Over 2m foreigners are now working in Britain

[keithisco]

Get rid of Party Politics...they simply preserve the status quo from one decade to the next, with some minor revisions. People tend to vote one of three ways...Labour, Liberal, Tory, and in very nearly equal numbers (despite some party gaining a massive number of seats due to our voting system, not because their local candidate has some really good or bad ideas.

Who gets rolled out in Marginal seats? The Leaders of the Parties, not because "their" man/woman has any desire to help the constituents, or anything new to contribute, but because Party HQ wants power.

Make all political parties proscribed organisations, change the voting system into one of real representation, and get rid of these "blaggers" that are career politicians.

Who was it who said...(badly paraphrased)" the only reason for disqualifying a candidate from becoming President, is because he wants to be President"

I see SC lurking on this thread.... Help me out with the real quote...please

I need a Captain Morgans, or G and T

[keithisco]

I can see it too, but there is an additional factor... there is the second portion of Britain that still lives in the Empire that is not anymore. So between the I-am-ashamed-of-the-Empire attitude and the I-am-still-in-the-Empire attitude Britain missed many turns on the way it should have taken.

The "Empire" has really evolved considerably QM, but I take your point about "mindsets" in the UK. The blusterers who still go on about an Empire, the same is true here in Spain as well.

Just a bit of trivia for those unaware of what the saying "The sun never sets on the British Empire" it didnt mean the Empire was indestructible, simply that its posessions were distributed around the globe and when the sun was setting on one of them, it was rising on another. I am fully aware that you know this QM, but I have seen a couple of posts that were wide of the mark from others.

The same is now true of the Commonwealth of Nations, and the remarkable thing is, that it works as a loose coalition of sovereign nations. The Commonwealth Games (only second in size to the Olympic Games) is known as the "Happy Games", so empires can change, and evolve and become positive re-inforcers for good. IMO

[Username Deleted]

well said User, i think 80% of the problem is due to weak leadership, and theres no doubt about its this left wing liberal ideology thats spread through politics of PC'ness is playing a big part, but back to the leaders just look at what jobs they've done before joining politics, privately educated, then on from there they go to a posh university, and some of them think they've lived in the real world because they smoked a tiny amount of pot, then they leave university join daddys business, then do campaigning for a political party then start off in the lower ranks of politics, then get promoted and we wonder why the county is in such a state, its simple, they have no life experience and it doesnt matter how much money they have, because you cant buy experience,

What we need in politics is the every day man or woman becoming MP's, you know the type, work 40 hours a week, have been through hard times, have lived on council estates where crime is high, are street wise, and have a firm grip on the reality of the situation, people who dont need percentages to tell them things are going wrong, because they can see it with their own eyes, but instead..........

we have politicians who cant even answer yes or no, they wont even speak their mind, incase its not PC, look at the politician who said enoch powelll was right, was pushed out of the tory party, and what for because he spoke his mind? thats the trouble today we need more straight talkers people who say what they feel and if it offends someone tough, deal with it, at least you know where they stand, but........

to be honest i'd throw the ****ing lot of them out, and start again, because its got out of hand, its says it all when you think about the EU treaty they promise us a referendum on it, but because they've changed the treaty but in reality 98% of it hasnt changed. all of a sudden the majority of people dont know whats good for them and so we the politicans high and mighty, wont ask what you the people think we'll sign up anyway, good god,..................

democracy my a***,.

I agree but i'd include the media in that too. When a politician stands up and says what he truly thinks they're hung out to dry - but that in itself is done on a one-sided level. If your criticising the country or the people who are proud of it your given air time disproportionate to the opposing view. Take Shami Chakrabarti the Director of Liberty, i see her on tv more then the politicians running the country, if my memory serves me right she represents a group of about 11,000 people, I mean for crying out loud Division 1 football teams have bigger support. Yet she pops up in every story relating to how uncivilised this country is Like i say i wouldn't mind so much if her views were balanced against an alternative view point, rarely is that the case.

Your right, weak leadership is a problem but that's kind of our own undoing through what i said in the previous post. When the loudest voices are the denigrators then the weak politicians rise to the top, they ride the fashionable wave as Blair did with 'Cool Britannia', Rule Britannia becomes a dirty word through generations of debunking and Cool Britannia follows in it's footsteps, it only follows because it means absolutely nothing and therefore won't offend anybody.

The irony of it all is the very same people who run this country in to the ground are the very same people who encourage other peoples to be proud of their history and culture and all that goes with it.....I might have a little bit of respect for the people with these views if they were consistant across the board, that's clearly not the case and slowly but surely people are starting to wise up to it.

I can see it too, but there is an additional factor... there is the second portion of Britain that still lives in the Empire that is not anymore. So between the I-am-ashamed-of-the-Empire attitude and the I-am-still-in-the-Empire attitude Britain missed many turns on the way it should have taken.

I'm not so sure about that, what i think happens is people who want this country to regain it's back bone (both domestically and abroad) are often shoved straight into the latter category of 'I-am-still-in-the-Empire'. I'm not ashamed of the fact we had an empire, and i'm proud of the fact that despite giving it up we're still a major player on the world stage, a feat that not many empires in history have been able to achieve. I think what worries people is that if we carry on with this method of self criticism we'll just ensure that long term we'll just go the way of other empires and dissolve into nothing.

[Bill Hill]

Perhaps the only solution is to vote for the BNP.

Labour had an image refit and turned into new Labour, so why not the BNP.. maybe an Olympic style logo.

[Bill Hill]

May I ask, what do you feel is 'dragging down' the UK? Because I have my thoughts on that, but I'm guessing they're different to yours...

what username-deleted, ships-cat and stevewinn said..

[Moon Monkey]

If only all immigrants felt like this guy:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport...ticle803767.ece

[stevewinn]

on the theme of political weakness, defence experts say.

"The security of the United Kingdom is at risk and under threat.

"This is a problem worsened by the lack of leadership from the majority which in misplaced deference to 'multiculturalsim' failed to lay down the line to immigrant communities, thus undercutting those within them trying to fight extremism. Some believe we are already at war. In all three ways our social fragmentation, the sense of premonition and the divisions about what our stance should be, there are uneasy similarities with the years just before the First World War.

"The deep guarantee of real strength is our knowledge of who we are. Our loss of cultural self-confidence weakens our ability to develop new means to provide for our security in the face of new risks.

"We look like a soft touch. We are indeed a soft touch, from within and without. "A more fundamental source of damage to the security of Britain has been flabby and bogus strategic thinking. Public expenditure has been directed in correspondingly perverse ways with clear consequences for our defence and security.

All this has contributed to a more severe erosion of the links of confidence and support between the British people, their government and Britain's security and defence forces, than for many years."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...ndefence215.xml

the same story is being reported on the BBC.

Britain 'soft touch' for attacks

The UK's security is at risk because of a national loss of self-confidence, a leading defence think tank says.

The Royal United Services Institute says Britain has become a "soft touch" because of divisions over its national aims, values and political identity.

Rusi attacks "misplaced deference to 'multiculturalism'" and failure to "lay down the line" to immigrants.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7246085.stm

Edited February 15, 2008 by stevewinn

[Sthenno]

I know the question wasn't directed at me but i've got an opinion on what's dragging the UK down. It's an attitude or state of mind that has gripped a large sway of the population, the roots of which probably started in the early 1900's but didn't really take hold and start to spread till the sixties and early seventies. It's an attitude that says that if your British you should be ashamed of your history and constantly criticise yourself and country for not living up to some exaggerated bench mark of fair play, a system which looks at the perspective of the rest of the world before your own. It started with the arm chair critics in the sixties and seventies who systematically took some of this countries greatest achievement (like exploration and military feats) and attempted to debunk them with often shocking inaccuracy and blatent lies. It's been a drip-drip effect which has led us to our current state of either being ashamed of our country and history (for no good reason) or just not giving a toss to begin with.

It is that attitude which runs from the youths on the street right up to the politicians who haven't got the balls to be proud of the country they govern, that is dragging this great country back. (imo).

While I understand what you're saying, I don't think it's that easy to dismiss all critics of the UK as simply attempting to measure it up to unfair standards. There are many people out there who just don't see Britain's history of colonialism and imperialism, not to mention its role in modern day globalisation through institutions like the World Bank, as something to be particularly proud of.

[Username Deleted]

Your missing the point, this isn't some well meaning and balanced critical review of our history it's a slow but relenting attack on the very heart of being British. The debunking of what it means to be proud of a country you live in - only Britain though (at the mo), others seem to miss the snipers sight. The rationale of debunking appears to be finding someone to blame, which if your British appears to be blaming yourself and loathing everything about your birth place in favour of the outsiders view., or alternatively, playing down other British peoples achievements (because we would want to be seen to be trumpeting about our own country, not in politically correct modern Britain) *sighs*

Now this is nothing new, it started in the early 1900's gathered steam in the 60's and 70's, went into overdrive in the mid ninties and were starting to see the fruit of all that labour NOW - end result - a whole generation of people who if polled on the street today would probably struggle to name something about this country they are proud of - that's not because there's nothing to be proud of but the programming through various books, media, television and the school curriculum has left alot of people not knowing who they are or where they come from. Even our achievements in the first world and second world war are put down to the arrival of Uncle Sam, and i know for a fact that is what my nieces and nephew are being taught in school - our history is regarded by those who make these descisions with such distain that we can't be seen to proud of anything. Take the first world war, you walk into any book shop and you'll find a whole host of books dedicated to blaming the carnage our men went through on people like Haig and his generals, who according to these arm chair experts were vain and unintelligent whereas there German counterparts are portrayed as clever and good to there troops, the fact we won is swept under the carpet by the arrival of the US. To qoute Ranulph Fiennes "never let it be said that historical facts get in the way of a determined denigrator". Oh how bloody true that is.

Here's a qoute from Dr Gary Sheffield, former Secretary General of the British Commission for Military History, when interviewed on BBC Timewatch about the image of the 1914 - 1918 British Army being "lions led by donkeys" - "It's misleading, the facts were that against a background of revolutionary changes in the nature of war, the British Army underwent a bloody learning curve and emerged as a formidable force. In 1918 this much-maligned army won the greatest series of victories in British military history."

Of coarse it's the former that is peddled as fact rather then the truth of the situation (particularly on an education level), it 's just one example of the slow turning of the screw of self criticism and being made to feel there's nothing to proud of in that time frame.

In the Sixties we had a whole generation ready to soak up whatever fantasy filled version of history the media wished to portray, and whilst military feats were being down played in favour of loathing of your Birth place a new breed of debunker emerged, these idiots focused their attention on playwriters and poets and just about anyone else who made you proud of achievements. Fiona MacCarthy's book on Byron being just one example of this new fashionable wave. A doom and gloom character assasination for absolutely no reason whatsoever other then to have someone else that we once trumpeted torn down a shred or two...

There are many many examples of the book above which do nothing and add nothing other then to fill the pockets of the writer. It was a conscience descision by publishers to pay high sums to writers that did a hatchet job on anything British, (and due to the slow turning of the screw where we are supposed to feel guilty because we once ruled half the planet) the public lapped it up.

(and don't get me started on the amount of crap written about our achievements in exploration)

From the print and film industry were now in the PC era which is nothing more then a verbal part of the rubbish i highlighted above.

Yet more apologising and bending over backwards to anyone and everyone, as long as you don't mention your proud of the past and proud of our achievements.

So whilst i'd like to believe that it's just a case of people having the right to NOT be proud of our colonial past i'm afraid i think history and the "facts" shown through the media and politicains don't tell the same story. Modern day Britain is a denigrators paradise.

[Sthenno]

Your missing the point, this isn't some well meaning and balanced critical review of our history it's a slow but relenting attack on the very heart of being British. The debunking of what it means to be proud of a country you live in - only Britain though (at the mo), others seem to miss the snipers sight. The rationale of debunking appears to be finding someone to blame, which if your British appears to be blaming yourself and loathing everything about your birth place in favour of the outsiders view., or alternatively, playing down other British peoples achievements (because we would want to be seen to be trumpeting about our own country, not in politically correct modern Britain) *sighs*

Now this is nothing new, it started in the early 1900's gathered steam in the 60's and 70's, went into overdrive in the mid ninties and were starting to see the fruit of all that labour NOW - end result - a whole generation of people who if polled on the street today would probably struggle to name something about this country they are proud of - that's not because there's nothing to be proud of but the programming through various books, media, television and the school curriculum has left alot of people not knowing who they are or where they come from. Even our achievements in the first world and second world war are put down to the arrival of Uncle Sam, and i know for a fact that is what my nieces and nephew are being taught in school - our history is regarded by those who make these descisions with such distain that we can't be seen to proud of anything. Take the first world war, you walk into any book shop and you'll find a whole host of books dedicated to blaming the carnage our men went through on people like Haig and his generals, who according to these arm chair experts were vain and unintelligent whereas there German counterparts are portrayed as clever and good to there troops, the fact we won is swept under the carpet by the arrival of the US. To qoute Ranulph Fiennes "never let it be said that historical facts get in the way of a determined denigrator". Oh how bloody true that is.

Here's a qoute from Dr Gary Sheffield, former Secretary General of the British Commission for Military History, when interviewed on BBC Timewatch about the image of the 1914 - 1918 British Army being "lions led by donkeys" - "It's misleading, the facts were that against a background of revolutionary changes in the nature of war, the British Army underwent a bloody learning curve and emerged as a formidable force. In 1918 this much-maligned army won the greatest series of victories in British military history."

Of coarse it's the former that is peddled as fact rather then the truth of the situation (particularly on an education level), it 's just one example of the slow turning of the screw of self criticism and being made to feel there's nothing to proud of in that time frame.

In the Sixties we had a whole generation ready to soak up whatever fantasy filled version of history the media wished to portray, and whilst military feats were being down played in favour of loathing of your Birth place a new breed of debunker emerged, these idiots focused their attention on playwriters and poets and just about anyone else who made you proud of achievements. Fiona MacCarthy's book on Byron being just one example of this new fashionable wave. A doom and gloom character assasination for absolutely no reason whatsoever other then to have someone else that we once trumpeted torn down a shred or two...

There are many many examples of the book above which do nothing and add nothing other then to fill the pockets of the writer. It was a conscience descision by publishers to pay high sums to writers that did a hatchet job on anything British, (and due to the slow turning of the screw where we are supposed to feel guilty because we once ruled half the planet) the public lapped it up.

(and don't get me started on the amount of crap written about our achievements in exploration)

From the print and film industry were now in the PC era which is nothing more then a verbal part of the rubbish i highlighted above.

Yet more apologising and bending over backwards to anyone and everyone, as long as you don't mention your proud of the past and proud of our achievements.

So whilst i'd like to believe that it's just a case of people having the right to NOT be proud of our colonial past i'm afraid i think history and the "facts" shown through the media and politicains don't tell the same story. Modern day Britain is a denigrators paradise.

I'm sorry but I just can't make the link between media representations of British history and a direct political agenda. I guess it's a which came first scenario... are people disaffected because the media tells them to be, or is the media reflecting a lack of nationalism which already exists?

I can't speak for the education system today, but I only left school eight years ago and I was certainly never taught that the US won World War 2, nor that being British was something to be ashamed of. I just don't feel very nationalistic... partly because of the stains I see on Britain's past, as I mentioned earlier, but largely because I see nationalism as a concept as detrimental. It's not about thinking Britain is worse than everywhere else, it's about rejecting the whole concept of pride in something you had nothing to do with and, in my opinion, something which widens boundaries between nations. I'm not going to get into a debate about nationalism here, but my point is that I've come to these conclusions despite an education system which tried to teach me otherwise, as have most people I know.

That's not too say I don't see 'anti-British' cynicism in today's media, you'd have to be blind not to. But I like to think that people are capable of taking these things with a pinch of salt... just look at the 'public outrage' that rears its head every time something which could be conceived as anti-British is mentioned. And personally, I'd rather have a system which looks a little too critically at itself than the self-congratulating attitude we see in other countries, or the situation we have now in Japan where textbooks are being altered to show the country in a better light.

[Username Deleted]

I'm sorry but I just can't make the link between media representations of British history and a direct political agenda. I guess it's a which came first scenario... are people disaffected because the media tells them to be, or is the media reflecting a lack of nationalism which already exists?

I can't speak for the education system today, but I only left school eight years ago and I was certainly never taught that the US won World War 2, nor that being British was something to be ashamed of. I just don't feel very nationalistic... partly because of the stains I see on Britain's past, as I mentioned earlier, but largely because I see nationalism as a concept as detrimental. It's not about thinking Britain is worse than everywhere else, it's about rejecting the whole concept of pride in something you had nothing to do with and, in my opinion, something which widens boundaries between nations. I'm not going to get into a debate about nationalism here, but my point is that I've come to these conclusions despite an education system which tried to teach me otherwise, as have most people I know.

That's not too say I don't see 'anti-British' cynicism in today's media, you'd have to be blind not to. But I like to think that people are capable of taking these things with a pinch of salt... just look at the 'public outrage' that rears its head every time something which could be conceived as anti-British is mentioned. And personally, I'd rather have a system which looks a little too critically at itself than the self-congratulating attitude we see in other countries, or the situation we have now in Japan where textbooks are being altered to show the country in a better light.

I'm all for freedom of speech and people being able write whatever drivel they like but there's a consequence to that, and if checks and balances and being handicapped by political correctness is unfairly weighing opinion then were do you draw the line?

I wouldn't want to see us like China either, but whilst they're altering text books to paint the country in favourable light, we're doing the opposite. That's just as worrying for me because we seem hell bent on dismantling to the point of becoming irrelevant.

[keithisco]

I have no idea where you are getting your information re: General Haig (actually I lie, it's the BBC) but when I went through starategy class at Sandhurst, the one thing made absolutely clear to me was that this man had no concern for the men he was sending out to be butchered. Remember, it was a war of attrition, we had more good men to send out to the slaughter than did germany. Haig was the worst butcher of his own men than any General since.

There is no victory in war, just someone ends up imposing their sense of justice on another... I hated what I saw in the Falklands, and in Belfast, to this day I never want to see another person killed, not if there is a any other solution.

Am I proud of our victories in WW2, you bet I am!!!! There was no other solution to what happened then, but now, there is the UN and I hold that institution in the highest regard for their intent... no more sanctioned murder, no more sanctioned genocide, I dont care about anything else, no more squaddies kiled for political / commercial interests. I never want to see another squaddie killed to maintain oil flow to the lazy western nations that have alternatives at their fingertips but wont take the opportunity given them.

That is my bottom line!!!!

Anybody disagrees, can just rot in H*** this nation has given so much already, whilst other nations sit on the sidelines, we have stood up to the menace...The USA? reagan said that the argentine and UK were equal friends, and apart from allowing us to use Diego Garcia for refuelling, offered nothing else... Why we are backing them in Iraq is beyond me, I say pull our men out let the US Govt forces of the almighty GWBush sort themselves out. I amsure that Halliburton will fill the gap :angry2: :angry2: :angry2:

[Sthenno]

I'm all for freedom of speech and people being able write whatever drivel they like but there's a consequence to that, and if checks and balances and being handicapped by political correctness is unfairly weighing opinion then were do you draw the line?

I wouldn't want to see us like China either, but whilst they're altering text books to paint the country in favourable light, we're doing the opposite. That's just as worrying for me because we seem hell bent on dismantling to the point of becoming irrelevant.

I agree that it is a tough call to make, and certainly would never want political correctness to get in the way of a fair and balanced education. I do however feel that there is an epidemic of "political correctness gone mad!" in this country at the moment, where the media is quick to declare political/educational policy as 'anti-British' without presenting a fair interpretation of the story... I guess this is the next level of the phenomena you previously described?

I think the problem here is a wider one... politicians and the media are always quick to jump on whichever bandwagon seems most popular, be it anti-British or anti-anti-British (!). Neither one is a fair representation of this country... we have our flaws and we have our pluses. Unfortunately I don't think a fair representation will ever be given, so I guess we have to trust people to look beyond what they are told.

[capoeiranger]

Well, immigrants are like twin edged knife. Wrong treatments and they'll damage your economy, right treatments and they'll boost your ka-ching!

[Username Deleted]

I have no idea where you are getting your information re: General Haig

My Great Grandad (who served) but that's a minor point. I didn't really want to get into the justification of war, I take on board what you say though.

[questionmark]

Well, immigrants are like twin edged knife. Wrong treatments and they'll damage your economy, right treatments and they'll boost your ka-ching!

I don't know a single country that did not benefit from immigration on the whole. People just have to get accustumed to the fact that there are many cultures that need to be respected, that goes for the emigrating as well as the immigrating culture.

[Username Deleted]

I agree that it is a tough call to make, and certainly would never want political correctness to get in the way of a fair and balanced education. I do however feel that there is an epidemic of "political correctness gone mad!" in this country at the moment, where the media is quick to declare political/educational policy as 'anti-British' without presenting a fair interpretation of the story... I guess this is the next level of the phenomena you previously described?

I think the problem here is a wider one... politicians and the media are always quick to jump on whichever bandwagon seems most popular, be it anti-British or anti-anti-British (!). Neither one is a fair representation of this country... we have our flaws and we have our pluses. Unfortunately I don't think a fair representation will ever be given, so I guess we have to trust people to look beyond what they are told.

I do hope your right, i don't feel so optimistic about people looking beyond what they are told tbh. Here's hoping though.

[Sthenno]

I do hope your right, i don't feel so optimistic about people looking beyond what they are told tbh. Here's hoping though.

They are there, I promise! Where are you based? I'd strongly recommend going along to a local social centre or grassroots social movement to get a really refreshing look at how people are ignoring what the media tell them and taking matters into their own hands... it can be really inspiring!

(Sorry, majorly off topic!)

[stevewinn]

I don't know a single country that did not benefit from immigration on the whole. People just have to get accustumed to the fact that there are many cultures that need to be respected, that goes for the emigrating as well as the immigrating culture.

no hang on, if you leave your home land for distant shores (UK) you should not be bringing your culture with you if its totally different from the country your leaving, this is were the problems start, the only people who need to get accustomsed is the immigrants to their host nations culture. and that way we all get along,

migration watch figures, immigration for the last 4 years in the UK has benefited the economy by 60p per person, but has made a loss of just under -£2 per person, and this is not counting the impact on infrastructure, the government tried to hide figures which show 68% of immigrants are from outside the EU,

[hetrodoxly]

I know the question wasn't directed at me but i've got an opinion on what's dragging the UK down. It's an attitude or state of mind that has gripped a large sway of the population, the roots of which probably started in the early 1900's but didn't really take hold and start to spread till the sixties and early seventies. It's an attitude that says that if your British you should be ashamed of your history and constantly criticise yourself and country for not living up to some exaggerated bench mark of fair play, a system which looks at the perspective of the rest of the world before your own. It started with the arm chair critics in the sixties and seventies who systematically took some of this countries greatest achievement (like exploration and military feats) and attempted to debunk them with often shocking inaccuracy and blatent lies. It's been a drip-drip effect which has led us to our current state of either being ashamed of our country and history (for no good reason) or just not giving a toss to begin with.

It is that attitude which runs from the youths on the street right up to the politicians who haven't got the balls to be proud of the country they govern, that is dragging this great country back. (imo).

Spot on

The fight back has started.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=gycwkZMs8g0&...feature=related

Edited February 15, 2008 by hetrodoxly

[stevewinn]

Spot on

The fight back has started.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=gycwkZMs8g0&...feature=related

i like this video, its BNP, but what the heck its just a bit of fun,

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...h&plindex=1

[Username Deleted]

They are there, I promise! Where are you based? I'd strongly recommend going along to a local social centre or grassroots social movement to get a really refreshing look at how people are ignoring what the media tell them and taking matters into their own hands... it can be really inspiring!

(Sorry, majorly off topic!)

Perhaps i should. I'm not sure if it would fill me with confidence or just depress me even more though lol.

[Lord Of The Dragons]

I'm a truck driver. I've been on the road for over 20 years (I'm now 43 years young). Through-out my adult life, I've had (in total) less than a full year when I've been unemployed, and that's since leaving school at 16. So, basically, I've been employed (in various jobs, not just the one) for approx. 25 years. That's a hell of a lot of Tax and National Insurance.

That all changed 2 years ago. I'm divorced and have 4 kids. My 3 youngest came to live with me and, because my youngest was only 10 at the time, it meant that I couldn't do long distance driving because I couldn't leave him at home on a night time. Long story short, I was made redundant and had to go on state benefits. Because I was a single parent, I was told it wasn't a problem. I could get this, get that, get all the others, yadda yadda. However, because of all the beurocratic BS, the state made a total bo****ks of all my payments and I actually ended up in debt because of it. In the end, it became so bad I was actually living on handouts from family and friends and using those handouts to feed and clothe my kids. The worst day of my life was when I had to tell my youngest that he had to go back to living with his mother (which he didn't, and still doesn't, want to do) so I could go back to work because we just couldn't survive. All this didn't happen to some lazy layabout who spends 9 months of every year sponging off the state or someone who was just out for an easy ride through life. This was someone who proved he was willing and able to earn his way, was willing to work for what he had.

As far as I personally am concerned, this country let me down and let me down badly. I used to be proud of my country and proud of who I was. But not any more. My experience of being an unemployed single parent has left me bitter and more than a little angry and that anger is made a whole lot worse when I see how immigrants can come to my country and end up getting more from the state than I, as a native single parent, could and with far less trouble than I had.

This is why I have no confidence in my country, it's beurocrats or it's politicians. This is why I say this country is nothing but a joke and why changes are drastically needed. The UK is on its knees and is sinking lower and lower with every passing week. It's alright saying "well vote someone else into government then." It honestly makes no difference. Thatcher screwed the country up. The idiot from Huntingdon who followed her did such a stand up job I can't even remember his freaking name. Blair actually seemed like he might turn things around for a while but ended up just as bad as all the rest and don't get me started on Gordon Brown. If ever we needed Hadrians Wall to keep a Scot out of England, it was that pillock.

I really shouldn't call immigrants because, right now, I really want to be one. Just not in this screwed up country.

[Sthenno]

I'm a truck driver. I've been on the road for over 20 years (I'm now 43 years young). Through-out my adult life, I've had (in total) less than a full year when I've been unemployed, and that's since leaving school at 16. So, basically, I've been employed (in various jobs, not just the one) for approx. 25 years. That's a hell of a lot of Tax and National Insurance.

That all changed 2 years ago. I'm divorced and have 4 kids. My 3 youngest came to live with me and, because my youngest was only 10 at the time, it meant that I couldn't do long distance driving because I couldn't leave him at home on a night time. Long story short, I was made redundant and had to go on state benefits. Because I was a single parent, I was told it wasn't a problem. I could get this, get that, get all the others, yadda yadda. However, because of all the beurocratic BS, the state made a total bo****ks of all my payments and I actually ended up in debt because of it. In the end, it became so bad I was actually living on handouts from family and friends and using those handouts to feed and clothe my kids. The worst day of my life was when I had to tell my youngest that he had to go back to living with his mother (which he didn't, and still doesn't, want to do) so I could go back to work because we just couldn't survive. All this didn't happen to some lazy layabout who spends 9 months of every year sponging off the state or someone who was just out for an easy ride through life. This was someone who proved he was willing and able to earn his way, was willing to work for what he had.

As far as I personally am concerned, this country let me down and let me down badly. I used to be proud of my country and proud of who I was. But not any more. My experience of being an unemployed single parent has left me bitter and more than a little angry and that anger is made a whole lot worse when I see how immigrants can come to my country and end up getting more from the state than I, as a native single parent, could and with far less trouble than I had.

This is why I have no confidence in my country, it's beurocrats or it's politicians. This is why I say this country is nothing but a joke and why changes are drastically needed. The UK is on its knees and is sinking lower and lower with every passing week. It's alright saying "well vote someone else into government then." It honestly makes no difference. Thatcher screwed the country up. The idiot from Huntingdon who followed her did such a stand up job I can't even remember his freaking name. Blair actually seemed like he might turn things around for a while but ended up just as bad as all the rest and don't get me started on Gordon Brown. If ever we needed Hadrians Wall to keep a Scot out of England, it was that pillock.

I really shouldn't call immigrants because, right now, I really want to be one. Just not in this screwed up country.

While I'm sorry that these things have happened to you, and certainly agree with you that the system sucks, I don't really see what any of that has to do with immigrants? Despite the tabloid stories and popular opinion to the contrary, they have to go through the same messed up system as everyone else. If some screwed up bureaucrat decided to prioritise their case over others to meet quotas, surely that is the fault of the system and not the immigrant?

[Sthenno]

i like this video, its BNP, but what the heck its just a bit of fun,

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...h&plindex=1

Another example of the kind of ignorance that helps the BNP win votes and Daily Mail headlines sell papers.

An asylum seeker is not the same thing as an immigrant. An immigrant is someone who has come to Britain to work; an asylum seeker is someone who has fled persecution and often the threat of death in their own country. Most of them have no idea where their destination will be - they pay huge amount of sums to get out of the country and are brought here by third parties.

They don't live the comfortable life alluded to in that video. They get the worst housing that no one else wants and £35 of supermarket vouchers - which they cannot get change from (so the supermarket makes a profit), cannot use for basic groceries like tampons or nappies, and can only use at set supermarkets - to survive on. It's a struggle to survive day to day - the chances of them being able to afford 'a brand new leather jacket' are laughable.

These people go through the most inhumane treatment on a regular basis and what do we, the country where they hoped to be able to find sanctuary, do? We make ill informed, offensive and artistically questionable 'animations' and post them on YouTube. If I had my way, I'd boot all the idiots who make this crap out of their homes and give them to those who truly deserve them.