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RabidMongoose

Pompeii House of the Ephebe

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Posted (edited)

There is a very famous Roman mosaic floor at the house of the Ephebe show below:

0_Mosaico_pavimentale_%E2%80%93_Grotte_C

Award yourself 100 points if you can you guess what's wrong with it?

Spoiler

Thats right it contains a pineapple which is native to South America not a European fruit. Something totally impossible if we think that these didnt make it to Europe until after the colonisation of the Americas.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-pineapple-of-pompeii

 

Edited by RabidMongoose
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Certainly resembles a pineapple - what else could it be? Some sort of artichoke?

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Posted (edited)

he “pineapple” is a more interesting case. The image, found at the “House of the Ephebe,” depicts what nearly most scholars are sure is the cone of the umbrella pine. I wish I could provide an image of the mural, but no author in the past 60 years has done so, and I am not able to find the picture in any readily accessible set of Pompeii mural images

Even if it is the cone of an umbrella pine, that would still be weird. The tree has been planted all over the world now, but in ancient times, maybe not. And how did the Romans get a tree that is native to Japan? Just asking.

http://awaytogarden.com/beloved-conifer-japanese-umbrella-pine/

Edited by susieice
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Posted (edited)

48 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Certainly resembles a pineapple - what else could it be? Some sort of artichoke?

Or as Colavito points out in his blog, the fruit of an umbrella pine.

Just saw susiece already mentioned it.

Edited by Jarocal
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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

There is a very famous Roman mosaic floor at the house of the Ephebe show below:

0_Mosaico_pavimentale_%E2%80%93_Grotte_C

Award yourself 100 points if you can you guess what's wrong with it?

  Hide contents

Thats right it contains a pineapple which is native to South America not a European fruit. Something totally impossible if we think that these didnt make it to Europe until after the colonisation of the Americas.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-pineapple-of-pompeii

 

Thanks for posting something new (to me) and an actual mystery! However having grown up on Hawaii and having had experience harvesting Pineapples that is a very small immature one if it were one. However it is probably something else. Lets see what others come up with.

 

 

 

Edited by Hanslune
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Tried to enlarge the fruit in question. Don't know what it is but it isn't a pine cone. The enlarged pic didn't upload, but you can click on it to make it bigger.0_Mosaico_pavimentale_%E2%80%93_Grotte_C

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2 hours ago, susieice said:

Even if it is the cone of an umbrella pine, that would still be weird. The tree has been planted all over the world now, but in ancient times, maybe not. And how did the Romans get a tree that is native to Japan? Just asking.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silk_Road

--Jaylemurph

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1 hour ago, jaylemurph said:

Thanks Jaylemurph. I knew there was contact with India but not that it reached as far as Japan.

So why would the Romans put this pine cone on a plate of fruit? I wouldn't think it would be very appetizing. Are they edible? I found some pictures of the cone to compare the mosaic with. It would be a strange garnish, but I'm not sure that's what's depicted. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=umbrella+pine+cone&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjOioSsx_3UAhUEND4KHTiEBdwQ7AkIVA&biw=1267&bih=913

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8 minutes ago, susieice said:

Thanks Jaylemurph. I knew there was contact with India but not that it reached as far as Japan.

So why would the Romans put this pine cone on a plate of fruit? I wouldn't think it would be very appetizing. Are they edible? I found some pictures of the cone to compare the mosaic with. It would be a strange garnish, but I'm not sure that's what's depicted. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=umbrella+pine+cone&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjOioSsx_3UAhUEND4KHTiEBdwQ7AkIVA&biw=1267&bih=913

Yes pine nuts are edible. 

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True and its also possible we are looking at artistic license in action or a  carpophagous alien.

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59 minutes ago, Jarocal said:

Yes pine nuts are edible. 

Ok. Did a little more research and I found a site that sells the seeds to grow this type of nut. It says it's Italian. It's called an umbrella pine but it doesn't look anything like the Japanese one. There are pictures of the cone and the nuts in the ad. The nuts are edible.

http://www.cheapsupermarket.top/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=12026

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I didn't know about the pineapple, either. You have clever posts, Hanslune. One of mine would've petered out by now. Did Rupert tell you about this?

LOL Carpophagous alien.

I've double-checked the mosaic but don't see the cocaine and tobacco.

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7 minutes ago, susieice said:

Ok. Did a little more research and I found a site that sells the seeds to grow this type of nut. It says it's Italian. It's called an umbrella pine but it doesn't look anything like the Japanese one. There are pictures of the cone and the nuts in the ad. The nuts are edible.

http://www.cheapsupermarket.top/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=12026

All pines produce nuts... some are tiny, some are not tasty, but all are edible. There's about 20 kind of pines that produce nuts big and tasty enough for good eating. And yep, they show up in Asia, Europe.. there's even a couple kinds native to the U.S..

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Posted (edited)

I've always liked pine nuts. 

I like them in humus and couscous. I pretty much like all nuts.

Shut up.

Edited by kmt_sesh
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I've heard of pine nuts but I've never eaten them. For some odd reason I just wasn't thinking you would extract them from a pine cone. That would be where you would find the seeds. 

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12 minutes ago, kmt_sesh said:

 

LOL Carpophagous alien.

 

Ah, you scoff at my idea do you? Well!!! You sir are bulbous eater of under-cooked lice I challenge you to prove to me it ISN'T a Carpophagous alien!!!!

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I can't zoom in on the mosaic in my post but I can easily on the one in Hanslune's post. It could be a pine cone that's been cut in half. The outer shell and the center of the cone. Would be the right size.

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1 minute ago, Hanslune said:

Ah, you scoff at my idea do you? Well!!! You sir are bulbous eater of under-cooked lice I challenge you to prove to me it ISN'T a Carpophagous alien!!!!

I was about to take offense. I read it wrong and thought you had written "under-cooked rice." What am I, a savage? But you wrote lice. Well, it's true, I prefer them under-cooked, preferably plucked right off carpophagous critters.

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Ya know.... I think the pineapple kind of looks like a cardoon. Cardoons are like artichokes, but more thistle looking.

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7 minutes ago, susieice said:

I've heard of pine nuts but I've never eaten them. For some odd reason I just wasn't thinking you would extract them from a pine cone. That would be where you would find the seeds. 

You do extract the nuts from the pine cone. The nuts grow between the cones petals. The nuts are the seeds.

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I had to look up "cardoon" and pictures of it. I'm such a rube. Not an especially appetizing-looking plant. Who thinks of eating such things?

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I had to look up cardoon too. Artichoke hearts are good and used in a lot of Italian dishes. 

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Same folks that thought of eating artichokes... they  are big thistles too, you usually don't see them with their fluffy top at the store or table.

 

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Posted (edited)

10 hours ago, susieice said:

Even if it is the cone of an umbrella pine, that would still be weird. The tree has been planted all over the world now, but in ancient times, maybe not. And how did the Romans get a tree that is native to Japan? Just asking.

http://awaytogarden.com/beloved-conifer-japanese-umbrella-pine/

There is a mistake between the Italian umbrella pine (pinus pinea), which is more well known under the name of "stone pine" to English speaker, and the Japanese umbrella pine (sciadopitys verticillata). The wikipedia article state: "Pinus pinea has been cultivated extensively for at least 6,000 years for its edible pine nuts, which have been trade items since early historic times. The tree has been cultivated throughout the Mediterranean region for so long that it has naturalized, and is often considered native beyond its natural range." So Romans would use them. Nowadays, pine nuts are one of the main ingredient of pesto.

http://www.simplyrecipes.com/recipes/fresh_basil_pesto/ 

Let me add an image:

pignon%20de%20pin_1.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pine_nut

Edited by Gingitsune
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11 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Certainly resembles a pineapple - what else could it be? Some sort of artichoke?

 

 

 

Image result for baked ham leg

 

 

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