What if you're wrong atheists...why take the

[northwest]

How does being Atheist or Agnostic mean that we're wasting our lives...

Because god is the source and oneness and light, and love, like a soil that everything grows from.

if a plant rejected the soil in which it grew, it would wither.

But if it spreads its roots deep into the ground and becomes connected with it, it grows

to be a tall sequoia tree, a witness of ages

and I'm not talking about christianity here, that is just one expression of spirituality,

each level of growth has its own expression.

for some spirituality is burning a dead animal that could be food in an expression of sacrifice to the higher power, because they know no better, for

some it is mediation, for some it is church sessions. Some like to call this oneness the light, some like to call it Allah,

some like to call it the great white spirit.

It is pointless to judge these manifestations of spirituality.

For each his own way of growing depending on how far he can see.

Edited September 16, 2007 by northwest

[Jodie.Lynne]

To each their own. Believers need to believe, others don't.

so what? If your believe makes you happy, then all is good.

My question is why do y'all feel incomplete if others have a different path?

But I know the answer I will get.

[northwest]

Yes, you can assume the answer

Look at it from our perspective.

Imagine if you knew, or if you will, thought you knew, something really important that affects people's lives, and your family didn't know. Wouldn't you be happier if they knew too?

Or, imagine how you would feel if you were educated in various sciences, and the world operated on some uneducated principles.

Some people get mad over it, some people get sad, and some are hopeful

but you can't be indifferent if you at least a little care for humanity as a whole.

Well now replace that privileged knowledge with what believers consider to be knowledge (what they believe in), and the feeling is the same.

[AtlantisRises]

mhm.

To believe out of fear would nont be belief in the first place. It would be pointless

[GreyWeather]

What if Atheism is wrong?

Well, I'm not a dead Atheist, so I couldn't tell you.

[Jodie.Lynne]

Yes, you can assume the answer

Look at it from our perspective.

Imagine if you knew, or if you will, thought you knew, something really important that affects people's lives, and your family didn't know. Wouldn't you be happier if they knew too?

Or, imagine how you would feel if you were educated in various sciences, and the world operated on some uneducated principles.

Some people get mad over it, some people get sad, and some are hopeful

but you can't be indifferent if you at least a little care for humanity as a whole.

Well now replace that privileged knowledge with what believers consider to be knowledge (what they believe in), and the feeling is the same.

BING! BING! BING! We have a winner!!!!!!

Now, do me a favor and turn that arguement around. What if I am happier being a non-believer? Let me share MY truth with you. You will be happy because I am happy knowing my truth. So, logically, I want to share my happy truth with YOU!

OR, you can believe what you will, and allow others to do the same.

Because, obviously & logically, if one were NOT happy with their current belief system, they would change it, no?

As I did. I followed your god, was instructed in the teachings of the christians. However, it NEVER made sense to me, and made me fearful rather than comforted. So, when I became of age to make my own decisions, I stepped outside those teachings and sought another path. One that makes sense, to me at least, and brings me comfort. And I daresay that I am probably as happy & content with my path as you are with yours.

[fullywired]

How does being Atheist or Agnostic mean that we're wasting our lives...

I would assume that if there ends up being no god when it comes down to it , it will be the religious fanatics and extremists who would have wasted their lives...

Just a honest question and an opinion.

I was replying to skim who is a believer not an atheist

fullywired

[SidSawter]

OR, you can believe what you will, and allow others to do the same.

Because, obviously & logically, if one were NOT happy with their current belief system, they would change it, no?

As I did. I followed your god, was instructed in the teachings of the christians. However, it NEVER made sense to me, and made me fearful rather than comforted. So, when I became of age to make my own decisions, I stepped outside those teachings and sought another path. One that makes sense, to me at least, and brings me comfort. And I daresay that I am probably as happy & content with my path as you are with yours.

I agree 110%. I'm happy not knowing and potentially not believing. I, as well, grew up as a Christian - Catholic actually. Frankly, i was not happy and didn't agree with what they saw as 'truth' so i quested for my own truth. In my opinion, i find that religion causes more hate, violence, and ignorance than it causes good.

Edited September 16, 2007 by SidSawter

[northwest]

seems like catholicism is an atheist-factory

many people born into catholic families are predisposed to be atheists it seems

[seanph]

Any god that would condemn me for lack of belief ... is not a god I'm interested spending eternity with. No thanks. I'll gladly live my life the best way I know how, try and make a positive difference in this life--instead of doing so for want of a heavenly reward--and take my chances with an afterlife.

Sean

[SidSawter]

seems like catholicism is an atheist-factory

many people born into catholic families are predisposed to be atheists it seems

I am not an atheist in any sense of the word. yes, i openly 'bash' (using bash for lack of better word) religion, but to be perfectly honest, i am trying to find something that i can believe in. Atheists flat out say there is no god. Frankly, for all i know, there could be one. If there is a god though, i will have a few things to say to him.

Edited September 16, 2007 by SidSawter

[lottie2002]

I don't think there's anything to worry about when it comes to believing or not believing. After all, if god loves all it's creatures, than surely he will forgive non-believers for, well, not believing in him? After all, could you condemn someone you love to hell? I doubt it.

Personally, I don't consider myself anything. I'm not atheist, not religious, not really anything. And I'm not too worried about it either. I'm not going to waste my time worrying and thinking too much about something that I'll never know for sure anyway, until I'm dead, after which it's pointless to start thinking about it.

[LittleIrishVampiress]

seems like catholicism is an atheist-factory

many people born into catholic families are predisposed to be atheists it seems

LOL!

funny, cos its true

[Cradle of Fish]

We all could be wrong, even the most certain christians and atheists.

Everyone is so sure of their stance on theological issues, yet so ignorant at the same time. I might be wrong about Jesus, Allah or Vishnu, but I applied skepticism to god. I could be wrong to do that, I really dont know. I dont rule out the possibility that God exists, but I dont act on it. If I acted on every theological possibility I'd have my hands full for the rest of my life.

[libra II]

http://www.lyrics007.com/Queen%20Lyrics/Pr...e%20Lyrics.html

[northwest]

Any god that would condemn me for lack of belief ... is not a god

Imagine there is a galaxy of stars, each star is a living entity of light, and as you go to the middle the stars get denser, until they become one ball of light.

And imagine that this whole galaxy is god, and that the further you go from the center this god "spills" around and the tiny little parts of it,

consider themselves separate from all others.

If the universe has nothing except this galaxy of light and darkness around it, how can one of these particles of light rebel against god and still

be something?

If god is in everything, then rebellion is like striving to be nothing.

Not believing in god is one thing, and I really don't mind people having legitimate views such as that

what I see as senseless is believing in gods existence and still refusing to come to him.

When two people come together, that's god, when they go apart, that's darkness. So if you reject that togetherness and love,

it is rejecting your own self and your place in the universe, because you yourself are a building block of this god.

But sorry if I didn't get you right.

Being a rebel and being an atheist is not the same thing. Being a rebel is denial and pain.

And rebels are those who perceive god as cruel.

God is like a hologram, depending on where you stand, you will see him as an avenger, or

as a being of love

It depends where in the great pyramid you are.

The top of the pyramid makes all points come together in one point, becoming mathematical point (infinite oneness)

on the top.

But as you go down, so does this oneness feel colder and more separate.

It is an illusion of the perceiver. Like a function outputing itself into itself: we see the god that we are

Edited September 16, 2007 by northwest

[seanph]

... Not believing in god is one thing, and I really don't mind people having legitimate views such as that

what I see as senseless is believing in gods existence and still refusing to come to him...

I don't believe in a deity simply because there is absolutely no evidence for one. If there was a god, and it showed itself, I would still reject it. Why? Any god that would create a world of such cruelty and barbarity, is not a god worthy of anything but scorn IMO.

But sorry if I didn't get you right.

Being a rebel and being an atheist is not the same thing. Being a rebel is denial and pain.

And rebels are those who perceive god as cruel.

God is like a hologram, depending on where you stand, you will see him as an avenger, or

as a being of love

I'm actually agnostic now. And if god does exist, IT is most certainly cruel. Again, any god that would create a world such as this ... is a monster.

Sean

[ShaunZero]

I don't believe in a deity simply because there is absolutely no evidence for one. If there was a god, and it showed itself, I would still reject it. Why? Any god that would create a world of such cruelty and barbarity, is not a god worthy of anything but scorn IMO.

I'm actually agnostic now. And if god does exist, IT is most certainly cruel. Again, any god that would create a world such as this ... is a monster.

Sean

I agree that any God who would create a world like this would be a very cruel God. But at the same time, what if God is just part of the universe? What if there is one central "source" of which everything comes from. That could also be called God... That's my favorite view of the universe. A divine being in and of itself. Everything is actually connected, leading back to it's source....

[northwest]

I don't see cruelty in the world, all I see people tripping and falling over their own shoelaces.

But I guess if you see death as something negative, then It could be a cruel world,

but god(cruel god) and death-as-an-end usually don't exist in the same model of things, at least

not in the model we are discussing

[libra II]

I don't see cruelty in the world, all I see people tripping and falling over their own shoelaces.

But I guess if you see death as something negative, then It could be a cruel world,

but god(cruel god) and death-as-an-end usually don't exist in the same model of things, at least

not in the model we are discussing

And yet you understand what the word cruelty means? Come on, NW, surely you can do better than that

[northwest]

Give me an example of this cruelty you see from first hand experience

[libra II]

Give me an example of this cruelty you see from first hand experience

How about an animal being skinned alive?

[northwest]

I suppose it is done by human bodies controlled by god himself in a trance?

A man chose to do it as his own free choice.

It's his blame

[momentarylapseofreason]

i would encourage all to at least give christ a chance and seek his knowledge. dont judge until you, open-mindedly, explore his love. if your still left wanting, then fair enough. i feel that if you truly open your heart, he will touch you. i can attest to his love in my life. im a better father and husband through practicing his ideas and embracing his love.

some people use evangalizm to "boost numbers." this is wrong. a fake "christian" only sets christianity back, because they arent representing the words of christ and makes us appear to be hypocrites.

even atheists, though they may not believe in the divinity of christ, must admit that if everyone practiced what christ preached, the world would be a better place. you may not believe he was god, but he believed in what he preached so much that he endured the most inhuman execution known to man. you have to admit, thats admirable.

When is it going to sink into that milky head of yours that MOST OF US went this route before? You keep saying this !!!

Some of us were fantically faithful. Then something or a couple things went "click" or "pop" in our bubble ! No it wasn't an unanswered prayer/s or bad experiences but may have been a mixed bag. What a drag !

Otherwise I pretty much agree with you.

Accepting Christ into your life is the best thing for you I am sure but some of us can be great fathers/wives/husbands because we want to create a positive effect in others lives and it's JUST PLAIN LOGICAL to be the best you can be.

I REALLY ADMIRE unbelievers who are kind,loving,giving people without any motive of fear or reward in the end. To me these are our TRUE SELFLESS HEROES. Simply the Best..............

Edited September 17, 2007 by momentarylapseofreason

[libra II]

I suppose it is done by human bodies controlled by god himself in a trance?

A man chose to do it as his own free choice.

It's his blame

So it isn't cruelty?