Too Late: Global Warming Out of Control

[IronGhost 43]

The Prophet of Climate Change: James Lovelock

One of the most eminent scientists of our time says that global warming is irreversible — and that more than 6 billion people will perish by the end of the century

Jeff Goodel

At the age of eighty-eight, after four children and a long and respected career as one of the twentieth century's most influential scientists, James Lovelock has come to an unsettling conclusion: The human race is doomed. "I wish I could be more hopeful," he tells me one sunny morning as we walk through a park in Oslo, where he is giving a talk at a university. Lovelock is a small man, unfailingly polite, with white hair and round, owlish glasses. His step is jaunty, his mind lively, his manner anything but gloomy. In fact, the coming of the Four Horsemen -- war, famine, pestilence and death -- seems to perk him up. "It will be a dark time," Lovelock admits. "But for those who survive, I suspect it will be rather exciting."

In Lovelock's view, the scale of the catastrophe that awaits us will soon become obvious. By 2020, droughts and other extreme weather will be commonplace. By 2040, the Sahara will be moving into Europe, and Berlin will be as hot as Baghdad. Atlanta will end up a kudzu jungle. Phoenix will become uninhabitable, as will parts of Beijing (desert), Miami (rising seas) and London (floods). Food shortages will drive millions of people north, raising political tensions. "The Chinese have nowhere to go but up into Siberia," Lovelock says. "How will the Russians feel about that? I fear that war between Russia and China is probably inevitable." With hardship and mass migrations will come epidemics, which are likely to kill millions. By 2100, Lovelock believes, the Earth's population will be culled from today's 6.6 billion to as few as 500 million, with most of the survivors living in the far latitudes -- Canada, Iceland, Scandinavia, the Arctic Basin.

Full story: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story..._james_lovelock

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Well, hope he's wrong anyway.

[Neognosis 655]

I hate nonsense like this that makes it so much easier to take a real problem and make it seem like wacko-fantasy.

[Fluffybunny 51]

Just because one man says something doesnt make it so.

I remember when I was a kid there were scientist who were running about screaming about the fact that there going to be icebergs in New York Harbor by 2020 and that we were in for the next ice age.

The planet is getting warmer no doubt. Man made or not there is doubt. The results of the rise in temperature is speculation at best and this guy seems to be shooting for the most spectacular worst case scanario that he can come up with, which to me is just silly.

[SilverCougar 17]

And Mother Earth says...

It's time fer a cullin!

Really, nature has always been greater then us. She is our one true preditor.

[IronGhost 43]

Just because one man says something doesnt make it so.

I remember when I was a kid there were scientist who were running about screaming about the fact that there going to be icebergs in New York Harbor by 2020 and that we were in for the next ice age.

The planet is getting warmer no doubt. Man made or not there is doubt. The results of the rise in temperature is speculation at best and this guy seems to be shooting for the most spectacular worst case scanario that he can come up with, which to me is just silly.

But climate science has advanced almost exponentially since you were a kid (depending on how old you are). The amount of data we have now is astronomical compared to those old predictions of ice ages. Also, we have much, much better space-based imaging technology that has revolutionized how we understand weather and climate.

Certainly, this guy is painting a worse-case scenario -- but the more I read about GW, the more I think guys like these are right. Look at what China is doing single handedly to their environment -- it's incredible -- they're destorying their world, and they don't care.

When I look at the big picture -- including all the deforestation going on, the expanse of deserts, the faster-than-ever-through melting of the polar ice caps -- I feel very bleak about it all.

[ASOP 3]

Yea it is scary.

[Never Here 1]

It wont take a century for all of mankind to be destroyed.The simple fact is,there are a million variables that will make for a perfectly desolate future.And no,i havent seen "I am Legend" but i might.You cant compare todays dire predictions with those of yesteryear.This is a very different time with very different intentions.Back when people would say,"the end is near" they didnt have to contend with the emergence of such disease as AIDS,or the fact that because of "terrorism" the world now waits for the next big attack.And in the meantime you have more and more co2 emmisions causing global warming to change climate weather.This will no doubt cause the food supply to suffer,and as job loss layoffs,people being drivin to homeless situations due to the huge inflation of the mortgage they didnt see coming.Or the fact that the dollar is going to be replaced by the euro,making the already almost worthless dollar worth even less!If you really look at how the world is rapidly deterirorating,(<spelling?) and how much is being done to stop or reverse the course we are on?Not much.HELL,OUR OWN PREZ WONT SIGN THE KYOTO agreement!Why not?Might have to cut back on all the petroleum.Cant do that,might lose money.So while we inhale pollution from all those car emmisions,watch the sky turn brown,(it is here in LOS ANGELES) we can relax knowing the people who make money off of our slow death's will be able to suffer the same fate as all of us for not heeding the warnings that have been here for so long.Man.The biggest danger to the planet.

[ships-cat 15]

<sigh>

James Lovelock is NOT "one of the 20th Centuries most influential scientists.....". He is - if anything - a bit of an eccentric who believes that the Earth is a giant living organism. (the Giaia theory). Well... sort of.

As for "6 Billion people will die before the end of the Century".. well DUH... yes .. of COURSE they will. Of old age.

Sheesh.

Meow Purr.

[Fluffybunny 51]

But climate science has advanced almost exponentially since you were a kid (depending on how old you are). The amount of data we have now is astronomical compared to those old predictions of ice ages. Also, we have much, much better space-based imaging technology that has revolutionized how we understand weather and climate.

The same kind of thing was said when I was a kid too...End of the world kind of talk goes over big and this conversation will happen again and again with different data and different outcomes. There are limits to what science can see of the future, speculation has limits.

It is a great deal of speculation. We can look at the facts of what we have seen in the past and extrapolate forward, but extrapolation is speculation...this guy is bouncing up and down talking about 6 billion dead people and that kind of stuff is just ridiculous...

No one is doubting that the earth is warming up; but to say 6 billion people are going to die is just wreckless and crazy. I get frustrated to see when extremists get coverage in the news just because it sells regardless of whether it has any validity or not. The world has always been changing, and will continue to do so...

On the bright side humans are resiliant adaptable beings. If the deserts move, so will we. If the oceans rise we will adjust.

Edited December 26, 2007 by Fluffybunny

[IronGhost 43]

<sigh>

James Lovelock is NOT "one of the 20th Centuries most influential scientists.....". He is - if anything - a bit of an eccentric who believes that the Earth is a giant living organism. (the Giaia theory). Well... sort of

You're dead wrong there. Lovelock is one of tge greatest scientists of the century, and has more than enough cache and credibility to make a hypothesis like the Giaia H.

Here's just a few of his accomplishments:

Lovelock invented the Electron Capture Detector, which ultimately assisted in discoveries about the persistence of CFCs and their role in stratospheric ozone depletion[3][4][5].

Lovelock was elected a Fellow of the Royal Society in 1974.

After studying the operation of the Earth's sulfur cycle[6], Lovelock and his colleagues developed the CLAW hypothesis as a possible example of biological control of the Earth's climate[7].

In 1990, Lovelock was awarded the first Dr A.H. Heineken Prize for the Environment by the Royal Netherlands Academy of Arts and Sciences.

An independent scientist, inventor, and author, Lovelock works out of a barn-turned-laboratory in Cornwall.

In 2003, he was appointed a Companion of Honour (CH) by Queen Elizabeth II.

Lovelock is currently president of the Marine Biological Association (MBA).

What does a guy have to do to become a "respected scientist" these days -- joint he Republican party and talk about 1970s-era Ice Age theories?

Edited December 26, 2007 by IronGhost

[Fluffybunny 51]

Do those credentials mean that 6 billion people are going to die?

No.

How many speculations has he made that have not come to pass or were completely off base?

[ships-cat 15]

Ironghost, those accomplishments are significant, but fall a LONG way short of demonstrating that he was "one of the most influencial scientists of his time".

He built a machine. So did lots of people.

He created a theory. Really ? Gosh.

He was elected a fellow of the Royal Society in 1973.. along with 43 other people from the UK. In 1974, they will have elected ANOTHER 44 (or thereabouts) fellows.. and so on.

He has a barn in Cornwall... oh.. right... in that case I bow down to him.

OK, I'm being sardonic, but you must see that - whillst he is obviously a clever and accomplished chap - he is NOT 'one of the most... ' etc etc.

As for the statement "6 billion people will die...", that is preposterous. It doesn't mean anything, because there is no context. It is an empty, unscientific statement.

OBVIOUSLY 6 billion people (MINIMUM) will die before the end of the century. The population of the earth is around 6 billion, and we are ALL going to die before the end of the century, barring a handfull who live to be more than 93.

Sigh.

Meow Purr.

[Neognosis 655]

An independent scientist, inventor, and author, Lovelock works out of a barn-turned-laboratory in Cornwall.

Why would you list that as a credential?

Seems to me, without knowing much about this and just going that list, he invented something important 34 years ago. Is he the same guy at 88 that he was at 54? Possibly, sure. But from my limited knowledge of Global Warming, I'm inclined to believe the other scientists, for what that's worth.

[questionmark 11,371]

<sigh>

James Lovelock is NOT "one of the 20th Centuries most influential scientists.....". He is - if anything - a bit of an eccentric who believes that the Earth is a giant living organism. (the Giaia theory). Well... sort of.

As for "6 Billion people will die before the end of the Century".. well DUH... yes .. of COURSE they will. Of old age.

Sheesh.

Meow Purr.

and in drunken stupor... indeed

[IamsSon 310]

I predict 9 billion human deaths in an instant as Earth is demolished to create a new hyper-spatial highway! This will happen in.... hmmm, let me see.... I'm 40 now, not in the best of health, so let's see.. add, 6 carry the one... ummm in 120 years!

If you convince the UN to provide me with a $1.5 billion grant, I will develop a full proof negotiation with the Galactic Federation's sub-committee on trans-spatial construction so that they will deviate their planned route. The negotiating plan will be ready 80 years after I receive the grant...

[IronGhost 43]

I predict 9 billion human deaths in an instant as Earth is demolished to create a new hyper-spatial highway! This will happen in.... hmmm, let me see.... I'm 40 now, not in the best of health, so let's see.. add, 6 carry the one... ummm in 120 years!

If you convince the UN to provide me with a $1.5 billion grant, I will develop a full proof negotiation with the Galactic Federation's sub-committee on trans-spatial construction so that they will deviate their planned route. The negotiating plan will be ready 80 years after I receive the grant...

That's pretty funny coming from a guy who believes their is a an evil winged being named Satan who was once God's favorite angel, but then went bad, and is now gliding about the Universe with an army of demons helpers who are making life miserable for the human race -- and that one day there will be an Apocalypse and there will be a might battle between the "Good God" and the "Evil Winged Being Named Satan" .... and so forth.

I suppose next we're going to here about the Creationist idea that dinosaurs were on Noah's Ark and the earth is 6,000 years old, and that after the two kangaroos jumped off the Ark in Turkey, they hopped on down to Australia somehow ...

[Caesar 3]

Global Warming is Global nonsense! its funny how the left make fun of peoples religions yet they expect us to follow this myth! 95% chance that its man-made, lol this is just to funny!

[Ghost Ship 53]

The Day After Tommorow scenario is possible. It might happen suddenly as like a bowl filled with one drop of water too many and suddenly tips over kind of deal.

Edited December 27, 2007 by Dark_Ambience

[Cradle of Fish 173]

I dont see what the problem is. The earths population will double in a hundred years, then half of it will die out. Net gain = 0.

And besides, the human race could use a catasrophe like this, it might be good for our evolution.

edit: Even if Lovelock is wrong about the human race being wiped out, he is one of the few proposing the only good solution to global warming: Nuclear Power.

Edited December 27, 2007 by Cradle of Fish

[Ins0mniac 3]

I dont see what the problem is. The earths population will double in a hundred years, then half of it will die out. Net gain = 0.

And besides, the human race could use a catasrophe like this, it might be good for our evolution.

The people undergoing horrible deaths will probably also be thinking along these lines. In fact, they'll probably be quite cheerful about the whole matter.

[bathory 1]

I dont see what the problem is. The earths population will double in a hundred years, then half of it will die out. Net gain = 0.

hah so i take it you'll happily go down with the ship?

[Raptor 21]

Global Warming is Global nonsense! its funny how the left make fun of peoples religions yet they expect us to follow this myth! 95% chance that its man-made, lol this is just to funny!

Are you educated in the field, or just propagating more second hand misinformation?

[ships-cat 15]

Are you educated in the field, or just propagating more second hand misinformation?

Good question Raptor.

But... was it aimed at Ceasar... or the scientist quoted in the OPA ? 'Cos it seems like it describes him to a 't'.

Meow Purr.

[Bob26003 0]

Anyone ever seen the movie "Toxic Avenger"

Well, that is what we are headed for unless we stop pumping poisons and toxic sludge into our air water and soil.

Edited December 27, 2007 by Bob26003

[stevewinn 12,893]

Anyone ever seen the movie "Toxic Avenger"

Well, that is what we are headed for unless we stop pumping poisons and toxic sludge into our air water and soil.

who we really need is captain planet Bob,

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...h&plindex=1

Edited December 27, 2007 by stevewinn