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promKing

Car that runs on water

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promKing

Watch this video about a invention of a car that runs on water VIDEO

Very cheap and clean.

Edited by Tiggs
Corrected Typo in title

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Please Explain

I heard this 20 years ago.

Deuterium project...but until now....?

Also i heard about fatty oils could be use.

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swtp
I heard this 20 years ago.

Deuterium project...but until now....?

Also i heard about fatty oils could be use.

Yeah i heard about this awhile back. There was a program on t.v. that showed a car like that and this guy even drank some of the water that dripped out of the exsaust pipe to show it wasn,t polluted! Also the there were several celebs on a talk show promoting these cars that ran on used cooking oil, they each owned at least one car like that and said it was great for driving around in town. But they wern,t yet practical for long distance trips since there arn,t any filling stations all over selling old cooking oil as fuel yet! But these celebs said they had their own pumps installed right in their back yards that they used for filling these cars up to drive around in the city, one said that every time you start one of these cars or they go by you they smell like french fries!

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BELOWIM

WaterPowered Car.com another interesting one is the Joe cell which apparently date,s back to WWII, these methods saw Rommell defeated because of the vast distance,s travelled. Joe cell,s operate on a Wilhelm Reitch Theory, and we know what happened to him, I have experimented with these cell,s Interesting!! youtube have various video,s of some of this. After WWII all these device,s were removed from Tank,s and put into a warehouse. Yes more Mystery!?!?

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Torgo

sorry for resurrecting this but something that runs on water with only water as a byproduct is impossible. You CAN use water as a hydrogen source - using some other form of energy to split the water into hydrogen and oxygen and using the hydrogen as fuel either by burning it or putting it through a fuel cell. HOWEVER, SPLITTING the water takes JUST AS MUCH energy as you get when you oxidize the hydrogen again. The water cannot be an energy source, just a way of STORING it as hydrogen.

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BELOWIM

Torgo "sorry for resurrecting this but something that runs on water with only water as a byproduct is impossible. You CAN use water as a hydrogen source - using some other form of energy to split the water into hydrogen and oxygen and using the hydrogen as fuel either by burning it or putting it through a fuel cell. HOWEVER, SPLITTING the water takes JUST AS MUCH energy as you get when you oxidize the hydrogen again. The water cannot be an energy source, just a way of STORING it as hydrogen." An easy contradiction there, would be a steam engine, but that is,nt what this is about, I was reading a while back and also had information, but I had a serious computer malfunction that erased all my link's, now I download to another connection! Anyway I read somewhere that in England a Law had been passed that forbade the use of this Technology? Doe"s anyone else know of this?

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ships-cat
An easy contradiction there, would be a steam engine, but that is,nt what this is about,

No. Power is not extracted from water in a steam engine. Power us put in to generate the steam, which then merely transfers a proportion of that energy into mechanical force in a cylinder. As with all our (current) engines and motors, you have to put more energy in then you get useful work out.

I was reading a while back and also had information, but I had a serious computer malfunction that erased all my link's, now I download to another connection! Anyway I read somewhere that in England a Law had been passed that forbade the use of this Technology? Doe"s anyone else know of this?

Absolutely not. All laws - even those relating to state secrets - have to be openly debated in parliament and voted on. It is impossible to have "secret" laws in the UK. After all, how could you be prosecuted for infringement of such a hypothetical 'law'?

? At the very least, judges and prosecutors would need to know of the existence of the law and , by implication, the existence of the technology.

This is pure fantasy.

Oh... and I tried to find referrences to the 'Joe Cell' on the internet. The only sites featuring it where - to say the last - highy unscientific. The cell acts as a crude storage battery. But you have to charge it from the mains first, and it only releases a fraction of the power that you initialy put in. Whillst people claim that the cell produces MORE power than you put in, I don't believe there is ANY example of this claim being verified. Ever. Anywhere.

Meow Purr.

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Torgo

EXACTLY. Any process where you get out the exact same thing you got in will produce EXACTLY *zero* net energy - and the laws of thermodynamics along with simple engineering hurdles ensure that you will overall have a net LOSS of energy.

Steam engines are totally not applicable - there the water is just used as a method to transfer the thermal expansion from one part of the engine to linear motion in another part. <warning: oversimplification ahead!> Its like hydraulic fluid, except gaseous steam instead of flowing liquid. Doesn't MAKE any energy, just moves it.

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Sharm

I did download two..ermm.. sort of blueprints for converting our internal combustion petrol engines to run on water. I have no time and enough resources to try them yet. One seems so simple but the other quite complicated. They claimed you can achieve 300mpg! 300 miles on a gallon of water! Wow! Surely the oil companies will do something about this!

Edited by Sharm

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ships-cat

I've vaugly heard theories of "zero-point" or "vacuumn" energy, mostly in science fiction novels. The idea is that even completely empty space is actually - on the nanoscopic level - a seething cauldron of sub-nuclear energies, all balanced and held in check by 'each other', with net zero radiation. (so you don't detect it). Seems somewhat far-fetched.

If it did exist, then I guess in principle you could tap into it. Juggling chain-saws seems a lot safer, somehow. (and also more useful in the event of sudden zombie attacks).

Meow Purr.

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BELOWIM

The law I referred to was something along the line's that if you were pulled over in your car an found to have a water fuel device fitted you would end up in court for breaching tax law's on fuel, anyone heard this?. It may surprise you that I use a water injection system on my vehicle, as do a lot of people, especially running turbo/super charger's, it cool's intake air and suppliment's fuel increasing performance and milage, this too was initially banned in racing as an unfair advantage.

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ships-cat
The law I referred to was something along the line's that if you were pulled over in your car an found to have a water fuel device fitted you would end up in court for breaching tax law's on fuel, anyone heard this?. It may surprise you that I use a water injection system on my vehicle, as do a lot of people, especially running turbo/super charger's, it cool's intake air and suppliment's fuel increasing performance and milage, this too was initially banned in racing as an unfair advantage.

Ahhhhhh right... gotcha.... yes, I beleive you are correct Belowim.

If you have converted your diesel car to run on Biodiesel (vegetable oil), then you have to make sure you pay Duty on the aforementioned vegetable oil. This is because ALL fuels are susceptiable to fuel duty. If I buy a carton of veg oil and use it to fry my Tuna, then that is fine. However, if I then put the SAME oil into my diesel tank, I must pay the Inland Revenue some extra money or face prosecution. Stupid or what ?

However, your water-intercooler system would NOT be against the law, because water is not the actual fuel.

Meow Purr.

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BELOWIM

ENERGY CAN NEITHER BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED.

IT IS, AND THUS IT IS FREE.! All truth passes through three stages: First, it is ridiculed; Second, it is violently opposed; and Third, it is accepted as self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860) http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/33570/118 http://www.waterfuelcell.org/concept.html http://www.waterfuelcell.org/ http://www.keelynet.com/energy/meyerx.htm http://www.water-4-fuel.com/ If I,m using solar power to split water am I breaking any so called law's?..

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aztek
ENERGY CAN NEITHER BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED.

IT IS, AND THUS IT IS FREE.! All truth passes through three stages: First, it is ridiculed; Second, it is violently opposed; and Third, it is accepted as self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860) http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/33570/118 http://www.waterfuelcell.org/concept.html http://www.waterfuelcell.org/ http://www.keelynet.com/energy/meyerx.htm http://www.water-4-fuel.com/ If I,m using solar power to split water am I breaking any so called law's?..

laws of physics are few hundrede years old road of corrected mistakes

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Torgo
ENERGY CAN NEITHER BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED.

IT IS, AND THUS IT IS FREE.! All truth passes through three stages: First, it is ridiculed; Second, it is violently opposed; and Third, it is accepted as self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860) http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/33570/118 http://www.waterfuelcell.org/concept.html http://www.waterfuelcell.org/ http://www.keelynet.com/energy/meyerx.htm http://www.water-4-fuel.com/ If I,m using solar power to split water am I breaking any so called law's?..

Using sunlight to split water is most certainly possible, and could be a great way to get fuel. The PROBLEM with the idea of a WATER-fueled car that only produces water as exhaust is that no matter what reactions take place in the intermediary steps theres NO NET gain of energy.

Splitting water with sunlight to make H2 and O2 takes the energy in the photons of sunlight and stores it chemically. By recombining the two you take that potential energy and can harness it. With no change in potential energy between water and water, however, you need some other energy source. You CAN'T run an engine on just water with no other energy source, and thats a fact.

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aztek
Using sunlight to split water is most certainly possible, and could be a great way to get fuel. The PROBLEM with the idea of a WATER-fueled car that only produces water as exhaust is that no matter what reactions take place in the intermediary steps theres NO NET gain of energy.

Splitting water with sunlight to make H2 and O2 takes the energy in the photons of sunlight and stores it chemically. By recombining the two you take that potential energy and can harness it. With no change in potential energy between water and water, however, you need some other energy source. You CAN'T run an engine on just water with no other energy source, and thats a fact.

you cant run car on gas alone either you need engine to convert it to energy, as for water, salt water when subjected to radio waves of certan hz emmits hydrogen, it is proven and it works,

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Never Here

Actually there is a car that runs on water,very well.Will the powers that be even let this car become reality?...

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BELOWIM

soldierspy "Actually there is a car that runs on water,very well.Will the powers that be even let this car become reality?...

Can anyone translate the Japanese version on youtube?

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Torgo
you cant run car on gas alone either you need engine to convert it to energy, as for water, salt water when subjected to radio waves of certan hz emmits hydrogen, it is proven and it works,

That PRECISELY illustrates my point!!!

The hydrogen is produced by the energy of the radio waves being absorbed by the water. Energy was absorbed and converted into chemical energy. BUT YOU NEED TO CREATE THE RADIO WAVES. This requires energy. And the amount of energy you get from burning the resultant hydrogen or running it through a fuel cell or whatever can never exceed the amount of energy you put into the system in the form of the radio waves. It simply does not matter how you split the water or make hydrogen or anything - the energy has to come from somewhere. You can't get energy from nothing, and any process that has the same thing as its input and output has to get energy from somewhere else.

I think people need to study their thermodynamics better here.

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Torgo
Actually there is a car that runs on water,very well.Will the powers that be even let this car become reality?...

This guy has been debunked time and again - its getting late here, and I will find the link some other time and post it, I promise. All this guy does is split water into a hydrogen-oxygen mixture using the energy from the engine. His hybrid is just a ploy to make it seem like water is fueling the thing when really its just storing a little energy - its worse than standard battery hybrids we have today.

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Never Here
This guy has been debunked time and again - its getting late here, and I will find the link some other time and post it, I promise. All this guy does is split water into a hydrogen-oxygen mixture using the energy from the engine. His hybrid is just a ploy to make it seem like water is fueling the thing when really its just storing a little energy - its worse than standard battery hybrids we have today.

Well,it has been more than a few days...and still no "debunking" going on...why?I have to be honest,i havent heard ANYTHING about this guy being a fraud.Too many scientist that have checked him out,and they have found his invention works just fine.The govt,LMFAO,They want to know everything about it,and have offered him Big bucks for patent rights.I think you could be looking for a very,very,longtime.I wont hold my breath waiting.

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Torgo
Well,it has been more than a few days...and still no "debunking" going on...why?I have to be honest,i havent heard ANYTHING about this guy being a fraud.Too many scientist that have checked him out,and they have found his invention works just fine.The govt,LMFAO,They want to know everything about it,and have offered him Big bucks for patent rights.I think you could be looking for a very,very,longtime.I wont hold my breath waiting.

Gah, I apologize. I've had a lot of crap going on the last couple days and checking up on forums has been the least of my concerns.

Anyways, a summary of the problems with this guy's deal:

All this person is doing is normal electrolysis, creating a mixture of hydrogen and oxygen gas. This technique has been known for a LONG time in the welding industry and is known as Brown's Gas. The fact that it got on the news is more a testament to the gullibility of reporters than the technology.

The term "HHO" means nothing. I wish i could say more about that, but saying he is making "H2O into HHO" has absolutely no meaning whatsoever. I can't even say its wrong. At best, I suppose we can assume it refers to a 2:1 mix of H2 and O2, which is what you get from electrolysis.

CONSERVATION OF ENERGY. This is the first law of thermodynamics. Confirmed by more experiments than can be counted. Here is how it applies to electrolysis: when you break water, you are putting the electrical energy into the potential chemical energy of the new mixture of H2 and O2. When you then burn the H2, breaking the HH bonds and making HO bonds, the HO bonds are a lower potential energy and the difference is released as heat (or some electricity as well as heat if you're using a fuel cell). However, this is the SAME ENERGY DIFFERENCE that must be overcome to take the lower energy H2O and make it into higher energy H2 and O2. This means that the exact same energy you put into the water when you split it is put out again when you burn it. More generally, any process that has the same substance as its initial input and final product will have no net energy gain - the same amount of energy will go in as goes out. THE ONLY THING THIS DEVICE DOES IS TURN ELECTRICAL ENERGY INTO CHEMICAL ENERGY.

I submit the idea that this "gas/water hybrid" is nothing more than a car that runs on gas and uses some of the electricity it generates to split water and then inject the resultant gas into the cylinders. It probably does this very little, thus only requiring very little water but about the same amount of gasoline.

I have no idea where the claims about the flame changing temperature comes from, other than the suggestion that it probably has something to do with the way the news always gets science news wrong and sensationalizes it.

A side note on physics being a series of corrected mistakes: i would call it more a series of successively more improved understandings. Before radioactivity was discovered, the output of energy from radioactive materials would have seemed to violate the conservation of energy. Eventually it was discovered to be related to the transmutation of elements, and it was proposed that this was causing the release of energy. By looking at more and more examples the relationship between the atomic decay and the energy released could be understood. Conservation of energy has always worked out in every circumstance in the end. I find it hard to believe that one particular chemical reaction out of trillions of possible ones would violate it, and furthermore if it were truly this simple real scientists would have found it and studied it.

References:

http://anti-rant.blogspot.com/2006/05/simp...-and-water.html While a blog and nothing professional, this person articulates all the relevant points and explains it in a very concise and easily understood way. Here, the writer assumes the term HHO refers to a mix of H2 and O2 gases.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown%27s_gas#Brown.27s_gas The entry on Brown's gas (a 2:1 mix of H2 and O2). Refers to "controvertial claims" made regarding its properties, and its long use in welding.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_thermodynamics The laws of thermodynamics.

and finally: critical thinking.

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BELOWIM
promKing

Well frankly I'm much more for electric powered cars then hydrogen. Since I saw the documentary "Who killed the electric car" I found out that hydrogen powered cars are fraud run by Oil Corporations who hold the politicians to literally divert public from using perfected electric cars that you can't even buy today because they have been banned by law. Hydrogen is just something that politicians want to fool the public that they worry about oil problems by working on hydrogen technology that will actually never be achieved.

I did a little research on that Filipino inventor who's name is Daniel Dingel and to be honest I wouldn't be surprised if he is just a fraud who is trying to milk money from people, altough there are lots of articles about him. This is a little segment in which is explained how his car works:

According to him, his reactor uses electricity from a 12-volt car battery to transform saltwater or ordinary tap water with salt into deuterium oxide or heavy water, which is chiefly used as a coolant for nuclear reactors. Deuterium is actually a hydrogen isotope with twice the mass of ordinary hydrogen, and heavy water is produced when the hydrogen atoms in H2O are replaced with deuterium.

"The electricity from the battery splits the water into its hydrogen and oxygen components, and this hydrogen can then be used to power the car engine. Normally it takes temperatures of about 5,400 degrees Fahrenheit to generate hydrogen from water, but here I am just using an ordinary 12-volt battery," he claimed.

Just how this kind of chemical reaction is possible using an ordinary car battery is, of course, the secret behind Dingel's invention--and the kind of claim that leads people to dismiss him as a crackpot and charlatan. In fact, while hydrogen is being touted as a viable alternative fuel in the US and other countries, these prototypes do not make use of ICEs but fuel cell engines, nor do they run on ordinary water but on liquid hydrogen.

For example, DaimlerChrysler unveiled in the US in March the hydrogen-powered NECAR 4 (New Electric Car), which is based on a Mercedes-Benz A-class compact car.

In these fuel cell cars, water is just a by-product of the reaction between hydrogen and oxygen ions, which produces the electricity to run the car's engine. In this sense, the fuel cell process is the reverse of Dingel's discovery. Also, Dingel claims that his reactor can work with any existing ICE-based car.

Dingel said some investors from Taiwan now plan to commercialize his car and help him get an international patent. source

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Torgo

According to him, his reactor uses electricity from a 12-volt car battery to transform saltwater or ordinary tap water with salt into deuterium oxide or heavy water, which is chiefly used as a coolant for nuclear reactors. Deuterium is actually a hydrogen isotope with twice the mass of ordinary hydrogen, and heavy water is produced when the hydrogen atoms in H2O are replaced with deuterium.

I have no idea where THIS is coming from. You can't turn water into heavy water with just a chemical reaction! This is a nuclear reaction and would require somehow adding a neutron to the proton in the hydrogen nucleus, DOUBLING THE ATOM'S MASS. As a general rule you can't influence nuclear reactions chemically, except in a few rare nuclear reactions that require an electron from the electron cloud of the atom to be captured by a proton.

"The electricity from the battery splits the water into its hydrogen and oxygen components, and this hydrogen can then be used to power the car engine. Normally it takes temperatures of about 5,400 degrees Fahrenheit to generate hydrogen from water, but here I am just using an ordinary 12-volt battery," he claimed.

Just how this kind of chemical reaction is possible using an ordinary car battery is, of course, the secret behind Dingel's invention--and the kind of claim that leads people to dismiss him as a crackpot and charlatan.

EXACTLY - a charlatan. You can do electrolysis yourself with a 9 volt battery, some wire electrodes, and some salt water. The "5,400 degrees Fahrenheit" bit is sheer baloney.

In these fuel cell cars, water is just a by-product of the reaction between hydrogen and oxygen ions, which produces the electricity to run the car's engine. In this sense, the fuel cell process is the reverse of Dingel's discovery.

Sort of! Fuel cells require at least a supply of hydrogen (they could probably get oxygen from the air). Unfortunately hydrogen does not occur naturally on the Earth - we have to MAKE it, hence the whole problem of hydrogen cars actually being BAD for the environment because you need to generate the power somehow to break the water and if you do it using fossil fuels, because of inefficiencies in the process you end up burning MORE than if you just burned the gasoline in the cars in the first place. (random nitpic, its actually between hydrogen and oxygen molecules, not ions...)

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