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Still Waters

Student killed trying to stop school shooter

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A disgruntled student armed with several weapons opened fire at a Washington state high school Wednesday, killing a classmate who tried to reason with him and wounding three others before he was captured, police said.

And the death toll at Freeman High School south of Spokane might have been even higher if the shooter's first weapon hadn't jammed at the outset, Spokane County Sheriff Ozzie Knezovich said.

"This would have been a lot worse if it didn't," he said. "That student came to school armed. He entered the school. He proceeded to take his weapons out. At that point he attempted to fire one weapon, it jammed. He went to his next weapon."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/gunshots-fired-washington-state-high-school-near-spokane-multiple-injuries-n801066

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Read about this in the early hours of the day, really laid a pall on the day ... RIP

Too many young lives lost senselessly as it is ...

~

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What a hero.

can we get him some sort of citation for standing up for life in the face of death?

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On 9/14/2017 at 6:00 AM, Still Waters said:

A disgruntled student armed with several weapons opened fire at a Washington state high school Wednesday, killing a classmate who tried to reason with him and wounding three others before he was captured, police said.

And the death toll at Freeman High School south of Spokane might have been even higher if the shooter's first weapon hadn't jammed at the outset, Spokane County Sheriff Ozzie Knezovich said.

"This would have been a lot worse if it didn't," he said. "That student came to school armed. He entered the school. He proceeded to take his weapons out. At that point he attempted to fire one weapon, it jammed. He went to his next weapon."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/gunshots-fired-washington-state-high-school-near-spokane-multiple-injuries-n801066

Here comes the democrats calling for us to ban all weapons and give up our 2nd amendment due to some kid who cracked. As for the victims of this tragedy, my wishes are with their family and my thoughts are with them as well.

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55 minutes ago, Uncle Sam said:

Here comes the democrats calling for us to ban all weapons and give up our 2nd amendment due to some kid who cracked.

To be honest, I haven't heard much from the anti-gun crowd about this. Seems surprising.

What I have read is that this was the 31st school shooting this year, and that there have been more mass shootings this year than there have been days. I get the impression that many see that as a price you pay for having the right to bear arms. But at what point does it become a problem that needs fixing?

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

What a hero.

can we get him some sort of citation for standing up for life in the face of death?

yea, give them a gun before they have to die as heroes

Edited by aztek

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1 hour ago, Arbenol said:

To be honest, I haven't heard much from the anti-gun crowd about this. Seems surprising.

What I have read is that this was the 31st school shooting this year, and that there have been more mass shootings this year than there have been days. I get the impression that many see that as a price you pay for having the right to bear arms. But at what point does it become a problem that needs fixing?

I think addressing the correlation between school shootings and SSRI's medication should be first and foremost.

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i think the way kids raised has as much to do as meds, this stupid idea, that kids  being indoctrinated, "you are awesome, if someone does not accept you the way you are, you need to stand up against them," never mind that you yourself can be a dangerous, boring, lame, sick,  moron, you are entitled to everyone accept you and like you.  sometimes i look at all these things on grand scale, and it seems as it is no coincidence. 

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I agree that kids aren't learning how to lose graciously, or basic lessons we all learned like life isn't always fair and how to cope when it isn't. You pull yourself up by your bootstraps and move on. These are life skills that are necessary to navigate adulthood and we now have generations who've missed out on gaining perspective. My youngest child was very hard on himself when making any kind of mistake so at times I would deliberately make one and say.. "Silly me! I made a mistake! Oh well, everybody does, nothing wrong with that." Or similar.....helped him to learn it's not the end of the world and how you can correct things with no loss to yourself.

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4 hours ago, Uncle Sam said:

Here comes the democrats calling for us to ban all weapons and give up our 2nd amendment due to some kid who cracked. As for the victims of this tragedy, my wishes are with their family and my thoughts are with them as well.

What's the point? Nothing will change until the majority in the US care about their kids more than they love their guns. Which will likely not happen in our lifetimes.

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9 hours ago, aztek said:

i think the way kids raised has as much to do as meds, this stupid idea, that kids  being indoctrinated, "you are awesome, if someone does not accept you the way you are, you need to stand up against them," never mind that you yourself can be a dangerous, boring, lame, sick,  moron, you are entitled to everyone accept you and like you.  sometimes i look at all these things on grand scale, and it seems as it is no coincidence. 

It's the logical end point of the "punching fascists is okay" train of thought. 

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On 9/16/2017 at 10:11 AM, ExpandMyMind said:

What's the point? Nothing will change until the majority in the US care about their kids more than they love their guns. Which will likely not happen in our lifetimes.

What an asinine statement. The vast majority of Americans do love their kids more than their guns. But it is possible to have kids and guns.

We are not to be treated as kinder gardeners. We don't believe in punishing the class for the actions of a few idiots.

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21 minutes ago, Bama13 said:

What an asinine statement. The vast majority of Americans do love their kids more than their guns. But it is possible to have kids and guns.

We are not to be treated as kinder gardeners. We don't believe in punishing the class for the actions of a few idiots.

It was a play on the Israeli quote: Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us

We had one mass shooting at a school here in Scotland and it shocked us so completely that we did the only logical thing and addressed the problem properly. We have, predictably, had none since. And Australia reacted the same way to the same problem with the same results. They happen in the US all the time but you simply don't care enough about protecting your children to properly address the problem. You have no real reason to own a gun today, really, other than to feel protected. Not to actually protect yourselves, because the vast majority of gun owners will never need to use a gun (and even less would have to if they weren't legal).

It's actually quite a barbaric practice.

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44 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

It was a play on the Israeli quote: Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us

We had one mass shooting at a school here in Scotland and it shocked us so completely that we did the only logical thing and addressed the problem properly. We have, predictably, had none since. And Australia reacted the same way to the same problem with the same results. They happen in the US all the time but you simply don't care enough about protecting your children to properly address the problem.

You could make the same argument for migrating masses of third world citizens. They rarely seem to need a gun to inflict big damage using vehicles or knives...and like guns, you could argue that if those people had been banned in the first place, all the victims would still be alive today. 

Now, I've heard your argument before, that school and public shootings have dropped since banning guns. Fair enough. What you rarely hear reported is that the rate of violent home invasions actually went up, compared to states that allow gun ownership. The viciousness of attacks and robberies increases when you remove any possibility of encountering lethal resistance. This is touted by the criminals themselves. 

Every house on my street is owned by a hunter or at least a proud gun owner. I would feel fairly secure kicking in a front door on your street - can you say the same about mine? Note also that here, on average, it takes about 4 minutes for Police to arrive. 

In 4 minutes, I can do a helluva lot of damage and be gone like the wind, assuming the home owner doesn't offer resistance which in your case, they won't. 

"It's better to have a gun and not need it, then to need it and not have it."

My guns aren't costing me anything or threatening anyone when simply locked up at home. I hope that I never need to use them in defense but should that day ever come, I will be thanking my lucky stars I have the freedom to not be a victim. 

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1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

It was a play on the Israeli quote: Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us

We had one mass shooting at a school here in Scotland and it shocked us so completely that we did the only logical thing and addressed the problem properly. We have, predictably, had none since. And Australia reacted the same way to the same problem with the same results. They happen in the US all the time but you simply don't care enough about protecting your children to properly address the problem. You have no real reason to own a gun today, really, other than to feel protected. Not to actually protect yourselves, because the vast majority of gun owners will never need to use a gun (and even less would have to if they weren't legal).

It's actually quite a barbaric practice.

Well we had a bad accident with a space shuttle, should we shut down the space program?

Airliners sometimes crash, should we ban air travel?

Sometimes ships sink, should we ban sea travel?

Since the majority of young people never need to see a doctor should they not have insurance? Or is it a case of better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it?

How is owning a gun a barbaric practice?

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Posted (edited)

12 minutes ago, Bama13 said:

Well we had a bad accident with a space shuttle, should we shut down the space program?

Airliners sometimes crash, should we ban air travel?

Sometimes ships sink, should we ban sea travel?

Since the majority of young people never need to see a doctor should they not have insurance? Or is it a case of better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it?

How is owning a gun a barbaric practice?

Excellent examples. Tell me, how many of those situations involve objects that were created solely to kill? 

It is an object designed to kill and has no other purpose (except to scare other people with murder objects into not using their murder object on you). Of course it's barbaric for a normal citizen to own a murder weapon in waiting. 

Edited by ExpandMyMind

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1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

It was a play on the Israeli quote: Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us

We had one mass shooting at a school here in Scotland and it shocked us so completely that we did the only logical thing and addressed the problem properly. We have, predictably, had none since. And Australia reacted the same way to the same problem with the same results. They happen in the US all the time but you simply don't care enough about protecting your children to properly address the problem. You have no real reason to own a gun today, really, other than to feel protected. Not to actually protect yourselves, because the vast majority of gun owners will never need to use a gun (and even less would have to if they weren't legal).

It's actually quite a barbaric practice.

Not really barbaric at all.   I assume it is just because of the culture difference.    Americans won't give up our guns.   Won't give up our swimming pools, motorcycles or alcohol either.  

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41 minutes ago, Dark_Grey said:

 

Now, I've heard your argument before, that school and public shootings have dropped since banning guns. Fair enough. What you rarely hear reported is that the rate of violent home invasions actually went up, compared to states that allow gun ownership. The viciousness of attacks and robberies increases when you remove any possibility of encountering lethal resistance. This is touted by the criminals themselves. 


 

You rarely hear that because it simply isn't true. The US has insanely higher crime than Europe. Much higher murder rates, much higher robbery rates. This is documented fact, by the way. What a ****ing ridiculously idiotic claim to try to make. Your guns do nothing, barring a few isolated incidents, except make it easier for criminals to commit those types of crimes.

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1 minute ago, Myles said:

Not really barbaric at all.   I assume it is just because of the culture difference.    Americans won't give up our guns.   Won't give up our swimming pools, motorcycles or alcohol either.  

Owning weapons designed to kill people that have no other purpose isn't barbaric? It's so obviously barbaric that it's embarrassing. It's practically the definition of barbaric.

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4 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Excellent examples. Tell me, how many of those situations involve objects that were created solely to kill? 

It is an object designed to kill and has no other purpose (except to scare other people with murder objects into not using their murder object on you). Of course it's barbaric for a normal citizen to own a murder weapon in waiting. 

Not sure that is relevant.    I have used my gun twice to kill.  Raccoons.     I have used my guns many times to shoot for fun.   

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Just now, ExpandMyMind said:

Owning weapons designed to kill people that have no other purpose isn't barbaric? It's so obviously barbaric that it's embarrassing. It's practically the definition of barbaric.

Nope. 

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Just now, Myles said:

Not sure that is relevant.    I have used my gun twice to kill.  Raccoons.     I have used my guns many times to shoot for fun.   

A farmer has a legitimate reason to own a gun. Killing relatively harmless vermin isn't a legitimate reason to own a gun.

' I have used my guns many times to shoot for fun.' This is the real reason Americans love guns and won't give them up. They're fun and give the user a sense of power. You guys should just ****ing own that instead of lying to yourselves. You like guns. 

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5 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

A farmer has a legitimate reason to own a gun. Killing relatively harmless vermin isn't a legitimate reason to own a gun.

' I have used my guns many times to shoot for fun.' This is the real reason Americans love guns and won't give them up. They're fun and give the user a sense of power. You guys should just ****ing own that instead of lying to yourselves. You like guns. 

If the vermin are pests, shooting them is OK.   Although I just trap them in a cage and drown them now.    Easier, cleaner and more humane. 

I can admit they are fun to shoot.   I do like guns.   They are a great investment.   They'll never go down in value.  

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44 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

A farmer has a legitimate reason to own a gun. Killing relatively harmless vermin isn't a legitimate reason to own a gun.

' I have used my guns many times to shoot for fun.' This is the real reason Americans love guns and won't give them up. They're fun and give the user a sense of power. You guys should just ****ing own that instead of lying to yourselves. You like guns. 

People own a lot of things they don't need. You don't have to need something, just have to want it. All we really need is sustenance, shelter, and clothing (in some cases clothing may not be n a need).

Yes American like their guns. They are fun to shoot. I believe that pistol shooting is still an Olympic event.

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Posted (edited)

who defines what other person needs????

no one needs to be on computer and talk sht about country he never been to and people he never seen with his own eyes, yet here we are, getting lectured by that very person, about our needs,  LMAO

Edited by aztek

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