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5yr-old dies after Doc refuses to see her


Eldorado

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A young girl suffering from asthma died hours after a GP refused to see her because she turned up "a few minutes late" for an emergency appointment.

Ellie-May Clark, five, died of an asthma attack after Dr Joanne Rowe allegedly refused to see her, the Mail on Sunday reported, despite having previously been warned the girl was at risk of having a life-threatening seizure.

At the Telegraph: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/26/five-year-old-girl-dies-gp-refused-see-minutes-late-appointment/

The doctor was suspended on full pay for six months.

Edited by Kismit
fixed title
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1 minute ago, seeder said:

 

Thats called a Holiday where Im from. Sad news indeed

Even sadder is this.....

"Dr Rowe claimed to have been "in the middle" of seeing a patient when Ellie-May arrived, but the surgery's computer system showed that was not the case."

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1 minute ago, Eldorado said:

Even sadder is this.....

"Dr Rowe claimed to have been "in the middle" of seeing a patient when Ellie-May arrived, but the surgery's computer system showed that was not the case."

 

Now that IS bad practice. Ive had 2 kids. well, not exactly "I" but you get the jist.... Id have gone ballistic if that was my one of my sons...

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2 hours ago, Eldorado said:

Even sadder is this.....

"Dr Rowe claimed to have been "in the middle" of seeing a patient when Ellie-May arrived, but the surgery's computer system showed that was not the case."

 

If the doc was trying to cover up, I suspect it will come out.  I can't imagine being a physician and knowing I could have saved a child but refused because of a scheduling error or a fit of pique. A five year old child....:no:

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I think I'm not understanding what an emergency appointment is?

Here, there's the Emergency room- no appointments, just walk in and wait your turn- it's for emergencies like your kid can't breathe, but not for things like you have the flu and need some antibiotics. Then there's walk in clinics, where you can have an appointment that day or walk in, depending on how the clinic sets itself up. It's for when you can't get into see your regular doctor right away and you do need to be seen like when you have the flu, but it isn't considered an emergency. But typically with those places if someone is having an emergency situation, they send them over to the emergency room. And then of course there are regular doctors.

I think it's terrible all they way around, but I'm also trying to figure out what the context of the medical system is there.

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2 hours ago, rashore said:

I think I'm not understanding what an emergency appointment is?

.

An emergency appointment is for when you want to see your family doctor the same day for something that's causing you real concern or discomfort but most likely doesn't require a visit to hospital.  The doctor's receptionists will tell you when you call to make this appointment if you're better getting yourself to a hospital.

If the receptionist is not sure they will go talk to your doctor and come back while you are on hold and give you the advice of the doctor or they may put you through to the doctor to talk.  You can even ask to speak to the doctor straight off.  If standing in the surgery, I've seen patients being ushered straight through and also seen the doctor come out and do some doctoring right there in the waiting room.

Edited by Eldorado
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Anyone else think there should be stiffer penalties for this? Geez. 

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1 minute ago, ChaosRose said:

Anyone else think there should be stiffer penalties for this? Geez. 

Most definitely.  Being late 4 bloody minutes?  How many times have we sat in doctor's offices waiting 20-30 mins past the time of our appointments? Those poor parents.

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This Doctor clearly didn't have the best interests of the patient at heart, Probably wanting to get home to a nice bottle of prosecco.

I was reading about this elsewhere where people were calling for zero tolerance with mistakes made by medical staff and calling for her to be struck off, I agree I think, She should be struck off, But what happened was not a mistake, It was neglect. People will make mistakes sometimes, This woman did not make a mistake and flat out refused to see a patient as according to her they were late, and it seems she used her power to play God, Yes I expect the family could maybe have taken her to an accident and emergency unit but maybe after the way they were treated by this so called doctor they were scared of the reaction they might have got and thought they could better  monitor the situation from home.

So sad and it makes me wonder what other horror stories we will be reading about/ on the receiving end of in the future.

 

 

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5 hours ago, rashore said:

I think I'm not understanding what an emergency appointment is?

Here, there's the Emergency room- no appointments, just walk in and wait your turn- it's for emergencies like your kid can't breathe, but not for things like you have the flu and need some antibiotics. Then there's walk in clinics, where you can have an appointment that day or walk in, depending on how the clinic sets itself up. It's for when you can't get into see your regular doctor right away and you do need to be seen like when you have the flu, but it isn't considered an emergency. But typically with those places if someone is having an emergency situation, they send them over to the emergency room. And then of course there are regular doctors.

I think it's terrible all they way around, but I'm also trying to figure out what the context of the medical system is there.

Indeed, this is a tragedy and that is not to be overlooked.  I do have some reservations though.

firstly, and I think this may just be bad reporting, but the start of the article states a paediatrician had warned the GP that the girl was at risk of a life threatening seizure.  However she died of an asthma attack.  

Then between being refused the appointment and the tragic death 5 hours transpired.  5 hours should have been ample time to attend an A&E department at a hospital, they are open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 days a year.  If the parents were concerned they could have just gone to the hospital, and would the GP really have been able to prevent an asthma attack 5 hours away?

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9 hours ago, Eldorado said:

A young girl suffering from asthma died hours after a GP refused to see her because she turned up "a few minutes late" for an emergency appointment.

Ellie-May Clark, five, died of an asthma attack after Dr Joanne Rowe allegedly refused to see her, the Mail on Sunday reported, despite having previously been warned the girl was at risk of having a life-threatening seizure.

At the Telegraph: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/26/five-year-old-girl-dies-gp-refused-see-minutes-late-appointment/

The doctor was suspended on full pay for six months.

Wasn't there just a topic on how inadequate UK hospitals have become?  This is horrible.

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No child should ever pass from something minor, my heart goes out to the family.  I don't want to hop on the bandwagon of hate towards the doctor either, It seems there is a serious issue over there with over worked and understaffed medical facilities, but damn it was just an asthma attack, easily treatable.

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Society has come a long way, but in the old days that was not too surprising in America. I am nearly 70, so I am talking about times 55 years ago.  When my first girlfriend was  a child of 11 she had pneumonia and trouble breathing.  The emergency room at the local hospital would not see her because her parents had no insurance and could not pay.  They were sent to a county clinic in another town that did the charity work.  That was just outside Dallas Texas in 1961. We are white, it was worse for Blacks and Hispanics.  People died of trivial causes because they couldn't pay. 

That is why there are such strong emotions around the Affordable Care Act, also called Obamacare in the USA.   Older people, especially minorities remember what it was like to pay or die. Charity hospitals, mostly religious, treated people but it wasn't until Reagan's  time that emergency rooms were obligated to treat everybody.   Many conservatives believe that basic health care, even emergency care is not a right.  Maybe they have a point, harking back to Ebeneezer Scrooge, it is a way to decrease the excess population. Kind of a harsh logic when you apply it to children. Ryan says repealing Obamacare will give Americans freedom to choose.  In some cases, that is a euphemism for pay or die.

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1 hour ago, EnderOTD said:

No child should ever pass from something minor, my heart goes out to the family.  I don't want to hop on the bandwagon of hate towards the doctor either, It seems there is a serious issue over there with over worked and understaffed medical facilities, but damn it was just an asthma attack, easily treatable.

It's not hate.  Shock and anger combined, maybe, but not hate.

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2 hours ago, Grey Area said:

Indeed, this is a tragedy and that is not to be overlooked.  I do have some reservations though.

firstly, and I think this may just be bad reporting, but the start of the article states a paediatrician had warned the GP that the girl was at risk of a life threatening seizure.  However she died of an asthma attack.  

Then between being refused the appointment and the tragic death 5 hours transpired.  5 hours should have been ample time to attend an A&E department at a hospital, they are open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 days a year.  If the parents were concerned they could have just gone to the hospital, and would the GP really have been able to prevent an asthma attack 5 hours away?

We don't know all the details but the mother and child will not just have been sent home without a further word.  She will have been told something, e.g. "go to hospital" or "come back tomorrow" or "there's nothing to worry about".

And yes, the GP may well have been able to prevent the asthma attack five hours away, by seeing the child and calling for an ambulance or telling them to go straight to hospital.  No?  You think the General Medical Council suspended them just for being rude?

Edited by Eldorado
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1 hour ago, Grey Area said:

firstly, and I think this may just be bad reporting, but the start of the article states a paediatrician had warned the GP that the girl was at risk of a life threatening seizure.  However she died of an asthma attack.  

I think they meant a life threatening asthma attack, that's what the BBC have reported.

Quote

Ellie-May had a history of severe asthma and had been treated five times in a hospital high dependency unit.

As the Mail on Sunday reported, Dr Rowe's practice had been warned by a paediatrician that Ellie-May was at risk of a life-threatening asthma attack.

She was sent home from school early on 26 January, 2015 because teachers were concerned her asthma was "deteriorating".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-39095656

Poor little girl, asthma can be very distressing. It's really disgusting how the Dr refused to see her, the little girl needed to be seen by a Dr, any Dr in the practice would have done even the practice nurse.

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1 minute ago, Still Waters said:

I think they meant a life threatening asthma attack, that's what the BBC have reported.

Poor little girl, asthma can be very distressing. It's really disgusting how the Dr refused to see her, the little girl needed to be seen by a Dr, any Dr in the practice would have done even the practice nurse.

That's what I've been wondering. Where was the Nurse and why didn't reception say, "Hold on and see the Nurse"?  We don't know everything though..... but it's a damned shame.  Poor wee lamb.

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2 minutes ago, Eldorado said:

That's what I've been wondering. Where was the Nurse and why didn't reception say, "Hold on and see the Nurse"?  We don't know everything though..... but it's a damned shame.  Poor wee lamb.

Further in the BBC article it says this -

Quote

The confidential report said reception staff rang through to Dr Rowe, but she shouted back at a receptionist "something like 'No I'm not seeing her, she's late'."

Dr Rowe claimed she was with another patient when she turned them away.

But the health board checked computer records at the surgery which showed the doctor did not see any patients between 16:55 and 17:20 after a number of cancellations that day.

The Serious Concern report also said reception staff were afraid of Dr Rowe, who was known for "repeated angry outbursts".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-39095656

It sounds like she had quite a reputation and the staff were too scared of her. 

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6 hours ago, Eldorado said:

 

An emergency appointment is for when you want to see your family doctor the same day for something that's causing you real concern or discomfort but most likely doesn't require a visit to hospital.  The doctor's receptionists will tell you when you call to make this appointment if you're better getting yourself to a hospital.

If the receptionist is not sure they will go talk to your doctor and come back while you are on hold and give you the advice of the doctor or they may put you through to the doctor to talk.  You can even ask to speak to the doctor straight off.  If standing in the surgery, I've seen patients being ushered straight through and also seen the doctor come out and do some doctoring right there in the waiting room.

 

2 hours ago, Grey Area said:

Indeed, this is a tragedy and that is not to be overlooked.  I do have some reservations though.

firstly, and I think this may just be bad reporting, but the start of the article states a pediatrician had warned the GP that the girl was at risk of a life threatening seizure.  However she died of an asthma attack.  

Then between being refused the appointment and the tragic death 5 hours transpired.  5 hours should have been ample time to attend an A&E department at a hospital, they are open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year.  If the parents were concerned they could have just gone to the hospital, and would the GP really have been able to prevent an asthma attack 5 hours away?

So what I'm understanding from these comments.. Is that the emergency appointment was with a GP that was within practice and had records. I assume A&E is Emergency room? As in even if the GP/Peds practice or even the walk in clinic turned them away for whatever reason (that should be addressed too).. the parents still had the option of taking their child into the Emergency Room/A&E?

Again, just trying to get a grasp on how that particular chain works there.

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2 minutes ago, rashore said:

 

So what I'm understanding from these comments.. Is that the emergency appointment was with a GP that was within practice and had records. I assume A&E is Emergency room? As in even if the GP/Peds practice or even the walk in clinic turned them away for whatever reason (that should be addressed too).. the parents still had the option of taking their child into the Emergency Room/A&E?

Again, just trying to get a grasp on how that particular chain works there.

Yes.

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5 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

Anyone else think there should be stiffer penalties for this? Geez. 

Like a charge of manslaughter, which is what it is as far as I can see.

Edited by ExpandMyMind
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Six months paid leave as a punishment.....

Sounds more like a reward 

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3 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Like a charge of manslaughter, which is what it is as far as I can see.

And what of the parents?  Do,you think it was responsible of them?  They clearly thought there was something wrong, walk in clinics are generally open until 8 - 9pm and A&E never closes, ambulances will take you straight there and keep you alive for the journey and there is a 24 hour hotline to call if you are unsure any symptoms are what constitutes an emergency.

while it is true, this GP's actions probably constitute malpractice, there is more here.  I'd be interested if there will be a serious case review, as a parent myself I cannot believe these parents simply gave up after the GP had turned them away.

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12 minutes ago, Grey Area said:

And what of the parents?  Do,you think it was responsible of them?  They clearly thought there was something wrong, walk in clinics are generally open until 8 - 9pm and A&E never closes, ambulances will take you straight there and keep you alive for the journey and there is a 24 hour hotline to call if you are unsure any symptoms are what constitutes an emergency.

while it is true, this GP's actions probably constitute malpractice, there is more here.  I'd be interested if there will be a serious case review, as a parent myself I cannot believe these parents simply gave up after the GP had turned them away.

Indeed there does seem to be some blame required for the parents (I'm not sure how they could possibly get over making such a mistake), but they aren't trained medical professionals, so not really at the same level of willful neglect in my opinion. 

Edited by ExpandMyMind
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