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DfizzleShizzle

Dear Skepitcs...

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DfizzleShizzle

Ok, as I have stated in other post, not only I can feel the "psi balls" I make, I told my brother to feel inside my hand, and tell me what he felt(Didn't tell him anything was there, and he doesnt know about psi) And when he did, he said it felt cold, and electricy, and then today, I made psi flow from my fingertips, and told my friend Austin(He knows that I practice this stuff, but doesn't know anything much about what psi feels like or anything) to put his hand under my fingers...As soon as he did he pulled his hand back, and said it felt cold...REALLY COLD...And said it felt really wierd...Also,jackpaperdig , a skeptic who says, that he doesn't believe in psi, and thinks of them as a trick of the mind...But he says to be sure, he made a "psi ball" and told his sister to feel inbetween his hands(His sister is bliss to psi also) and he said as soon as she did, she pulled her hand back saying "What the hell was that!!!" He said she said it was very cold, and almost electricky...Now, do you think, it's just a coincidence, that all these people, had the same feelings when asked to feel inbetween our hands(For Austin under my hands) I highly doubt each person, if psi is fake, I doubt each one of their minds would make up the same feelings...It's highly unlikely...

So look, I'm extending a challenge to the skeptics...You guys do the work for a change...You guys all seem to love and make me do work to prove stuff to you, now it's your turn to put soem effort into this...I want you guys, the skeptics, to practice making psi balls, for one week, once you feel that you have something (Even if you think it's just your mind) Tell someone, who is oblivous to psi, to feel inbetween your hands, note their reactions...Also, note your own sensations as well...This is my challnge for you guys...I have put out way more than my fair share of effort for you skeptics, so it's your turn...I know you guys don't believe in psi, but give it a try, and see what others think..I know alot of you have tried psi before, and dismissed it as a figment of your imagination, but try it anyways, and note other peoples reactions when they feel the energy in your hands...For those skeptics who havent tried...Go here and if you want alot more detail on it, go here...

Just do this little test....Many of you say you truely wnat psi to exist, so expelling a little effort won't be hard, right? Post your results here, and please, for God's Sake, don't lie, or change your info to support your arguement....Have fun!

Edited by Heartagram3200

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Im-postle-able
Just do this little test....Many of you say you truely wnat psi to exist, so expelling a little effort won't be hard, right? Post your results here, and please, for God's Sake, don't lie, or change your info to support your arguement....Have fun!

hahahaha for extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence..

Since we all agree that the effect could be a form of self / empathetic hypnosis.. how exactly is getting more people to do the same thing in ANY way helping support the thoery you have about psi-balls etc? More people experiencing the same NON-paranormal effects doesn't make it any more paranormal!!!

[please please read the following paragraph slowly and consider EVERY word as important as the last]

Doesn't it phase you at all that there has never been a shred of evidence, not a single measurable, reproducible effect ever discovered in the realm of telekinesis. If the evidence is so obvious and testable then the scientific community would flood to you in huge numbers, the whole of humanity would be caught up in an age of discovery and development.. the repercussions for such evidence would have groundbreaking global repercussions... and yet no-one can find this evidence.... it's almost as if it doesn't exist!

Edited by Im-postle-able

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DfizzleShizzle

And yet, we didn't relize the world was flat until humanity had many around for 1000's of years...

Science is at it's begining, not it's end...We know less than 10% about the world in which we live...

And I'm not simpiliy asking you guys to try it, I'm askin you guys to try it, but make others comfirm what you feel...Like, make a psi ball, tell your friend to feel in bewteen your hands, note their reaction, and see what they felt, see if the feelings are similar to yours...You don't need to say psi isn't real...I know all your opinions...Just do this test though...It cant possibly hurt your stance on this issue...Or can it?

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jay123
And yet, we didn't relize the world was flat until humanity had many around for 1000's of years...

Science is at it's begining, not it's end...We know less than 10% about the world in which we live...

And I'm not simpiliy asking you guys to try it, I'm askin you guys to try it, but make others comfirm what you feel...Like, make a psi ball, tell your friend to feel in bewteen your hands, note their reaction, and see what they felt, see if the feelings are similar to yours...You don't need to say psi isn't real...I know all your opinions...Just do this test though...It cant possibly hurt your stance on this issue...Or can it?

And soon as we had the means to discover the world was infact spherical. We did.

Just as in the same way, I didn't know what made the psi-wheel spin, and discovered through the means of suggestion, convection currunts and heat minipulation

Its not our responsibility to provide proof, that belongs to the believer.

Edited by jay123

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eight bits

So, H...

If I understand your position, then you could also cup your hands so that there would not be a psi-ball there. It's your choice, right?

So, play a little game. See if you can make your brother and your friends tell you all about a psi-ball that isn't there.

Now you need to be careful, since you might tip them off. You need to be all gushy and stuff. And you need to ask the same kinds of leading questions you always do (like, What do you feel now?).

Um, but the suggestion in the OP is a waste of time. None of your critics doubts that your friends get as worked up as you say they do. It is uninteresting whether their friends could be convinced to say something, too.

And if they did what you asked anyway, then when the krowd said that the answer is yes, their friends reactions were the same whether there was a psi-ball or not, then you would say "Oh, you guys don't know whether there's a psi-ball there or not."

See, you do learn from them.

So, bottom line, you're the one who needs to do this experiment. You've already done half of it. Now try the other half.

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DfizzleShizzle
So, H...

If I understand your position, then you could also cup your hands so that there would not be a psi-ball there. It's your choice, right?

So, play a little game. See if you can make your brother and your friends tell you all about a psi-ball that isn't there.

Now you need to be careful, since you might tip them off. You need to be all gushy and stuff. And you need to ask the same kinds of leading questions you always do (like, What do you feel now?).

Um, but the suggestion in the OP is a waste of time. None of your critics doubts that your friends get as worked up as you say they do. It is uninteresting whether their friends could be convinced to say something, too.

And if they did what you asked anyway, then when the krowd said that the answer is yes, their friends reactions were the same whether there was a psi-ball or not, then you would say "Oh, you guys don't know whether there's a psi-ball there or not."

See, you do learn from them.

So, bottom line, you're the one who needs to do this experiment. You've already done half of it. Now try the other half.

Ok, I'll do it now...

Just did, he said he didn't feel anything...He just felt heat, which was the reult of me just washing my hands...I did this with Austin earlier today, I told him to feel my hands when nothin was their, he didn't feel anything...So they CAN tell the difference..

And, why would it kill you to go ahead and tyr it anyways? Just for kicks?

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Im-postle-able
And yet, we didn't relize the world was flat until humanity had many around for 1000's of years...

Science is at it's begining, not it's end...We know less than 10% about the world in which we live...

And I'm not simpiliy asking you guys to try it, I'm askin you guys to try it, but make others comfirm what you feel...Like, make a psi ball, tell your friend to feel in bewteen your hands, note their reaction, and see what they felt, see if the feelings are similar to yours...You don't need to say psi isn't real...I know all your opinions...Just do this test though...It cant possibly hurt your stance on this issue...Or can it?

"we didn't relize the world was flat until humanity had many around for 1000's of years" what does this mean? The evidence to confirm that the world was flat wasn't readily available.. when it was.. it was "proven" with re-producable, testable evidence...

Science isn't at it's end? yes... we all know this and agree completely! Are you trying to say that science knows everything about everything? well.. thats obviously wrong and no skeptic would EVER claim it to be so....

The effects and explanations for psi-balls have been noted to be self/empathetic hypnosis... by more people doing exactly the same self/empathetic hypnosis it won't do ANYTHING to support your claims.

By claiming that skeptics are afraid of doing your "test" because they mind find evidence is laughable in the extreem.. science is the framework for a never ending persuit of knowledge, asking people to perform a FLAWED test and saying they are afraid if they don't do it ISN'T science and it's NOT proof.. it's called a logical non-sequitur.. the conclusion doesn't follow the premise.

The test you're asking of us is flawed and non-supportive... THAT is the reason i'm not going to waste my time.. with simple scientific concepts of experimental controls i don't HAVE to do the "test" to KNOW that there is something seriously wrong with it..

Edited by Im-postle-able

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DfizzleShizzle

Well, why dont you try it anyways? It isn't your feelings I'm concerned about as much as the people yyou ask...I just wanna see if everyone reports feeling the same thing....And, it wouldn't of been that hard to prove...The way the figured it out, was when they would sail ships from one place, and end up exactly in the same place...Doesn't sound that hard to do...And, isn't it possible maybe we don't have the technology to prove TK?

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Im-postle-able
Just did, he said he didn't feel anything...He just felt heat, which was the reult of me just washing my hands...I did this with Austin earlier today, I told him to feel my hands when nothin was their, he didn't feel anything...So they CAN tell the difference..

And, why would it kill you to go ahead and tyr it anyways? Just for kicks?

So they had absolutely NO idea what you were doing?

1. Are they in the room when you "make the psi-ball"

2. Can they see your face (possibly able to pick up on body language that you're not being serious)

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eight bits
And, why would it kill you to go ahead and tyr it anyways? Just for kicks?

Because, grasshopper, I know I can do it. So what would be the point?

Sorry to hear that you can't control the effect. Others can.

Edited by eight bits

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DfizzleShizzle

I made sure thye werent there when I made it...They Koty didn't know about psi at all...It was dark, he couldn't see me really, it was at night in our room, he walks in when I'm playin with a psi ball, he didn't notice it, so I asked him to fele inbetween me hands...

And Eight bit...Why not do the test, to prove me wrong? I doubt you have better stuff to do...You spend hours on here anyways...So why not spend a little time doin this?

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Im-postle-able
Well, why dont you try it anyways? It isn't your feelings I'm concerned about as much as the people yyou ask...I just wanna see if everyone reports feeling the same thing....And, it wouldn't of been that hard to prove...The way the figured it out, was when they would sail ships from one place, and end up exactly in the same place...Doesn't sound that hard to do...And, isn't it possible maybe we don't have the technology to prove TK?

Oh...... my....... god.........

Thats NOT how the world was discovered to be round... the first global sea voyage was in 1519AD (and yes, traveling around the globe in a ship was a VERY hard thing to do) the world was discovered to be round in about 300BC by observing lunar eclipse and using trigonometry to calculate the worlds circumference...

Secondly.. if a person can feel a physical sensation then it is measurable... very easily measurable... the technology to "prove" psi-abilities has existed for a very long time...

It's obvious that you have a VERY bad grasp on the realm of scientific enquiry... just horribly bad... you don't even seem to grasp even the most basic forms of critical thinking or simple reasoning... i don't mean this as an insult.. it's just an observation..

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jay123
Well, why dont you try it anyways? It isn't your feelings I'm concerned about as much as the people yyou ask...I just wanna see if everyone reports feeling the same thing....And, it wouldn't of been that hard to prove...The way the figured it out, was when they would sail ships from one place, and end up exactly in the same place...Doesn't sound that hard to do...And, isn't it possible maybe we don't have the technology to prove TK?

We do have the technology to detect energy.

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drakonwick

I have said this once before Heart!

Asking someone to put their hands between yours, the automatic reaction of them is going to be that

that they will expect to feel something. So, the mind has already made this preconcieved notion

without any action taken place.

Anyway, I done it just to say I did. (Hopefully it makes you happy!)

I cupped my hands together then thought about energy flowing through my hands, then I walked into

the next room and asked my fiance to put her hand in between my cupped hands.

Her 1st reaction was just as I thought! (The resounding WHY?) she finally did it. There was no immediate

reaction, the only thing she said that she could feel was heat emanating from my hands, nothing unusual.

Regards,

Tom

Edited by Moro Bumbleroot

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AngelOfMusic

oh my god why don't you guys just get on with it and have a go? It's bad enough when believers make excuses why they can't give proof, but when the very people who get annoyed most at this end up doing it! How many hours a day do a lot of you stare at the telly, when you could take, i don't know, maybe ten fifteen minutes to try this? Come on you're the ones asking for proof! If you're right, fantastic, you've shut us up. If you're wrong, never mind you've proven something, you know a little bit more.

So please, stop whining and have a go, you might like it!

Best Wishes, AoM xx

*edit*sorry tom i posted at the same time as you, and thanks, i told you you were nice *edit*

Edited by AngelOfMusic

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Im-postle-able
oh my god why don't you guys just get on with it and have a go? It's bad enough when believers make excuses why they can't give proof, but when the very people who get annoyed most at this end up doing it!

Because understanding the basic principles of critical thinking show us that the test is horribly flawed. We're not being difficult, it's just a really bad test to perform which outcome won't support or disprove the original premise. Being able to rationalize the elements of the "test" show us that firstly it's flawed in that it doesn't prove anything as it isn't using any kind of control or taking into account any likely variables...

1. He's made a paranormal abilities claim

2. We've pointed out possible factors which could affect the claim...

3. He AGREES with us...

4. He then tells us to do a flawed test which doesn't address any of the factors we've all been discussing

See the problem?

If any person claiming paranormal abilities would LIKE to prove their abilities simply apply to http://www.randi.org/joom/challenge-info.html you will be tested fairly, with professional and correct techniques.. and if you prove your ability you get $1,000,000... simple...

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DfizzleShizzle

Yes, Moro, makin psi balls is alot more than that...Once you feel satisfied that you feel something there(Even if you think it's fake) Then try it...And hey impostable, I'm just a teen man...I'm gettin this stuff from years ago, afetr reading it in science text books and stuff...Don't quote me on this stuff...I'm just givin examples...And, alot of times, the least possible scientific theory turns out bein the right one...If you want to follow the scientific method, then you must be open to EVERY possibility, and test EVERY possibility...And by test I dont mean get other people to do it...Test it yourself! Even if you think you know the results, try it anyways!

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DfizzleShizzle
Because understanding the basic principles of critical thinking show us that the test is horribly flawed. We're not being difficult, it's just a really bad test to perform which outcome won't support or disprove the original premise. Being able to rationalize the elements of the "test" show us that firstly it's flawed in that it doesn't prove anything as it isn't using any kind of control or taking into account any likely variables...

1. He's made a paranormal abilities claim

2. We've pointed out possible factors which could affect the claim...

3. He AGREES with us...

4. He then tells us to do a flawed test which doesn't address any of the factors we've all been discussing

See the problem?

If any person claiming paranormal abilities would LIKE to prove their abilities simply apply to http://www.randi.org/joom/challenge-info.html you will be tested fairly, with professional and correct techniques.. and if you prove your ability you get $1,000,000... simple...

Ugh...Not again..The James Randi comp is completely a waste of time...Even in case he has no evidence against, he simpily makes up something to call it fake...He just wants to keep his money...

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drakonwick
Yes, Moro, makin psi balls is alot more than that...Once you feel satisfied that you feel something there(Even if you think it's fake) Then try it...And hey impostable, I'm just a teen man...I'm gettin this stuff from years ago, afetr reading it in science text books and stuff...Don't quote me on this stuff...I'm just givin examples...And, alot of times, the least possible scientific theory turns out bein the right one...If you want to follow the scientific method, then you must be open to EVERY possibility, and test EVERY possibility...And by test I dont mean get other people to do it...Test it yourself! Even if you think you know the results, try it anyways!

ONCE AGAIN! I have seriously tried to create a psiball many times Heart. The conclusion is always the same.

Nothing out of the ordinary happens, and can be explained with normal mind, and bodily functions.

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DfizzleShizzle

Ok, well, maybe some of the others here should try and do this test, just to see what happens...I knew you all would do this..And I know how the test could be contamminated, but if the vast majority of people show the SAME EXACT FEELINGS...Than something must be going on! Thats what this test is for...The other skeptics need to suck it up and do it, like I do for you all!

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eight bits
And Eight bit...Why not do the test, ...So why not spend a little time doin this?

Already asked and answered.

to prove me wrong?

Not much of a reason to do anything.

I doubt you have better stuff to do

It is encouraging that you doubt something.

You spend hours on here anyways...

And yet, grasshopper, nobody else pays a dime to feed me, house me, clothe me, ... when you can say the same, I shall take more seriously your opinion of how I spend my time.

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DfizzleShizzle

I didn't say anything....Just implied it...I still don't get what the problem is...You guys cnat even do this tiny test...I agreed to do the psi wheel, which you guys told me to do, even though according to you people it is flawed...I agree to do stuff for you all the time...Why cant you return the favor?

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drakonwick
I didn't say anything....Just implied it...I still don't get what the problem is...You guys cnat even do this tiny test...I agreed to do the psi wheel, which you guys told me to do, even though according to you people it is flawed...I agree to do stuff for you all the time...Why cant you return the favor?

The test is flawed because none of us are there to observe what is happening Heart. You say that your friends etc.

do not have a clue to what you are doing before you ask them to put their hand between yours! But, this just

doesn't justify much of anything.

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Im-postle-able
Yes, Moro, makin psi balls is alot more than that...Once you feel satisfied that you feel something there(Even if you think it's fake) Then try it...And hey impostable, I'm just a teen man...I'm gettin this stuff from years ago, afetr reading it in science text books and stuff...Don't quote me on this stuff...I'm just givin examples...And, alot of times, the least possible scientific theory turns out bein the right one...If you want to follow the scientific method, then you must be open to EVERY possibility, and test EVERY possibility...And by test I dont mean get other people to do it...Test it yourself! Even if you think you know the results, try it anyways!

Don't be so open minded that your brain falls out...

Sure, the explanations for any phenomenon can be the least known / accepted ones.... do you know HOW these little known / accepted explanations are supported? With controlled, repeatable, verrifyable and FALSIFYABLE evidence..

If an explanation is unlikely it doesn't mean we have to consider it unless there is enough evidence to lead us down that path. In the case of psi-abilities.. in the world.. in the history of modern science.. there has been ZERO evidence for psi-abilities... therefore it is VERY VERY unlikely that they exists.. if they DO exist then they simply require simple, easy to do, easy to falsify, easy to test, easy to reproduce evidence...

The evidence to support your claims is very very simple.... the rational thinkers here ARN'T the ones ducking & weaving to avoid these tests....

I still don't get what the problem is...You guys cnat even do this tiny test...I agreed to do the psi wheel, which you guys told me to do, even though according to you people it is flawed...I agree to do stuff for you all the time...Why cant you return the favor?

Because the test is very simply flawed and WON'T help your claims at all... it's very simple to deconstruct your test & point out the problems... if you had a good test... like putting a psi-wheel under a glass bowl resting in shallow water not subject to a source of heat or vibrations then THAT is a good test... right there!! PERFECT TEST!!

Edited by Im-postle-able

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DfizzleShizzle
The test is flawed because none of us are there to observe what is happening Heart. You say that your friends etc.

do not have a clue to what you are doing before you ask them to put their hand between yours! But, this just

doesn't justify much of anything.

then do it to other people, and see what you get...Simple as that...One person's results doesnt give you a conclusion...

Zero Proof?

Whta about all the people who knew to cancle their flights on 9-11, cause they had a bad feleing...How people can predict certain events...How some things fly off tables and shelfs, when a person walks who is stressed...

Theres alot of evidence..You just have to look for it..Which you dont seem to feel like doing...

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