The Urantia Papers

[Tatetopa]

17 minutes ago, Will Due said:

I'm starting this thread not to debate what the UB is, whether or not it's true, but rather to present a summary of what it says.

I do have to admire your persistence, a missionary among many who don't see any uniqueness  in your message.  You seem to be a true believer in your book.   For many of us in other persuasions;  Christian and non, it is a story that offers little to change our lives.  As science fiction, it is rather stuffy and dull.  As a belief system, in my case anyway, it does nothing to expand my spirit or offer me any sense of completeness. It doesn't explain the world or cosmos in a way that meshes with my small technical knowledge of physics, astronomy. and quantum mechanics.  As someone who values equality and independence, a universal bureaucracy of  various stages of enlightened beings governing my life from afar is not an attractive picture.

[Greeker]

I hadn't heard of this book. I've just downloaded the Kindle version and skipped straight to the crucifixion. It pretty much follows the Bible version in which Jesus himself was crucified. However, the Farsight Institute, via remote viewing of the past, discovered that another man was crucified in the place of Jesus (or "Jeshua"). So I have a conflict.

Anyway, when I get time, I'll read some more of the book (if I live that long!) It seems to have rather a lot of chapters.

[Piney]

11 minutes ago, Greeker said:

the Farsight Institute, via remote viewing of the past,

[Greeker]

I assume, Piney, from your erudite comment that you are unaware that the US intelligence departments (and others) have been using remote viewing, successfully, for several decades.

[rashore]

Since this does seem to be a multiposting, I'm merging this with Will's original thread.

[Swede]

11 minutes ago, Greeker said:

I assume, Piney, from your erudite comment that you are unaware that the US intelligence departments (and others) have been using remote viewing, successfully, for several decades.

The Stargate Project was terminated and declassified in 1995 after a CIA report concluded that it was never useful in any intelligence operation. Information provided by the program was vague and included irrelevant and erroneous data, and there was reason to suspect that its project managers had changed the reports so they would fit background cues (emphasis added).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project

The final recommendation by AIR was to terminate the STAR GATE effort. CIA concluded that there was no case in which ESP had provided data used to guide intelligence operations  (emphasis added).

https://fas.org/irp/program/collect/stargate.htm

.

[Piney]

20 minutes ago, Greeker said:

I assume, Piney, from your erudite comment that you are unaware that the US intelligence departments (and others) have been using remote viewing, successfully, for several decades.

 

 

Edited March 11, 2018 by Piney

[Greeker]

4 minutes ago, Swede said:

The Stargate Project was terminated and declassified in 1995 after a CIA report concluded that it was never useful in any intelligence operation.

Yes, I can read Wikipedia, too, but my research confirms that it's full of disinformation. Do you really believe that a useless project could be allowed to run for over twenty years at a cost of at least $20 million in taxpayers' money then shut down? It makes no sense unless they found a better method to gain the information. (They gained plenty of information.) My guess is that they developed (or reverse-engineered) technology that could do it, or they are using friendly telepaths from another civilisation. We'll probably never know because anything related to psi or telepathy is classed SAP or above top secret. Various governments (and "secret governments") work very hard to suppress all discussion of these subjects. They employ people specificaly to spread disinformation and to ridicule anyone who gets near to the truth.

 

 

[Piney]

 

1 minute ago, Greeker said:

Yes, I can read Wikipedia, too, but my research confirms that it's full of disinformation. Do you really believe that a useless project could be allowed to run for over twenty years at a cost of at least $20 million in taxpayers' money then shut down? It makes no sense unless they found a better method to gain the information. (They gained plenty of information.) My guess is that they developed (or reverse-engineered) technology that could do it, or they are using friendly telepaths from another civilisation. We'll probably never know because anything related to psi or telepathy is classed SAP or above top secret. Various governments (and "secret governments") work very hard to suppress all discussion of these subjects. They employ people specificaly to spread disinformation and to ridicule anyone who gets near to the truth.

 

Since I have family members in the upper echelon of the Japanese intelligence community and the U.S intelligence community is using them and not remote viewers for situations in Asia I would question your research.

 

[Piney]

9 minutes ago, Greeker said:

 my research

and what is your connection to the intelligence community?

[Herr Falukorv]

56 minutes ago, Greeker said:

I assume, Piney, from your erudite comment that you are unaware that the US intelligence departments (and others) have been using remote viewing, successfully, for several decades.

[Swede]

28 minutes ago, Greeker said:

my research confirms

Given that you have not supplied any credible documentation to support your comments, these comments presently fall into the realm of pure speculation and "conspiracy theory" promulgation. Thus, the comments are of no substantive value.

.

[Piney]

Oh, back on topic..

The Urantia Book is nothing more than the product of a early 20th Century UFO cult and all @Will Due did was personify and give gender to a 'higher power' to replace a non-existent and/or abusive father figure, which is not very enlightened if you ask me....

[toast]

1 hour ago, Greeker said:

Do you really believe that a useless project could be allowed to run for over twenty years at a cost of at least $20 million in taxpayers' money then shut down?

20M in 20 years is a ridiculous amount of money for a project related to national defence so your rhetorical rule of three does not work here. In addition, >50% of the money has been spend in the first 5-7 years of the project, so the budget was decreasing during the last 13 to 15 years into the project. If the project would had been successful in the first half, it would had vanished into black budget channels very quickly but, it hasnt.

Quote

Over a period of more than two decades some $20 million were spent on STAR GATE and related activities, with $11 million budgeted from the mid-1980's to the early 1990s. Over forty personnel served in the program at various times, including about 23 remote viewers. At its peak during the mid-1980s the program included as many as seven full-time viewers and as many analytical and support personnel.

https://fas.org/irp/program/collect/stargate.htm

 

[+Sherapy]

4 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

I do have to admire your persistence, a missionary among many who don't see any uniqueness  in your message.  You seem to be a true believer in your book.   For many of us in other persuasions;  Christian and non, it is a story that offers little to change our lives.  As science fiction, it is rather stuffy and dull.  As a belief system, in my case anyway, it does nothing to expand my spirit or offer me any sense of completeness. It doesn't explain the world or cosmos in a way that meshes with my small technical knowledge of physics, astronomy. and quantum mechanics.  As someone who values equality and independence, a universal bureaucracy of  various stages of enlightened beings governing my life from afar is not an attractive picture.

Very well said, I read a bit of the UB too in an effort to understand Will and I didn't find any thing practical for my own use. I think there is wisdom on most paths too. I think the book is so lucky to have such a passionate follower. For me, If this is what enlightened beings sound like, I think I will stick with Socrates, Rorty, Russell, Hume, Plato....

[+Hammerclaw]

"One original thought is worth a thousand mindless quotings."              Diogenes Laertius.

[WoIverine]

Will, love you bro, please be careful with extra biblical doctrine.

A recent study I heard highlighted the circulation of non-gospel (but related) teachings that have been circulating around since Paul's day. It was shocking.

[Will Due]

1 minute ago, WoIverine said:

Will, love you bro, please be careful with extra biblical doctrine.

A recent study I heard highlighted the circulation of non-gospel (but related) teachings that have been circulating around since Paul's day. It was shocking.

 

Thanks.

I guess what makes sense to me about the advent of the Urantia Book is that Jesus did not personally write anything when he was here. His writings would not have survived unabridged if he did. So to me it makes sense that he would've needed to wait until a time came when written material could be printed like the UB was when its text could be sustained without being changed.

When I first started to study the Bible, there was one thought I just couldn't shake. That if God is all powerful, he could send us all the missing details that are missing about the life and teachings of Jesus in the Bible.

So when I first had a UB in my hands, I immediately realized my prayer was answered.

 

 

[I'mConvinced]

5 minutes ago, Will Due said:

So when I first had a UB in my hands, I immediately realized my prayer was answered.

You didn't study it first? You just picked it up and realised immediately that this was the real message from God? 

6 minutes ago, Will Due said:

I guess what makes sense to me about the advent of the Urantia Book is that Jesus did not personally write anything when he was here. His writings would not have survived unabridged if he did. So to me it makes sense that he would've needed to wait until a time came when written material could be printed like the UB was when its text could be sustained without being changed.

So why didn't he come before 1955? Why was 1955 the supposed year that we finally record things when paper was invented around 100BC? Why didn't God just send down some indelible ink? 

7 minutes ago, Will Due said:

When I first started to study the Bible, there was one thought I just couldn't shake. That if God is all powerful, he could send us all the missing details that are missing about the life and teachings of Jesus in the Bible.

It's a good question but the made up science in the UB doesn't fill me with confidence about its voracity or authenticity.

[WoIverine]

14 minutes ago, Will Due said:

When I first started to study the Bible, there was one thought I just couldn't shake. That if God is all powerful, he could send us all the missing details that are missing about the life and teachings of Jesus in the Bible.

I wouldn't be surprised if heretical churches, etc. buried the actual writings of Christ specifically for our detriment. We aren't even exactly sure what He wrote in the sand.

I am hesitant to deviate from the Bible though, there are quite a few warnings.

[Will Due]

8 minutes ago, WoIverine said:

I wouldn't be surprised if heretical churches, etc. buried the actual writings of Christ specifically for our detriment. We aren't even exactly sure what He wrote in the sand.

I am hesitant to deviate from the Bible though, there are quite a few warnings.

 

I understand. But what Jesus taught the people was a deviation. And he asked us to follow him in this deviation. 

 

 

Edited March 12, 2018 by Will Due

[WoIverine]

3 minutes ago, Will Due said:

I understand. But what Jesus taught the people was a deviation. And he asked us to follow him in this deviation.

I'm fine with Christ's teachings, His coming was foretold by many, even by God Himself.

"And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel."

[Piney]

48 minutes ago, Will Due said:

So when I first had a UB in my hands, I immediately realized my prayer was answered.

Self brainwashing. Not enlightenment. Enlightenment would give you original ideas. Not parrot someone else's.

[Piney]

1 hour ago, WoIverine said:

Will, love you bro, please be careful with extra biblical doctrine.

A recent study I heard highlighted the circulation of non-gospel (but related) teachings that have been circulating around since Paul's day. It was shocking.

The Gospels were not "doctrinized" until long after Paul. It was Athanasius, the Bishop of Alexandria who decided the 27 books of the New Testament a few centuries later.

Your speaking of the Nag Hammadi Library and most of it is later Gnosticism. 

[+joc]

22 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

I understand. But what Jesus taught the people was a deviation. And he asked us to follow him in this deviation. 

 

 

What Jesus taught the people was only a deviation from what they had been taught by the Scribes.  Jesus had heard stories growing up about his mysterious birth and such.  That's why he went into the Wilderness...he just had to leave all that behind and find out the truth for himself.  And he did.  From that point on he referred to himself as the Son of Man.   I think right now, perhaps you are in the wilderness as well...trying to make sense of it all...and that is perfectly okay...sometimes you just have to wade through the weeds, and then the mud, and even drag your canoe across wide expanses of shallow water before you get to the calm of mind.