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$110 Billion More In Weapons. Guess who?


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$110 Billion More In Weapons

This weekend, President Trump will unveil a proposed mammoth arms sale to Saudi Arabia. The pro-Gulf foreign policy establishment in the United States and the Middle East will cheer it as an investment in a new security arrangement for our Sunni partners in the Middle East to combat extremism and fight against Iranian expansion. It was negotiated by Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law, who has zero experience in foreign relations generally, or Saudi arms sales specifically. It appears the Trump administration is counting on the country with the worst human rights record in the region to enforce peace and security in the Middle East.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/just-what-the-middle-east-needs-110-billion-more_us_5920669be4b0e8f558bb26e9

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The Saudis can afford to waste their money.  No doubt they will bomb the Hell out of Yemen and parts of Egypt and parts of Iraq and Syria, and maybe even Iran and Afghanistan and Somalia sooner or later.  All those bombs bought by Muslims to bomb Muslims.

Of course I doubt Israel likes this much, but aggression against Israel would end up in the Saudi kingdom's destruction, so if this is what they are spending the money for they are really wasting it.  I can't imagine even a Trump allowing such a thing (although over time my inability to imagine Trump doing stupid things has diminished a great deal).

I note a silly brouhaha about Trump bowing to the Saudi king.  Royalty is supposed to be bowed to, and it is just a ceremonial thing.

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2 minutes ago, Frank Merton said:

The Saudis can afford to waste their money.  No doubt they will bomb the Hell out of Yemen and parts of Egypt and parts of Iraq and Syria, and maybe even Iran and Afghanistan and Somalia sooner or later.  All those bombs bought by Muslims to bomb Muslims.

Of course I doubt Israel likes this much, but aggression against Israel would end up in the Saudi kingdom's destruction, so if this is what they are spending the money for they are really wasting it.  I can't imagine even a Trump allowing such a thing (although over time my inability to imagine Trump doing stupid things has diminished a great deal).

I note a silly brouhaha about Trump bowing to the Saudi king.  Royalty is supposed to be bowed to, and it is just a ceremonial thing.

I think the Saudis are doing more than buying over priced weapons. I think they've made a deal with Trump to further their foreign policy, Frank. The Saudis have been outspending the Israelis for a long time when it comes to weapons. The thing is that this deal was organised by one of the biggest supporters of Israel in Washington, Trump's son in law. A Jew himself. I bet the Jewish state has no problem with this. 

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Israel seems quite happy about it, since they both see Shia, and Iran in particular, as the enemy. This is of course for quite different reasons; for the ultra-hardline Wahhabists in Saudi Arabia it's an ideological; struggle where Shia as the apostates who should be converted to the One True form of Islam, while Israel, whether it's realistic or not, sees Iran as a threat to its own existence (or at last some point in the future it might possibly be). I suppose Israel does know that it's being used by an ultra-hardline fundamentalist state for its own ends, but I suppose it's happy to see America support Saudi for the same reasons. 

(If you're thinking of saying something funny about me spreading Russian lies again don't bother Frank, because the joke's worn through.) 

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hopefully there's an secret embedded Kill Switch in the computerised weaponry - that can be activated if necessary.. :w00t:

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34 minutes ago, bee said:

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hopefully there's an secret embedded Kill Switch in the computerised weaponry - that can be activated if necessary.. :w00t:

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No need for that. All they need to do is stop the flow of spare parts, upgrades and training and those toys will not move. 

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10 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

No need for that. All they need to do is stop the flow of spare parts, upgrades and training and those toys will not move. 

Well, Iran has managed to keep its fleet of F-14s going that the US supplied to the Shah for more than 35 years without US help, though they may well be smarter and have more initiative than their fanatically backward barbarian rivals in Islam.

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10 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

No need for that. All they need to do is stop the flow of spare parts, upgrades and training and those toys will not move. 

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:w00t:........:ph34r:

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3 minutes ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

Well, Iran has managed to keep its fleet of F-14s going that the US supplied to the Shah for more than 35 years without US help, though they may well be smarter and have more initiative than their fanatically backward barbarian rivals in Islam.

.

and I suppose all the high tech weapons that are purchased can be reverse engineered for spares and whatnot - 

(you know..... like the Roswell Craft......B) )

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1 hour ago, Captain Risky said:

I think the Saudis are doing more than buying over priced weapons. I think they've made a deal with Trump to further their foreign policy, Frank. The Saudis have been outspending the Israelis for a long time when it comes to weapons. The thing is that this deal was organised by one of the biggest supporters of Israel in Washington, Trump's son in law. A Jew himself. I bet the Jewish state has no problem with this. 

I have for some time suspected what you imply -- that the Saudi kingdom is not terribly unhappy with the state of Israel except for Muslim consumption.  So you think the deal was in effect a Saudi bribe to buy American support -- mainly against Iran I would suppose.  The thing is Iran is evolving into a reasonablee of a democracy, once the Mullah's lose their veto it would be a surprising liberal democracy.  Does the US want to instead side with a feudal monarchy?  Tough call I suppose and not too hard so long as the Mullahs have legal powers.

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24 minutes ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

Well, Iran has managed to keep its fleet of F-14s going that the US supplied to the Shah for more than 35 years without US help, though they may well be smarter and have more initiative than their fanatically backward barbarian rivals in Islam.

Yea it seems to me likely that this "solution" to a crisis is a bit too glib and people aren't that stupid.

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7 hours ago, Captain Risky said:

$110 Billion More In Weapons

This weekend, President Trump will unveil a proposed mammoth arms sale to Saudi Arabia. The pro-Gulf foreign policy establishment in the United States and the Middle East will cheer it as an investment in a new security arrangement for our Sunni partners in the Middle East to combat extremism and fight against Iranian expansion. It was negotiated by Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law, who has zero experience in foreign relations generally, or Saudi arms sales specifically. It appears the Trump administration is counting on the country with the worst human rights record in the region to enforce peace and security in the Middle East.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/just-what-the-middle-east-needs-110-billion-more_us_5920669be4b0e8f558bb26e9

Trump is currently giving a great speech to the Muslims. Quite impressive. The money is to go on fighting terrorism and deterring Iran.

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1 minute ago, RabidMongoose said:

Trump is currently giving a great speech to the Muslims. Quite impressive. The money is to go on fighting terrorism and deterring Iran.

the fact that Iran is actually one of the countries that's currently fighting terrorism in the form of the lovable scamps at ISIS obviously needn't concern the Dear Leader's truth filters. 

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11 minutes ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

the fact that Iran is actually one of the countries that's currently fighting terrorism in the form of the lovable scamps at ISIS obviously needn't concern the Dear Leader's truth filters. 

Iran is not fighting terrorism unless it is that against their friend Assad.

Everywhere else Iran is funding, training and providing intelligence to terrorist groups.

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18 minutes ago, RabidMongoose said:

Iran is not fighting terrorism unless it is that against their friend Assad.

Everywhere else Iran is funding, training and providing intelligence to terrorist groups.

Iran fights against other countries in the region but it doesn't export terror all over the world on the scale that SAudi Arabia does.

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The biggest despots and brutal regime in the ME must be held up, don't you love the smell of hypocrisy first thing in the morning. 

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8 hours ago, Frank Merton said:

I note a silly brouhaha about Trump bowing to the Saudi king.  Royalty is supposed to be bowed to, and it is just a ceremonial thing.

That brouhaha is in response to the Republican shouting about president Obama doing exactly the same thing a few years ago. Even Trump attacked Obama because of it. The present noise is to point out yet more Republican hypocrisy.

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10 hours ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

Well, Iran has managed to keep its fleet of F-14s going that the US supplied to the Shah for more than 35 years without US help, though they may well be smarter and have more initiative than their fanatically backward barbarian rivals in Islam.

Actually I read an article on the Iranian F-14 program just the other day. Fascinating as to the lengths the mullahs went to to keep them flying. In the end they ended up flying them with Russian engines and weapons and Chinese parts. I swear it would have been cheaper and easier just to have scraped them and bought SU-27's. Prolly keeping them flying had more to do with thumbing their nose at the "great satan" that having any tactical advantage. 

BTW just to add... the radars on the F-14 were very powerful as they needed to be to operate the BVR American missiles that went with them. So maybe the mullahs used them more as awac than fighters. 

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4 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Trump is currently giving a great speech to the Muslims. Quite impressive. The money is to go on fighting terrorism and deterring Iran.

Yeah well Trump will say anything to score a 'wonderful deal.' It seems there are options with this deal that if activated will take this arms deal to 350 billion dollars in the next 10 years. Biggest contract ever and coming from the guy that wants to ban Muslims from entering the U.S.

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1 minute ago, Captain Risky said:

Actually I read an article on the Iranian F-14 program just the other day. Fascinating as to the lengths the mullahs went to to keep them flying. In the end they ended up flying them with Russian engines and weapons and Chinese parts. I swear it would have been cheaper and easier just to have scraped them and bought SU-27's. Prolly keeping them flying had more to do with thumbing their nose at the "great satan" that having any tactical advantage. 

BTW just to add... the radars on the F-14 were very powerful as they needed to be to operate the BVR American missiles that went with them. So maybe the mullahs used them more as awac than fighters. 

Oh no, they used them to great effect in the war against Iraq. Something like 60 kills for every F-14 loss, and very few of those were in combat. And i think the Russian engines and parts was a bit of a fiction; they were refurbished certainly, but I think they still kept the same engines and most of the systems. About two dozen still in service, it seems. And they've got about 40 Phantoms. 

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1 minute ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

Oh no, they used them to great effect in the war against Iraq. Something like 60 kills for every F-14 loss, and very few of those were in combat. And i think the Russian engines and parts was a bit of a fiction; they were refurbished certainly, but I think they still kept the same engines and most of the systems. About two dozen still in service, it seems. And they've got about 40 Phantoms. 

...Iraqi air farce units were not exactly the best out there. Pre mullah Iran actually had the best Air Force in the Middle East so American trained pilots would have also been a major factor in Iranian air superiority. But your point is well taken. 

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10 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Iran is not fighting terrorism unless it is that against their friend Assad.

Everywhere else Iran is funding, training and providing intelligence to terrorist groups.

Well, not true.

They are also on the forefront of the fight against ISIS in Iraq, through their Shia millitias and the IRGC. It sure does serve their interests, but you know, it's also serving ours since our 'friends & allies' in the region haven't done much in that regard.

Edited by TruthSeeker_
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7 hours ago, TruthSeeker_ said:

Well, not true.

They are also on the forefront of the fight against ISIS in Iraq, through their Shia millitias and the IRGC. It sure does serve their interests, but you know, it's also serving ours since our 'friends & allies' in the region haven't done much in that regard.

Well, yes true.

ISIS are fighting the Syrian government which is why Iran launches operations against them. Iran doesnt want the Sunni Caliphate because they are largely Shia.

Edited by RabidMongoose
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at least some of the weapons will end up with groups like boko haram, ISIS and  al qaeda which will lead to more bloodshed all over the world 

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11 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Well, yes true.

ISIS are fighting the Syrian government which is why Iran launches operations against them. Iran doesnt want the Sunni Caliphate because they are largely Shia.

But you are completely ignoring the role that Iran is playing in Iraq as well, assisting the government fighting terrorism. High-ranking Iranian military officers have died on that front battling ISIS. The Iraqi Army is dependant on Iran-backed Shia millitias. Those are the facts.

[LINK] Maliki lauds Iran's role in anti-IS fight, says Sunni leaders support terrorism

[LINK] Iran-backed Shiite forces in Iraq now estimated at 100,000 – US military spokesman

[LINK] Iran holds funeral for general killed in Iraq

 

 

Edited by TruthSeeker_
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