hatred of Muslims in many Westerners

[julianpenrod]

Julian Penrod

4 Fairfield Avenue

West Caldwell, New Jersey 07006

(973) 220-1601

julianpenrod@comcast.net

February 8, 2006

Letters to the Editor

Dear sirs:

There can be many levels to an issue, and, unless you look at all of them, you cannot necessarily be said completely to understand it.

An essential for any practitioner of the malignant is controlling the spread of the truth about their actions. Indeed, so crucial is it for malevolence that the reality of their filth be misrepresented or even utterly hidden that the presence of obfuscation or willful engineering of facts seems invariably connected with foul machinations. And this is exactly what one can see in the recent issue of the caricatures of Mohammed and Muslim reactions to it.

The "official story" has Jyllands-Posten, a "noble devotee of freedom and democracy", innocently posting a number of editorial cartoons, involving the image of the Prophet, Mohammed. In keeping with their supposed innate viciousness, embodying hypocrisy and demonstrative of their will to rule the world under an iron grip of thought control, Muslims exploded into irrational violence against Denmark, Norway and other countries whose newspapers refused to give in to demands that they end "freedom of speech". The Muslims, right wing detractors gleefully opine, have shown their Fascist leanings, using death threats and attacks on embassies to force residents of every country to follow their orders!

If the sheer implausibility of this "explanation" fails to successfully connive to deceive the "rubes", shills for this story add the detail that the pictures in Jyllands-Posten were inspired by the "plight" of a Danish author of a children's book on Mohammed, Kare Bluitgen. He supposedly "couldn't find someone to illustrate it" because "it is considered sacrilege to depict the Prophet, and illustrators were all afraid of being killed, if they did the pictures for the book". This, however, already runs the risk of representing the caricatures of Mohammed to be an act of deliberate provocation of the situation, rather than a "well-meaning act that was perverted by a ruthless religion"! That seems why this aspect is so aggressively swept under the rug in most references to the matter!

In fact, in Islam, it is discouraged to depict any living thing, out of fear of it leading to idol worship. Mohammed holds a special place in Islam, but proscriptions on depicting him were based on fear of idolatry, more than the "insult" that most covering the story, even in the media, erroneously suggest! And, in fact, it is all but unmentioned in the media that it is not against Muslim law for a non-Muslim to graphically depict the Prophet! Indeed, if they did not resort to idolatry, even a Muslim likely would go unpunished for a depiction of Mohammed! In apparent service to this evident misrepresentation are careful refusals to address whether or not the illustrators that Bluitgen contacted were Muslim or not! Only lightly touched on is the fact, too, that the author of the book contacted only three illustrators, not the multitude that shills for the "official story" seem to want people to believe! And the cartoons depicting Mohammed were not, as supporters for Jyllands-Posten apparently want to suggest, innocent editorial references to the affair. In fact, Jyllands-Posten actually contracted for individuals to do a deliberately patently insulting depiction of Mohammed, in the form of “editorial cartoons”, apparently so the newspaper, essentially, could see just how much of a reaction they could get! And the “argument” that newspapers cannot censor themselves just to attend to the sensitivities of readers, yet newspapers regularly withhold names of accident and crime victims, to show respect for their families!

It should also be mentioned that the “high minded journal”, Jyllands-Posten, actually has a history of, among other things, actually praising Mussolini and even recommending dictatorship over democracy! Collaborator newspapers, reprinting the caricatures, include journals from Franco’s Spain, Hitler’s Germany, Mussolini’s Italy and Vichy France! Jyllands-Posten, it appears, is nothing short of a neo-Fascist rag, currently doing everything it could to fan the flames of outrage, to give the European Union an “excuse” to commit wholesale extermination of Muslim populations! Or, at least, enslave those who won’t fight back, “for the safety of the whole world”! There are those who warned that, if Europe were allowed to coalesce into a single military/economic/political power, apparently they would reprise Nazi Germany’s role during World War II, and launch a wholesale war against decency! International corporate greed, and criminal political interest seem to have triumphed over the warnings, though, in the evident abomination called the European Union being allowed to form!

And now, they seem to be paving the way for politically sanctioned mass murder. Of the Muslims first, then of anyone else who disagrees!

Unsurprisingly, these events have been assiduously plundered by evident servants of anti-Muslim agendas to denounce the entire religion.

“They condemn those who publish caricatures of Mohammed, but they don’t condemn suicide bombers”, goes one accusation. “They denounce a cartoon of Mohammed, but they don’t denounce the equally unflattering depictions of Jews in the Arab media”, goes another. You can almost see the smugness of the individuals who opine, “Muslims engage in all this violence over a cartoon, and you dare call yours a ‘religion of peace’?” To say nothing of the endless insistences that, “If you saw a political cartoon featuring Jesus, you wouldn’t see any reaction to it by Westerners!” The attempt to portray Muslims as hypocritical for calling themselves a “religion of peace” uses a familiar tactic of seasoned, conniving character assassins, namely, piling abuse on an individual, then calling them “violent” when they strike back!

And, as for the “tolerance” for cartoons with unflattering depictions of Jesus, just how many political cartoons featuring Jesus insultingly have there ever been?

But the suicide bombers, even the extremists, either fight for, or act at the behest of, a Muslim “rank and file” who see themselves as having been the victim of infiltration, destabilization and economic exploitation by the CIA, MI-5 and the Mossad for decades. The suicide bombers Muslims seem to see as working for their fight for identity and self-respect as a people! The publishers of the Mohammed cartoons they apparently see as just another of the anti-Muslim forces! And, since they have evidently engineered the calculated insult in order to have an “excuse” to exterminate the Muslims, the Muslims are apparently correct in the malevolence behind the publishers’ actions! And, inasmuch as the Jewish state and Jewish money does not seem to have been very far behind every assault on Muslim lands, unappetizing representations of Jews in the Arab press do not seem to stray very far from the truth! Arms dealing, covert operations, assassination of Arab leaders, all seem to be very much in the province of Israeli operations in the area, and their apparent part in engineering UN support for the evident theft of Palestinian land does not argue very much for their innocence in Middle East chaos!

Even the matter of “freedom of speech” seems to be being ruthlessly appropriated for misuse in this case. Because, in fact, what Jyllands-Posten did was not “freedom of speech”! A “freedom” is a “liberty”, and no matter what shills for sanctioned abusiveness may try to say, “liberties” do not permit you to do just anything whatsoever that comes into your head to do! “Liberties” carry with them the responsibility to use them wisely! Anything else is “license”! It was pointed out that “freedom of speech” is abridged at the point of, for example, falsely yelling “Fire!” in a crowded theater! And, for that matter, newspapers, as providers of factual information, are also, in that way, prevented from saying many things that are permitted in non-journalistic settings! “Freedom of speech” may allow you to say the sky is green, but not in a newspaper! In the same way, an editorial cartoon is required to actually cover an issue! Those presented in Jyllands-Posten were not illustrative of a breaking story, but, rather, were deliberately concocted to be insulting! Jyllands-Posten was acting, almost exactly in their own words, to foment outrage!

When this much of the facts behind an issue are so determinedly left out of the “official story” on the matter, it is generally due to criminality in high places!

And a rancid look into the anti-Arab side of the matter, as well as a truly loathsome “guilt by association” demonstration of the apparent malignance behind Jyllands-Posten’s agenda, can be seen by looking at the “thought campaigns” waged all over the internet, on the subject. Blogs, forums, bulletin boards, chat rooms, newsgroups, all seem to be being deluged with commentary on the subject. For the most part, what passes for “sympathy” seems strongly, even rabidly, anti-Muslim. And, almost to a one, those comments are foul mouthed, contemptuous or even downright vicious! They represent what seems a deep-seated venom against Muslim society among those who try to pass themselves off as “Westerners”!

All you need to do is type some combination of “Muslims, blogs, forums, Mohammed, cartoons, caricatures” into any search engine, and you will find a plethora of commentary across the internet! Many sites even that you might not expect to delve deeply into the issue are hosting messages dealing with the situation.

Disturbingly, commentary on more or less “international” type forums seems to show a more favorable attitude toward Muslims; it’s blogs and websites that seem to carry a stamp of “American” styling and content that show such bile!

Global Voices Online, for example, speaks disparagingly of Syria’s apologizing for Muslim outrage at the cartoons, and quotes an MSNBC poll that shows more than 50% of respondents saying Muslims are right to be incensed at what Jyllands-Posten did.

For example, JihadWatch, that seems to enter every discussion with the conviction that all Muslims would be better off dead includes comments like, “If Muslims do not want to see cartoons of Mohammed they should remain in Islamic countries”, by Roxane; “The ‘Supreme Islamic Council’ should be told to go and get stuffed”, by Sheik Yer’Mami; “Islamofecesland”, by Ironman Hondo; “I don’t suppose it ever occurred to those morons that WAY more people have now seen the cartoons since they created such a stink about them”, by fireangel; Infidel33 describing the Koran as filled with pig feces; “they fear any realistic picture of him would reveal that he was a monster”, by Chris; and Constantinople recommending their website, www.muslimparody.com.

Those who evidently want to see Muslim blood spilled under the pretext of responding to the riots think nothing of blaming them for being so weak minded and inherently violent that they would fly off the handle in response to “just a couple of cartoons”! If that was the case, they would have exploded at the depiction of the Koran on My Pet Jawa! There is no reason to think they weren’t aware of examples of viciousness on the internet such as this! What happened in this case is, apparently, the combination of a long-standing government facilitated corporate rape of the Middle East and a highly visible public display of contempt in the form of the cartoons in the newspaper!

NewsBusters, which touts that they are “Exposing and Combating Liberal Media Bias”, includes on its website someone calling themselves Jack Bauer referring to “Islamopaths”.

Flemming Fuch’s Weblog features comments such as James saying “Mohammed was either sick or the devil (satan [sic]) was speeking [sic] to him”. IslamIsDying says to the Danes “YOUR [sic] IDIOTS’ because they apologized to “these D*ckheads”, followed by saying of Mohammed “P*SS be upon him” and describes Islam in general as “a bullsh*t religion”. In response, terrorist_nº_1 contributed “**** ISLAM, **** MUSLIMS, **** ISLAM”. And ed brown described Mohammed as “the sacred raghead leader”. And Mel referred said of Muslims that “They already have a fatwa on the world”. PotShot described Muslims as “backwoods yokels”, while vibrani described them saying “These guys are nuts”.

On IMAO, spacemonkey provided their own cartoon about Mohammed, among other things pointing out that he has the word “ham” in the middle of his name. On a slightly different topic, but still representative of their sentiments, Harvey described the Hamas leadership of the Palestinians blaming all their problems on “JOOOOOOS” and characterizing Palestinians in general as so weak that their army could be beaten by “a troop of Israeli Girl Scouts”.

Unexplained Mysteries covers items from UFO’s to unusual animals to conspiracy theories, so events such as the outrage over the Mohammed cartoons is to be expected in their forum on news items. By and large, their reaction is similar to those above. Kratos, a moderator, comments, among other things, “how crazy are the Muslims?”. In another post, they shortened that to “crazy Muslims”. Uversa termed all Arabs as “moronic and childish”. Fluffybunny, another moderator, asserted that the outrage over the cartoons is “just another matter of muslims [sic] wishing to control everyone and impose their belief system on others by force and coercion”. XSAS answer to Muslims’ anger is “if they don’t like it tough.” Erikl, apparently tellingly from Israel, said, “Mohammed was nothing but a demon-inspired rapist/murderer/paedophile [sic].” They also described the mentality of the Middle East as “kill or be”, then they seem to have incompletely edited their comment to be “Of not showing you [sic] weakness to your enemies.” Bathory described “muslims [sic]” as “backwards *ss” and termed them “hypocrits [sic]” and said, cold bloodedly, “round them up shoot them simple solution:)”! Talon termed Muslims “cavemen” and “a threat to all civilised [sic] nations”. Lottie offered that “these minorities need to be rounded up and shipped out, somewhere where they never again can be a threat.” Natael said, of the Muslims rioting against the cartoons, “Let’s kill ‘em!” With respect to Muslim immigrants, Talon offered, “Then arrest them all a [sic] deport them. And if they werr [sic] born in the UK and we can’t deport them to another country, then throw them off a plan [sic] in the Atlantic, nobody will find their bodies and the bleeding-heart EU Human-rights commission will never know.” They also added, “Put me in charge of the UK tomorrow, I’ll wipe out the threat of Islamic terrorism in this country within the year. I’ll also make a lot of empty houses for our homeless population to move into.” In addition, Talon asserted, “If I , or 60% of other people in this country were in charge, we’d have these radicals arrested overnight by the secret police without noting [sic] EU or the media”. Gothikchile13 termed the Muslims protesting over the caricatures “bullies”. Rykster called the Middle East a “tumor” and all Arabs “idiots” and recommended, “Let’s test some of our missiles there. Sand and heat make for a nice parking lot. For the casino we would build afterward.” Rykster continued, “It is time to put an end to the madness. Even if it means eradicating these fools.” It’s okay, Rykster seems to think, to commit genocide on Arabs. After all, they’re not Jews. They don’t have rights! Talon joined with Rykster, crowing, “We don’t need to invade or engage in combat with their civilians, we’re so technologically advance [sic] we can destroy their entire war machine without stepping onto Irian [sic] soil.” Echoing both Ryskter and Talon, limited added, “nice plan 8 hrs [sic] of bombing might change their attitude.” In a later post, Ryskter took the evident campaign of deliberate offensiveness a step further by calling Allah “a new topping for pizza”!

Lord Umbarger, also from the site, hasn’t apparently weighed in on the issue, but they have made no secret of their feelings toward Muslims the Bush Administration orders Americans to hate. By admission a Jew and a policeman, Lord Umbarger said that, if he had come across Saddam Hussein in his “spider hole”, they would have just shot him, without benefit of trial, then burned his body and, to make sure he didn’t make it into Paradise, covered Hussein’s body with a pig carcass! But, the only reason someone could make it into Paradise is if they aren’t guilty of sins. So Lord Umbarger is saying that they would kill an innocent man! That explains a lot about recent charges of brutality, committed by police forces across the country!

Extremely telling in this case is the fact that, while it can be said that pustulent contributors on other sites didn’t have anyone to contest their poisonous attitudes toward Muslims, those on Unexplained Mysteries have no such “excuse”! Ever since the beginning of the matter, I have placed posts on the site, explaining that these evidently were deliberate provocation by Jyllands-Posten and that that is not covered by “freedom of speech”; I informed them that Jyllands-Posten has a history of Fascist leanings; I informed them that most newspapers do have a policy of respecting the sensitivities at least of the families of accident or crime victims. The members of the site only called my posts “rants”, termed me “pompous” and continued to crucify Muslims based on the disproved aspects of the “official story”! I even tried starting a thread deliberately addressing questions and points that countered the “official story”. The moderator staff of the site shut the thread down! Those on the site have absolutely no excuse for viciousness based on incorrect depictions of the matter, because I provided the truth! Yet they insisted on adhering to the version that appealed to their apparently already deep-seated hatred of Muslims!

The site My Pet Jawa provides a particularly revealing, and vile, example of apparent anti-Muslim sentiment in “the civilized world”. When Muslim detainees were complaining about CIA forces trying to break them by mistreating the Koran, especially tossing it into the toilet, the My Pet Jawa site actually ran a contest of sorts for regular contributors to provide appropriately loathsome scenes of the Koran being desecrated! They called it the Karnival of the Koran Krapping! Photographs of the Koran stuffed into toilets, both in private houses and public places, were common, but the loathsome displays on the site included also a photograph of the Koran buried under a pile of dog feces and an image of the cartoon character Calvin urinating on the book! This wasn’t even when Muslims were demonstrating and torching embassies! This wasn’t even when they were engaging in what apparently malignant political entities tried to depict as “opposing freedom of speech”! This is when detainees were being subjected to seeing the Koran mishandled! The hatred of Muslims on the site is palpable!

Being a patently Republican oriented site, www.gopusa.com perhaps predictably has patently vile things to say against the Muslims protesting the depictions of Mohammed. Radio Woman, for example, described Islam as not having a “sense of anything other than insane ragefilled [sic] hatred of everyone”, and declared this situation “a chance for ALL non-muslim [sic] nations to severely limit these idiots’ control over them”. 11m89 termed Muslim actions “barbarism”, described Islam as a “demonic cult” and, terming the Koran “their cults [sic] official play-book”, insisted that it ordered Muslims to “destroy everything in their evil, bloody path”. 11m89 finished, saying, “Since Islam started this war we must fight them, and there’s only one way to fight a war, we win and they loose [sic], sooner rather than later”! Mary-Lou Kirshon referred to Mohammed as “Mo”. Revolutionary declared that this and Abu Ghraib should be cheered since they displayed “the enemy’s weakness”. Revolutionary proclaimed that “humiliation is the Achilles Heel of the enemy”. They then said, “Personally, I would like to see bronze statues of Lyndie [sic] England holding an Arab at bay with a dog collar”! Describing death as “the ultimate orgasm” for “these fanatics”, Revolutionary recommended instead continuing “the humiliation and mockery as a weapon of total war”! GOP-forlife described Muslims as “morons”. Old Man termed the Muslims denouncing the caricatures as “not the brightest bulbs in the pack”, while cgretired termed them “the laughing stock of the world”.

Meanwhile, www.stormfront.org, a neo-Nazi site, spent most of their time cheering refusals by local governments not to force newspapers to hold back on printing the caricatures, rather than actually foul-mouthing Muslims. KeepBritainWhite complimented “Danish refusal to pander to the Muslims”. Xpac cheered that, with Scandinavian refusal to consider Muslim outrage, “they might leave on their own.” Elena Haskins said “Blessed Be Those Who Refuse To Submit to the Abuser/Controllers”. Lidskjalv described the Norwegian prime minister as having “backbone”. Xefor condemned the situation, saying of politicians, “don’t they have something better to do.[sic]” Serbisches-SS, though, said, “Muslims is [sic] the cancer of civilization - General Ratko Mladic is a cure!”

And Keith Olbermann on MSNBC declared a Muslim flag shop owner, who provided Norwegian flags to protestors who wanted to burn them, “the worst person in the world”! There’s been indications for some time that MSNBC is a FOX News wannabe, this only seems to prove that more!

To be sure, the contributors to Stormfront were as dismissive of the Muslim point of view as all the rest of the sites, but they were far less openly venomous about it! It says a lot when a neo-Nazi site has more class on an issue than one hosting Republican Party members!

But, then, those who post on Stormfront only seem to be play-acting at Fascism, while Republican Party politicians and the football addicted, beer sodden thugs who seem to make up their power base seem to be practicing the real thing!

In fact, there seems a potent, virulent thread of utmost viciousness and hatred for Muslims among many in the West! And the Muslims can see it easily! They can connect to the internet! They can see the malevolence being promoted there against them! And, as My Pet Jawa shows, this utter and complete contempt existed even before the reactions to the Mohammed cartoons! This foul and putrid current running through so many who claim to respect “democracy” and “fairness” was evidently eminently obvious to the recipients of the hate, the Muslims, for a long time!

In fact, it is misleading to the point of being deceitful to characterize recent Muslim backlash solely as the result of the Mohammed caricatures! They are not reacting against the cartoons! They are reacting to the apparently willfully provocative nature of the illustrations , heaped on top of apparently already generations long patterns of disruption, infiltration, subversion and destabilization by the CIA, MI-5 and Mossad!

To say that it is only a case of wounded pride leading inherently unstable Muslims to explode into violence is nothing short of a lie, and lies, too, constitute a form of aggression! And this, they see every day in the media, too! And any venue that would lie as readily and casually as so many in the West have done about the nature of this uprising will also have lied easily about covert operation aggressions against Muslim populations in the past! And, frankly, anyone who does not see through the smokescreen provided to whitewash the actions of Jyllands-Posten likely is either utterly lame-brained or criminally depraved! One likely wouldn’t know that it is unethical to attack Muslims on the president’s whim, the other likely wouldn’t care! Right wing sources may prate endlessly about “Muslim imams teaching hatred of the West”, but, frankly, the sheer unvarnished malice displayed by many in the West for Muslims seems all but unmatched anywhere else!

The Muslims have absolutely no reason not to expect genuine hatred and venom from many in Western culture toward them. They see their lives largely made difficult by foreign installed puppet regimes who make sure multinational oil cartels get rich, by keeping local populations down. Rather than have the evident rape of their lands and legacies by Western corporate interests depicted as a source of valid resentment, they are described as irrationally deciding out of nowhere to “hate all Westerners”! They see a president of the United States who apparently engineered an attack on his own country, in order to blame it on Muslims, and who used that “excuse” to launch invasions on Afghanistan and Iraq! They see an evidently deliberate scurrilous act of out-and-out provocation represented as an honorable and noble act! Now, the media, supposedly responsible for valid reporting, depict the entire affair as a case of Muslims demanding that everyone do only what they allow them to do, on a whim! And apparently Western sites on the internet do everything from depicting the Koran covered in dog feces to endorsing the genocide of Muslims!

And word is beginning to leak out that the U.S. has finalized plans to invade Iran on March 28 of this year, and this entire matter was engineered to give the Bush Administration a pretext!

The Middle East, apparently, has lost all patience with the hatred so many in the West hold for them, and the wholesale greed of corporate forces that are evidently manipulating that hatred to slaughter them, and they are no longer willing to extend the kind of benefit of the doubt that would allow underhanded corporate scum to knife them in the back ever again! The low and sick, the perverted minions of the New World Order Bush and his apparently socipathic ilk are evidently trying to engineer, may launch jibes and taunts at the Muslims, but a wholesale race war with half the human population of the planet is not something to smirk about! That is the kind of conflict which, if the West wins, could still claim the souls of many in the West!

Julian Penrod

[Celumnaz]

Would it be unreasonable to say:

"hatred of westerners in many Muslims"?

What year was the first plane hijacking?

[Talon]

julianpenrod, have you ever considered that white people arn't to blame for all the Middle Easts troubles? And that Islamic extremists have shown through their bombs that the are full of hate. You're anti-western rant completely ignores that all the modern events Afghanistan, Iran and now Iran all occured AFTER Islamic extremists started bombing us.

[Mekorig]

i will take a middle ground here. It is true that is a growing (some could see huge) tend of hate toward the wast civilization. But its also true that the cartons were insulting, and that some of the most "civilazed" countries in the wast had been medling into the internal affairs of the ME countries, when not topling a goverment to defend their oil interest. Both side have reasons to dislike each other.

[Saint Macabre]

It should also be mentioned that the “high minded journal”, Jyllands-Posten, actually has a history of, among other things, actually praising Mussolini and even recommending dictatorship over democracy! Collaborator newspapers, reprinting the caricatures, include journals from Franco’s Spain, Hitler’s Germany, Mussolini’s Italy and Vichy France! Jyllands-Posten, it appears, is nothing short of a neo-Fascist rag, currently doing everything it could to fan the flames of outrage, to give the European Union an “excuse” to commit wholesale extermination of Muslim populations! Or, at least, enslave those who won’t fight back, “for the safety of the whole world”! There are those who warned that, if Europe were allowed to coalesce into a single military/economic/political power, apparently they would reprise Nazi Germany’s role during World War II, and launch a wholesale war against decency! International corporate greed, and criminal political interest seem to have triumphed over the warnings, though, in the evident abomination called the European Union being allowed to form!

source? Just to satisfy my curiosity...

sooo, in short, w/out the anti-republican, the West deserves it attitudes (I'm not being sarcastic, please) ...with the freedom of speech comes a resposibilty...there are 2 sides to a story, hatred of a race/religion should not be acceptable to anyone ...mess with the bull you get the horns...did I interepret your essay correctly?...

also...could you quote/provide a link of all the people on the web you quoted? (blogs, forums, etc.) I would like to read them in their entirety...

BTW, you're probably tired of hearing this, but you really need to be careful and not post such personel info. on the web ...

[PadawanOsswe]

whats the solution to every problem? BLAME WHITEY! AND THE WESTERN WORLD!

[Talon]

whats the solution to every problem? BLAME WHITEY!

It does seem true, that under political correctness, if you're a white male working able-bodied hetrosexual with no criminal record then you are to blame or everything.

Now don't get me wrong, I have no problems with non-whites, females, disabled people and gays, its just why does multiculturalism blame us for everything that goes wrong for the others.

As for non-workers they should get a job, and I don't care what Political Correctness says, criminals are scum.

[Fluffybunny]

Why would a person send a "Letters to the editor" and then mention quotes of people from a forum of folks that have nothing to do with any publications that have editors?

Why would any editor of any publication want anything to do with the quotes of a forum on paranormal mysteries? It is very odd, and I would be willing to bet that the posts never see the light of day outside of this forum.

It smells a little fishy to me.

Edited February 10, 2006 by Fluffybunny

[Michelle]

Another question...what editor is actually being written to?

[RamboIII]

your point...

[__Kratos__]

Kratos, a moderator, comments, among other things, “how crazy are the Muslims?”. In another post, they shortened that to “crazy Muslims”.

When did this happen?!

Well... honestly, look at they way they are behaving.

Those who evidently want to see Muslim blood spilled under the pretext of responding to the riots think nothing of blaming them for being so weak minded and inherently violent that they would fly off the handle in response to “just a couple of cartoons”!

Freedom of speech vs getting up in riots, taking hostages, going after embassies and all things related to that country/countries and destroying them is not acceptable in any way or form. Have to do something to stop them.

[Talon]

One thing I notice about this idiots rant, is that he totally misquotes people. There are several quotes by members including myself were we are talking about the rioters, yet he claims we're talking about all muslims. For example I say the rioters are 'cavemen', he delibrately rewords this to claim I said all muslims where cavemen; I say all the protesters should be deported he claims "With respect to Muslim immigrants, Talon offered". What a paraniod prat.

Instead of writing a big easy and wasting our time by posting it, why doesn't julianpenrod stop telling us what nasty racists we all are, and start dealing with his own bigoted beleifs (and his inability to accurately quote people).

Edited February 10, 2006 by Talon

[<bleeding_heart>]

Us westerners tend to be a bit "off" with people who burn down are embassies, take hostages, threaten violence etc. Its one of those quaint little traits we have.

Now repeat after me;

Hating/wanting to punish a group of violent, vile, d*****s who happen to be muslim is NOT the same as hating muslims.

[Mekorig]

Its all a bif mess, whit, excus the word, IDIOTS from both side flaming up the whole problem, idiots like this:

http://thestudyofrevenge.blogspot.com/

and a lot of other, from both sides.

[thebarman]

How can anyone from any democratic society have any sympathy or understanding for those involved in killing, inciting killing or violently protesting against these cartoons.

Freedom of speech is the foundation of a free society, and that includes the freedom to offend. The freedom to only speak inoffesively isn't even worth having.

Just as Jews are forbidden from eating pork, it is Muslims who are forbidden to depict anything living, including of course the prophet Mohammed. I eat bacon, but I haven't had a single complaint from anyone.

The west should not be forced into obeying rules for a religion it does not follow, we are bound only by the laws of our own societies, for which all our ancestors have fought many wars and lost many lives fighting to protect, not by rules or laws of other nations or religions of any kind.

[Talon]

How can anyone from any democratic society have any sympathy or understanding for those involved in killing, inciting killing or violently protesting against these cartoons.

Because there are bleedingheart apologists out there who will sympathies with anyone. I've actually had people at University in debates stand up for Hitler, saying 'He was just a victim of his environment, and he wouldn't have done all those terrible things if he was born in the UK. So we should have tried to talk to him more rather than go to war, and convince not to invade other countries. And killing all his followers at Nuremburg was wrong, because what if they didn't know about the Holocaust and killing of POWs, it means the Allies were no better than the Nazis -" BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH!

In short some people are weak pathetic pacifistic idiots, who if someone broke into there house and started killing their family would follow them around as they did it say 'Oh, you shouldn't do that, that’s not nice' rather than fighting back, and assuming they didn't get killed themselves would then become a witness for the defence saying it was the environment that the murderer was raised in that killed his family, not the murderer themselves.

Edited February 10, 2006 by Talon

[gothikchile13]

First let me just say I think the threadstarter is an idiot.

Ok, now that I got that off my chest...

I see no reason for the Muslims to react the way they did. Cartoons never hurt anybody. I'm blonde and Polish, I've hear every joke there is...did I ever start a riot and go on a killing spree...no. I know boundaries, that's the problem with a lot of people today, they know no boundaries. They feel that if they are offended, then it's ok to kill, maim, and terrify. I have no remorse for them, none. Maybe it is sacreligious, but I think flying planes into the World Trade is more sacreligious than a few drawings.

Oh, and threadstarter, if you're going to go on such an idiotic rant, don't post your personal information at the top of it.

--Jon

Edited February 10, 2006 by gothikchile13

[BazookaTooth]

Organised religion and their hissy fits..pff.