Trump weighing military options in Syria

[Space Commander Travis]

11 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

The damn thing would be well over by now and Syria would be like Egypt is now except for the intervention of the Russians.  

Syria would be like Egypt is now? You don't think it might be like Libya is now? Why do you think it would be a peaceful hardline dictatorship (at least you do recognize that it would be a hardline dictatorship and not some "democratic" fantasy) and not a totally disintegrated state full of factional fighting and several competing "governments", while providing a breeding ground for terrorists? Do you imagine that the "Good" rebels (the ones affiliated to Al Qaeda) would be victorious, rather than the much better organised and unified ISIS? 

 

[+DieChecker]

6 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Here's what I don't get... the media's security experts used The Tokyo Subway occurred in an ideal environment; but, was comparitively ineffective when compared to other possible methods of attack.

Would any military consider this method worthwhile?

Sure... Imagine if a military wanted to invade some city that was giving resistance. They drop some sarin on it. Maybe near known barracks areas. And then two hours later they invade the city. The sarin is 90% gone, so the most your guys are going to get is some runny noses and a headache, while the other guy might be 50% incapacitated. And.... zero material damage. The buildings, weapons, equipment is all still at 100%. 

What other way can you incapacitate a bunch of people, and still have their equipment and buildings completely functional? And risk (close) to zero of your own people?

[The Silver Thong]

27 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

The damn thing would be well over by now and Syria would be like Egypt is now except for the intervention of the Russians.  They hold the blame for this, and they are also to blame for encouraging the barbarity with which Damascus has carried out its war, causing all the refugees.

I think, from an American perspective, that the US is better off steering clear -- although I have no idea what promises were made to the Saudis -- who certainly do not want a Russian/Iranian domination of Syria.

From the point of view of justice, the Russians should have their noses chopped off.

You do understand it was the United States that created Isis right. Russia went in and cleaned house. The US knows how to make a mess but not clean up after themselves. Don`t be such a fool Frank. It takes 10 min of looking to see that your deluded.

[Frank Merton]

Just now, The Silver Thong said:

You do understand it was the United States that created Isis right. Russia went in and cleaned house. The US knows how to make a mess but not clean up after themselves. Don`t be such a fool Frank. It takes 10 min of looking to see that your deluded.

That is disinformation.  Please provide source.

[Frank Merton]

11 minutes ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

Syria would be like Egypt is now? You don't think it might be like Libya is now? Why do you think it would be a peaceful hardline dictatorship (at least you do recognize that it would be a hardline dictatorship and not some "democratic" fantasy) and not a totally disintegrated state full of factional fighting and several competing "governments", while providing a breeding ground for terrorists? Do you imagine that the "Good" rebels (the ones affiliated to Al Qaeda) would be victorious, rather than the much better organised and unified ISIS? 

 

It might be like Libya -- the two aren't that different.  The point is that the Arab Spring produced a set of quasi-Autocratic military governments opposed to Muslim Extremism.  In Syria the Russians have brought about something quite different and much worse.

[Yamato]

30 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

The damn thing would be well over by now and Syria would be like Egypt is now except for the intervention of the Russians.  They hold the blame for this, and they are also to blame for encouraging the barbarity with which Damascus has carried out its war, causing all the refugees.

From the point of view of justice, the Russians should have their noses chopped off.

The Russians should continue following conventions of international law and respecting the sovereignty that countries like Syria enjoy under it.

Conversely if countries like Cambodia think they can go around the world violating the law and attacking whoever they want for whatever reason, like some fake video production they scrap together on a green screen...they should be wiped off the map for it "from the point of view of justice."

Abraham Lincoln is overrated too.   We encourage that barbarity in every public elementary school in America, yet we're the only western colonial power who allegedly needed a civil war to free the slaves.

To actually believe that Syria would be like Egypt is to be incapable of distinguishing ISIS from the common Egyptian.   Those weren't terrorists camping out on Tahrir Square, they were families who wanted better futures for their children than another 30 years of Mubarak puppetry.  

As it turns out it doesn't matter who's running Egypt, they still get their free bilk money from American patriots who know everything about Islam.

[The Silver Thong]

8 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

That is disinformation.  Please provide source.

I will keep this short.

We know the truth you do not

 

Edited May 25, 2017 by The Silver Thong
add

[+DieChecker]

Didn't see this posted yet....

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2017-05-23/un-chemical-experts-found-sarin-exposure-in-syria-attack

Quote

UNITED NATIONS (AP) — A team from the international chemical weapons watchdog found exposure "to sarin or a sarin-like substance" in samples from an April 4 attack in northern Syria that killed over 90 people and now wants to visit the opposition-held town of Khan Sheikhoun, a senior U.N. official said Tuesday.

U.N. disarmament chief Izumi Nakamitsu told the U.N. Security Council that the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons also submitted a report into the alleged use of chemical weapons near Um Hosh in the Aleppo countryside on Sept. 16, 2016 which indicated the use of "sulfur mustard."

Quote

In the attack in the area of Um Hosh last Sept. 16, Nakamitsu said an OPCW team was deployed at the request of the Syrian government but wasn't able to visit the site.

She said a review of blood samples from two women victims of the alleged attack indicated exposure to sulfur mustard. The team also evaluated a mortar reported to be connected to the incident that was handed over by Russian experts, she said, and "laboratory analysis indicated that this mortar contained sulfur mustard."

As for Khan Sheikhoun, Nakamitsu said the fact-finding mission's report said their team conducted interviews with victims of the alleged attack and witnessed the collection of biomedical samples from casualties in an unidentified neighboring country.

UN is still collecting data/samples/testimonies.

 

Edited May 25, 2017 by DieChecker

[The Silver Thong]

This was done for a reason. Mass imigration to keep the war going and taking rights away. It`s really that simple.

[+DieChecker]

6 minutes ago, The Silver Thong said:

This was done for a reason. Mass imigration to keep the war going and taking rights away. It`s really that simple.

I wonder if these are the 65,000 refugees Clinton wanted to bring into the US?

[The Silver Thong]

If one has 3 brain cells they can figure out a war on terror will never end never Frank. Hmmm explaine why that is true or not.

[The Silver Thong]

1 minute ago, DieChecker said:

I wonder if these are the 65,000 refugees Clinton wanted to bring into the US?

Spooky, at least in my opinion.

[The Silver Thong]

There will be another terroist attack soon. France, Britain, Germany, the US possibly Sweden even Canada. WE know what the problem is but social justice  Warriors don`t care. Kinda of an oxymoron right. We are so screwed.

[Yamato]

7 minutes ago, The Silver Thong said:

If one has 3 brain cells they can figure out a war on terror will never end never Frank. Hmmm explaine why that is true or not.

Not just Frank, I raise this winning the war-on-terror question to anyone here who agrees with Trump's "military options" in Syria.  --> Anyone who is gullible enough to actually believe in the blizzard of nonsense called the "war on terror" in the first place.

If Frank's the first one in line, he gets the first pie in the face though, absolutely.

[Yamato]

There will be another terrorist attack and another one after that, because Trump's popular "military options in Syria" aren't going to secure a military victory in the "war on terror".

At some point after all this failing and all this losing, all these lies and all this nonsense that o/w intelligent people actually believe.... it'd be nice to just stop.   Neocons make Progressives look like geniuses.  

But I Just Say No to endless war, I must be a kook.

[The Silver Thong]

2 minutes ago, Yamato said:

Not just Frank, I raise this winning the war-on-terror question to anyone here who agrees with Trump's "military options" in Syria.  --> Anyone who is gullible enough to actually believe in the blizzard of nonsense called the "war on terror" in the first place.

If Frank's the first one in line, he gets the first pie in the face though, absolutely.

I have to agree on that, it`s manufactured. Not that it`s not happening but why and how. Most people have no clue bugs me.

[The Silver Thong]

5 minutes ago, Yamato said:

.  

But I Just Say No to endless war, I must be a kook.

All it takes is a few attacks a year and the war goes on. It;s like fighting a ghost

[+DieChecker]

53 minutes ago, The Silver Thong said:

There will be another terroist attack soon. France, Britain, Germany, the US possibly Sweden even Canada. WE know what the problem is but social justice  Warriors don`t care. Kinda of an oxymoron right. We are so screwed.

When you have to prove how tolerant you are by allowing your own people to suffer, I think that is idiotic. Help where you can, but protect yourself first, is what I practice in my life.

[+DieChecker]

50 minutes ago, Yamato said:

There will be another terrorist attack and another one after that, because Trump's popular "military options in Syria" aren't going to secure a military victory in the "war on terror".

At some point after all this failing and all this losing, all these lies and all this nonsense that o/w intelligent people actually believe.... it'd be nice to just stop.   Neocons make Progressives look like geniuses.  

But I Just Say No to endless war, I must be a kook.

Wait... I thought some "Progressives" were Neocons?? In today's political rainbow, it is possible to be both it seems...

[Yamato]

2 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Wait... I thought some "Progressives" were Neocons?? In today's political rainbow, it is possible to be both it seems...

The only defining issue for a neocon is foreign policy.   They're fiscally conservative, in their dreams.  And they're indistinguishable from regular conservatives on social issues.  

Make absolutely no progress in neocon foreign policy (regime change in oil rich countries like Iraq and Syria) in 15 years, give them a dum dum on the way out, and they'll go home happy.  

Progressives are more demanding, they demand progress.   So I wouldn't insult a progressive by calling them a neocon.   Neocons are happy to wage America's longest war forever.

[Phaeton80]

Luckily, The Donald just secured hundreds of millions of dollars worth of arms deals, and jobs - jobs - jobs, from the Saudi's (who are themselves engaged in a horrific [illegal] war in Yemen)! No doubt implicitly gathering support for an Iranian engagement, as desired by our beloved allies the Israeli's since the early nineties.

This ideological and monetary heimat of the Wahhabi school of thought, Saudi Arabia, beheading people on a monthly basis and the nation sporting just about the worst womens rights environment imaginable, will assuredly help us battle.. the most extreme outwash of Wahhabism; ISIS. You know, the very synthetic entity we love to implicate and condemn the whole of Islam with. Yeay! Cuz thats how we roll here in the West. We bomb the hell out of sovereign nations without senate or international approval to supply 'democracy', create power vacuums so extremist elements can prosper anabated.. Attempt to label Russia and its head of state as the enemy, destroying the terrorists we support in our efforts to oust Al Assad.. To subsequently go on royal audience to re instate and re confirm our political and economical ties to the very source of the very element used to spend our taxdollars and blood of our children.. taking hundreds of millions of dollars in arms deals.

Yeay!

[Yamato]

You're off by three orders of magnitude it's hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars of weapons to Saudi Arabia.   If a US taxpayer isn't intellectually (politically) capable of questioning that, who cares what they think about anything else.  Only by blind chance will they be reasonable on any other issue if they're following what someone else tells them to think for political reasons.  They're not stewards of precious resources they're sold shills for the worst governments/countries on the planet.   It isn't hard to predict that they'll salute whatever the govt raises up the flagpole when it comes to israel.  It's because of obedient citizens like these that govt gets away with what it does.  If we had an educated and knowledgeable voting populace that asked questions, thought critically and called their govt out for its crimes, these wars would have never occurred in the first place.   We wouldn't even be in the Middle East, "ISIS" wouldn't even exist, 9/11 would have never happened, Saddam Hussein would have never invaded Iran, we wouldn't have been arming Islamic extremists since the 1980s, we can go on and on.  It's little wonder we get fake chemists and even faker fighter pilots with no end to the word count defending every vile move their fed gov makes.

[Merc14]

8 hours ago, Yamato said:

It was never established Assad used Sarin in 2013. 

8 hours ago, Yamato said:

The thing with civil wars is, your country becomes unstable, you lose a lot of assets, territory, people, objects, chemicals and control.   The fox nooz bologna that if you can't make something you can't have it is pathetic religious belief.   Jesus walked on water 10x before this fake news story about Assad's sarin in Syria can even be taken seriously.

What does this word salad of bizarre silliness even mean?   Religious belief and walking on water?  WTF ?  What are you imbibing that your brain gets twisted enough to actually vomit out these sentences?

8 hours ago, Yamato said:

And what can't you understand about your beloved Hillary Clinton helping to move the sarin from Libya to Syria through the "rebels"?   Why can't people like you who pretend as hard as you can to hate Hillary Clinton even ACKNOWLEDGE that?  Stop protecting "that woman" like you always do every time the **** really hits the fan.  

Beloved Hillary Clinton?  I think that anyone who knows me here is raising their eyebrows and giggling at such a ridiculous post.  You truly are bizarre.   As far as Sarin being moved from Libya to Syria I don't think anyone but you has suggested that one, especially sine Syria is perfectly capable of manufacturing Sarin themselves. 

[Phaeton80]

5 hours ago, Yamato said:

You're off by three orders of magnitude it's hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars of weapons to Saudi Arabia.   If a US taxpayer isn't intellectually (politically) capable of questioning that, who cares what they think about anything else.  Only by blind chance will they be reasonable on any other issue if they're following what someone else tells them to think for political reasons.  They're not stewards of precious resources they're sold shills for the worst governments/countries on the planet.   It isn't hard to predict that they'll salute whatever the govt raises up the flagpole when it comes to israel.  It's because of obedient citizens like these that govt gets away with what it does.  If we had an educated and knowledgeable voting populace that asked questions, thought critically and called their govt out for its crimes, these wars would have never occurred in the first place.   We wouldn't even be in the Middle East, "ISIS" wouldn't even exist, 9/11 would have never happened, Saddam Hussein would have never invaded Iran, we wouldn't have been arming Islamic extremists since the 1980s, we can go on and on.  It's little wonder we get fake chemists and even faker fighter pilots with no end to the word count defending every vile move their fed gov makes.

 

Exactly. Which I think would in fact represent the greatest threat to Western society, our freedom, safety, general well being. Not so much religious extremism, but rather the dimness of the masses.. so unbelievably easily malleable, it isnt even funny anymore. Majority rules suddenly becomes a clear and present straight up nightmare waiting to happen. Then again, maybe Im completely wrong. Maybe its all in my head, maybe Im paranoid.. become irrational - seeing relations, or patterns, that arent really there. And these masses are the ones who are more right then I am. Who in the hell, at the end of the proverbial day, truely knows. It would be a hell of a koinkydink though, everything that lead up to the present narrative.. My god.

[Yamato]

7 hours ago, Merc14 said:

What does this word salad of bizarre silliness even mean?   Religious belief and walking on water?  WTF ?  What are you imbibing that your brain gets twisted enough to actually vomit out these sentences?

Beloved Hillary Clinton?  I think that anyone who knows me here is raising their eyebrows and giggling at such a ridiculous post.  You truly are bizarre.   As far as Sarin being moved from Libya to Syria I don't think anyone but you has suggested that one, especially sine Syria is perfectly capable of manufacturing Sarin themselves. 

There you go again, defending Hillary Clinton, ad hominem plus conjecture that Syria has the capability to produce Sarin.  I don't know why I'm the only one that notices this pattern of coming to Hillary Clinton's aid but it's a serious pattern with you.   You're exactly like the liberal Steve Buscemi who represents you.

I don't believe anything I hear about Syria, by default, because virtually everything we get from the mainstream media is false.  

Do you believe everything you hear in the mainstream media about Syria?    Of course you'll dodge this question too and respond with more personal attacks but here's your challenge for the hour:

Show me some things about Syria that you can find in the mainstream media that you DON'T BELIEVE so you can convince me that you're not incapable of skepticism.