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Trump's Budget for 2018


Claire.

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50 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

I'd agree. Those that can leave are leaving. People vote with their feet. The "system" in some of the larger cities is completely broken. People in power promise to fix things and don't, so people leave. And then those same people who failed remain in office because they promise even more to those who remain, who keep voting for them.

The way the system for local schools is set up is that they are usually dependent on the local tax economy, which is often property taxes. The rich and middle class leaving drops property values. When the property values drop, then the money for schools drops even faster, resulting in super bad schools, and lack of opportunities for many. This leads to a spiral which results in more crime, more people leaving, and even more poverty and crime.

Not that I blame those people who are leaving.... 

I'm not sure if it is a political/governance problem, or a economic one. But, clearly in many of these really bad cities, it is Democrats who have been in control for, in many times, decades....

It's a governance problem; as it is in the States people have to vote to be annexed to a city and no suburbanite with any sense is going to vote to have their taxes doubled and their teacher salaries halved.

Some countries have central agencies that periodically redraw boundaries to reflect actual settlement patterns and force suburbs into the cities.  While the suburbs don't like it, the cities are given a chance to survive and the suburban voters are suddenly of interest to city governments.

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18 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

McCain is relatively independent as a thinker, although basically conservative, not a "party man."  He just won re-election and will probably retire at the end of this term, so he is not worried about the political consequences and will probably do what he thinks is right, without being flaky about it.

McCain is from Arizona, which did go for Trump last year, but not by much. I think he's trying to play more down the middle in order to retain his seat. At least to a degree. He might retire, but maybe not. So many politicians try to hold on right up to where they're basically on death's door.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election_in_Arizona,_2016

Edited by DieChecker
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12 hours ago, Frank Merton said:

McCain is relatively independent as a thinker, although basically conservative, not a "party man."  He just won re-election and will probably retire at the end of this term, so he is not worried about the political consequences and will probably do what he thinks is right, without being flaky about it.

Man you're an optimist ! LOL....IMO I dont know if Mccain has ever done what was truly right 

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21 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Man you're an optimist ! LOL....IMO I dont know if Mccain has ever done what was truly right 

And you are a straw man constructionist.

He said "what he thinks is right," not "what Farmer thinks is right."

Harte

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23 minutes ago, Harte said:

And you are a straw man constructionist.

He said "what he thinks is right," not "what Farmer thinks is right."

Harte

That's not what Farmer said.  Farmer meant that McCain doing what he thinks is right has never been truly right.  

Frank also said "an independent thinker."   Is McCain the "Maverick" that he's been sold to us as by the mainstream media 10,000 times?   Not at all.   If you're genuinely critical of the chorus lines from the MSM, you'll agree with that too.   o/w all it takes is a look at the foreign policy.  Like the media, John McCain thinks he's a Maverick too though, and of course John McCain thinks he's right.   So is John McCain right, or is Farmer right about McCain being chronically wrong?

 

Sometimes he's right, like when he's arguing with people who think the USAF doesn't need a dedicated close air support aircraft. 

https://youtu.be/_up7IHd3LDs

Just listen to the general saying the 2015 budget wasn't enough not to have cuts all over the place.  If I was running the Air Force the A-10 would be the last thing to get cuts.   I think what the bureaucrats were really telling him was that using a slower and relatively more vulnerable aircraft isn't necessary when they can streak in and out at supersonic speed instead.    Who cares about cost, right?   It's spare of no expense.

Who are we even providing close air support for?   The Iraqi government?   it's closely allied with Iran now congratulations.   The Syrian govt?   Assad Must Go and nobody on TV thought he was a bad guy more (and more often) than Fox News Channel did.   Or is it really the "moderate rebels" who are getting all those F-16 sorties?   Who's that, I wonder?   It's a shame we don't spend our military dollars more wisely.   :(

Edited by Yamato
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Frank never said a word about McCain being right. Just that McCain will probably do what he thinks is right.

I don't know if what McCain thinks is right is actually right.

I have my own opinions, but I'm humble enough (believe it or not) to recognize that I can't judge whether what McCain thinks is right is right, or even to judge exactly what would be right, in many cases.

I know that McCain has at times been a thorn in the side of his own party, or appeared to be. That tells me he's not simply a party line pol.

I think there may be some meaning to that fact, but I don't know if that has any real significance or not.

Harte

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58 minutes ago, Harte said:

Frank never said a word about McCain being right. Just that McCain will probably do what he thinks is right.

I don't know if what McCain thinks is right is actually right.

I have my own opinions, but I'm humble enough (believe it or not) to recognize that I can't judge whether what McCain thinks is right is right, or even to judge exactly what would be right, in many cases.

I know that McCain has at times been a thorn in the side of his own party, or appeared to be. That tells me he's not simply a party line pol.

I think there may be some meaning to that fact, but I don't know if that has any real significance or not.

Harte

When I was hot and heavy with the republican party in the early 'oughts McCain was hated by the party. Im pretty sure the term RINO was invented for him 

My opposition to McCain is that he is a warmonger. He carries the military industrial complex's water all day every day and as I said above if it were up to him we would be at war with Russia right now. He also is all for arming terrorists in Syria, which clearly only perpetuates war and military industrial complex profits.   

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9 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

When I was hot and heavy with the republican party in the early 'oughts McCain was hated by the party. Im pretty sure the term RINO was invented for him 

My opposition to McCain is that he is a warmonger. He carries the military industrial complex's water all day every day and as I said above if it were up to him we would be at war with Russia right now. He also is all for arming terrorists in Syria, which clearly only perpetuates war and military industrial complex profits.   

I just don't have that impression about him.  I certainly doubt we would be at war with Russia now, as if it got to that point the Russians would back down (they go as far as they can go and constantly test the West's unity and determination).  

I am in favor of arming the freedom fighters in Syria -- not the "terrorists" -- a distinction can be made and failing to make it causes a lot of people to not clearly understand the issues.

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3 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

I just don't have that impression about him.  I certainly doubt we would be at war with Russia now, as if it got to that point the Russians would back down (they go as far as they can go and constantly test the West's unity and determination).  

I am in favor of arming the freedom fighters in Syria -- not the "terrorists" -- a distinction can be made and failing to make it causes a lot of people to not clearly understand the issues.

I dont agree that a distinction can be made.Amnesty report: ISIS armed with U.S. weapons 

A new report from a prominent human rights group has found that ISIS has built a substantial arsenal, including U.S.-made weapons obtained from the Iraqi army and Syrian opposition groups.

Or at least I dont know if one is being made: Al Qaeda In Syria Changed Its Name And Now The US Is Arming Them 

Though many scoffed when the Al Qaeda affiliate in Syria, Jabhat Al-Nusra, rebranded itself Jabhat Fateh Al-Shamthat cosmetic change was apparently enough to convince the US government to start sending them arms.

I also dont agree that theyre freedom fighters, or at least that theyre freedom fighters we should be arming. Theyre islamists trying to take out a leader who isnt an islamic extremist and who posed no threat to the US. 

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5 hours ago, Frank Merton said:

I just don't have that impression about him.  I certainly doubt we would be at war with Russia now, as if it got to that point the Russians would back down (they go as far as they can go and constantly test the West's unity and determination).  

I am in favor of arming the freedom fighters in Syria -- not the "terrorists" -- a distinction can be made and failing to make it causes a lot of people to not clearly understand the issues.

Just... :no: 

What i like about these assertions of yours is that they're spoken with the voice of absolute authority. Have you told us what is the source of your information that you're so absolutely certain about? 

 

Edited by Manfred von Dreidecker
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On 3/26/2017 at 1:25 AM, Yamato said:

Do you think drones are humanitarian when compared to...bombs being dropped by piloted aircraft?    

You're lucky LBJ isn't President.  :)    You're safe on a technicality.  

But the neocon government you constantly defend is cut from the same cloth as the Vietnam war.   If they don't get their war they scream like babies and cowards and mess the country's bed till they get it.   Now that they're all lubed up with oil for the past 30 years they're feeling the entitlement to endless war in the Middle East courtesy of Joe the Taxpayer, replete with policy excuses that make no sense.    Ex. Arming Al Qaeda to fight Assad in a "war on terror".   So there's no principle there.   A few buffoons from the bureau blab loudly enough and if they convince enough politicians that bombing Laos and Cambodia again is a good idea, you'll be getting them dropped on your head.   Does it really matter to the principle what kind of plane delivers the ordnance?

Bad news yammie, some more of your favorite guys got taken out, this time the ISIS war minister.  Time to ratchet up your foaming at the mouth diatribes Bad news 

"Today it was announced that ISIS’s deputy leader has been killed in air strike in Iraq.

…’The air force’s planes executed with accuracy a strike on the headquarters of Daesh in al-Qaim… resulting in the killing of Ayad al-Jumaili, alias Abu Yahya, the war minister,” said state TV, citing a statement from the directorate of military intelligence.

Iraqi forces, backed by a US-led coalition, have been battling since October to retake the city of Mosul, ISIS’ stronghold in Iraq and the city where Baghdadi declared a ‘caliphate’ nearly three years ago. […]

US and Iraqi officials believe Baghdadi has left operational commanders with diehard followers to fight the battle of Mosul, and is now hiding out in the desert with senior commanders.

That is two big ISIS leaders in three days.  Sorry (not really) yammie and even worse (for you), we are just getting started.   Hope your head explodes yamster.  

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36 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

Bad news yammie, some more of your favorite guys got taken out, this time the ISIS war minister.  Time to ratchet up your foaming at the mouth diatribes Bad news 

"Today it was announced that ISIS’s deputy leader has been killed in air strike in Iraq.

…’The air force’s planes executed with accuracy a strike on the headquarters of Daesh in al-Qaim… resulting in the killing of Ayad al-Jumaili, alias Abu Yahya, the war minister,” said state TV, citing a statement from the directorate of military intelligence.

Iraqi forces, backed by a US-led coalition, have been battling since October to retake the city of Mosul, ISIS’ stronghold in Iraq and the city where Baghdadi declared a ‘caliphate’ nearly three years ago. […]

US and Iraqi officials believe Baghdadi has left operational commanders with diehard followers to fight the battle of Mosul, and is now hiding out in the desert with senior commanders.

That is two big ISIS leaders in three days.  Sorry (not really) yammie and even worse (for you), we are just getting started.   Hope your head explodes yamster.  

So pentagon forces took out a CIA asset , why would @Yamato be upset with that? 

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15 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

Bad news yammie, some more of your favorite guys got taken out, this time the ISIS war minister.  Time to ratchet up your foaming at the mouth diatribes Bad news 

"Today it was announced that ISIS’s deputy leader has been killed in air strike in Iraq.

…’The air force’s planes executed with accuracy a strike on the headquarters of Daesh in al-Qaim… resulting in the killing of Ayad al-Jumaili, alias Abu Yahya, the war minister,” said state TV, citing a statement from the directorate of military intelligence.

Iraqi forces, backed by a US-led coalition, have been battling since October to retake the city of Mosul, ISIS’ stronghold in Iraq and the city where Baghdadi declared a ‘caliphate’ nearly three years ago. […]

US and Iraqi officials believe Baghdadi has left operational commanders with diehard followers to fight the battle of Mosul, and is now hiding out in the desert with senior commanders.

That is two big ISIS leaders in three days.  Sorry (not really) yammie and even worse (for you), we are just getting started.   Hope your head explodes yamster.  

Meh.  I haven't been led to believe what we have to worry about over there is contained by "ISIS".   I don't trust that Obama (or Trump) know the good guys from the bad guys, and there's plenty of reason not to.   Do you continue to support arming Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups?   Or do you join me in protesting it?    How can you get away with continuing this schizophrenic policy?   By invoking the Obama Administration's and the mainstream media's fables about ISIS!

Let's face it.  You got duped, bro.  You bought the kool aid that Barack Obama and the Leftist media was selling you and you never even questioned it.   

We're going to kill Baghdadi himself and not defeat the ISIS we've created.   We'll win another city and get the same results, a continuing need for endless subsidies, occupation, damage and debt.   How many more times Merc?   How many more brain injuries and mental illness?   How many more years of occupation are there?   How are you going to pay for it?  

Once again it's like I often say, you don't really disagree with Obama.   The politically safe and minor disagreements you raise with Democrats are what Ron Paul would call "fluff".   But on the major policies, you're a lockstep Obama supporter.

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10 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

So pentagon forces took out a CIA asset , why would @Yamato be upset with that? 

LMAO.  

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8 minutes ago, Yamato said:

Meh.  I haven't been led to believe what we have to worry about over there is contained by "ISIS".   I don't trust that Obama (or Trump) know the good guys from the bad guys, and there's plenty of reason not to.   Do you continue to support arming Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups?  

When did I ever support arming Al Qaeda yammie?  Are you lying again you yammie?  You know what happens when you lie to or about me don't you yammie?   

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Or do you join me in protesting it?

You protest everything yammie, I wouldn't join you in anything because you are certifiable.

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   How can you get away with continuing this schizophrenic policy? 

Umm....I don't make policy in this country yamster.

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  By invoking the Obama Administration's and the mainstream media's fables about ISIS!

This is where it gets fun folks.  This is where we all get to take a look down a wackadoo rabbit hole.  So yamster, why don't you tell us why you think ISIS is a fable.

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Let's face it.  You got duped, bro.  You bought the kool aid that Barack Obama and the Leftist media was selling you and you never even questioned it.   

We're going to kill Baghdadi himself and not defeat the ISIS we've created.   We'll win another city and get the same results, a continuing need for endless subsidies, occupation, damage and debt.   How many more times Merc?   How many more brain injuries and mental illness?   How many more years of occupation are there?   How are you going to pay for it?  

Once again it's like I often say, you don't really disagree with Obama.   The politically safe and minor disagreements you raise with Democrats are what Ron Paul would call "fluff".   But on the major policies, you're a lockstep Obama supporter.

 

Didn't bother reading as we all know where this is going.  

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59 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

When did I ever support arming Al Qaeda yammie?  Are you lying again you yammie?  You know what happens when you lie to or about me don't you yammie?   

You protest everything yammie, I wouldn't join you in anything because you are certifiable.

Umm....I don't make policy in this country yamster.

This is where it gets fun folks.  This is where we all get to take a look down a wackadoo rabbit hole.  So yamster, why don't you tell us why you think ISIS is a fable.

Didn't bother reading as we all know where this is going.  

Well you're welcome to lose your virginity and speak out against arming Al Qaeda right here for your very first time.   I'll be good with that.  :)

 

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So yamster, why don't you tell us why you think ISIS is a fable.

Because it's unbelievable that the Middle East's armies with hundreds of thousands of troops, millions of troops combined, need our help to defeat 15,000.   Because of your "Leftist Media's" green screen beheadings and over $500 million of Pentagon make-believe.

If Al Qaeda can change their name and dupe us into helping them, why wouldn't I believe we'll be helping ISIS in a few years after they change their name?   When not even 9/11 is enough to wake you up enough to join me in protesting our tax money going to Al Qaeda?    The lid is off.  You'll fall for whatever gang of thugs they want to arm next, why would I expect anything less?

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5 hours ago, Merc14 said:

Today it was announced that ISIS’s deputy leader has been killed in air strike in Iraq.

…’The air force’s planes executed with accuracy a strike on the headquarters of Daesh in al-Qaim… resulting in the killing of Ayad al-Jumaili, alias Abu Yahya, the war minister,” said state TV, citing a statement from the directorate of military intell

Yet again? It's like Kenny from South Park. it's like Dr. Evil's Minions. However do they get anyone for that position? "Ooh, Deputy Leader, that sounds a prestigious and no doubt highly remunerative position." "Yes, Abdullah. Only one snag; you get killed every two weeks."

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3 hours ago, Yamato said:

Well you're welcome to lose your virginity and speak out against arming Al Qaeda right here for your very first time.   I'll be good with that.  :)

 

Because it's unbelievable that the Middle East's armies with hundreds of thousands of troops, millions of troops combined, need our help to defeat 15,000.   Because of your "Leftist Media's" green screen beheadings and over $500 million of Pentagon make-believe.

If Al Qaeda can change their name and dupe us into helping them, why wouldn't I believe we'll be helping ISIS in a few years after they change their name?   When not even 9/11 is enough to wake you up enough to join me in protesting our tax money going to Al Qaeda?    The lid is off.  You'll fall for whatever gang of thugs they want to arm next, why would I expect anything less?

 

 

Edited by Farmer77
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On 3/24/2017 at 0:07 PM, MstrMsn said:

We're waiting for Puerto Rico to make up it's mind about joining the union. Maybe just keep the moon a US territory?

It would probably be less expensive than keeping Puerto Rico for anything ;) 

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Just now, and then said:

It would probably be less expensive than keeping Puerto Rico for anything ;) 

Hang on now, coffee and chocolate can grow in PR. We might wanna hang on to them! 

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9 hours ago, Yamato said:

Well you're welcome to lose your virginity and speak out against arming Al Qaeda right here for your very first time.   I'll be good with that.  :)

You mean when Hillary and Obama overthrew Qaddafi and allowed the Syrian rebels and therefore ISIS access to his advanced weapons?  I spoke out about that a lot yammie, where the F were you?

9 hours ago, Yamato said:

Because it's unbelievable that the Middle East's armies with hundreds of thousands of troops, millions of troops combined, need our help to defeat 15,000.   Because of your "Leftist Media's" green screen beheadings and over $500 million of Pentagon make-believe.

Which just proves how little you comprehend about armed conflict.  Also, yammie, you just lied again!  Unbelievable!  I'll asjk you for proof that thos beheadings were green screened and keep asking, you liar, unless you admit you were simply foaming at the mouth angry when you posted that and were making things up to suit you delusions.

9 hours ago, Yamato said:

If Al Qaeda can change their name and dupe us into helping them, why wouldn't I believe we'll be helping ISIS in a few years after they change their name?   When not even 9/11 is enough to wake you up enough to join me in protesting our tax money going to Al Qaeda?    The lid is off.  You'll fall for whatever gang of thugs they want to arm next, why would I expect anything less?

Asking for more proof that ISIS and Al Qaeda are the same thing.  

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