U.S guns coming into Canada

[DR. YO]

Don't blame U.S. for gun crime, ambassador tells Canada

By CAMPBELL CLARK

Thursday, October 27, 2005 Posted at 5:25 AM EST

From Wednesday's Globe and Mail

The U.S. ambassador said in an interview that Canada is unfairly blaming the United States for half its gun crime.

"I think they're incorrect," Mr. Wilkins said in an interview. "I just think it's easy when things go wrong to blame us, and I think that that's being done unfairly, quite frankly. I think we ought to emphasize that we're working together to solve the problem.

"I think the figure that's been bandied about of 50 per cent has not been substantiated."

Mr. Wilkins told CTV's Canada AM that the Canadians admitted the figure has no basis. Mr. Wilkins declined to tell The Globe whether the Prime Minister conceded the figure was not substantiated.

He listed U.S. efforts to stop gun smuggling to Canada, including joint Canada-U.S. police teams, more than 40 joint investigations, access to U.S. electronic gun-tracing systems, and training for Canadian forces.

A spokesman for the Prime Minister, Melanie Gruer, said that Mr. Martin had difficulty recalling the source of the figure in the meetings, but did not say it was unsubstantiated.

In a press conference on Monday, Mr. Martin said that the United States had to shoulder responsibility for gun smuggling into Canada.

"But when we hear, for example, the police association, the chiefs of police, say that as many as 50 per cent of crimes committed using guns, they are guns that come from the United States, largely illegally, it's clear we have to work together," Mr. Martin said.

Many police experts say a substantial number of guns from the United States are used in crimes, but many cannot be traced. Weapons are often stolen or smuggled, but the RCMP, Justice Canada, and Statistics Canada's Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics said they have no figures for their origins.

Spokesmen for the Canadian Professional Police Association and the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police said the statistic did not come from them.

Ms. Gruer said yesterday that the source was Toronto Police Chief William Blair and Toronto Mayor David Miller. A spokesman for Mr. Miller said that the information came from the Toronto Police Service, and Chief Blair.

"It was said by the chief, but to be frank with you, we're not sure it's a Toronto statistic," said Staff Inspector Bruce Crawford, who oversees the force's gangs and guns task force.

Aside from the differences of opinion over what constitutes a "crime gun," serial numbers are usually rubbed out on guns seized, making them untraceable, he said.

He said from the handguns they have traced, the 50 figure seems believable for Toronto, but he has no idea whether that would apply to areas where rifles and shotguns are more frequently used.

Staff Insp. Crawford said most of the guns smuggled from the United States come in cars a few at a time over land borders. Most are smuggled by Canadians, perhaps with U.S. accomplices, he said.

Since guns are available everywhere in the U.S it's coming into Canada in great numbers.

[HotDogBun]

We send them Guns, they send us Weed. Sounds perfectly fair.

[__Kratos__]

Yeah, guns are every where here in America but that our right. If Canadians choose to break Canadian laws that would be Canada's problem. It's like Canada is saying we should stop our freedom of guns for the benefict of Canada and that will never happen.

[Piney]

The only problem with the U.S. is in certain states any knucklehead can buy a gun and they run them to the states were you can't. I live in New Jersey, one of the hardest states to buy a gun. Most illegal guns here come from the South. I have a big collection and I have to keep my current address updated and have a background check with every purchase. Every state should have these laws. I am not saying ban guns just keep them in the right hands. Background for a mental record and a criminal record should be required for every purchase on a national level but we don't so we have a "gun route" which gives the ultra left excuses to take mine and we get flack such as this....

Lapi'che

[Michelle]

Being a gun owner from the South, Piney, I can assure you the same rules apply...in Tennessee and Georgia anyway. Not sure about the others.

[rocky4]

Dont blame the U.S for Canada's domestic problems!

Edited November 11, 2005 by rocky4

[__Kratos__]

Background checks are only for handguns here. That doesn't apply to gun shows either if you know what I mean. *wink wink*

I can go over to really any store with guns... wal-mart, dick's, fleet farm and such... buy a rifle/shotgun, ammo, and everything as long as I have the money tonight.

[Novo]

Ummm... excuse me? Kratos the U.S is entirely at fault for this. U.S citizens are the ones bringing the weapons in, Not canadians. There guns largely produced or at the very least exported through the U.S. Bringing guns into there country violates there laws, Hence were at fault. Thats like saying its okay for us to buy illegal fireworks from some mexican guy. Whos at fault? Partially us yes, He did get through the border. But given the huge amount of border traffic between us and both of our neighboring countries its easy to understand how so many things manage to be smuggled through.

In summary, Canada has every right to complain. Violating there laws is just that, Its there country and they as such can reserve to right to do whatever the hell they want with it.

[rocky4]

I'm just want to say that I am really fedup with your country. Canada has been sitting there for years doing nothing about anything. When there's a war your country never participates and when you do it's only because 30 other countries do. You expect us to defend your boarders because you lack the ability to.

C'omon..... Let's be fair !!!!

[Mekorig]

Canada had a much better international imgae than you country. Have dome more good to the world that your country. Have help much more than your country. Hasnt begin unnecesary wars has your country. Had helped the allied forces in both World Wars, and had an stable army, air force and navy, soo, they dont need the "USA shield".

Soo, before making redneck nationalistic coments on Canada, please inform yourself better.

[Piney]

Canada had a much better international imgae than you country. Have dome more good to the world that your country. Have help much more than your country. Hasnt begin unnecesary wars has your country. Had helped the allied forces in both World Wars, and had an stable army, air force and navy, soo, they dont need the "USA shield".

Soo, before making redneck nationalistic coments on Canada, please inform yourself better.

....broke off from England without a war, freed their slaves without a war and treats Native Americans a hell of a lot better. AMEN bro..............

Lapi'che ni'tis

[rocky4]

Canada had a much better international imgae than you country. Have dome more good to the world that your country. Have help much more than your country. Hasnt begin unnecesary wars has your country. Had helped the allied forces in both World Wars, and had an stable army, air force and navy, soo, they dont need the "USA shield".

Soo, before making redneck nationalistic coments on Canada, please inform yourself better.

I think you have your facts wrong. It was the U.S that helped Germany and Japan rebuild after the war. If it was not for the U.S. europe would be under Hitler

Edited November 11, 2005 by rocky4

[Jodie.Lynne]

I'm just want to say that I am really fedup with your country. Canada has been sitting there for years doing nothing about anything. When there's a war your country never participates and when you do it's only because 30 other countries do. You expect us to defend your boarders because you lack the ability to.

C'omon..... Let's be fair !!!!

Off Topic, but....

Aren't you off to a rollicking start. 1st day here, and you've already had one of your topics locked, and now you're trashing the Canadians.

Whats next? Armageddon?

Enjoy your stay on UM, but I don't think you will.

[rocky4]

Off Topic, but....

Aren't you off to a rollicking start. 1st day here, and you've already had one of your topics locked, and now you're trashing the Canadians.

Whats next? Armageddon?

Enjoy your stay on UM, but I don't think you will.

I'm just stating the facts. You know it, you are from the U.S. You are just afraid to express it due to your conformity.

[Jodie.Lynne]

rocky4, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any facts to back up your vitriolic statements, or are you just speaking out of your cloaca?

[rocky4]

....broke off from England without a war, freed their slaves without a war and treats Native Americans a hell of a lot better. AMEN bro..............

Lapi'che ni'tis

What you dont understand is war. War is the last resort, if we never went to war with England we would have never become the nation we are now.

[Mekorig]

I think you have your facts wrong. It was the U.S that helped Germany and Japan rebuild after the war. If it was not for the U.S. europe would be under Hitler

Well..lets ee. Another guy that belives that the USA defeat Hitler and US troops conquered Berlin by itself whiout help.

The soviets were already giving a hell of a fight to the nazis when the USA came into the war, and when the co-join attack of the USA/Comonwealth to france begin, the russian were pushing back the nazis and invading their territories. By the time the USA/Comonweatlh were still fighting in france, the soviets were at the doors of BErlin.

The USA/Comonwealth help a lot in the fight? Yes, i dont deny that. The bombing of the Nazi industrial might was very necesary.

The USA/UK defeat the nazis by thenself. Hell no.

The USAdefeated the Japanese by itself. Partially. The Comonwealth was fightin the Japanese already in asia, and the USA begin to attack form the east. The Japanese surrender by two reason. The drop of the two nuclear bombs into two cities of the main island, and by the serious treath of a soviert invasion form the north. They prefered to treat whit the USa than whit the soviets (i understand them).

Canada give mens, supliess, pilots, crews, technicians, ships, tanks, blood, sweat and tears has the USA, soo, has i said, try to inform yourself better when make a coment like that.

[SilverCougar]

I'm just stating the facts. You know it, you are from the U.S. You are just afraid to express it due to your conformity.

On can say the same thing about you...

[rocky4]

rocky4, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any facts to back up your vitriolic statements, or are you just speaking out of your cloaca?

Facts? Look around you, look at your standard of living, look at the quality of education we have......OMG I can go on and on.. Look at the internet, we invented this.

[rocky4]

On can say the same thing about you...

I stating it as I see it.

[Jodie.Lynne]

I'm just want to say that I am really fedup with your country. Canada has been sitting there for years doing nothing about anything. When there's a war your country never participates and when you do it's only because 30 other countries do. You expect us to defend your boarders because you lack the ability to.

C'omon..... Let's be fair !!!!

Canada has been sitting there for years doing nothing about anything.

Care to expand on this?

When there's a war your country never participates and when you do it's only because 30 other countries do.

As opposed to our country which goes to war under false pretenses.

You expect us to defend your boarders because you lack the ability to.

You do realize that Canada has its own Armed Forces? In fact, at least one member on these boards is serving Canada in her military services.

Oh, and when speaking about a country's boundaries, it is "borders", not "boarders"

Edited November 11, 2005 by JMPD1

[Thanato]

I'm just want to say that I am really fedup with your country. Canada has been sitting there for years doing nothing about anything. When there's a war your country never participates and when you do it's only because 30 other countries do. You expect us to defend your boarders because you lack the ability to.

C'omon..... Let's be fair !!!!

I'm just stating the facts. You know it, you are from the U.S. You are just afraid to express it due to your conformity.

Nice lies err as you put it facts.

The FACT is Canada hasnt been sitting up here doing nothing, we have been doing a hell of a lot, were active in NATO, NORAD, the UN, and varius other Alliances. It is Safe to say with out Canada, the Ruskies could of launched a Suprise attack on the US.

Canada was a very militaristic nation before the FLQ Crisis, We have NEVER lost a War, not once, Wars we participated in and won, Bore War, WW1, WW2, Korean War. We were one of the first Nations in WW1 and WW2, and had major roles in both of them, and in the KOrean war, we also had a major role.

Canada would of taken part in the War in Iraq if the UN had given the get go. And since POPULAR damand in Canada told the government not to go, we didnt.

And about defending our boarders, we dont have to Geography is taking care of that for us.

~Thanato

[Piney]

What you dont understand is war. War is the last resort, if we never went to war with England we would have never become the nation we are now.

Was war with Iraq a last resort. I think not. How about Vietnam. Vietnam was over Dupont's rubber plantations. My father died for rubber. I understand war completely child. I fought from the Drug War to Eastern Europe. The question is do you?

As for quality of education. I noticed the Canadian posters can certainly spell alot better here.

Lapi'che

[Mekorig]

Facts? Look around you, look at your standard of living, look at the quality of education we have......OMG I can go on and on.. Look at the internet, we invented this.

In fact, to the recent world standards the USA is scoring prety low for a 1st world country. A lot of your brain pool is people from outside the country, and other countrys are keeping in line whit the USA in investigation, and surpasing it in some fields. And what about your standard of life. A lot of your population is havely in debt to mantain that standard, the free heatl system is almost inexistent, and your country is gaining more and more internal and external debt, creating a enormous deficit. Your civil lierties are being cut in the name of "segurity", making your once proud republican legacy into a dictatorial system each day. You dont live in paradise rocky4, and beliving in that dont have you the right to make statements whiout checking the facts.

And by the way. The internet statrted has a military nertwork named ARPANET IIRC, and later, taken by the geek generation of bussinessmen to create what is now. And now the world is reclaiming that no one could control the internet, to make it free for real.

[__Kratos__]

Ummm... excuse me? Kratos the U.S is entirely at fault for this. U.S citizens are the ones bringing the weapons in, Not canadians. There guns largely produced or at the very least exported through the U.S. Bringing guns into there country violates there laws, Hence were at fault. Thats like saying its okay for us to buy illegal fireworks from some mexican guy. Whos at fault? Partially us yes, He did get through the border. But given the huge amount of border traffic between us and both of our neighboring countries its easy to understand how so many things manage to be smuggled through.

In summary, Canada has every right to complain. Violating there laws is just that, Its there country and they as such can reserve to right to do whatever the hell they want with it.

Then let the Canadian officals arrest those guys. That's their right, it's their country up there.

To solely blame America because of a couple criminals is just stupid. Blaming someone else for your own problems is so much easier to do.