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religions sensitive to criticism


Ozfactor

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A thought I have been mulling over the last few days . If certain religions are so sensitive to criticism and if we criticise them we are called racist and worse but the books these religions worship are full of critical remarks against anyone who is a woman, gay, non believer etc . If religion has the right to protection from criticism should they have to remove all critical remarks from their holy books because why should they have the right to criticise us when we don't have the right to criticise back ? it is hypocritical and does not make sense, if you are so sensitive to your own feelings why be insensitive to others ?

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Criticize to your heart's content. Who is complaining about criticism ? No one twists your arm and makes you read religious texts, so the solution seems pretty simple to me, just ignore what you deem indigestible.

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6 minutes ago, Habitat said:

just ignore what you deem indigestible.

Well that cuts out the abrahmanic religions totally. 

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Your free to criticize away! The followers of said religion wont like it though. They'll either damn you to eternal hellfire or cut of your head.

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29 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Well that cuts out the abrahmanic religions totally. 

OK, but don't throw the baby out with the bath-water.

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I don't believe that religious beliefs should be protected from criticism or scrutiny (protected from discrimination and persecution, yes, criticism, no). I find religion really annoying, to be honest, Not so much in and of itself, but because of how pervasive it is, and because of how much it impacts the lives of non-believers. Look at all the issues around same sex marriage and abortion, for instance. So yeah, absolutely it has to be challenged.

And I don't know why people get defensive about it. Perhaps one reason is because deep down inside they know there's nothing to it.

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2 minutes ago, Habitat said:

OK, but don't throw the baby out with the bath-water.

Or, throw out the baby and keep the bathwater.

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I'm fine with religion being seen as nothing more than a form of self therapy. No problem, but the way it is now when people take the words written from a religious book or someone one with 'divine authority' as legit. Nope. The way I see it is that it's between you and your god, keep me and everyone else out of it.

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Just a reminder...

 

Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs

'Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs' board guidelines

Please always respect the beliefs of other members - the bashing of specific religions, countries, races or belief systems is strictly disallowed. Several of the topics in this section cover some sensitive areas and it is important to respect the views of others; this means no flaming, no flamebaiting, no trolling and no personal attacks. We must also ask that members do not use the forums to promote or 'preach' their personal spiritual beliefs to others.

The Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs board is primarily aimed at discussing general topics pertaining to religion and spirituality, for skeptic vs believer style discussion and debate on the nature of spirituality themed topics please visit the Spirituality vs Skepticism board.

Edited by Daughter of the Nine Moons
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23 minutes ago, Clair said:

I don't believe that religious beliefs should be protected from criticism or scrutiny (protected from discrimination and persecution, yes, criticism, no). I find religion really annoying, to be honest, Not so much in and of itself, but because of how pervasive it is, and because of how much it impacts the lives of non-believers. Look at all the issues around same sex marriage and abortion, for instance. So yeah, absolutely it has to be challenged.

And I don't know why people get defensive about it. Perhaps one reason is because deep down inside they know there's nothing to it.

The law is what governs these issues, if churches influence legislative decisions, against the majority of the population, then I think you have a problem with lobbyists, and the conduct of elected representatives, in general.

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6 minutes ago, Habitat said:

The law is what governs these issues, if churches influence legislative decisions, against the majority of the population, then I think you have a problem with lobbyists, and the conduct of elected representatives, in general.

Yes, absolutely.

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Religions by definition do not invite criticism. You're either a believer or not. That's what begets schisms within religion.

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I'm not going to cast 'everybody' under the same umbrella where hypocrisy and religion is concerned. For I know there are good and bad in all walks of life. But nothing annoys me more - when one preachers their self righteous values and beliefs to others - then do the very opposite of what they propagate. And believe me - I have known a few of them in my life.

images_14.jpg

 

Edited by Astra.
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3 minutes ago, Astra. said:

I'm not going to cast 'everybody' under the same umbrella where hypocrisy and religion is concerned. For I know there are good and bad in all walks of life. But nothing annoys me more - when one preachers there self righteous values and beliefs to others - then do the very opposite of what they propagate. And believe me - I have known a few in my life.

images_14.jpg

 

Do you think those people were consciously aware of their double standards ?

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1 minute ago, Habitat said:

Do you think those people were consciously aware of their double standards ?

Yes - only after I took the liberty of pointing their double standards out.

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Well, if they then mended their ways, all was good !

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3 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Well, if they then mended their ways, all was good !

No - it's a rare thing for leopards to change their spots. But it certainly made me feel better :tu:

Seriously tho - I'm sure most are aware how hypocrisy runs rampant among the many followers of any particular religious faith.

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Hypocrisy is pretty much a standard human trait, not restricted to religious types.

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3 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Hypocrisy is pretty much a standard human trait, not restricted to religious types.

Most certainly true - but this thread is touching more on the hypocrisy that goes on with 'religion' not in general.

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7 hours ago, Likely Guy said:

Religions by definition do not invite criticism. You're either a believer or not. That's what begets schisms within religion.

I agree with you to a point. They do if they preach hatred and the like. Something like that cannot be condoned from anyone (religious or otherwise). But to hate on someone because they believe in a god, for example, is also not cool. People are entitled to believe whatever they choose to. But no one is entitled to negatively impact others as a result of those beliefs.

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Quote

 

“The moment you say that any idea system is sacred, whether it’s a religious belief system or a secular ideology, the moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible.”

Salman Rushdie

 

Sorry, but if you have the right to thump your book, I have the right to point out the flaws in your thinking and your source. As a Pagan I am used to getting a lot of criticism of my beliefs. I have been told I am the Antichrist, by a woman at support group meeting for MS where religious prayers and display are banned, so the meeting it incorporates everyone regardless of their religion.  She had questioned the rule, because everyone is a Christian.  I pointed out, I  was Pagan and the president of the group is Jewish. That was the response I got from her. I just laughed and said that is why they have the no religion rule.  

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A lot of people from certain religions, like Islam or certain pagan religions, are so used to be constantly criticised by others for their beliefs, and constantly having to defend their religion that It gets tiring. A lot of arguments are extremely redundant as well, the same thing is being said to muslims every time they are "criticised" and I can tell that It gets annoying to have to explain again and again the same thing, all the while you are being completely ignored whilst the stranger brings up evidence from unofficial and untrustworthy sources.

Put yourself in their shoes, having to constant (and I mean constantly, at least once a day) defend your choices and beliefs.

Its tiring.

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Because they don't stand up to scrutiny, most religions don't really care but one is on such unstable ground they don't want it questioned or looked at to closely and invent phobias for those that dare.

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25 minutes ago, ailill said:

A lot of people from certain religions, like Islam or certain pagan religions, are so used to be constantly criticised by others for their beliefs, and constantly having to defend their religion that It gets tiring. A lot of arguments are extremely redundant as well, the same thing is being said to muslims every time they are "criticised" and I can tell that It gets annoying to have to explain again and again the same thing, all the while you are being completely ignored whilst the stranger brings up evidence from unofficial and untrustworthy sources.

Put yourself in their shoes, having to constant (and I mean constantly, at least once a day) defend your choices and beliefs.

Its tiring.

Try to put yourself in the shoes of an atheist like myself and see religion everywhere you look and know that you are amongst the most untrusted people on the planet. A lot of Christians and Muslims love to dish it out but when shoved back they get all offended. Total hypocrisy.

I'm not saying it's right to badger people on their beliefs, but if the religious people would just quit trying to push their beliefs on others maybe we could all live in peace.....and yes.....it's tiring.

 

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1 hour ago, Euphorbia said:

Try to put yourself in the shoes of an atheist like myself and see religion everywhere you look and know that you are amongst the most untrusted people on the planet. A lot of Christians and Muslims love to dish it out but when shoved back they get all offended. Total hypocrisy.

I'm not saying it's right to badger people on their beliefs, but if the religious people would just quit trying to push their beliefs on others maybe we could all live in peace.....and yes.....it's tiring.

 

I've been an atheist in the past, for several years. I have faced more criticism when I was muslim (for only a year) than when I was atheist. I've been on both sides of the fence and trust me when I say It is massively harder to be a muslim (especially now) with the intense and hate-filled criticisms, than It is to be atheist. Im not saying that as an atheist you dont get hounded by people who dont understand It, but when I was atheist the criticisms I got were out of trying to recruit me, whilst the "criticisms" I got as a muslim were hateful and there were several times I feared for my life. 

I've converted to practically every religion that I found interest in, trying to find the right one. And while I was most satisfied with the community and general practice and morals of Islam, the overwhelming hate from non-muslims (and realisation that I wasn't monotheist) is what made me stop.

I know you most likely didn't mean for me to go off on a tangent but I have the utmost respect for every muslim that can declare they are muslim when the world is so full of hate right now.

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