seeder Posted October 1, 2016 #51 Share Posted October 1, 2016 5 minutes ago, jmccr8 said: Up until my son was 5 when I wanted him to go to sleep I would pick him up and rock him gently in my arms and as I did this I would slowly let my eyes droop and yawn while regulating my breath,then yawn and blink my eyes tiredly then let them droop again,he would resist a bit then through my half closed eyes I could see him struggling to stay awake and the he would relax and drift off. jmccr8 yep...a classic example of pacing and leading...ie: show the behaviour you want others to adopt youre a natural !! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted October 1, 2016 #52 Share Posted October 1, 2016 1 hour ago, seeder said: yep...a classic example of pacing and leading...ie: show the behaviour you want others to adopt youre a natural !! Maybe I should try that with a 30ish(to be polite)raven haired beauty. jmccr8 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted October 1, 2016 Author #53 Share Posted October 1, 2016 seeder, I cannot be hypnotized. tho, I am able to accept suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeder Posted October 2, 2016 #54 Share Posted October 2, 2016 (edited) 16 hours ago, danielost said: seeder, I cannot be hypnotized. tho, I am able to accept suggestions. Everyone...to an extent....can achieve a trance....they just dont recognise it as trance....its a bit like reading a great story in a book, or watching a gripping film....your conscious is so 'in to' that which you read...or watch...that you forget to notice the chair youre sitting in....how your feet feel.... the passage of time....and your mind seems so fixed...on the experience of a good story....in fact you have many trances daily....without even knowing it... Its entirely natural. While I accept people believe they could never achieve trance... Ive never come across one.... because when I do actual hypnosis...its very covert....I dont actually tell you....to relax...I just talk about something you can relate too, that was relaxing....and by doing so,,,YOU go ahead and access the feeling of relaxing.... For example... one guy I worked with was a keen fisherman....so I had him tell me about fishing, how he did it etc....and so I simply asked him to remember a relaxing time at the river.....and he was sat just there.....while I talked to him....about how relaxing it was to get away from everything....for a while....watching the float on the river...where time seemed to pass by so slowly... and how he enjoyed 'these times'.;....times where he could think....deeply about stuff...and while he was thinking about that,,,, I pointed out what a lottery fishing was......because you never knew if youd catch a fish....but youd have a better chance....if you could go beneath the surface...to have a look at things.. And just beneath that surface....is a new experience and eventually he closed his eyes....because what he didnt know was.....Id loaded my talk with suggestions....suggestions that couldnt be denied....as....I was just, apparently... talking about fishing But if you read the above again....what I was suggesting was: remember a pleasant relaxing time (sitting at the river) watching the float on the river (narrowing his focus down), time distortion was suggested, by me saying: time seems to pass by slowly, I also suggested it was time to think deeply about things, and I also suggested he go beneath the surface to...look at things Very subtle, yet powerful commands, when spoken with the right emphasis on certain phrases, ie: the bolded stuff above...and its stuff that appears as normal conversation.... so theres little resistance....as Im not commanding.... "Close your eyes, relax, go deeper".... all of which can be rejected by the person.... Edited October 2, 2016 by seeder 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 2, 2016 #55 Share Posted October 2, 2016 (edited) On 10/1/2016 at 1:21 PM, seeder said: Exactly example of a sly conversational suggestion I used often with my son when he was a kid (no swinging watch needed) "Hey Josh, do you want to wear the blue pyjamas or the spider-man ones before you go to bed at 7"? seems innocent enough right? Just a simple question. But....what Ive really told him is.... "youre going to bed at 7....now choose your pyjamas" Now if he considers which pyjamas....WHICH HE WILL.... he has also heard "bed at 7".....but hes not being asked to choose bed at 7, hes being told....though I gave him the illusion of choice....ie: 'CHOOSE YOUR PYJAMAS'.... while he's also accepting its bedtime at 7. Of course this isnt all there is to it....but its good enough for now They would have busted me on that one ! But then again 'Josh' seems easy to manage ? probably a stable home and good parents and all that . Three mischievous little boys under 6 , including twins ( not mine ) , from a broken distressed family - but great little guys , most of the time ; " We dont go to bed then and I want the Superman pajamas ! " ( which may or may not exist , who knows ? ) Ways were found, in any case, to achieve a result and I suppose I was just as 'sneaky' or even more so ; eldest, due to observed behavioral issues and known past trauma , needed serious body bodywork. Of course, he would have none of that . But he loved zooming around as an airplane and often had crashes . Airplanes need maintenance ! So the bed became a runway that he landed on, with his wings / arms outstretched, and the groups of little maintenance men would come out and run all over the plane, even up and down the Isles ( spine ) and clean out all the rubbish those darn passengers left behind between their seats ( vertebrae ) , check the wings, and wheels ( feet massage ) , maybe change the tires and ...... Edited October 2, 2016 by back to earth 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 2, 2016 #56 Share Posted October 2, 2016 23 hours ago, Debstermania said: True....do.. Did u rhyme on purpose? Yeah listen you( humanity) can suggest all you) they)want... who wants to turn their bum into crispy meat by wanting one of the seven circles? Not me thank you! I think not to send thee there, as if it were some Devi''s lair and hanged sinners feet dance upon the air, but since you mentioned seven circles (and not an elephant stacked on turtles ) under our earth , where life meets death and death meets birth, what could be more fun than to explore the sins one by one ; to Limbo lustfully under the bar, to feast and feed and never contain any wrathful violence of Disdain and curse the Lord our God in name ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 2, 2016 #57 Share Posted October 2, 2016 ..... not that I am suggesting anything , mind you 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielost Posted October 2, 2016 Author #58 Share Posted October 2, 2016 my problem is my parents told me that they hated me. after that it didn't matter too much what they did or said to me. don't tell your kids you hate them. you will do more damage than you think. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted October 2, 2016 #59 Share Posted October 2, 2016 42 minutes ago, danielost said: my problem is my parents told me that they hated me. after that it didn't matter too much what they did or said to me. don't tell your kids you hate them. you will do more damage than you think. First off that sucks. Second, if you hold what they say to be true then it will affect you until you die. You must rewrite that belief in order to resolves it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes4747 Posted October 3, 2016 #60 Share Posted October 3, 2016 3 hours ago, danielost said: my problem is my parents told me that they hated me. after that it didn't matter too much what they did or said to me. don't tell your kids you hate them. you will do more damage than you think. Xenos right! Re-write that script!! Daniel, the worth of a person isn't intelligence or money-or even my strikingly good looks!! My father was very critical of me, and I often wondered if was ever good enough for him. Pretty young I realized his opinion of me was just one of many. I'm free to be myself, and offer the best of me to the world. Stop wondering about who loves you, start thinking about who you love, what you love and be true to those people/ things!! Give them the best of you expecting nothing!! That came out a little commanding, I just hate to see someone suffer... Try it... Wish ya the best Daniel! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted October 3, 2016 #61 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Our perception of the external reality is based on our inner reality, To change your outer view, you must change the inner one. All those beliefs, desires, and emotions. In the inner realm thought is power. Beliefs is substance, so transmute those old useless beliefs through better thought into something more desirable. We all have our own thought-demons Daniel. I have trouble with self doubt and anxiety a lot more than I want to admit but I do. So you also must find something that will build you up in real time, real confidence. I got told I was stupid a lot as a kid, because I had trouble reading. It hurt for a long time, but what hurt the worst was when I started believing it. I had to rewire a lot of negative thinking and it took me years to feel somewhat intelligent. (I still question this though). Yet I make the effort to achieve what I think I can, do the same Daniel. You are not what they think you are. Open your mind and let go of those demons. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan max2 Posted October 3, 2016 #62 Share Posted October 3, 2016 3 minutes ago, XenoFish said: Our perception of the external reality is based on our inner reality, To change your outer view, you must change the inner one. All those beliefs, desires, and emotions. In the inner realm thought is power. Beliefs is substance, so transmute those old useless beliefs through better thought into something more desirable. We all have our own thought-demons Daniel. I have trouble with self doubt and anxiety a lot more than I want to admit but I do. So you also must find something that will build you up in real time, real confidence. I got told I was stupid a lot as a kid, because I had trouble reading. It hurt for a long time, but what hurt the worst was when I started believing it. I had to rewire a lot of negative thinking and it took me years to feel somewhat intelligent. (I still question this though). Yet I make the effort to achieve what I think I can, do the same Daniel. You are not what they think you are. Open your mind and let go of those demons. For what it's worth from the post I see I think you're pretty smart 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted October 3, 2016 #63 Share Posted October 3, 2016 2 minutes ago, spartan max2 said: For what it's worth from the post I see I think you're pretty smart Thanks. I often post about ideas and the power of thought on the forum. The reason being is that everything is a results of them. Our entire lives are built around our beliefs and assumptions. Magick taught me that. It taught me that to change my reality I had to change the way I thought about it. Sure confirmation bias explains the results of spell, but if I had not set the spell or sigil in motion would I have not been able to perceive the opportunity laid before me? I think not. To set a negative belief and to see realty through it is to reinforce an idea that may very well be false. If a person thinks themselves righteous they must act in a righteous manner. If not they are a walking falsehood, deceiving others, but worse deceiving themselves. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan max2 Posted October 3, 2016 #64 Share Posted October 3, 2016 1 minute ago, XenoFish said: Thanks. I often post about ideas and the power of thought on the forum. The reason being is that everything is a results of them. Our entire lives are built around our beliefs and assumptions. Magick taught me that. It taught me that to change my reality I had to change the way I thought about it. Sure confirmation bias explains the results of spell, but if I had not set the spell or sigil in motion would I have not been able to perceive the opportunity laid before me? I think not. To set a negative belief and to see realty through it is to reinforce an idea that may very well be false. If a person thinks themselves righteous they must act in a righteous manner. If not they are a walking falsehood, deceiving others, but worse deceiving themselves. Pretty much sums up cognitive behavioral therapy lol 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted October 3, 2016 #65 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Just now, spartan max2 said: Pretty much sums up cognitive behavioral therapy lol I read them things with words. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 3, 2016 #66 Share Posted October 3, 2016 4 hours ago, XenoFish said: First off that sucks. Second, if you hold what they say to be true then it will affect you until you die. You must rewrite that belief in order to resolves it. I think he did rewrite it , into some form of personal religion / salvation / God hope . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 3, 2016 #67 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, spartan max2 said: For what it's worth from the post I see I think you're pretty smart he has become emotionally smart ! L. Ron Hubbard junior , when exposing the ridiculousness 2 of Scientology's 'precepts' was asked why some members believed such craziness when many were very intelligent - doctors, lawyers , etc . Answer ; " They may have been intellectually smart, but they were not emotionally smart. Xenos smarts are 'self- forged' , a lot is in his posts but it is all 'scattered' , not presented in a systematic step by step approach. and that is because , in real life ( as opposed to any idea theory or systematic approach ) , thats how it is .... especially when pulling one's self up by ones own bootstraps. and more of a 'magical approach ' (trying himself the ' psychological technology' himself - psychonaut ) as opposed to a 'religious approach' of accepting and following the results of another 'psychonaut' and its 'accretions' (religion ) . Edited October 3, 2016 by back to earth 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back to earth Posted October 3, 2016 #68 Share Posted October 3, 2016 1 hour ago, XenoFish said: Thanks. I often post about ideas and the power of thought on the forum. The reason being is that everything is a results of them. Our entire lives are built around our beliefs and assumptions. Magick taught me that. It taught me that to change my reality I had to change the way I thought about it. You see! This is also the central theme of central 'magical initiation' ( ie. life, the rites before relate to birth, and those after, death ( combined with the 4 square solid foundation that allows one to 'build up' stable growth ) In the words from the ritual: To obtain Magical Power, learn to control thought; admit only those ideas that are in harmony with the end desired, and not every stray and contradictory Idea that presents itself. Fixed thought is a means to an end. Therefore pay attention to the power of silent thought and meditation. The material act is but the outward expression of thy thought, and therefore hath it been said that “the thought of foolishness is sin.” Thought is the commencement of action, and if a chance thought can produce much effect, what cannot fixed thought do? ........ I will continue this below so as to juxtapose the text as Xeno explains the 'navigation' through the ritual (even though he has never done it ) 1 hour ago, XenoFish said: Sure confirmation bias explains the results of spell, but if I had not set the spell or sigil in motion would I have not been able to perceive the opportunity laid before me? I think not. To set a negative belief and to see realty through it is to reinforce an idea that may very well be false. If a person thinks themselves righteous they must act in a righteous manner. If not they are a walking falsehood, deceiving others, but worse deceiving themselves. sound elemental theory ; I would add a variation : Inspiration is fire, we could call it 'an idea' ; that should be modified by water - how do we feel about it, then air, think about it, is it rational, what is the best way to manifest it. The earth, do it . " Therefore, as hath already been said, Establish thyself firmly in the equilibrium of forces, in the center of the Cross of the Elements, " As far as 'building us up' or 'knocking us down' too much ( and parents have much influence here ) ' Remember that this earth is but an atom in the universe, and that thou thyself art but an atom thereon, and that even couldst thou become the God of this earth whereon thou crawlest and grovellest, that thou wouldest, even then, be but an atom, and one amongst many. Nevertheless have the greatest self-respect, and to that end sin not against thyself. The sin which is unpardonable is knowingly and wilfully to reject truth, to fear knowledge lest that knowledge pander not to thy prejudices. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka CAT Posted October 3, 2016 #69 Share Posted October 3, 2016 23 hours ago, danielost said: my problem is my parents told me that they hated me. after that it didn't matter too much what they did or said to me. don't tell your kids you hate them. you will do more damage than you think. My sympathy. In the interest of healing, please see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Id3al Experience Posted October 18, 2016 #70 Share Posted October 18, 2016 On 9/16/2016 at 0:03 PM, seeder said: As a qualified hypnotherapist, I can assure you suggestion is real and powerful, but suggestion ISNT any form of magic Most ads on the TV are full of clever suggestions You are a hypnotherapist too? Fantastic me too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeder Posted October 18, 2016 #71 Share Posted October 18, 2016 19 minutes ago, The Id3al Experience said: You are a hypnotherapist too? Fantastic me too Ericksonian or authoritarian? My first few books were on the authoritarian slant...it got me interested. Then I discovered Milton Erickson, and that got me fascinated enough to study and obtain qualification. I remember reading Ericksons books and giggling at how crafty the old fella seemed...and how simple some of his metaphorical interventions were....which came to be known as teaching tales. The man was a genius trancemaster... Id have never believed you could induce a trance simply by shaking a mans hand... until I understood what Erickson was doing. He was one of the guys studied in the early formation of NLP. So I studied that too, got the certificate etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Id3al Experience Posted October 18, 2016 #72 Share Posted October 18, 2016 2 hours ago, seeder said: Ericksonian or authoritarian? My first few books were on the authoritarian slant...it got me interested. Then I discovered Milton Erickson, and that got me fascinated enough to study and obtain qualification. I remember reading Ericksons books and giggling at how crafty the old fella seemed...and how simple some of his metaphorical interventions were....which came to be known as teaching tales. The man was a genius trancemaster... Id have never believed you could induce a trance simply by shaking a mans hand... until I understood what Erickson was doing. He was one of the guys studied in the early formation of NLP. So I studied that too, got the certificate etc Yes both infact but certified im conversational hypnosis as i too love ericksons work. Im certified as nlp practitioner as well. Handshake induction is one of my personal favourites but the bantler version not the ambiguous touch version Erickson used 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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