jethrofloyd Posted July 18, 2016 #1 Share Posted July 18, 2016 Swimming with mermaids, flying alongside your plane and seeing an old flame: Scientist uncover the TRUTH behind near-death experiences http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3694321/Swimming-mermaids-flying-alongside-plane-seeing-old-flame-Scientist-uncover-TRUTH-near-death-experiences.html#ixzz4El8I8NBl Some say they floated above their own body, others have been pulled towards a blinding light or been reunited with a deceased loved one. But far from being a brush with the afterlife, near-death experiences may simply be a trick of the mind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilly Posted July 18, 2016 #2 Share Posted July 18, 2016 "Truth" implies that this hypothesis can somehow be proven...it can't. No one knows what lies beyond the veil of life and that's "the truth". 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susanc241 Posted July 18, 2016 #3 Share Posted July 18, 2016 I have always been inclined to believe these experiences are caused by the brain in stressful situations, lack of oxygen etc. Whether that is the whole story............. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitat Posted July 18, 2016 #4 Share Posted July 18, 2016 I refuse to believe that all those St Peter at the Pearly Gates jokes are void. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenith Posted July 18, 2016 #5 Share Posted July 18, 2016 2 hours ago, Lilly said: "Truth" implies that this hypothesis can somehow be proven...it can't. No one knows what lies beyond the veil of life and that's "the truth". I think that in this case 'truth' refers to the explanations/causes of NDEs not the afterlife. But even in saying that, scientists still can't explain all of it. There's still work to be done. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted July 18, 2016 #6 Share Posted July 18, 2016 NDEs are something that don't make much sense to get worked up about. All of the evidence points to them being how the brain reacts to trauma. If that's not the case, we can't experience death without dying, so we don't know. So there's no sense caring about it, really. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclefred Posted July 20, 2016 #7 Share Posted July 20, 2016 The thread title is innacurate. Someone approachng the question from a materialist pov is looking for a materialist explanation. The brain hypothesis is a hypothesis, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlitterRose Posted July 20, 2016 #8 Share Posted July 20, 2016 There are people who were dead in a clinical sense for a period of time. Some of them had these experiences, while others did not. I don't think anybody really knows why. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted July 20, 2016 #9 Share Posted July 20, 2016 2 hours ago, ChaosRose said: while others did not Yep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted July 23, 2016 #10 Share Posted July 23, 2016 NBC interviews a woman who claims NDE. https://youtu.be/YO8UVebuA0g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted July 24, 2016 #11 Share Posted July 24, 2016 On 7/18/2016 at 7:08 PM, Podo said: NDEs are something that don't make much sense to get worked up about. All of the evidence points to them being how the brain reacts to trauma. If that's not the case, we can't experience death without dying, so we don't know. So there's no sense caring about it, really. I never really understood this POV. Seems to me that would imply that the brain has a consciousness separate from normal consciousness. An that under the stress of death, feels the need to calm normal consciousness with a hallucination show that would make one believe there is no real death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted July 26, 2016 #12 Share Posted July 26, 2016 On 2016-07-24 at 7:25 AM, preacherman76 said: I never really understood this POV. Seems to me that would imply that the brain has a consciousness separate from normal consciousness. An that under the stress of death, feels the need to calm normal consciousness with a hallucination show that would make one believe there is no real death. You're giving the natural processes too much credit. It makes more sense that we find what the brain's natural trauma response calming, not that the trauma response is calming because it has trauma. An evolved trauma-response has existed far longer than our mythologies regarding any sort of afterlife. We've adapted to it, not the other way around. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSilhouette Posted July 30, 2016 #13 Share Posted July 30, 2016 On 7/18/2016 at 4:35 AM, jethrofloyd said: Swimming with mermaids, flying alongside your plane and seeing an old flame: Scientist uncover the TRUTH behind near-death experiences http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3694321/Swimming-mermaids-flying-alongside-plane-seeing-old-flame-Scientist-uncover-TRUTH-near-death-experiences.html#ixzz4El8I8NBl Some say they floated above their own body, others have been pulled towards a blinding light or been reunited with a deceased loved one. But far from being a brush with the afterlife, near-death experiences may simply be a trick of the mind. Except when remote events can be described in details impossible for the NDE to have known while they were presumed dead, laying on their back. That little fly in the ointment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted August 5, 2016 #14 Share Posted August 5, 2016 On 7/26/2016 at 0:26 PM, Podo said: You're giving the natural processes too much credit. It makes more sense that we find what the brain's natural trauma response calming, not that the trauma response is calming because it has trauma. An evolved trauma-response has existed far longer than our mythologies regarding any sort of afterlife. We've adapted to it, not the other way around. I can agree with that. Problem is these NDE aren't just calming. They go on to tell elaborate stories of Gods and dead relatives ect ect. Whats the point in all that? The brain doesn't have to do any of that to keep calm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted August 5, 2016 #15 Share Posted August 5, 2016 8 hours ago, preacherman76 said: I can agree with that. Problem is these NDE aren't just calming. They go on to tell elaborate stories of Gods and dead relatives ect ect. Whats the point in all that? The brain doesn't have to do any of that to keep calm. That's a matter of opinion and belief, actually. What the brain creates, humans have interpreted into being some kind of story or cognizant hallucination. Our brains existed long before our consciousness, remember. Our mythologies developing around our natural responses are a much simpler explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidE Posted August 5, 2016 #16 Share Posted August 5, 2016 The brain is incredibly complex and not yet understood. We don't even fully understand how commonly prescribed psychiatric medications work. I'd say that anyone claiming to know the "truth" behind the causes of NDE's is jumping the gun in the extreme. Brain chemistry also doesn't explain such experiences such as hearing what medical staff is saying while floating over the body, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted August 5, 2016 #17 Share Posted August 5, 2016 1 hour ago, lucidE said: The brain is incredibly complex and not yet understood. We don't even fully understand how commonly prescribed psychiatric medications work. I'd say that anyone claiming to know the "truth" behind the causes of NDE's is jumping the gun in the extreme. Brain chemistry also doesn't explain such experiences such as hearing what medical staff is saying while floating over the body, for example. The person simply hearing what the medical staff were saying does explain it, though. An NDE means that, by definition, the person was alive, because full death is non-refundable. It's no different than someone remembering snippets of what went on around them while they are in a coma, which does occasionally happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidE Posted August 6, 2016 #18 Share Posted August 6, 2016 2 hours ago, Podo said: The person simply hearing what the medical staff were saying does explain it, though. An NDE means that, by definition, the person was alive, because full death is non-refundable. It's no different than someone remembering snippets of what went on around them while they are in a coma, which does occasionally happen. I was under the impression that a person needed to be brought back from a clinically defined state of death for it to be considered a proper NDE. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted August 6, 2016 #19 Share Posted August 6, 2016 2 minutes ago, lucidE said: I was under the impression that a person needed to be brought back from a clinically defined state of death for it to be considered a proper NDE. That wouldn't be near-death, that's a zombie apocalypse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted August 6, 2016 #20 Share Posted August 6, 2016 Near death in this case means you are clinically dead, no measurable brain activity, and are brought back from that state. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingAngel Posted August 8, 2016 #21 Share Posted August 8, 2016 Maybe what happened to the brain is the effect and not the cause. For example if I got a needle in my ass, my brain could act differently out of pain. It's all about the brain but it doesn't mean the needle is not real. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrLzs Posted August 9, 2016 #22 Share Posted August 9, 2016 On 7/30/2016 at 1:11 PM, SSilhouette said: Except when remote events can be described in details impossible for the NDE to have known while they were presumed dead, laying on their back. That little fly in the ointment. Can you cite the best documented example of that? Thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdohle Posted August 9, 2016 #23 Share Posted August 9, 2016 On 7/18/2016 at 8:01 AM, Susanc241 said: I have always been inclined to believe these experiences are caused by the brain in stressful situations, lack of oxygen etc. Whether that is the whole story............. Those have all been dealt with and found wanting. Peace mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan max2 Posted August 10, 2016 #24 Share Posted August 10, 2016 On Monday, July 18, 2016 at 7:08 PM, Podo said: NDEs are something that don't make much sense to get worked up about. All of the evidence points to them being how the brain reacts to trauma. If that's not the case, we can't experience death without dying, so we don't know. So there's no sense caring about it, really. One of my issues is that the brain needs oxygen to form memories. So if not having oxygen causes these expierences then how do the memories form? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podo Posted August 10, 2016 #25 Share Posted August 10, 2016 On 05/08/2016 at 6:44 PM, lucidE said: 5 minutes ago, spartan max2 said: One of my issues is that the brain needs oxygen to form memories. So if not having oxygen causes these expierences then how do the memories form? Reduced oxygen cause the effect. They do not die, so obviously their brains had enough oxygen to start doing weird things. Also keep in mind that NDEs are rare; the conditions are likely very specific to produce such a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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