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Sherapy

Corn fed or grass fed?

112 posts in this topic

We live in a time when the standard diet is calorie rich and nutrition poor...We live in a time when grain (corn) is a huge commodity..Its storable, portable, fungible...It can be acumulated , its a form of wealth, its also a weapon, the nation with the biggest surplus for grain has always held the most power over the ones in short supply.....this can not be said about grass..You see grain supports the larger economy, the chemical and biotech industries, the oil industry, Detroit and the pharmacueticals...without phamacueticals industry, just couldn't keep the animals healthy..Grass farmers use little to no pesticides or fertilizers, they do little to support the agribuisness or the pharmacueticals...grass does nothing for the nations power or balance of payments and no farmer gets subsidized for using grass not like the corn growers do....Grass can't be broken down into a myriad of molecules to be rearraanged into a cornucopia of processed foods.ONLY meat,milk and fiber is about all you can get out of grass and the only way to do this is with a living organism....Grass feed i'm afraid dosen't oil the hub of industry and Indsutry has no use for things it can't bend to its bottom line........Industry Rules the day.........The idea of the grass fed animal is maybe nothing more than a really good story........

discuss...... :D

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So rather then making money, jobs and more for people... Why is it bad to feed corn to animals?

I actually think they genetically designed some corn to resist bugs and such, so they wouldn't have to use as much on the crops. These crops as you say are in much need and help millions.

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I don't understand how corn can be bad but at the same time grass is god too......as long as the animals are fed right?

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Geri, Cows are herbivores, not grain eaters....they have been turned into grain eaters at much peril to there health and ours....

Cows that are natural herbivores are fed corn (grain) pumped full of antibiotics becasue they are so sick from the diet they eat???? Do you have any idea the disease and sickness these animals endure???????Do you care??????I doubt if there is any organic meat.....This practice of feeding corn to cows is the light bulb moment of the gov't.......

The truth is a animal that is feed grain isn't gonna have any measure of health after about 150 days, their systems can't handle it, the first thing that happens is they bloat remember the rumen i mentioned , the corn produces a horrendous amount of gas in the rumen which would normally be released through belching by runminatioin, but there diets contain way too much starch and not enough roughage and the rumen inflates like a balloon and a foamy slime forms and that traps the gas until it presses against the animals lungs, unless action is taken immediatlely the animal will suffocate, (the action usually taken is a hose forced down the animals esophogas to release the gas....)

A concentrated diet of corn can give an animal acidosis, a cows rumen is neutral unlike ours which is acid , corn is acidic and it creates a kind of heartburn that can kill the animal, but it ususally makes them sick ..Acidotic animals go off their feed, pant and salivate excessively, paw and scratch their bellies and eat dirt..This often leads to diarreah, ulcers, bloat, rumentitis,liver disease, and general weaking of the immune sytem that leaves the animal at peril for a myriad of feedlot disease such as pneumonia, coccidiosis, enterotoxemia, feedlot polio...Just like humans animals are susceptatble to all sorts of disease too.....more often than not this diet blows out there livers, over time the acid eats throught he rumen wall and the bacterias enter the animals blood stream, these microbes end up in the liver which impairs the livers funtions...So you see antiobiotics are needed for some semblence of kindness to these animals.....--------------------

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umm corn is a grass justl ike bamboo is a grass..... think about that

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Robbie corn is a GRAIN........Do you know why a cow eats grass???????

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Posted (edited)

grass is a grain. and corn is a grass crazy right? no. because u need to remebmer that a grain is a grass not all grasses are grains though. look it up. a corn is a type of tall grass liek bambo. corn is a cerael grain. a grain is a wheat and a wheat is a grass.

a cow natualry will eat any plant it can get. the bulk of its diet however is garss.

Edited by robbieb

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there are more than just cows that are feed grain such as horses for example

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Robbie inventive use of logic :w00t: but no a grass isn't a grass is a grass.......I'm a bit tired so I'll psot the reason tomorrow.... :D

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Posted (edited)

Geri, Cows are herbivores, not grain eaters

What's the difference :lol:

Edited by frogfish

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there isnt a diffrence ur either and herbivore carnivore omnivore decomposer scavanger or parasite (endo or ecto) cows are herbivores.

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Theres quite a difference, a cow isn't a grain eater and that is what they will eat the majority of their lifes, they will get grass the first few weeks of life only in preperation for the feedlot. a animal that is almost only fed grain gets sick relatively fast within 150 days of its life..the reason corn is used is becasue it fattens up the cow very fast a grass fed animal takes alot longer years actually and the more grain the more Omega 3 is depleted and the 'protien is a very poor quality...the only country that exclusively grass feeds there animals is Argentina...i am in the process of researching just what ranchers are actually grass feeding ...what companys ..Nutrition is a wholeness philosophy its not seperate little compartments , if the soil is infertile and the cow is malnourished and the water is polluted it will trickle to the person eating the food.....Most other countrys see no line between heatlth and food ....Americans for some reason don't make the connection YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT..........I'm not looking to debate just putting out info..... :D

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sherri CORN IS A GRASS!

The teosintes make up a group of large grasses of the genus Zea found in Mexico, Guatemala and Nicaragua. There are five recognized species of teosinte: Zea diploperennis, Zea perennis, Zea luxurians, Zea nicaraguensis and Zea mays. The last species is further divided into four subspecies: ssp. mays, ssp. huehuetenangensis, ssp. mexicana, and ssp. parviglumis, the last three also are teosintes. The species group into two sections, sect. Luxuriantes, with the first four species, and sect. Zea with Zea mays.
Zea Mays is CORN!!!!!! I WIN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teosinte

SO LIKE I SAID GRASS IS A GRAIN GRAIN IS WHEAT GRASS IS A WHEAT SO CORN IS A WHEAT CORN IS A GRAIN AND CORN IS A GRASS HAHA so haha yea that right for dinner i had grass yea i had corn so there.

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sherri CORN IS A GRASS! Zea Mays is CORN!!!!!! I WIN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teosinte

SO LIKE I SAID GRASS IS A GRAIN GRAIN IS WHEAT GRASS IS A WHEAT SO CORN IS A WHEAT CORN IS A GRAIN AND CORN IS A GRASS HAHA so haha yea that right for dinner i had grass yea i had corn so there.

but didnt you also say..you dont care for online info...when someone posts you a link to read you say its .....garbage.....buut when it suits you whuuoops there it is :w00t:

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i never said that i said i dont liek surveys and out dated sites. whops there it is READ NEXT TIME. u people get realy anoying after a while. ur refering to when i was given a site that had a bunch of surveys done from 1970 till 1994 on adhd no one accepts anything realy that came from that time frame on adhd all new studies say its genetisc and i showed u liek 3 sites saying that. and when i was givne some weird doctors perosnal site and her weird view of adhd and ever other thing on earth. she seemss more like a televangelist thne a doctor sorry if i didnt accecpt her twisted views. i give sites that are up to date and accurate. dont get mad at me for not accpeting the same and i explaned why i dont liek surveys many times. (statics made me realise that there usualy crap)

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Posted (edited)

i never said that i said i dont liek surveys and out dated sites. whops there it is READ NEXT TIME. u people get realy anoying after a while. ur refering to when i was given a site that had a bunch of surveys done from 1970 till 1994 on adhd no one accepts anything realy that came from that time frame on adhd all new studies say its genetisc and i showed u liek 3 sites saying that. and when i was givne some weird doctors perosnal site and her weird view of adhd and ever other thing on earth. she seemss more like a televangelist thne a doctor sorry if i didnt accecpt her twisted views. i give sites that are up to date and accurate. dont get mad at me for not accpeting the same and i explaned why i dont liek surveys many times. (statics made me realise that there usualy crap)

They are only CRAP to you LOL you select what you want to believe...cuz I gave you links (UPDATED ONES) and you refused to believe them too ^_^

On the other hand I agree with you on the corn and grass issue...but at the same time can see what Sheri is talking about...

Edited by Beckys_Mom

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robbie got you sheri :P

Corn is actually a grass...a C4 monocot. Grass seeds are the equivalent of corn :tu: Throw some corn on the ground in front of some grazing cow, they will eat it up. Same with pigs :tu:

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Psh tell me i dont know my biology, and what lol

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Yo guys it's not a contest as to who know more about this and that...and FYI Sheri is a highly educated woman....never underestimate her :)

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Psh tell me i dont know my biology, and what lol

:lol: translated - psh tell me I don't know how to google biology and what lol

:lol:

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Maize and Alfalfa crops here grown specifically to feed animals and great care is taken to make sure it's healthy for the animals, or their crops don't get sold. Something else too but can't recall atm. Bunch of animal/biology freaks out here at the aggie depot.

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or u knwo when u major in zoology u learn some bio too

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Posted (edited)

Zea mays indentata is the main variety grown commercially for grain and fodder, but there are other types, of zea Mays ( technically of the grasses family) but ....Stay with the class here robbie and frog we are discussing Zea mays Indentata corn /grain that is fed to herbivores, In simple english this isn't the grass these animals should be eating... do you two know what a rumen is????? No frog a cow would not just eat corn unless it had been taught too......And after about 150 days without antibiotics the cow would not eat the grain at all.....

It kind of goes with the human is an omnivore it can eat meat, it can smoke cigarettes it can pour cups of oil and sugars down its throat, it can eat corn fed meat but at too what peril.....this is what this thread is about...... :no: ..do you guys even care about waht you eat????Frog how do you feel about a fish eating corn???????they are being bred to do that???what does a fish eat naturally????that is what we are talking about.....

Edited by Sheri berri

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From Cornell University Science News:

http://www.news.cornell.edu/releases/Aug97...estock.hrs.html

MONTREAL -- From one ecologist's perspective, the American system of farming

grain-fed livestock consumes resources far out of proportion to the yield, accelerates soil erosion, affects world food supply and will be changing in the future.

"If all the grain currently fed to livestock in the United States were consumed directly by people, the number of people who could be fed would be nearly 800 million," David Pimentel, Professor of Ecology in Cornell University's College of Agriculture and Life Sciences, reported at the July 24-26 meeting of the Canadian Society of Animal Science in Montreal. Or, if those grains were exported, it would boost the U.S. trade balance by $80 billion a year, Pimentel estimated.

With only grass-fed livestock, individual Americans would still get more than the recommended daily allowance (RDA) of meat and dairy protein, according to Pimentel's report, "Livestock Production: Energy Inputs and the Environment."

An environmental analyst and longtime critic of waste and inefficiency in agricultural practices, Pimentel depicted grain-fed livestock farming as a costly and nonsustainable way to produce animal protein. He distinguished grain-fed meat production from pasture-raised livestock, calling cattle-grazing a more reasonable use of marginal land.

Animal protein production requires more than eight times as much fossil-fuel energy than production of plant protein while yielding animal protein that is only 1.4 times more nutritious for humans than the comparable amount of plant protein, according to the Cornell ecologist's analysis.

Tracking food animal production from the feed trough to the dinner table, Pimentel found broiler chickens to be the most efficient use of fossil energy, and beef, the least. Chicken meat production consumes energy in a 4:1 ratio to protein output; beef cattle production requires an energy input to protein output ratio of 54:1. (Lamb meat production is nearly as inefficient at 50:1, according to the ecologist's analysis of U.S. Department of Agriculture statistics. Other ratios range from 13:1 for turkey meat and 14:1 for milk protein to 17:1 for pork and 26:1 for eggs.)

Animal agriculture is a leading consumer of water resources in the United States, Pimentel noted. Grain-fed beef production takes 100,000 liters of water for every kilogram of food. Raising broiler chickens takes 3,500 liters of water to make a kilogram of meat. In comparison, soybean production uses 2,000 liters for kilogram of food produced; rice, 1,912; wheat, 900; and potatoes, 500 liters. "Water shortages already are severe in the Western and Southern United States and the situation is quickly becoming worse because of a rapidly growing U.S. population that requires more water for all of its needs, especially agriculture," Pimentel observed.

Livestock are directly or indirectly responsible for much of the soil erosion in the United States, the ecologist determined. On lands where feed grain is produced, soil loss averages 13 tons per hectare per year. Pasture lands are eroding at a slower pace, at an average of 6 tons per hectare per year. But erosion may exceed 100 tons on severely overgrazed pastures, and 54 percent of U.S. pasture land is being overgrazed.

"More than half the U.S. grain and nearly 40 percent of world grain is being fed to livestock rather than being consumed directly by humans," Pimentel said. "Although grain production is increasing in total, the per capita supply has been decreasing for more than a decade. Clearly, there is reason for concern in the future."

EIGHT MEATY FACTS ABOUT ANIMAL FOOD

From "Livestock Production: Energy Inputs and the Environment"

By David Pimentel

-- WHERE'S THE GRAIN? The 7 billion livestock animals in the United States consume five times as much grain as is consumed directly by the entire American population.

-- HERBIVORES ON THE HOOF. Each year an estimated 41 million tons of plant protein is fed to U.S. livestock to produce an estimated 7 million tons of animal protein for human consumption. About 26 million tons of the livestock feed comes from grains and 15 million tons from forage crops. For every kilogram of high-quality animal protein produced, livestock are fed nearly 6 kg of plant protein.

-- FOSSIL FUEL TO FOOD FUEL. On average, animal protein production in the U.S. requires 28 kilocalories (kcal) for every kcal of protein produced for human consumption. Beef and lamb are the most costly, in terms of fossil fuel energy input to protein output at 54:1 and 50:1, respectively. Turkey and chicken meat production are the most efficient (13:1 and 4:1, respectively). Grain production, on average, requires 3.3 kcal of fossil fuel for every kcal of protein produced. The U.S. now imports about 54 percent of its oil; by the year 2015, that import figure is expected to rise to 100 percent.

-- THIRSTY PRODUCTION SYSTEMS. U.S. agriculture accounts for 87 percent of all the fresh water consumed each year. Livestock directly use only 1.3 percent of that water. But when the water required for forage and grain production is included, livestock's water usage rises dramatically. Every kilogram of beef produced takes 100,000 liters of water. Some 900 liters of water go into producing a kilogram of wheat. Potatoes are even less "thirsty," at 500 liters per kilogram.

-- HOME ON THE RANGE. More than 302 million hectares of land are devoted to producing feed for the U.S. livestock population -- about 272 million hectares in pasture and about 30 million hectares for cultivated feed grains.

-- DISAPPEARING SOIL. About 90 percent of U.S. cropland is losing soil -- to wind and water erosion -- at 13 times above the sustainable rate. Soil loss is most severe in some of the richest farming areas; Iowa loses topsoil at 30 times the rate of soil formation. Iowa has lost one-half its topsoil in only 150 years of farming -- soil that took thousands of years to form.

-- PLENTY OF PROTEIN: Nearly 7 million tons (metric) of animal protein is produced annually in the U.S. -- enough to supply every American man, woman and child with 75 grams of animal protein a day. With the addition of 34 grams of available plant protein, a total of 109 grams of protein is available per capita. The RDA (recommended daily allowance) per adult per day is 56 grams of protein for a mixed diet.

-- OUT TO PASTURE. If all the U.S. grain now fed to livestock were exported and if cattlemen switched to grass-fed production systems, less beef would be available and animal protein in the average American diet would drop from 75 grams to 29 grams per day. That, plus current levels of plant-protein consumption, would still yield more than the RDA for protein.

***************************************************************************

My sincerest apologies to Robbie because this article wasn't written this morning or yesterday or even in 2006, so according to Robbie, its value is questionable at best.

And, Robbie, perhaps if you lost your obnoxious, arrogant attitude and tried to contribute productively to the discussion, you might not incur as much counterproductive conflict and negativitity.

****************************************

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thanks micheal, excellent point grain fed is the least efficent way to feed the majority in the bigger picture...

the topsoil is depleted meaning it has no nutritive value....that is why it is recommended for the vegan to be sure to find a good source of B-12...b-12 came from the soil...I'm not convinced its coming in the meat ...my undestanding is a grain fed animal will eventually blow out its liver and the liver never works at optimal ability anyways its usually riddled with lesions and tumours..... i wouldn't trust that b-12 is in the meat......as a meat eater I'd look into that just to be sure....Just my 2 cents

also the waters are horrible especially here in Calif....Our water is contaminated the newest concern is percholate and it may concern some since we supply alot of the milk...percholate causes the thyroid to malfunction and its very serious in a growing child.......It seriously concerns me how much more damage a child can handle......In our whole foods stores warnings are posted on milk...i suspect warning labels will be added to the carton.......

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