Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -

Girl, 5, fined £150 for lemonade stand


Unusual Tournament

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, Parsec said:

Well, they could have told her "look, you have to have a permit in order to sell food to people. You can either buy one or you have to pack your things, but you definitely can't sell your lemonade as it is now. It's in order to safeguard people, you included, from potential, unwanted, hazards."

In that case she could have learnt something, even useful. 

 

Assuming you are not ironic, what she learnt instead is that some people are coward pricks, that given an ounce of power, they feel entitled to be bullies and raise their voices with the weaks.

Four enforcement officers against a 5 years old girl? Wow, that's so brave. 

 

But she also learnt that you should never bow your head in front of bullies and keep quite; instead you speak up and show them for what they are. 

And that laws need to be applied with common sense, not as mindless drones. 

By the way, do enforcers get a commission on the fines? 

Now that is interesting, sounds like a very corrupt  system.  This almost sounds like the Mafia charging people for protection money. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 
2 hours ago, The Silver Thong said:

I'm 44 yrs old and wow,  have things changed since I was a kid. I remember , when I was , about 10 yrs old and my sister was 8. She would make cup cakes and sell them around the neighborhood.  So if I may ask how much would a permit cost and how many cups of lemon aid would you have to sell at 50 cents a cup to cover the cost of that permit.  

The whole thing is if something goes bad, say you used a bad batch of batter or somehow containminated with bacteria etc and say since you are just a child your level of understanding of hygiene is not yet mature and you pick your nose and dip in lemonade etc etc. the whole thing is emotional because a child is involved, if it was just some middle aged man we would have supported the city without second thought , if you are going to sell something for consumption a preliminary examination of premises and permit is a must

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, kartikg said:

The whole thing is if something goes bad, say you used a bad batch of batter or somehow containminated with bacteria etc and say since you are just a child your level of understanding of hygiene is not yet mature and you pick your nose and dip in lemonade etc etc. the whole thing is emotional because a child is involved, if it was just some middle aged man we would have supported the city without second thought , if you are going to sell something for consumption a preliminary examination of premises and permit is a must

My thing is they could of just sent like a cease and desist letter to the parents later instead of reacting with officers and fines 

And like are we really so scared as a society thst we think 5 year old girl lemonade stands are full of poison now lol

Edited by spartan max2
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

My thing is they could of just sent like a cease and desist letter to the parents later instead of reacting with officers and fines 

And like are we really so scared as a society thst we think 5 year old girl lemonade stands are full of poison now lol

The council didn't react with officers and fines.. The officers acted on the spot when it was happening, issued fine... then the council found out about it, then the fine got revoked.. I kind of think mailing a letter after the fact might be pretty moot.

I think the officers telling them to stop right then and there was ok, but the fine issued was going overboard.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, kartikg said:

The whole thing is if something goes bad, say you used a bad batch of batter or somehow containminated with bacteria etc and say since you are just a child your level of understanding of hygiene is not yet mature and you pick your nose and dip in lemonade etc etc. the whole thing is emotional because a child is involved, if it was just some middle aged man we would have supported the city without second thought , if you are going to sell something for consumption a preliminary examination of premises and permit is a must

It still doesn't work with a permit.  You have no idea how many times I have been grossed out when I see people in a public washroom not wash there hands. How many times does a mother or father wipe the kids nose and then goes back to eating the burger for example. Maybe even after changing a diaper.  Lets lock people in the restroom untill they wash there hands.  It's not emotional it's logical. Every time you touch a door knob or pick up a phone  or shake someones hand you will get germs. If your immune system is so weak you can't handle a germ then stay home  and don't buy a 5 year old girls  lemon aid. 

Good thing we have permits cause that will solve it. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, rashore said:

The council didn't react with officers and fines.. The officers acted on the spot when it was happening, issued fine... then the council found out about it, then the fine got revoked.. I kind of think mailing a letter after the fact might be pretty moot.

I think the officers telling them to stop right then and there was ok, but the fine issued was going overboard.

good to hear, thanks for that info. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, spartan max2 said:

Hopefully these councile members get voted out.

Why? The council didn't make this decision. They handled it absolutely right. The officers made a stupid decision so the council apologised and reversed it. 

7 minutes ago, The Silver Thong said:

good to hear, thanks for that info. 

I mean, it's literally in the op... 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Setton said:

I mean, it's literally in the op... 

The fact is that it happened. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It should have never gone to council to begin with. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Parsec said:

That's inaccurate. 

If you are an employee, you should fill a tax return only if you got 2,500 pounds or more in untaxed income. 

This is wrong.

To see how wrong it is, imagine you get £2,499 pounds a week-you'd be liable for tax!

We have a tax-free personal allowance, (about £11k),anything above that is liable for tax.

"I highly dout anyone in the UK Is paying taxes on their yard sell lol"

Obviously we won't pay tax on a one-off yard sale, but if we had them weekly we should declare it, as we should with an income from eBay or Amazon.

With regard to this little girl, it was obviously ridiculous fining her. She is  a minor, her parents would have legal responsibility for any of her actions.

Edited by eugeneonegin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/21/2017 at 3:24 PM, aztek said:

are there any rules regarding lemonade stands in london? like license , or inspection certificate? since she sells items that people consume,  spot where you can sell, and where you can not?

if yes, that it may sound harsh, but i'm with city council,  but i do agree he is a ratbag. but not for giving a ticket but for backing off.

we live by the rules, she needs to learn it from young age,  she may have broke one, or two, she got punished.  now what has she learned? if you cry and complain, you get off??? that is a bad lesson to teach.  so what is stopping her to brake more rules knowing she can cry, tell daddy and she wont face consequences,. 

 

Seriously, man?  She's FIVE.  I get your drift and I agree that teaching children that rules are there for a reason is a positive in their lives but FIVE?  It seems to me her parents have already instilled respect for uniformed types or she wouldn't have reacted with tears.  Bad call, IMO.  Have a chat with her parents and if the citation HAD to be written then just give it to them and let them explain it to her.  

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, kartikg said:

The whole thing is if something goes bad, say you used a bad batch of batter or somehow containminated with bacteria etc and say since you are just a child your level of understanding of hygiene is not yet mature and you pick your nose and dip in lemonade etc etc. the whole thing is emotional because a child is involved, if it was just some middle aged man we would have supported the city without second thought , if you are going to sell something for consumption a preliminary examination of premises and permit is a must

I think that adults who see a kid selling lemonade on a street corner or in front of their house, especially when the child is five, understand that an adult has helped prepare or at least shown them how it's done.  That said, if they are concerned about possible contamination, they should pass the stand and keep the money in their pocket.  Whatever happened to personal responsibility?  You make a valid point about the potential health issue but the chance that someone would get seriously ill from lemonade is slim.  If they did there is always the use of the courts for redress.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 
36 minutes ago, and then said:

Seriously, man?  She's FIVE.  I get your drift and I agree that teaching children that rules are there for a reason is a positive in their lives but FIVE?  It seems to me her parents have already instilled respect for uniformed types or she wouldn't have reacted with tears.  Bad call, IMO.  Have a chat with her parents and if the citation HAD to be written then just give it to them and let them explain it to her.  

That is kind of what happened. The police turned on their cam, talked to dad, ticketed dad. Again, they could have handled that part a bit better too. Been a bit more sensitive to the 5 year old and perhaps pulled dad off to the side a bit and been a bit more discreet rather than being all in front of the kid where she was watching it happen. Of course she freaked. Dad was getting "a talking to" by a person in authority she has been taught to respect, and it was because of her lemonade?

I mean really. The police wouldn't have addressed her directly or handed her the ticket. They would have addressed dad and gave him the ticket. Unfortunately they did in in what IMO was a bad manner. Scared the kid, could have been more discreet, didn't need to issue a ticket or fine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

48 minutes ago, eugeneonegin said:

This is wrong.

To see how wrong it is, imagine you get £2,499 pounds a week-you'd be liable for tax!

We have a tax-free personal allowance, (about £11k),anything above that is liable for tax.

"I highly dout anyone in the UK Is paying taxes on their yard sell lol"

Obviously we won't pay tax on a one-off yard sale, but if we had them weekly we should declare it, as we should with an income from eBay or Amazon.

With regard to this little girl, it was obviously ridiculous fining her. She is  a minor, her parents would have legal responsibility for any of her actions.

No mate, your argument is wrong.

It depends.

As specified, my post was from an employee point of view. 

If you are self-employed, that's different. 

 

Personal allowance is one thing, and is applied to the taxed income, such as your salary. It's applied to the income the government knows (or sometimes estimates) you earn. 

Besides your regular salary as an employee, you can have other untaxed income, meaning income the govt doesn't necessarily know about (yarn sells, ebay, adwords, etc.). Up to 2,500 pounds you don't need to declare it, above that threshold, you have to fill a tax return. 

It doesn't matter how long it takes you to get to the threshold, it can be one day or 11 months. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, Parsec said:

No mate, your argument is wrong.

It depends.

As specified, my post was from an employee point of view. 

If you are self-employed, that's different. 

 

Personal allowance is one thing, and is applied to the taxed income, such as your salary. It's applied to the income the government knows (or sometimes estimates) you earn. 

Besides your regular salary as an employee, you can have other untaxed income, meaning income the govt doesn't necessarily know about (yarn sells, ebay, adwords, etc.). Up to 2,500 pounds you don't need to declare it, above that threshold, you have to fill a tax return. 

It doesn't matter how long it takes you to get to the threshold, it can be one day or 11 months. 

You don't understand the basics of income tax. Or any tax.

It seems strange as you seem to be in the UK.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The income tax rules in the UK are so simple a 5year old can understand them (well, maybe not this 5 year of girl).

We are allowed a tax-free personal income of about £11k per year.

Income, above that, from any source, is taxed at 20%, up to about £45k.

After that it is taxed at 40% till the end of time.

There are other taxes like Capital Gains Tax, Death Duties, etc. and we all know the super rich avoid tax to a greater or lesser degree.

But there is no rule that £2,500 or £2.20  or 2.5 pence is exempt from tax.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Parsec said:

No mate, your argument is wrong.

It depends.

As specified, my post was from an employee point of view. 

If you are self-employed, that's different. 

 

Personal allowance is one thing, and is applied to the taxed income, such as your salary. It's applied to the income the government knows (or sometimes estimates) you earn. 

Besides your regular salary as an employee, you can have other untaxed income, meaning income the govt doesn't necessarily know about (yarn sells, ebay, adwords, etc.). Up to 2,500 pounds you don't need to declare it, above that threshold, you have to fill a tax return. 

It doesn't matter how long it takes you to get to the threshold, it can be one day or 11 months. 

If you are referring to the "cash in hand" black market, which must be what you mean by the words I have put in bold, you are referring to illegal trade. You have no entitlement to it and it is a crime.

That's not to say we haven't all done it,occasionally, but it is illegal.

On a large scale, it carries a custodial sentence.

Edited by eugeneonegin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Susanc241 said:

What would have been wrong with having a word with this child (and her father hovering nearby) to explain the whys and wherefores of the situation.  Asking them to pack up and go home and leaving it as an educational opportunity.  A lot of 'enforcers' like council inspectors, traffic wardens etc really do seem to lack any compassion or common sense.

i can see both sides of the argument and i agree with your thoughts. a few tips and pointers on providing clean and safe lemonade that the 5 year old and her parents could follow would have been better. Rob cop needs to get a life. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thread cleaned

Enough with the personal insults please.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Latest:

Quote

A five-year-old girl who was fined £150 by a council for selling 50p cups of lemonade has received dozens of offers to set up stalls at other events.

The family tweeted: "We have been overwhelmed by the kind response from people across the world.

"Dozens of festivals, markets and businesses have offered us the opportunity to set up a lemonade stand.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-40697243

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Still Waters said:

Latest:

Her lemonade stand and signs were too cute, and I'm glad the community is being supportive of her.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.