jimrich Posted March 11, 2017 #1 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Many years ago, I came upon the Conspiracy Theory of history, read a few books and attended some private meetings where Conspiracies and government "games" were discussed. It all made and still makes perfect sense to me but, since I am a very small ant in a very large ant-hill and did not have a computer back then nor the time to study all the weird and troubling details about Conspiracies, I dropped out of that mess for the sake of my own sanity. It was glaringly obvious to me that, unless one has a lot of time, money and courage, delving into these government and alien matters could get one hurt or KILLED. Then, about a year after 9/11, I began hearing very disturbing stories of government scams over the radio (Coast to Coast with George Noory) so, once again I dove into the 9/11 issue on line and ran up against a solid wall of dis-information, information I could not examine or verify for myself, HUGE bitter and even threatening anger, attacks and CONTEMPT in online forums and any place that 9/11 was mentioned. I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down by Direecte4 Energy Weapons and that the entire drama was carefully orchestrated and pulled off by teh Bush administration and our own government or factions within it and that there has been and most likely always will be Conspiracies and Secrets that, even if I came to know the truth, there is not a single things that I, the smallest ant, could ever do to fix what is wrong or broken in this or any other culture but would most likely suddenly disappear from the face of the earth after a visit from the "men in black". It amazes me that certain authors have been allowed to publish books explaining the dirty secrets behind 9/11 and a lot more mysterious events, but, perhaps even those works are part of the cover up and Conspiracies. I'm not in a position to examine or verify anything so, once again, I've returned to my hide-away int the ant=hlll and can only HOPE for the best. IMO, the Spiritual answer is correct = what will be, will be, this is it, nothing's wrong, the Absolute knows what it's doing, "He's got the whole world in his hands" and Things just happen - so do what you believe is right and just do the best you can..................... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted March 11, 2017 #2 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Or they're publishing fiction under the guise of truth. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlitterRose Posted March 11, 2017 #3 Share Posted March 11, 2017 I didn't like George W. I also thought he was an idiot. Idiots don't pull off masterminded plans. They muck things up and it's evident that they've been mucked up. If people can't look around and see that's what happened, I don't know how they could be enlightened. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abaddonire Posted March 11, 2017 #4 Share Posted March 11, 2017 4 hours ago, jimrich said: Many years ago, I came upon the Conspiracy Theory of history, read a few books and attended some private meetings where Conspiracies and government "games" were discussed. It all made and still makes perfect sense to me but, since I am a very small ant in a very large ant-hill and did not have a computer back then nor the time to study all the weird and troubling details about Conspiracies, I dropped out of that mess for the sake of my own sanity. And? 4 hours ago, jimrich said: It was glaringly obvious to me that, unless one has a lot of time, money and courage, delving into these government and alien matters could get one hurt or KILLED. Then, about a year after 9/11, I began hearing very disturbing stories of government scams over the radio (Coast to Coast with George Noory) so, once again I dove into the 9/11 issue on line and ran up against a solid wall of dis-information, information I could not examine or verify for myself, HUGE bitter and even threatening anger, attacks and CONTEMPT in online forums and any place that 9/11 was mentioned. 911 nonsense is worthy of contempt. 16 years of abject nothing. What respect is due to that? 4 hours ago, jimrich said: I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down by Direecte4 Energy Weapons and that the entire drama was carefully orchestrated and pulled off by teh Bush administration and our own government or factions within it and that there has been and most likely always will be Conspiracies and Secrets that, even if I came to know the truth, there is not a single things that I, the smallest ant, could ever do to fix what is wrong or broken in this or any other culture but would most likely suddenly disappear from the face of the earth after a visit from the "men in black". DEW? Really? Oh dear. Those are a fantasy. As are MIB. 4 hours ago, jimrich said: It amazes me that certain authors have been allowed to publish books explaining the dirty secrets behind 9/11 and a lot more mysterious events, but, perhaps even those works are part of the cover up and Conspiracies. Anyone can publish anything no matter how mad it is. The FBI, CIA et al. ignore it for the nonsense it is. 4 hours ago, jimrich said: I'm not in a position to examine or verify anything so, once again, I've returned to my hide-away int the ant=hlll and can only HOPE for the best. Except that you are, you simply ignore that in favour of being told what to think by CT proponents. Abdicating your own brain in that way is not a healthy thing. 4 hours ago, jimrich said: IMO, the Spiritual answer is correct = what will be, will be, this is it, nothing's wrong, the Absolute knows what it's doing, "He's got the whole world in his hands" and Things just happen - so do what you believe is right and just do the best you can..................... He who? Your particular flavour of deity? As opposed to all the other thousands of flavours of deity? I don't think so. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 27, 2017 Author #5 Share Posted March 27, 2017 On 3/11/2017 at 0:33 PM, Abaddonire said: I don't think so. what will be will be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 27, 2017 #6 Share Posted March 27, 2017 (edited) Are there government conspiracies? You betcha, and I think you won't find too many people on this forum who would disagree with that. Was 9/11 one of those conspiracies? Absolutely not, and every piece of evidence supports that conclusion. When you say "... I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down..." you hit the nail on the head: stories. I am guessing you tended to stick to pro-conspiracy sites? I say that because you also say that found contempt in online forums. What I am not seeing is evidence of a lot of investigation towards the various claims. For example, you say that directed energy weapons were used at 9/11. What sort of research did you do to confirm that these sort of weapons were even feasible on the scale we are talking about, and that they were used on the day in question? No gish-galloping or huge lists of links to conspiracy sites, please. Thank you. Edited March 27, 2017 by Obviousman Corrected syntax (insert missing word) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #7 Share Posted March 28, 2017 (edited) 11 hours ago, Obviousman said: Are there government conspiracies? You betcha, and I think you won't find too many people on this forum who would disagree with that. Jim: I wouldn't call them "government conspiracies"..... more like greedy human conspiracies that USE governments - all governments. Was 9/11 one of those conspiracies? Absolutely not, and every piece of evidence supports that conclusion. Jim: Show me your "evidence". I'll come to your home or office and examine your "evidence" for myself. Send me the address where you are keeping this "evidence". Are you an agent for the Super Rich Rulers who had the 9/11 drama enacted? When you say "... I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down..." you hit the nail on the head: stories. I am guessing you tended to stick to pro-conspiracy sites? I say that because you also say that found contempt in online forums. Jim: I stick to the TRUTH if and when I can find any. Pro-conspiracy sites are not much different than anti-conspiracy sites - they all rely on hearsay and speculation or just dumb beliefs. If I had access to any real "evidence" I'd stay off the internet for my own safety. Folks who "know too much" generally disappear without a trace! I am guessing that you work for the International Rulers who pay you to cruise the web and challenge anyone who says that 9/11 was a conspiracy at the highest levels. What I am not seeing is evidence of a lot of investigation towards the various claims. Jim: Exactly how would you know about any "investigations'? You are just parroting stuff you've heard or read about. Got any actual evidence or proofs? Are you part of the special group of insiders doing or not doing an "investigation" ? For example, you say that directed energy weapons were used at 9/11. Jim: NO! I did not say they were used, I said "I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down by Direecte4 Energy Weapons", which is another way of saying it's just my opinion based on HEARSAY! Already you are twisting and distorting my words! You must be an agent for the Rulers who planned and executed this heinous crime to get America into another lucrative war. How much are they paying you?. What sort of research did you do to confirm that these sort of weapons were even feasible on the scale we are talking about, and that they were used on the day in question? Jim; Just like you, I do not have the resources to do any personal research and, just like you, I am left with believing or not believing what others say about 9/11 so I base my OPINIONS on the writings of Judy Wood http://drjudywood.com/ No gish-galloping or huge lists of links to conspiracy sites, please. Jim: Not to worry. I am into TRUTH and not stupidly believing stuff from websites or the newspapers. Do your own "research" and show us your evidence and proof and then I might take you seriously. For now, you are no better than the conspiracy sites since you have nothing at all to show anyone. But you are definitely showing me that you represent the Conspirators. How much do they pay you to cruise the web and attack others beliefs??? I am OK with skeptics and dis-beliefs but I despise out right CONTEMPT. I am skeptical about a lot of things but I do not need to attack and insult others just because they see things differently than I do. But then, nobody is PAYING me to go on line and attack or malign others and their beliefs or assumptions. If someone has actual "evidence" - bring it on! Edited March 28, 2017 by jimrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #8 Share Posted March 28, 2017 I'm sorry, but you are the one making extraordinary claims, so you are the one who needs to provide the evidence. Are you able to back up your assertion with a single claim, and back up that claim with evidence? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #9 Share Posted March 28, 2017 45 minutes ago, jimrich said: But you are definitely showing me that you represent the Conspirators. How much do they pay you to cruise the web and debunk others??? That sort of accusation is frowned upon here. Let's just stick to claims regarding 9/11 and evidence to back them up. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #10 Share Posted March 28, 2017 11 hours ago, Obviousman said: Are there government conspiracies? You betcha, and I think you won't find too many people on this forum who would disagree with that. Was 9/11 one of those conspiracies? Absolutely not, and every piece of evidence supports that conclusion. When you say "... I am satisfied with some of the stories of how the towers were brought down..." you hit the nail on the head: stories. I am guessing you tended to stick to pro-conspiracy sites? I say that because you also say that found contempt in online forums. What I am not seeing is evidence of a lot of investigation towards the various claims. For example, you say that directed energy weapons were used at 9/11. What sort of research did you do to confirm that these sort of weapons were even feasible on the scale we are talking about, and that they were used on the day in question? No gish-galloping or huge lists of links to conspiracy sites, please. Thank you. IDK man I dont pretend to know the answers but I do tend to believe the witnesses who said bombs went off in the basement of the towers and the official story for tower 7 stinks to high heaven. There are alot of things about the official story that dont quite line up. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #11 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Oh - and I have researched many aspects of 9/11 and actually have professional expertise in one area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #12 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Just now, Farmer77 said: IDK man I dont pretend to know the answers but I do tend to believe the witnesses who said bombs went off in the basement of the towers and the official story for tower 7 stinks to high heaven. There are alot of things about the official story that dont quite line up. And you disregard the witnesses who saw the aircraft hit the towers? And the professionals who said that WTC7 would collapse because of the fire, debris, etc? And the firefighter who support them? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #13 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Just now, Obviousman said: And you disregard the witnesses who saw the aircraft hit the towers? And the professionals who said that WTC7 would collapse because of the fire, debris, etc? And the firefighter who support them? I never said an aircraft didnt hit the towers. I just dont believe they are what brought the towers down. As for the professionals what do you mean they said it would, you mean the famous "pull it comment" or is there something else im missing? You are aware there are professionals that contend just about every point of the official story right? Neither position can make a blanket statement about professional support. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #14 Share Posted March 28, 2017 14 minutes ago, Obviousman said: I'm sorry, but you are the one making extraordinary claims, so you are the one who needs to provide the evidence. Are you able to back up your assertion with a single claim, and back up that claim with evidence? You are the one making claims and assertions with: "Was 9/11 one of those conspiracies? Absolutely not, and every piece of evidence supports that conclusion" So bring on your evidence or admit that these are only your ill-informed OPINIONS. I have already said my concepts and assumptions are only my opinions but you continue to write as if you have proof and evidence. Quote That sort of accusation is frowned upon here. I apologize for saying that even if I personally believe it is true. Quote Let's just stick to claims regarding 9/11 and evidence to back them up. Yes, let's stick to some kind of facts and proofs starting with your evidence to back up your claims that the 9/11 attack was NOT a conspiracy at the highest levels. I am eager to examine your evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #15 Share Posted March 28, 2017 23 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: IDK man I dont pretend to know the answers but I do tend to believe the witnesses who said bombs went off in the basement of the towers and the official story for tower 7 stinks to high heaven. There are alot of things about the official story that dont quite line up. Read some of this: http://drjudywood.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #16 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Just now, jimrich said: Read some of this: http://drjudywood.com/ I spent YEARS deeply studying the issue. It really was one piece of my conversion from mindless nationalist to a vigilant citizen. Now though I really try and ignore it if im totally honest. It seems Americans are split on the issue with many I know simply having to ignore it in order to get on with their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #17 Share Posted March 28, 2017 15 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: I never said an aircraft didnt hit the towers. I just dont believe they are what brought the towers down. As for the professionals what do you mean they said it would, you mean the famous "pull it comment" or is there something else im missing? You are aware there are professionals that contend just about every point of the official story right? Neither position can make a blanket statement about professional support. Most of us are in the same boat = we only have hearsay or possibly tainted testimonies and videos to go on and very few ordinary folks have the ability to do their own research to gather genuine EVIDENCE about anything yet we argue and argue over second hand stories from questionable others. It all just comes down to personal beliefs!. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #18 Share Posted March 28, 2017 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: I spent YEARS deeply studying the issue. It really was one piece of my conversion from mindless nationalist to a vigilant citizen. Now though I really try and ignore it if im totally honest. It seems Americans are split on the issue with many I know simply having to ignore it in order to get on with their lives. I'd be interested to know what all you learned in those years of deep study. I tried to study it on line but quickly realized I had no way to verify any of the vast array of conflicting info out there so i just dropped it as another Pear Harbor style stunt that worked and got American mad enough to go to war thus putting a huge amount of $$$ and power into the pockets of the Hidden Rulers. I now ignore most conspiracies, like the Kennedy killings, Roswell UFO, Crop circles, Big Foot, Aliens, etc. because I am not able to do my own research and following this stuff second hand just makes me INSANE! Examining the IRS and the US tax code alone can make a person insane. Edited March 28, 2017 by jimrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #19 Share Posted March 28, 2017 6 minutes ago, jimrich said: Most of us are in the same boat = we only have hearsay or possibly tainted testimonies and videos to go on and very few ordinary folks have the ability to do their own research to gather genuine EVIDENCE about anything yet we argue and argue over second hand stories from questionable others. It all just comes down to personal beliefs!. Yeah ive seen too much first hand to trust the government 1 minute ago, jimrich said: I now ignore most conspiracies, like the Kennedy killings, Roswell UFO, Crop circles, Big Foot, Aliens, etc. because I am not able to do my own research and following this stuff second hand just makes me INSANE! Examining the IRS and the US tax code alone can make a person insane. Thats kind of ironic, for me after having spent those aforementioned years laser focused on the 9/11 conspiracy I find I can enjoy the pursuit of other stories/conspiracies because of the separation from emotion that time grants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #20 Share Posted March 28, 2017 19 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: As for the professionals what do you mean they said it would, you mean the famous "pull it comment" or is there something else im missing? You are aware there are professionals that contend just about every point of the official story right? Neither position can make a blanket statement about professional support. Sorry - I was referring to WTC7. The firefighters who saw the damage being caused, and said that the building would likely collapse. I wonder why they do not carry as much weight with you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #21 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Just now, Obviousman said: Sorry - I was referring to WTC7. The firefighters who saw the damage being caused, and said that the building would likely collapse. I wonder why they do not carry as much weight with you? What started the damage being caused is where the questioning comes in. You really dont find it odd that the only 3 steel buildings to collapse from fire were wtc 1, 2 and 7 which all happened to be owned by the same guy? To be totally honest , aside from the clip of the FF on 9/11 saying that building is gonna come down I havent heard any other FF speak on building 7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #22 Share Posted March 28, 2017 15 minutes ago, Obviousman said: Sorry - I was referring to WTC7. The firefighters who saw the damage being caused, and said that the building would likely collapse. I wonder why they do not carry as much weight with you? Is that what you consider EVIDENCE? There are 1000s of stories from 1000s of "witnesses" to say whatever anyone wants to hear. Is any of that "evidence"? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted March 28, 2017 #23 Share Posted March 28, 2017 21 minutes ago, jimrich said: You are the one making claims and assertions with: "Was 9/11 one of those conspiracies? Absolutely not, and every piece of evidence supports that conclusion" So bring on your evidence or admit that these are only your ill-informed OPINIONS. I have already said my concepts and assumptions are only my opinions but you continue to write as if you have proof and evidence. Yes, let's stick to some kind of facts and proofs starting with your evidence to back up your claims that the 9/11 attack was NOT a conspiracy at the highest levels. I am eager to examine your evidence. Perhaps you don't quite understand how a debate works, and that would explain some of your apparent exasperation. That 9/11 was the result of hijacking, that aircraft impacts caused the towers to collapse, etc is all accepted fact. I don't have to "prove" accepted fact. You are saying that the facts (or at least some of them) are wrong. You, therefore, should be able to supply the alternative and supply evidence to back up your assertion. You seem quite convinced you are right and I am wrong; can't you offer something to support your opinion? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted March 28, 2017 #24 Share Posted March 28, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Obviousman said: Perhaps you don't quite understand how a debate works, and that would explain some of your apparent exasperation. That 9/11 was the result of hijacking, that aircraft impacts caused the towers to collapse, etc is all accepted fact. I don't have to "prove" accepted fact. You are saying that the facts (or at least some of them) are wrong. You, therefore, should be able to supply the alternative and supply evidence to back up your assertion. You seem quite convinced you are right and I am wrong; can't you offer something to support your opinion? Accepted fact is a bit strong Half Of Americans Believe 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Majority of Americans Believe in 9/11 Conspiracies: Chapman U Fear Study perhaps government approved information would be better terminology Edited March 28, 2017 by Farmer77 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimrich Posted March 28, 2017 Author #25 Share Posted March 28, 2017 13 minutes ago, Obviousman said: Perhaps you don't quite understand how a debate works, and that would explain some of your apparent exasperation. That 9/11 was the result of hijacking, that aircraft impacts caused the towers to collapse, etc is all accepted fact. I don't have to "prove" accepted fact. You are saying that the facts (or at least some of them) are wrong. You, therefore, should be able to supply the alternative and supply evidence to back up your assertion. You seem quite convinced you are right and I am wrong; can't you offer something to support your opinion? You do not understand how a debate works. You offer your OPINIONS, unless you have solid evidence, and then I offer my OPINIONS or my solid evidence and then we can either agree, disagree or shut up. You are the one attacking my opinions as if your opinions are facts so, back up your opinions. Quote That 9/11 was the result of hijacking, that aircraft impacts caused the towers to collapse, etc is all accepted fact. They may be "accepted facts" to you but they are NOT accepted facts to me. I cannot prove they are not facts and you cannot prove they are facts. You are just relying on hearsay and suppositions, IMO. Quote You are saying that the facts (or at least some of them) are wrong. I have not yet said the facts are wrong. I said I do not BELIEVE them and you are continuing to twist and distort my words so this is going to be my last reply to your offensive distortions of what I say here. Quote You seem quite convinced you are right and I am wrong; I have not said you are "wrong" and I am "right". i have said again and again that I believe such and such and so do you - since you cannot or will not offer any "evidence" to support your beliefs and opinions. I'm done speaking with you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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