them everything. They immediately said,..."have you tried seeing a priest or pastor"? They thought the things I went through may very well have religious signifigance. But I tried everything,...nothing worked. I remember thinking to myself that quote from...Epicurus-

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?Is he neither able nor willing? Thenwhy call him God?”

I believe what this quote is saying has truth to it. If God could put a stop to evil, why not do it. If God could end human suffering, why not do it? If God is able, why not do it? Maybe because just as the quote says, God is malevolent,...just evil. What excuse could there be for him standing idly by as men, women, and innocent children suffer? There is no excuse besides he's malevolent. The bible really explained things to me when I read in there that "God creates evil" and that "God creates calamities". It's basically saying God is the cause of suffering and evil in this world. Before reading, I thought Satan was, but I was wrong. God is the source of all evil, not Satan.  And where does Satan fit into all of this at? God of the bible does more killing and deceiving than Satan himself. It's unbelievable if you read it. It's almost as if God and Satan are playing role reversal, but not entirely. That's just something to think about. I'e seen alot in my life,...but despite what I've seen, it's lead me to believe in this world, you only have friends and family. No good God is out there. If there is a God out there he's evil. What "good" excuse can God have for why 1000s of children die of starvation every single day. Bread doesnt rain from the sky in they're country. It's not humanities fault,...there are rich people and poor people. They were born into those horrible conditions,...no one had control over who put them there. They were just born, and its where they turned up. Their deaths are inexcusable, ..and so is the pain we all endure every single day. I think we as people need to question religion and life itself and try to put together the pieces and figure out what we are as humans and where we are going. The answers are out there, ...waiting to be known if only someone begins to search with an open mind. I don't believe God is the answer to all those questions we have, ...I think he'll do more to complicate the problem rather than to fix it, espcially given his biblical history. There are so many philosophical and moral implications to what is going on. We may never get all the answers in our life-time. We can only share our experiences and hope it brings truth to someone else's life. I think there is an enemy out there,...but it's not who you think. Things are actually more sinister than we previously have thought about this world. I think there is a spiritual battle going on within mankind, but it's not for souls,...it's really for us to find out who our enemy is and how to remove ourselves from it so we can progress as humans to our next phase of existence. For what happened to me, I think there is an invisible enemy out there, and he's evil. But there is also a place after we die that removes us from the grasp of this enemy. Can't say where it is though. Hey, my brother survived. Im an atheist and a realist, not a Satanist or Christian. That's my experience. Take it for what you will. I've just come to know, there is something more to life than what we see with our physical eyes, I just dont believe in God is the cause.

[XenoFish]

I would love to read your experience but I have dyslexia and big paragraphs look like this to me.

My brain get's all jumbled. Not trying to start something with you, it's just that I got issues.

[An Urban Leg3nd]

54 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I would love to read your experience but I have dyslexia and big paragraphs look like this to me.

My brain get's all jumbled. Not trying to start something with you, it's just that I got issues.

 

Oh! Wow. Strange to find you here on a message board. To make a long story short,...I had an encounter with what we'd call evil spirits. Searched for truth and found out it lead me to a place away from Jesus, Christianity, and God. I found out there is more to life than human eye can see. There is no death, but only life after wards. It's nothing more but a transition of the human consciousness to somewhere else. Where? I cannot explain or account. You have to experience the unexplained, which exists, in order to really believe in certain things. Rightfully so,...for some people "seeing" is believing.

[XenoFish]

1 minute ago, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Oh! Wow. Strange to find you here on a message board.

It's not terribly severe. Small paragraphs are not a problem, it's just big blocks of text say "Screw you brain."

[An Urban Leg3nd]

1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

It's not terribly severe. Small paragraphs are not a problem, it's just big blocks of text say "Screw you brain."

I can imagine! That must be hard. I don't in particular like reading long drawn out paragraphs either, but if it's worth it sometimes I'll invest my time and read. Othertimes, I dont bother or I skim through. All while still comprehending whats been said...I just dont waste alot of time immersing myself into alot of things. Unless its interesting.

[XenoFish]

I've got my own set of trick that help. Most of the time I just skim for keywords.

[crystal sage]

On ‎7‎/‎5‎/‎2016 at 8:23 PM, XenoFish said:

I might have believed that 4 years ago. Not today.

Just like the stages of Grief one jumps from stage to stage... forward.. backwards.. till the areas feel cleared enough for you to move forward..    you'll get there...

[crystal sage]

On ‎7‎/‎13‎/‎2016 at 8:12 AM, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Oh! Wow. Strange to find you here on a message board. To make a long story short,...I had an encounter with what we'd call evil spirits. Searched for truth and found out it lead me to a place away from Jesus, Christianity, and God. I found out there is more to life than human eye can see. There is no death, but only life after wards. It's nothing more but a transition of the human consciousness to somewhere else. Where? I cannot explain or account. You have to experience the unexplained, which exists, in order to really believe in certain things. Rightfully so,...for some people "seeing" is believing.

Totally agree with you here... I would not have believed so much ( Believe it or not.. I was once a skeptic on all things supernatural.. healing .. etc)    But fate... synchronicity threw so much at me.. ( I still held on and decided to "put it out there "  that I wasn't going to believe anything unless others with me experienced the same thing.. so much amazing 's&^% ' happened to me and who ever was with me at the time.. I noticed many saying this couldn't be for real.. or this shouldn't be happening.  I believe were on the verge of wiping it from their memories.. , but I immediately stepped in and started discussing it.. kept bringing it up to ensure that they did not dismiss it as some sort of inexplicable anomaly that was put into the too hard basket until something else similar cropped up to give validation to the experiences.... So I think .. with the wisdom of James Redfield famed for his work on the Celestine Prophecies..  that once you start noticing these things.. suddenly you find more and more of these coming your way... the law of attraction.. you are more open to noticing these things.. where as with others who haven't had to mentally digest these experiences may be oblivious.. like these studies..    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2277759/Can-dancing-gorilla-New-psychological-study-reveals-83-percent-radiologists-fail-spot-it.html

[Trichakra]

I believe in god. God is everywhere.

[quiXilver]

why?

why ask why?

what is why?

[XenoFish]

9 minutes ago, quiXilver said:

why?

why ask why?

what is why?

Because I want to know the mentality it takes to believe in irrational things. 

[Wes4747]

48 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Because I want to know the mentality it takes to believe in irrational things. 

Seems you might have gleened enough from your personal experience to logically deduce any persona is susceptible.

[drowning-lessons]

I'm an omnist, which is confusing and frustrating...to believe in everything and nothing at the same time. 

[Mr Walker]

I define two differnt forms of belief .

First, things we can believe in as an article of faith because there is no evidence for them, such as a god. I don't have nay of those forms of belief. I am an agnostic  on any form of belief from religious to secular. who suspends both belief and disbelief but creates a line of acceptancee from non acceptance to acceptance  of a things truth or reality based on evidences .

The second form of belief is the faith we choose to invest in things and people I have faith in my wife  (her love faithfulness and character etc) my parents etc because i invest t faith in them.  I have faith that my car will start, the earth will not stop rotating etc because this makes life more workable and happy than if i was agnostic or suspended faith in them. .  Imagine worrying every time you went to start your car, whether it would go or not.

 By investing, or choosing to have faith, in things and people, you eliminate any concern. When it fails you deal with it (I haven't had a car fail to start anytime in this millennium so  I have avoided lots of worry by having faith..  My wife has never been unfaithful to me in 40 years of marriage, and by having absolute faith in her loyalty, i have thus avoided 40 years of pointless concern about it. .) 

[Trichakra]

I believe in god. I have no reason...

[An Urban Leg3nd]

Im an atheist, but I have a maltheistic approach to things, presupposing alot of things for the Christians sake. If God does exist, I wouldn't worship him anyway.  And if he is real, he's not benevolent, but he's exactly the opposite-malevolent. He's nothing more but a deity thats invisible harboring evil intentions towards man. If he wasn't he wouldnt be waiting to rid the world of so much confusion and evil that is taking place all over the world. He sits back and allows it. And nobody knows why. Many different religions all divided over who's god is this, or who's god is that, which god to worship and so forth. God could eliminate all the confusion and unessisary bloodshed that is taking place because of HIM and just show up and then all people would believe in him and all the falsehoods would disappear and everybody could "know God" and be saved instead of being thrown in hell for unbelief or believing in the wrong god.  But unfortunately, the bible says despite God's love of the world and the people therein, "few will be saved". Meaning, the majority of the world is going to hell....for all eternity. And that's how God has it planned. Isn't it a bit ruthless to throw MOST OF ALL humanity in hell just for believing the wrong things,...the wrong things which sparked from ignorance and not knowing itself? Humans all sought answers to how the world came to be, but it later developed into 1000s of religions all seeking to answer these questions. None can be proven though, you have to have faith. If God doesn't wish to eradicate evil, why call him benevolent? If God can't eradicate all evil, then why call him God? If God has the power to eradicate evil but just doesn't want to,...this make him malevolent. He's evil. Lets get real with this.

[Wes4747]

4 hours ago, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Im an atheist, but I have a maltheistic approach to things, presupposing alot of things for the Christians sake. If God does exist, I wouldn't worship him anyway.  And if he is real, he's not benevolent, but he's exactly the opposite-malevolent. He's nothing more but a deity thats invisible harboring evil intentions towards man. If he wasn't he wouldnt be waiting to rid the world of so much confusion and evil that is taking place all over the world. He sits back and allows it. And nobody knows why. Many different religions all divided over who's god is this, or who's god is that, which god to worship and so forth. God could eliminate all the confusion and unessisary bloodshed that is taking place because of HIM and just show up and then all people would believe in him and all the falsehoods would disappear and everybody could "know God" and be saved instead of being thrown in hell for unbelief or believing in the wrong god.  But unfortunately, the bible says despite God's love of the world and the people therein, "few will be saved". Meaning, the majority of the world is going to hell....for all eternity. And that's how God has it planned. Isn't it a bit ruthless to throw MOST OF ALL humanity in hell just for believing the wrong things,...the wrong things which sparked from ignorance and not knowing itself? Humans all sought answers to how the world came to be, but it later developed into 1000s of religions all seeking to answer these questions. None can be proven though, you have to have faith. If God doesn't wish to eradicate evil, why call him benevolent? If God can't eradicate all evil, then why call him God? If God has the power to eradicate evil but just doesn't want to,...this make him malevolent. He's evil. Lets get real with this.

I actually wonder, and am  not trying to sell this, if we are all in the imaginings of some benign being. After a sense of something would be established, perhaps it would be polarized, then all shades of that something filled in. Polarized in every way- tall, short and everything in between. And maybe the evil exist necessarily to give more depth to the concept of good.

And in this beings eyes, or whatever it has, our pain and struggles would be of little understanding or consequence, for we are nothing in that reality.

I just can't fathom us being created for absolute cruelty.

[XenoFish]

I believe in humanity, I believe that we have the potential to reach beyond the stars. To lift ourselves out of the muck and away from the old ways of thinking. I believe that if we found reason to discard the old ways for something new and better, we'd achieve greatness as a species. 

[Mr Walker]

8 hours ago, XenoFish said:

I believe in humanity, I believe that we have the potential to reach beyond the stars. To lift ourselves out of the muck and away from the old ways of thinking. I believe that if we found reason to discard the old ways for something new and better, we'd achieve greatness as a species. 

 and even become as gods.

 

[GoldenWolf]

On 8/31/2016 at 11:59 PM, An Urban Leg3nd said:

Im an atheist, but I have a maltheistic approach to things, presupposing alot of things for the Christians sake. If God does exist, I wouldn't worship him anyway.  And if he is real, he's not benevolent, but he's exactly the opposite-malevolent. He's nothing more but a deity thats invisible harboring evil intentions towards man. If he wasn't he wouldnt be waiting to rid the world of so much confusion and evil that is taking place all over the world. He sits back and allows it. And nobody knows why. Many different religions all divided over who's god is this, or who's god is that, which god to worship and so forth. God could eliminate all the confusion and unessisary bloodshed that is taking place because of HIM and just show up and then all people would believe in him and all the falsehoods would disappear and everybody could "know God" and be saved instead of being thrown in hell for unbelief or believing in the wrong god.  But unfortunately, the bible says despite God's love of the world and the people therein, "few will be saved". Meaning, the majority of the world is going to hell....for all eternity. And that's how God has it planned. Isn't it a bit ruthless to throw MOST OF ALL humanity in hell just for believing the wrong things,...the wrong things which sparked from ignorance and not knowing itself? Humans all sought answers to how the world came to be, but it later developed into 1000s of religions all seeking to answer these questions. None can be proven though, you have to have faith. If God doesn't wish to eradicate evil, why call him benevolent? If God can't eradicate all evil, then why call him God? If God has the power to eradicate evil but just doesn't want to,...this make him malevolent. He's evil. Lets get real with this.

 

Edited September 2, 2016 by Mystic Crusader

[Podo]

On 2016-09-01 at 2:03 PM, XenoFish said:

I believe in humanity, I believe that we have the potential to reach beyond the stars. To lift ourselves out of the muck and away from the old ways of thinking. I believe that if we found reason to discard the old ways for something new and better, we'd achieve greatness as a species. 

Despite the Abrahamic religions' best efforts to pull us, screaming, back into the sea of ignorance from which they do not wish to tread.

[lovycrop]

Because I have experienced God's power and his love towards people.

[MWoo7]

Why? What is why? etc. HA! a thought twister eh? How about why the hell would anyone believe? Oh no -- not relevant , delete, no because some braindead didn't like it, DELETE!  Has anyone ever had that happen in here?, mute point I'm sure, and moving on .....

Why is simply what .   ....and , and ! its probably healthy for your faculties/reasoning center, I'm no expert I think I read that in one of their bibles. (shrink books/Psychology)

Side note, ever watch Dr. Monroe's Island ?   I was going to say the end was kind of weird but the whole movie was kind of weird/creepy but near the end they were (island creatures) were trying to set up laws , sayings chants etc. to keep everyone from , well sort of like good guidelines so all of them wouldn't become animals.

Had to start somewhere and sometime and if we're lucky it will grow out of us in the next millennium.

I heard some ancient fossil mention, eeeeeeeh its good for kids and kittens and you can bank on that or something to that effect and after having kids I'm kind of in agreement with that old codger. 

Just two bits, for what its worth.

Edited September 3, 2016 by MWoo7
added ?

[Habitat]