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I created a new world religion

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DigitalSentinal

You know, I should talk. I might very well be in your shoes this summer - except that I won't be able to enjoy the fruits of my work anonymously. I'll just set the record now by saying that I am not trying to start a religion, but merely to provide another sense of direction on an already oversaturated topic. In fact, if people try to "follow" me or my beliefs, they may wind up in a world of trouble, since I'm no angel.

No. I cannot say at this time what my work is about.

Edited by DigitalSentinal

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Irish
But, and if I can say this respectfully, your comments are ridiculous, if not bordering on hysterical.

No you cant say that respectfully,

I have put forward legitimate questions, if your intention is to be respectful than answer the questions! I am not alone in feeling that what you have done is both unethical and immoral and I have stated why.

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Irish

Here are my questions once again, and other can judge if they are ridiculous, if not bordering on hysterical.

1. Do you lose sleep knowing that you have purposely set out to deceive your fellow man and quite possibly your own children and grandchildren for a handful of coin?

2. If this religion grows internationally would you step forward and admit it was all a lie for the sake of personal greed?

3. Are you prepared to answer when you leave this world to the souls you willingly deceived in your life?

4. Are you so sure it is harmless and cannot be twisted to the benefit of your employer?

5. You have stated yourself that you have no idea why those people who hired you to write this wanted it for. How are you so sure it is not for malevolence purposes?

6. You do not know the reason you were asked to write this story. So you do not know how they intend to use it.

7. You claim it is inspired by beings from the spirit world via a number of Ouija Board entity intelligences. How do you know these spirits are trustworthy?

8. If they had asked you to come up with a recipe for a new drug that could be harmful and knowing full well that someone would be stupid enough to consume it would you accept the payment for the recipe.

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crescent moon

It amazes me that we a a people are so lost and looking for something that we can be compared to sheep

and i think this motivating factor is fear, fear of the unknown, fear that maybe we are the only pilots in our lives

and so therefor have to take personal accountability for where we are

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Moon Demon

If you are looking for credibility, I wouldn't exactly start with this board.

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IronGhost

Here are my questions once again, and other can judge if they are ridiculous, if not bordering on hysterical.

1. Do you lose sleep knowing that you have purposely set out to deceive your fellow man and quite possibly your own children and grandchildren for a handful of coin?

Technically, I have no children, and will never have my own children. Therefore, I will never have grandchildren.

Also, technically, it was more than a “handful of coin.“ On the other hand, it was not an impressive amount of “coin.”

But, in creating this religion, I did not deceive my fellow man.

I hereby state upon my honor and on my dead mother’s grave that I do not lose sleep over my extremely novel and positive effort to introduce a better form of religion among the people of planet earth.

For example, my new religion does not tell people that they can burn in Hell forever for sins they may have committed while they were on the planet earth.

Also, my new religion does not instill fear in people by postulating the existence of an evil winged being named Satan, who has at his command an army of demons, whose function it is to devour the souls of innocent, unwitting people, or people who are not obeying their leaders in their religions hierarchy, or who are failing to donate 10% of their hard-earned income to religious authorities.

In my new religion, there is no unproven or unsubstantiated threats that evil beings will attack you and devour your soul. That’s because there is no evidence such being exist.

In short, I believe my religion is a lovely gift to the world.

2. If this religion grows internationally would you step forward and admit it was all a lie for the sake of personal greed?

The religion I created has already grown internationally -- I have confirmation that it is already being practiced in at least 20 countries. I will not step forward and admit it is was a lie for the very simply reason that it was not a lie -- and there was no personal greed involved -- just a desire to earn a humble, middle-class income, while at the same time, doing something positive and beautiful for my fellow mankind.

3. Are you prepared to answer when you leave this world to the souls you willingly deceived in your life?

The simple answer is that no “souls” were deceived.

4. Are you so sure it is harmless and cannot be twisted to the benefit of your employer?

Yes, I am 100% certain that my new religion is harmless. In fact, I guarantee it.

This is more than can be said of current mainstream religions, including all sects of Christianity. For example, the Bible says it is okay to not only own slaves, but to beat your slave as severely as you want to beat your slave, as long as you do not kill him or her. Here is a direct quote from the Christian Bible on the issue:

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

In my new religion, no one is allowed to own slaves, much less beat slaves if they do own them.

Also, for example, in my new religion, no one will be stoned to death for working on a day committed to a God. Here is what the Christian Bible says about this:

"Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the Lord: whoseoever doeth work therein shall be put to death. Ye shall kindle no fire throughout your habitations upon the sabbath day." (Exodus 35:2)

In my religion, this will not be allowed.

5. You have stated yourself that you have no idea why those people who hired you to write this wanted it for. How are you so sure it is not for malevolence purposes?

It does not matter, because even if these people were up to no good, the religion I created for them will not serve their purposes, if their purposes are evil. That’s impossible. Also, I have been monitoring the growth of my new religion, and it has performed in exactly the positive and uplifting way I designed it to perform.

So, to date, my new religion has had a positive effect on the lives of all who adopt it. I feel good about that.

6. You do not know the reason you were asked to write this story. So you do not know how they intend to use it.

The religion I created can only be used in the way I designed it to be used. If others decide to change, add, or amend the religion I created, that is not of my doing, and therefore, not on my conscious. It would be on the conscious of the dabblers, obviously.

The fact is, anyone can take any of the thousands of religions existent in the world today and anyone can change them all they want, and they do so every day. I hardly see how that applies to me.

7. You claim it is inspired by beings from the spirit world via a number of Ouija Board entity intelligences. How do you know these spirits are trustworthy?

Your term “inspired” is not entirely accurate. I simply asked for advice from my Ouija friends and received frank suggestions, some of which I adopted.

Also, there is no need to make distinctions between Ouija entities and any other normal human being in terms of trustworthiness. When it comes to discerning trustworthiness, there is always an element of doubt, be it an Ouija entity, or a human being, or even a local minister, or the Pope himself for that matter.. For example, in my hometown, one of our local Catholic priests was arrested for soliciting a male prostitute, and for defrauding a bank. He did so with money donated from parishioners. So, he was not trustworthy, obviously. I have never met an Ouija entity that took my money and spent it on a prostitute, nor defraud a bank.

There was another priest in our Diocese. His name was Father Porter. He was eventually convicted of raping more than 1,100 young boys over a period of 20 years. Even though the Bishop of our Diocese knew that Father Porter was raping young boys, he said nothing and did nothing, and even tried to hide the crime from the police.

In my new religion, this kind of thing could never happen.

8. If they had asked you to come up with a recipe for a new drug that could be harmful and knowing full well that someone would be stupid enough to consume it would you accept the payment for the recipe.

I hardly see how this is relevant, since I am not involved in pharmacology, and took only one class in chemistry while in college, for which I received a “B”.

I am not qualified to come up with a recipe for a new drug.

Irish, I look forward to your promise to ban yourself from these board for two weeks in August. If you do this, as you promised you would, you slate will be clean, with me at least.

Edited by IronGhost

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Irish

Perhaps our definitions of deceit are different? Based on the information you have provided I see hidden risk and malice for both yourself and others that may be deluded with a story that is fabricated and then presented as truth. If this was simply a work of fiction I would have no problem in fact I have enjoyed your contributions up until this one.

If the entire thing is a work of fiction I would understand why you are not concerned with any repercussions or harm this may cause in the future.

But if they are true, the information provided here is personally alarming. You describe shady secretive characters who commission you to author the principles’ of a new religion. You have even alluded to the point that they may be of alien origins. And yet you are not concerned as to how they will use this information to get a return on their investments. You simply will wash your hands grab your wallet and vanish excepting no responsibility. Having no children of your own is no excuse to mislead others.

I won’t get into debating the bible or mainstream religion in this thread, but it is clear that you have a very limited understanding of scripture. In another thread I would take on the Pope on his interpolation, so we might actually agree on some issues.

I am curious that you would accept communication and advice with spiritual beings normal as you would a chit chat with the next door neighbour. Between the shady banana eating aliens and your Ouija advisers perhaps you are the one that is being deceived after all. Sorry for messing up your slate that was not my intention when you post on these board you should not expect everyone to agree with your actions and not question your intent. When I ban myself in Aug for a couple of weeks I shall throw a trout in the pan in your honor. :tu:

All the best Irish

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lunartwin

Alright, I had a comment nearly finished, managed to hit a keystroke wrong and lost it all. So here's a summed up version, which will probably be better than my author's rambling habit, anyway.

After five years of lurking this site, I finally registered tonight and you get my first comment, Mr. Ironghost. I've read your articles, I don't agree with everything you've written, but found it all entertaining, nonetheless. I've seen you get dumped on for creating a religion for personal gain and I disagree with anyone who's asked you such questions of "ethics" or "morals". Of course, this is mostly because of my own disbelief in any form of religion, but I understand everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

I, too, am a writer, so I understand how you would have been approached to do something so huge. We have a gift of creativity and I've created religions for some of the stuff I've written as well, though none were ever created with the hopes or thoughts of them being followed internationally, lol. Personally, I believe all religions (at least the mainstream ones) are a form of mass control and distraction. Religion - the earliest form of government created by man, for man. I also understand that some people need a form of faith in order to survive. They need that guidance and if you created one for them, that's awesome. If it's something that will make their lives better or make them better people for the practice they follow, that's even better.

I was born and raised Roman Catholic and I don't have a religion now. I follow astrology and astronomy, the oldest forms of science and-from my experience-the most accurate. The stars have never lied to me and they've never steered me wrong either. But that's just me.

In short, kudos to you for giving people something to believe in.

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IronGhost
Alright, I had a comment nearly finished, managed to hit a keystroke wrong and lost it all. So here's a summed up version, which will probably be better than my author's rambling habit, anyway.

After five years of lurking this site, I finally registered tonight and you get my first comment, Mr. Ironghost. I've read your articles, I don't agree with everything you've written, but found it all entertaining, nonetheless. I've seen you get dumped on for creating a religion for personal gain and I disagree with anyone who's asked you such questions of "ethics" or "morals". Of course, this is mostly because of my own disbelief in any form of religion, but I understand everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

I, too, am a writer, so I understand how you would have been approached to do something so huge. We have a gift of creativity and I've created religions for some of the stuff I've written as well, though none were ever created with the hopes or thoughts of them being followed internationally, lol. Personally, I believe all religions (at least the mainstream ones) are a form of mass control and distraction. Religion - the earliest form of government created by man, for man. I also understand that some people need a form of faith in order to survive. They need that guidance and if you created one for them, that's awesome. If it's something that will make their lives better or make them better people for the practice they follow, that's even better.

I was born and raised Roman Catholic and I don't have a religion now. I follow astrology and astronomy, the oldest forms of science and-from my experience-the most accurate. The stars have never lied to me and they've never steered me wrong either. But that's just me.

In short, kudos to you for giving people something to believe in.

Wow -- welcome to UM, and with a terrific opening post. I am an obsessed amateur astronomer, and have been since a very young age -- when I was a young man, all of my heroes were astronomers, and not just because they were astronomers, but because they were revolutionaries -- Copernicus, Galileo, Tyco Brahe -- all of them challenged not only authority, but religious authority to drag the rest of humankind kicking and screaming toward the truth. They kept their feet planted in the ground of rationality -- yet, at the same time, they dared to go beyond the status quo.

One of my favorite quotes: "He loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night."

Thanks again lunartwin -- and I am not the type of person who needs anyone to agree with me, nor cares.

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DigitalSentinal

Hate to break it to you, but if you truly did not care about what others think about your having created a religious movement...

...you would not have wrote about it in an international forum. ^_^

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IronGhost
Hate to break it to you, but if you truly did not care about what others think about your having created a religious movement...

...you would not have wrote about it in an international forum. ^_^

Why? I'm just doing what a story teller does -- tell a story.

As most experienced writer might admit -- you eventually get to a point where you just tell your story whether anyone cares about it or not.

As the great writer Jane Roberts said: "Inspiration is its own motivation."

Or as Kurt Vonnget said, "You just have to write the book you were damn well meant to write."

And for the record, just because I am using terms like "tell a story" no one should conclude from this that my story is fictional. Because this story is most definitely NOT fictional.

I swear on the life of my beautiful seven-toed polydactyle cat Trantor, whom I love very much, that the story I told here is true.

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DigitalSentinal

Sorry Iron. I don't buy it. Jaw clicking humanoids offering large sums of money for a custom built religion that share no commonalities with other movements/religions and who on top of that give you complete freedom to divulge your part in this adventure is...just a tad too out there for me. And I'm an open minded guy.

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IronGhost
Sorry Iron. I don't buy it. Jaw clicking humanoids offering large sums of money for a custom built religion that share no commonalities with other movements/religions and who on top of that give you complete freedom to divulge your part in this adventure is...just a tad too out there for me. And I'm an open minded guy.

No need to apologize. I respect your opinion. I probably would not believe this either -- whether people believe me or not, nothing in my life changes anyway.

EDIT: Ooops -- just noticed your comment "gave me complete freedom" -- anything but!! I had to labor like a slave to keep the central aspect of the story a secret -- not just the name of the religion -- but a description of all it entails, which is a rich wonderful story in itself!!!!

So please -- not complete freedom -- not at all.

Edited by IronGhost

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DigitalSentinal

So, was she hot? The female I mean? I suspect it becomes far less difficult to work for people when at least one of them is just smokin' hot.

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lunartwin
I am not the type of person who needs anyone to agree with me, nor cares.

Well, we have that in common then.

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jpjoe
-- and I am not the type of person who needs anyone to agree with me, nor cares.

-- whether people believe me or not, nothing in my life changes anyway.

Any proferssional writer has a reputation to care for.

edit: +quotes

Edited by jpjoe

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3rd rock resident alien

2008 zoster virus outbreak. pray for the sick.

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DigitalSentinal

Sounds good. You Franipdop the ranidoo and I'll terentate it.

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Mbyte

You religion seems like it's not a religion at all. I would imagine it to be like "the secret". It sounds practically the same. Well I suppose your religion can apply to anything. You want something you create a means to get it. You create an imaginary system to get what you want. YOur religion seems like a mixture of philosophy, The secret, mathematics. Everything we use is imaginary. Even the language I use to type with. It's only a means in which we can express and comprehend this reality.

Iron ghost you have a weird point of view. Basically non of us understand your point of view due to your vagueness. You say your religion is Bullsh** however you compare it to time or physics. For the crack let's just say Time isen't bullsh** then would your religion still be bullsh**?

Reading your long defending post makes you seems like a polotition or a lawyer. You use the law. It's not this because it's it's not breaking the law.

A person may be free to choose what the want but they don't know what they are getting becasue the history is shrouded. You have detached yourself from the religion thus it's not deception but this is bullsh**. Your just playing with semantics. You have created a deception from what I can see. However your point of view seems to be all over the place. It's a deception but what kind of a decpetion is it. (you may say it's not a deception but I don't know what else to call it) Are you saying that in a techinical point of view that if you hypothetically created a mathematical formula that it too would be a deception or are you saying that you created utter lies and people are following something that is the typical everyday ordinary persons type of dellusion.

You say it's bullsh** but the people follow your bullsh** as if it is truth. What exactly is bullsh** about this religion??

The sentence above is a deception.

Your going to have to give an example about your c effect because it's too vague at the moment.

It's also to vague in general. We logically assessing your posts and not seeing your hidden logic. The way you play with semantics is going to raise questions.

What If I wanted to do this religion? How can I find out about it?

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DigitalSentinal

Makes great advertising material for a blog though...

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IronGhost
So, was she hot? The female I mean? I suspect it becomes far less difficult to work for people when at least one of them is just smokin' hot.

I'm not sure who you are talking about. At any rate, I accuse you of "lookism."

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IronGhost
You religion seems like it's not a religion at all. I would imagine it to be like "the secret". It sounds practically the same. Well I suppose your religion can apply to anything. You want something you create a means to get it. You create an imaginary system to get what you want. YOur religion seems like a mixture of philosophy, The secret, mathematics. Everything we use is imaginary. Even the language I use to type with. It's only a means in which we can express and comprehend this reality.

Iron ghost you have a weird point of view. Basically non of us understand your point of view due to your vagueness. You say your religion is Bullsh** however you compare it to time or physics. For the crack let's just say Time isen't bullsh** then would your religion still be bullsh**?

Reading your long defending post makes you seems like a polotition or a lawyer. You use the law. It's not this because it's it's not breaking the law.

A person may be free to choose what the want but they don't know what they are getting becasue the history is shrouded. You have detached yourself from the religion thus it's not deception but this is bullsh**. Your just playing with semantics. You have created a deception from what I can see. However your point of view seems to be all over the place. It's a deception but what kind of a decpetion is it. (you may say it's not a deception but I don't know what else to call it) Are you saying that in a techinical point of view that if you hypothetically created a mathematical formula that it too would be a deception or are you saying that you created utter lies and people are following something that is the typical everyday ordinary persons type of dellusion.

You say it's bullsh** but the people follow your bullsh** as if it is truth. What exactly is bullsh** about this religion??

The sentence above is a deception.

Your going to have to give an example about your c effect because it's too vague at the moment.

It's also to vague in general. We logically assessing your posts and not seeing your hidden logic. The way you play with semantics is going to raise questions.

What If I wanted to do this religion? How can I find out about it?

The religion I created is absolutely nothing like The Secret which is basically a bunch of simplistic babble about quantum physics, and a crass appeal to people's materialisms -- it's like a get-rich-quick scheme that tells people they can have anything they want by just thinking about it long enough, without having to work for it -- and they try to support this simple theory with incorrect interpretations of quantum physics.

***

I mentioned the law to point out that what I did was not only ethical -- but legal and ethical on all levels, including in the eyes of the law.

Mbyte, I simply can't understand how you can say "people don't know what they are getting because the history is shrouded."

That's ridiculous.

First of all, the history of ALL religious texts are shrouded.

For example, who wrote the Book of Genesis in the Bible? For years, theologians told us it was written by Moses -- but now this theory is no longer popular. The fact is, no one knows who wrote Genesis in the form we see it today -- and the book is most likely the written form of centuries of oral traditions that came before the written word was invented. The Book of Genesis, like all books in the Bible, have also been changed, edited, redacted, altered, translated, retranslated, mistranslated, deliberately mistranslated, and so on, uncounted times.

Who wrote the Book of Ruth in the Bible? Absoltuely no one knows -- yet, this never stopped anyone for considering it a text that backs up a particular religion.

What about the Book of Mormon? The Mormon Church is one of the most respected mainstream religoin in the world with millions of followers. Yet, the story of how the book came to be strange, to say the least. This from Wiki:

The Book of Mormon was first published by Joseph Smith, Jr. in March 1830 in Palmyra, New York. According to Smith's written account, the book is a translation of gold plates which contained the writings of prophets in ancient Meso-America between approximately 600 BC and AD 400, which were buried by Moroni, the last of these prophets, at a hill called Cumorah, before his death. Smith said that on September 22, 1827 he received the plates from an angel named Moroni and was directed to translate them using two stones called the Urim and Thummim that were deposited with the plates.

And as we all know, after he copied down all the information on the gold plates, they mysteriously disappeared!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sorry, but this sounds basicaly like a "whopper" to me -- yet, this does not bother the many millions of Mormons and their religion.

What about Vedic texts in the Hindu tradition -- again, shrouded in mystery.

Everyone is free to believe these books were written by "gods and angels" if they want to -- or they can disbelieve them. The fact is, all religious texts are "shrouded in mystery" but the new "bible" I wrote makes no grandious claims to have been written by gods or angels -- the book speaks for itself, and I have no doubt everyone will assume it was written by an ordinary human being, which is me.

I have not "created a deception" as you say. Yet, all other major religions of the world clearly have "created a deception." They are lying to us by claiming their books were written by God, or angels, or whatever.

My new religion is far, far, far more honest that this -- I lead no one astray with dozens of threats and promises -- there are no threats of hell, or punishments, or demon possession -- and there are no grandious vague promises of eternal paradises. In my religion, no one is told they will receive 72 virgins in heaven if they go an kill the member of another religion.

If any one wants to vent there concern over "decpetions" look no further than mainstream religion -- they have enough deception to keep anyone busy all day, or for years on end.

But my new religion has no deception whatsoever.

You're right about my vaugueness here, though, mbyte, but I have explained why I must tell this story in an essentially vague way.

Edited by IronGhost

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keithisco

As far as I am concerned you are just talking out of your rear end. "Shadowy" figures needing YOU (of all people) to create a fictional Religion. A hack that no-one knows to create this thing.

To be honest you sound like another little-kid student trying to get maximum points in his asessmet by trying to fool the real cognoscenti.

Sounds like another candidate for Junior UM....

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IronGhost
As far as I am concerned you are just talking out of your rear end. "Shadowy" figures needing YOU (of all people) to create a fictional Religion. A hack that no-one knows to create this thing.

To be honest you sound like another little-kid student trying to get maximum points in his asessmet by trying to fool the real cognoscenti.

Sounds like another candidate for Junior UM....

But what religion isn't "fictional"?

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jpjoe
It's really hard to shoot a ball from the other side of the court.

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