Russia probes kick into high gear

[ian hacktorp]

2 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

So far the best that they have been able to do was question who paid for it.

No, they're also getting answers to that question.  And it ain't looking good for those involved.

All this fluff about Trump "colluding" (which is not a crime), while these folks were engaging in conspiracy (which IS a crime).

[Farmer77]

5 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

You should know by now that there are anti-Trumpers among both Democrats and Republican swampers...so party makes absolutely no difference.  Mueller was hired to run cover for the crimes of the previous administration and those who benefitted from it...from both sides of the aisle.  And it worked for a little while.

But now it's failing...bigly.

So a man Trump hired, Rosenstein, arbitrarily turned around and hired a team of investigators to get rid of the man who hired him? 

And POTUS pressuring the head of the FBI to drop their investigation into his friend who he knew was guilty, and then firing the head of the FBI for not dropping the investigation had nothing to do with Mueller being appointed? 

Edited December 12, 2017 by Farmer77

[Gromdor]

7 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

No, they're also getting answers to that question.  And it ain't looking good for those involved.

All this fluff about Trump "colluding" (which is not a crime), while these folks were engaging in conspiracy (which IS a crime).

No offense, but after seven years of waiting for Hillary charges from these guys, I am not holding my breath.  Mueller on the other hand is at least getting criminal charges

[+joc]

25 minutes ago, Einsteinium said:

You must not be paying attention to all the evidence coming to light. Like that email that explicitly said they wanted to hand over 'dirt' on Hillary Clinton, and that the effort was, "“part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.”, and that Donald Trump Junior reponded to that email with "if it is what you say I love it!"

I haven't seen that email...could you please provide a copy of the actual email so we can all read it in context? Thank you! Look forward to that!  Please provide the ENTIRE email. 

How is that not evidence for collusion?

Who doesn't dig up dirt on their opponents?  Lets see the email please.

The Trump campaign, if they did not collude with Russia it was not for lack of trying.

Pure conjecture on your part.

Then you have Trump calling on Russia to find Hillary Clintons email and then days later Wikileaks publishes DNC emails.

Well that changes everything doesn't it? No, in fact...it is a bunch of hooey...Julian Assange has said repeatedly he got nothing from the Russians...and no one has proved that he did.

How is that not evidence of collusion? Not to mention the numerous lies that campaign officials made regarding contacts they had with Russians.

Specifically...What campaign officials and what lies?  

Why lie if they did nothing wrong? Throw in Paupodopolous, and now Flynn who lied to the FBI about the nature of a conversation he had with the Russian ambassador. Reports coming out now that Flynn stated that sanctions against Russia would be ripped up once Trump took office....you have to be blind not to see the mountain of indications pointing to collusion or something close to it.

You sound like a CNN reporter reading off the teleprompter...none of what you are saying is true.  There is no evidence...if there was...why isn't Trump in front of a Grand Jury?

You have a motive for both sides (Trump getting help to win against Hilary, Putin hoping to get sanctions lifted), you have clear email evidence and meetings between known Russian agents and high level Trump campaign officials.

As ABC retracted and corrected...Trump contacted the Russians AFTER he was President-Elect which is what any PE would and has done.

Besides that...Trump didn't need anyone to help him win over Hillary...did you not pay attention to the rallies put on by Trump...meanwhile Hillary couldn't gather 200 people if her life depended on it.

We know the Russians hacked the DNC and we know they used Troll farms to spread fake damaging news about Hillary.

There is absolutely no substantial proof of that.

What we do know is that Hillary colluded with the DNC to thwart the election efforts of Bernie Sanders.

You think all of that just coincidentally happened in the timeframe and timeline that it happened with no coordination at all whatsoever between the Trump campaign and Russia?

I think this whole thing is Fake News in an attempt to overthrow a sitting President because the Left cannot get over the fact he won.  Hey, I understand!  I felt the same way when Obama won...and my business dropped like a rock to half of what it had been in years before.

Wow, I don't know what to say.

In fact, all you know to say is what CNN, ABC, CBS,  NBC, MSNBC, NYT, and The Washington Post tell you to say.

 

 

[ian hacktorp]

15 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

No offense, but after seven years of waiting for Hillary charges from these guys, I am not holding my breath.  Mueller on the other hand is at least getting criminal charges

Mueller and FBI have been shielding the criminality of the Clintons and the rest of the Bush/Clinton/Obama crew for a lot longer than 7 years, so it's wise not to hold one's breath.

But change is definitely in the air, so instead breathe deeply.  It's refreshing.

[Gromdor]

15 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

Mueller and FBI have been shielding the criminality of the Clintons and the rest of the Bush/Clinton/Obama crew for a lot longer than 7 years, so it's wise not to hold one's breath.

But change is definitely in the air, so instead breathe deeply.  It's refreshing.

Eh, if you say.  I can wait another seven years.  Old age will take care of that problem eventually.

[ExpandMyMind]

1 hour ago, hacktorp said:

Nicely put, and demonstrates quite clearly the box Mueller and the rest of the anti-Trumpers have put themselves in:

Without a clean investigation, the "dude" could skate...yet without a phony investigation, they got nothing to pin on the "dude".

What to do, what to do...

Why do you think the claims of bias weren't propagated by the far-right before Flynn was charged and started cooperating? That's when they started flooding their content with these flimsy claims. They've known who these people were for a long time. It looks to me like they were holding off until it started to look like Trump was under-the-gun.

"We fully support the investigation... unless it starts bearing fruit".

[ExpandMyMind]

3 hours ago, hacktorp said:

So it would seem...

Congress Expands Uranium One Probe After Senator Claims Obama Admin Misled Him Over Yellowcake Exports

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-12-12/congress-expands-uranium-one-probe-after-senator-claims-obama-admin-misled-him-over-

Event horizon, dead ahead...

The only semi-valid reasoning that has been put forth with regards to any wrong-doings with his investigation into the affiliated Uranium One company (Uranium One wasn't itself actually investigated, for the record), was the claim that he held information back from Congress. But as Tiggs already brought to light much earlier in the thread, this was not his responsibility. The DOJ were responsible for informing Congress, not the FBI.

In reality, the only way he could be considered compromised is if this current investigation somehow led to him investigating himself. This was the reason Sessions was forced to recuse himself. That is a conflict.

[ExpandMyMind]

2 hours ago, hacktorp said:

You should know by now that there are anti-Trumpers among both Democrats and Republican swampers...

But we all know that this is simply due to the vast Deep State Clinton Conspiracy to control the universe and couldn't possibly have anything to do with Trump and his team's actions regarding Russia or Wikileaks and the countless times they have all lied - some under oath - about it. 

It is known.

[ian hacktorp]

49 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

But we all know that this is simply due to the vast Deep State Clinton Conspiracy to control the universe and couldn't possibly have anything to do with Trump and his team's actions regarding Russia or Wikileaks and the countless times they have all lied - some under oath - about it. 

It is known.

I don't know about the universe, but it sure seems like they've tried to control a lot of things in the US and elsewhere.

But maybe we'll know more about that soon.  AG Jeff Sessions indicated today the Bruce and Nellie Ohr revelations may finally provide the "factual basis" he needs to open a new investigation into the whole FusionGPS/FISA/FBI/DNC mess.

Gosh, I hope they don't end up getting Julius and Ethel Rosenberg'd.  Not a pleasant way to go.

Edited December 12, 2017 by hacktorp

[ExpandMyMind]

4 minutes ago, hacktorp said:

I don't know about the universe, but it sure seems like they've tried to control a lot of things in the US and elsewhere.

But maybe we'll know more about that soon.  AG Jeff Sessions indicated today the Bruce and Nellie Ohr revelations may finally provide the "factual basis" he needs to open a new investigation into the whole FusionGPS/FISA/FBI/DNC mess.

Gosh, I hope they don't end up Julius and Ethel Rosenberg.

Another investigation. Good luck with that.

[Paranormal Panther]

16 hours ago, bee said:

 

the vicious and deceitful campaign to try and manage perception that there was '''collusion''' is very polluting -

not just for individuals but for the US and the West  - *slow hand clap for all involved*

very corrosive and swampy -- ugh - just reading  some posts makes you feel like you need to take a thought shower
and scrub away the unhealthy nonsense -

IMO  

 

I'll put my cards on the table. I'm not a big fan of Trump. I preferred Cruz or Paul. They were real conservatives. They acted like decent adults too. That said, I preferred Trump over the chosen Bush and the chosen Clinton. They were last on my list. Heck, I preferred Sanders over Clinton. I knew that his socialism would be rebuffed if he won. Hillary was surrounded by corruption and criminality, and she was a globalist and a warmonger. Trump was strong medicine to treat various illnesses in the government. He wasn't her!

The Resistance of Democrats and their academe/Hollywood/media alliance made me more of a Trump supporter. It was like a soft coup, and it led to a cold civil war. Their misbehavior pushed me, as well as many Americans, more into the Trump camp. They were so glaringly obvious in their intentions. I and you know and understand that this is just a witch hunt. It's a lame Kabuki Theatre performance that will bust a few individuals to cause guilt by association in the minds of the true believers, as well as the ignorant gullible. In the meantime, real hope and change will be put in second place behind political gossip. This, more than anything, makes me wish for a metaphorical destruction of the PTB.

[Paranormal Panther]

15 hours ago, bee said:

 

They seek it here - they seek it there -  

But at the end of the day they will make do with any old convoluted crapola to try and
bring down the democratically elected president - what a shameful state of affairs -

The Founding Fathers must be spinning in their graves - 

 

 

It will never stop. They place this nonsense over the good of our country. It's a distraction and diversion from important things that benefit all citizens regardless of their team. At the end of this witch hunt, Trump will remain in office while they plan the next smear campaign.

[Paranormal Panther]

15 hours ago, and then said:

I agree, and I'm with you on that little wager.  IF proof comes forward that can be corroborated, I'll send the Free Wheelchair Mission 100 bucks too.  Heck, it's Christmas, I'll send them $50 just because  

They'll do just enough to cast more doubt on Trump's presidency. Comey and Mueller, combined, can't take down Trump with this BS. This is just a waste. Of course, I'm a paid Russian troll.

[Paranormal Panther]

12 hours ago, Tiggs said:

Trump Jr wasn't the conduit of choice for Assange. That would be Roger Stone via Randy Credico.

Trump Jr wasn't the conduit of choice for communication with Russian hackers, either. Peter Smith was.

Was CNN's claim not false? There was no meeting between Assange and Trump Jr.. It was more crap from the dishonest, misleading anti-Trump media. CNN, like various media cons this month, retracted their initial "finally, this has *got* to take out Trump" trash in the guise of news.

[ExpandMyMind]

13 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Was CNN's claim not false? There was no meeting between Assange and Trump Jr.. It was more crap from the dishonest, misleading anti-Trump media. CNN, like various media cons this month, retracted their initial "finally, this has *got* to take out Trump" trash in the guise of news.

Assange has been trapped in a foreign embassy since 2012, so I highly doubt that anyone has claimed they met.

What is clear is that Jr was in contact with Wikileaks and on numerous occasions followed their suggestions during the campaign. 

[Paranormal Panther]

Just now, ExpandMyMind said:

Assange has been trapped in a foreign embassy since 2012, so I highly doubt that anyone has claimed they met.

What is clear is that Jr was in contact with Wikileaks and on numerous occasions followed their suggestions during the campaign. 

I'm referring to communication. I know Assange can't meet him in person. Anyway, what is clear is that CNN's coverage and reporting was false and misleading. Was it not wrong?  

[ExpandMyMind]

2 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I'm referring to communication. I know Assange can't meet him in person. Anyway, what is clear is that CNN's coverage and reporting was false and misleading. Was it not wrong?  

There are multiple messages between the two that were released long before last week's CNN article. That you don't know this speaks volumes.

This isn't even in question. They were in regular contact and I posted the exchanges between them a couple of pages ago.

[Paranormal Panther]

12 hours ago, Tiggs said:

We know how it happened: Multiple sources gave CNN incorrect information.

As someone once said -- the difference between Journalism and Propaganda is the difference between Astronomy and Astrology.

One relies on evidence and is self-correcting. The other relies on blind faith and rarely retracts.

In other words, move along folks, there's nothing to see here. Nah, the media is blatantly dishonest. 

[Paranormal Panther]

Just now, ExpandMyMind said:

There are multiple messages between the two that were released long before last week's CNN article. That you don't know this speaks volumes.

This isn't even in question. They were in regular contact and I posted the exchanges between them a couple of pages ago.

It speaks volumes that you won't answer my question because you have an innate need to support your team with innuendo. Was CNN wrong? 

[ExpandMyMind]

3 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

It speaks volumes that you won't answer my question because you have an innate need to support your team with innuendo. Was CNN wrong? 

Yes, they made a factual error and corrected it - the error has been addressed by myself and others on numerous occasions. As far as I know they never claimed the two met.

But you said:

14 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I'm referring to communication. I know Assange can't meet him in person

They were in regular contact. They were collaborating on the run up to the election. Are you not aware of this?

 

[Paranormal Panther]

Just now, ExpandMyMind said:

Yes, they made a factual error and corrected it - the error has been addressed by myself and others on numerous occasions. As far as I know they never claimed the two met.

But you said:

They were in regular contact. They were collaborating on the run up to the election. Are you not aware of this?

 

What did they allegedly discuss? Prove that they colluded to throw the election. All you have is gossip and innuendo. Are you not aware of this?

[ExpandMyMind]

Just now, Paranormal Panther said:

What did they allegedly discuss? Prove that they colluded to throw the election. All you have is gossip and innuendo. Are you not aware of this?

No one is suggested the election was fixed. You can read what they discussed here. There's no "allegedly" about it.

Quote

The messages, obtained by The Atlantic, were also turned over by Trump Jr.’s lawyers to congressional investigators. They are part of a long—and largely one-sided—correspondence between WikiLeaks and the president’s son that continued until at least July 2017. 

How can you not know this? Where do you get your news from that they didn't see fit to report this?

[+and-then]

1 hour ago, Paranormal Panther said:

They'll do just enough to cast more doubt on Trump's presidency. Comey and Mueller, combined, can't take down Trump with this BS. This is just a waste. Of course, I'm a paid Russian troll.

Da tovarich! Spasiba!  

[Black Red Devil]

1 hour ago, Paranormal Panther said:

It will never stop. They place this nonsense over the good of our country. It's a distraction and diversion from important things that benefit all citizens regardless of their team. At the end of this witch hunt, Trump will remain in office while they plan the next smear campaign.

A couple of quotes come to mind, "you reap what you sow" and "where there's smoke there's fire".  You have to be fair and admit that the smear campaign started with the Republicans accusation towards Hillary Clinton which Wikileaks had a lot of influence in propagating and Assange, "strangely" enough, worked for RT?  The circle seems to be coming to an end. 

Edited December 13, 2017 by Black Red Devil