Miracles OF Islam ! ! !

[Ozi]

Alright alright alright, we don't need to discuss the terrorism issue anymore. Can we please get back to the topic?

I'll start us off: The images claimed to be symbolic of "Allah" are nothing more than the products of nature. Honestly, these things are no different than the Virgin Mary on Toast thing.

I agree in some cases its just natural phenomena. But there is such isntances, whereby you find the words there is not god but allah, in a fruit or on the skin of animal. A rock a prostrating and looking like the shape of a human in prostration, the same way muslims prostrate and all the prophets did too. A tree bent in the Rukuh position which is forms a part of the muslim pray, and facing the direcion of the kabah, is just coincedence. Just like the big bang, just like evolution, its all coincedence, everything has a cause and a purpose, what seems in animate to me and you its true form is unknown to us all. Everything is a perception.

[Ozi]

This I can say True Miracle of Islam (Courtesy of BBC Today)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7330330.stm

"This is a warning for the non-believers that if they do not leave our lands there are many more like us and many more like me until the law of Allah is established on this earth," he went on.

He was then heard warning: "Martyrdom operations upon martyrdom operations will keep on raining on these kuffars [non-believers] until they release us and leave our lands."

Hmmm interesting, it seems to be the main point here is that, they feel agreived at te US actions and occupation, the are taking actions in to their own hand(i dont agree with them), but its unilateral action, exactly what the US did, when it ignored the world and its governing authorities.

[Mainpoint]

This I can say True Miracle of Islam (Courtesy of BBC Today)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7330330.stm

What is your opinion on organized hindu tamil terrorrists. They have killed and displaced millions of muslims christians and budhists.

And also what hindu terrorists did in Gujrat

http://www.geocities.com/understandinghind...cide-india.html

I cant imagine why someone in this modern world choose to follow hinduism

No wonder in masses hindus are converting to other religions

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6050408.stm

If you want to tackle hindu spirituality and present your opinion why dont you go ahead and start a ask a hindu thread

Before you start blasting someone or some group, develop an extreme and spiteful opinion based on individual stories. How about knowing your background well.

[churchanddestroy]

"This is a warning for the non-believers that if they do not leave our lands there are many more like us and many more like me until the law of Allah is established on this earth," he went on.

He was then heard warning: "Martyrdom operations upon martyrdom operations will keep on raining on these kuffars [non-believers] until they release us and leave our lands."

Hmmm interesting, it seems to be the main point here is that, they feel agreived at te US actions and occupation, the are taking actions in to their own hand(i dont agree with them), but its unilateral action, exactly what the US did, when it ignored the world and its governing authorities.

Aw, come on you guys, can't we just drop the terrorism thing, please? Just this once? Let it go, we don't want to get off topic.

[EmpressStarXVII]

Aw, come on you guys, can't we just drop the terrorism thing, please? Just this once? Let it go, we don't want to get off topic.

Yes, this thread should be about the beautiful miracles of Islam.

I have to say, my favorite out of all those pictures is the one of the hands. I tried searching on snopes to see if any of these were debunked. The one with the snow on the mountain seems photoshopped. But they are all really interesting of course.

Islam is such a beautiful religion, and I feel very blessed to be a Muslim.

Edited April 4, 2008 by EmpressStarXVII

[eight bits]

Aw, come on you guys, can't we just drop the terrorism thing, please? Just this once? Let it go, we don't want to get off topic.

With respect, churchanddestroy, the topic is purported evidence for the action of God, as Islam conceives of him, in earthly events.

Game on.

[SunDogDayze]

Well you see islam and the quran tells us that, everything in creation is in submission to the will of allah and worship him, rocks, trees, the earth, everything. So when we see a rock, looking like a man in prostration we know its a rock in constant worship to allah and in submission, like the tree, which looks human, bowing in a worship position and facing exactly towards mekkah.

Are you suggesting that Allah made that tree grow that way on purpose to remind Muslims of their faith? If that is the case, why that tree, so subtle, instead of a giant redwood on top of a hill where no other trees are growing?

Or that the tree has a conscience of it's own and decided to grow that way to show it's submission? In that case, does that make all the other trees sinners or infidels because they grew straight?

Or maybe that a natural structure is naturally positioned in a way that it reminds some people of their faith? Just like how Catholics seeing Mary on toast and Christian's seeing God's hand in the clouds reminds them?

Even though I can appreciate that paradoleia can be a good tool to remind one of their faith, it becomes unhealthy when one thinks it was made specifically for that purpose. These examples are no more evidence of Islam being the one true religion than any other 'sign' seen by anyone of any faith.

[Atheist God]

Let us be real; specifically, there are murderers, thieves, pedophiles, terrorists, etc. in all the "great" religions of the world.

No disagreement there

But how many times do you hear about christians in this day an age execute people by beheading for blasphemy? Not as many as muslims I bet.

Religions cannot be compared to one another cause each is different and carries with it different views and morals.

[Ozi]

Aw, come on you guys, can't we just drop the terrorism thing, please? Just this once? Let it go, we don't want to get off topic.

Your absolutely right, we should stick to the topic, but what i find is , people will take any opportunity to attack islam, on baseless grounds, and often tarnish the whole ummah, (global community of muslims) with the same brush.

With respect, churchanddestroy, the topic is purported evidence for the action of God, as Islam conceives of him, in earthly events.

Game on.

Yeh what ever.......

Are you suggesting that Allah made that tree grow that way on purpose to remind Muslims of their faith? If that is the case, why that tree, so subtle, instead of a giant redwood on top of a hill where no other trees are growing?

Maybe, its a possibility, this is allahs wisdom as to why he chose that tree to grow in such away that it would remain a constant reminder to mankind, not just muslims, to worship god, as everything in creation does.

Or that the tree has a conscience of it's own and decided to grow that way to show it's submission? In that case, does that make all the other trees sinners or infidels because they grew straight?

No, the power over everything is with allah. A rock, in prostration, or a tree in another position of woship, which is acted out daily, numerous times within a single pray time, and then repeated five times aday, each occasion that postion is taken up several times as the prostration. I wonder if many of you have ever witnessed muslims pray at the mosque, you should go to any mosque and ask if you can observe and you should be welcome. Its genuine request to all non muslims, to see the unity in pray that muslims project. There is nothing like it.

Or maybe that a natural structure is naturally positioned in a way that it reminds some people of their faith? Just like how Catholics seeing Mary on toast and Christian's seeing God's hand in the clouds reminds them?

Possibly, i dont disagree, things like this are ambigious, neither provable anyway, the wisdom of such things is with allah, all we can do is see and take heed, remember allah, is what the tree tells a muslim, to a non muslim, its just an odd tree.

Even though I can appreciate that paradoleia can be a good tool to remind one of their faith, it becomes unhealthy when one thinks it was made specifically for that purpose. These examples are no more evidence of Islam being the one true religion than any other 'sign' seen by anyone of any faith.

No i dont think anyone is trying to say these definitely prove that islam is the truth, Islams miracle is a live today, unlike jesus's, moses or anyother might prophet of god, islam true miracle is the quran, and those who doubt it, simply need to answer the qurans own challenge, then produce somethng like it. besides other challenges too

No disagreement there

But how many times do you hear about christians in this day an age execute people by beheading for blasphemy? Not as many as muslims I bet.

Religions cannot be compared to one another cause each is different and carries with it different views and morals.

You dont hear about the christian state sponsered terrorism, they do it from high above, dropping bombs on innocent poeple and call it collateral. Religions can be compared with one another, they have common teachings, laws etc, if we all stuck to what was common amongst our religions, then you would find most of you would need practise your own religions, and you would look and behave similar to muslims, although you maybe christian or jew, or hindu etc.

[Ciss]

Are you suggesting that Allah made that tree grow that way on purpose to remind Muslims of their faith? If that is the case, why that tree, so subtle, instead of a giant redwood on top of a hill where no other trees are growing?

Or that the tree has a conscience of it's own and decided to grow that way to show it's submission? In that case, does that make all the other trees sinners or infidels because they grew straight?

Or maybe that a natural structure is naturally positioned in a way that it reminds some people of their faith? Just like how Catholics seeing Mary on toast and Christian's seeing God's hand in the clouds reminds them?

Even though I can appreciate that paradoleia can be a good tool to remind one of their faith, it becomes unhealthy when one thinks it was made specifically for that purpose. These examples are no more evidence of Islam being the one true religion than any other 'sign' seen by anyone of any faith.

That' s just soooooo "not right!"

Allah shows himself in beautiful settings...leave it to the christian savior to show up on a dog's @zz!

That's just not fair!

[MID]

Ok, let say i take over your house, put you in your garden in a tent as a refugee. Im not occupying your place, i believe you need my assistance, while you receive my assistance, i will rape your wife and daughters, torture you for fun, if i can get any vital info out of you, and drop bombs on your house. At the end of it you may wanna call the police to say i am illegally occupying your house, you would be right, thats exactly what your doing iraq.

Baloney. That has nothing to do with what we are doing, or what we did in Iraq. No one has raped and tortured anyone's wives or daughters. You sound very much like John Kerry or John Murtha, which is mighty distressing...

No the UN, the legal global body allegedly, agreed, most of the world was against it, you as a nation still took the illegal step to occupy another country, firstly under false pretence of WMD's when the only nation on the planet who has ever had the audacity to use a WMD is THE US itself on hiroshima, and then preaches that other nation ought not to have them. Jokers. You then quickly switch to regime change, which is illegal, the very thing Saddam wanted to do in Kuwait, cause before colonial times it was a part of iraq, you do very same thing yourselves. Dont get me wrong, Saddam was a b******, but he was their b****** and theirs only to sort out. The only thing the US was really worried about was the reserves of dollars being changed to the euro, if other Arab states followed suit, your economy would be screwed. Iraq is receiving much needed, assistance from america, since you have been there, no clean running water, no electricity, etc. These people had better lives under Saddam, sicne the US has been there, they have accomplished nothing, just taking out someone like Saddam, who was once a close friend, well when he used have the money to by your weapons.

Better lives under Saddham? No clean running water and no electricity?

Again, where have you been? Don't you realize that we re-build and re-establish infrastructures, schools, etc... when we do these liberation operations?

LOL, what a joker, so the enemy you fight is poor, has not weapons, no army, these are poeple fighting for their land, the property, their lives and their religion

Who said the enemy is poor, with no weapons...???

Who's land and religion are they fighting for? Islam's? C'mon. Even you should know better than that.

They have plenty of weapons. They also hide. Of course they're not an army...by any classical definition of the term. They also have no country. They are illegal enemy combatants. Know what that means? They use anyone as shields. They hide under the cover of the population, and they are cowards by any definition of the term. They commit cowardly, unmanly acts against defenseless people.

You sound like you've bought the radical left line completely. This ravaging the country nonsense is now boring.

LOL, Abu Ghariab according to your own authorities maybe just the tip of the ice berg, its one that got caught, what happens out there is relatively unknown. What you know and everyone knows about the insurgence is from your own media and your own sources, they have their agenda, war is also won and ground gained via propaganda. Thats all it is. Its an absolute joke to call someone who is fighting occupying forces in his own country, a terrorist

No...your information is gained from our mainstream media. Their agenda parallels yours very closely.

And again, these are terrorists, not freedom fighters. They have no country, and they are not fighting an occupation force. They are fighting Iraqis, who are running their own show...with American troop assistance as a part of the war on terror. American are risking their hides for the stability of Iraq.

Its like syaing if america got invaded, and occupied, any american fighting back is a terrorist to the new occupiers, but freedom fighter to their fellow american.

Bull.

It has no correlation to what's actually happening.

If America got invaded, and occupied by a victorious force...well, something would be really wrong...since that's just not possible. If America was an oppressive regime, and of course not the most powerful nation on the planet, I should suspect, that just like the Iraqis, the citizens would welcome the change...and also be very favorable to the conquerers re-building their schools, and getting their power plants up and running, establishing a new government, getting people back to work, and getting rid of the oppression once and for all.

Of course, that doesn't exist in America. It happens in the Middle East.

But supposing such an almost third world paradigm did exist in America, and out of the woodwork, from all sorts of places, un-uniformed religious radicals came in by droves and began murdering defenseless American civilians, attacking their churches and places of business, murdering our newly established leadership, and attacking the forces that were helping us get it together for our own good again...that Americans (as are the Iraqis presently) would get damn tired of it...

...the Iraqis want us there. They are rising up against Al Qaeda and the wacko insurgents who re TERRORIZING THEM. They support us. We, for our part, are trying to help them do just that, while killing as many of the morons as we possibly can.

Kindly recall that WE WERE ATTACKED BY THESE SAME LUNATICS. The sleeping giant, for the most part, woke up on 9-11-01.

Some of them, it seems, are still asleep...like you...despite the fact that you are from the UK, you ought to know better, as you have been targeted by these same kooks.

Apparently you haven't yet learned to quote properly so as to provide a nice flow of dialogue, but I can understand that.

I also understand your somewhat skewed positions....

Based upon this comment:

As for the moon landing, personally i dont believe its ever been done, it was a hoax.

Well, that explains alot about your positions overall.

[--Mandalore--]

Link

Hmm.....yep it was definitely better under Saddam...LOL!!

[SunDogDayze]

No i dont think anyone is trying to say these definitely prove that islam is the truth, Islams miracle is a live today, unlike jesus's, moses or anyother might prophet of god, islam true miracle is the quran, and those who doubt it, simply need to answer the qurans own challenge, then produce somethng like it. besides other challenges too

What?!

Okay, first off, this is from the OP:

An undeniable proof showing that Allah is the creator of the heavens and the earth.

Someone IS trying to say that these definitely prove that Islam is the truth. If it is considered proof that Allah is the creator of the heavens and earth, wouldn't that be exactly the same as saying that Islam is true?

Secondly, you not only contradict the OP, you contradict yourself. A few times. You act like no one is trying to say that Islam is the truth, but I could pull about 20 threads you started that were started for no other reason than for you to "prove" your religion is the right one.

Also, please show me why the Quran is any more believable than the Bible, or the Torah, or the Mahabharata, or Sumerian texts about Ea and Enlil, or heiroglyphic spiritual texts from ancient Egypt. As of the present, no one has been able to find anything about any of those examples, including the Quran, that can prove it's legitimacy regarding the 'true' religion. It hasn't happened. There isn't reason to believe the Quran is based off truth any more so than any other spiritual employee handbook.

[ShaunZero]

Pareidolia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareidolia

The term pareidolia (pronounced /pæraɪˈdoʊliə/), referenced in 1994 by Steven Goldstein,[1] describes a psychological phenomenon involving a vague and random stimulus (often an image or sound) being perceived as significant. Common examples include images of animals or faces in clouds, the man in the moon, and hidden messages on records played in reverse

This is no different than people seeing the virgin mary in a piece of toast, or a devil in the smoke at 911. You can see all kinds of things if you want to see them...

I don't believe any of this topic to be evidence of Allah, however, I disagree that it is pareidolia. Pareidolia is whenever your eyes see patterns that AREN'T ACTUALLY there. These patterns actually are there. At least similar to the actual name. Nothing more than random chance. To begin with, the name isn't even a complicated set of shapes.

[3rd rock resident alien]

Its miracles right now is in Sudan Chad Darfur.

Its angels - Janjawed.

True God gives you complete freewill and ask nothing in return whatsoever.

Respect all other humans for they are created equals as you are.

You breath, they breath.

Your wife or your girlfriends are your equals. Don't enslave.

[Life_Rulezz]

THe Miracles OF Islam has a great impact than other religions. We sa see the evidence. That's all need to be said. May Almighty God have mercy on us...................

[godsmantru]

THe Miracles OF Islam has a great impact than other religions. We sa see the evidence. That's all need to be said. May Almighty God have mercy on us...................

IF YOU LOVE ISLAM YOU NEED TO GOTO THE NEW THREAD ENTITLED ARE YOU READY FOR THIS!!

[Ozi]

Baloney. That has nothing to do with what we are doing, or what we did in Iraq. No one has raped and tortured anyone's wives or daughters. You sound very much like John Kerry or John Murtha, which is mighty distressing...

Baloney, thats all you american can say, when you cant see beyond porch window, there is a world beyond america and your front garden, when you get a chance have a look at it. Because it the world which america rapes and takes all the resources and occupies lands illegally.

Better lives under Saddham? No clean running water and no electricity?

Again, where have you been? Don't you realize that we re-build and re-establish infrastructures, schools, etc... when we do these liberation operations?

Yes they were, ofcourse he was a dictator, like the korean guy, but you dont invade him, your waiting to weaken it as nation via sanctions, then when its poor and cant defend itself you will probably invade. You see you reckon re-establish all the infrastructure, well you need to wake up, coz the iraqi's and the Afghanis are still waiting, and the latter have been waiting longer, oh by way afghanistan does not start and end in kandahar. LOL

Who said the enemy is poor, with no weapons...???

Who's land and religion are they fighting for? Islam's? C'mon. Even you should know better than that.

Ofcourse they were poor, 5000 children died before the war simple because they did not have medical supplies, due to sanctions and the money that did come in, saddam kept, you best friend when he was rich and buying your weapons. Hypocrites, like i said you needed to take out a puppet, who longer dances to the stars and stripes, now you have installed on who does. Iraqi;s are not fighting for islam, they are fighting for their homes, dignity, property, lifes, wifes, children, if they were fighting for islam, you would know, it would be more intense. Every iraqi capable of holding a weapon would be fighting if it was for islam and the rest of the reasons.

They have plenty of weapons. They also hide. Of course they're not an army...by any classical definition of the term. They also have no country. They are illegal enemy combatants. Know what that means? They use anyone as shields. They hide under the cover of the population, and they are cowards by any definition of the term. They commit cowardly, unmanly acts against defenseless people.

you see this is what you are told on your bias media, which is bias when i watch some of your channels here in the UK, its makes me laugh that most american get duped by the media. The people fighting our troops and yours are iraqi's. when you invaded, you sacked the previous army, big mistake, they have no jobs now, so what do you think they will do, ofcourse become the insurgence. Jokers. They use anyone as shield, yeh right, just cause they tell you that, dont believe it, you ave laser guided precise missiles, use them and how come they always miss. Cowards are those, who attack from the skies, and when its get tough on the ground in a fire fight, they call on their radios, for WMDs. from the skies. COWARDS, allegedly looking for WMD's when the only nation with a record for using such fire power is the US.

You sound like you've bought the radical left line completely. This ravaging the country nonsense is now boring.

Its nonsense to you, as it probably is to most americans, you see most of you cant see beyond your living rooms, you think america is the only place that exists. You went in iraq, and immediatley the first place you went to was not so people could have water, or electricity, you went to occupy the oil fields and change the iraqi reserves from the Euro back to the Dollar, the latter was the real threat. If your not bombing and taking iraq back to the stone age, and taking its resource, then your being there is useless, because you have not managed anythign else, people are still waiting on basic amenities.

No...your information is gained from our mainstream media. Their agenda parallels yours very closely.

And again, these are terrorists, not freedom fighters. They have no country, and they are not fighting an occupation force. They are fighting Iraqis, who are running their own show...with American troop assistance as a part of the war on terror. American are risking their hides for the stability of Iraq.

Your joking right! Abu Gharaib is well known and documented case of abuse by americans and there are more, that was the tip of the ice berg, one that got out. Terrorists, how, are they bombing your beloved US, or are they fighting a force trained equpped and supported by the occupying force. Ofcourse its the latter,s they are freedom fighters to most iraqi's and terrorists to you, because your occuoying them. Its like when the brits were occupying india, and hindus, muslims, sikhs that fought them were called terrorists by the brits and rest of europe. WEll were they terrorists?

Bull.

It has no correlation to what's actually happening.

If America got invaded, and occupied by a victorious force...well, something would be really wrong...since that's just not possible. If America was an oppressive regime, and of course not the most powerful nation on the planet, I should suspect, that just like the Iraqis, the citizens would welcome the change...and also be very favorable to the conquerers re-building their schools, and getting their power plants up and running, establishing a new government, getting people back to work, and getting rid of the oppression once and for all.

See what i mean, you live in holllywood. that only does not happen in the movies when america does not get defeated, Vietnam, remember. Well if america was invaded, infact if i invaded your house, on suspicion that your holding some WMD, with out any hard evidence, like your country, i invade your house, kick you and your family out, ofcourse you will fight back for it and be a freedom fighter. not a terrorist.

Of course, that doesn't exist in America. It happens in the Middle East.

But supposing such an almost third world paradigm did exist in America, and out of the woodwork, from all sorts of places, un-uniformed religious radicals came in by droves and began murdering defenseless American civilians, attacking their churches and places of business, murdering our newly established leadership, and attacking the forces that were helping us get it together for our own good again...that Americans (as are the Iraqis presently) would get damn tired of it...

LOL. Iraq under saddam as bad as he was, he was their leader and their reponsibilty, regime change is illegal and still is, and you are in a illegal war, infact it did not start off as regime change it started off as some other bull first. The shiites, Kurd and Sunni's did have difference, Saddam did treat shiite and Kurds bad, i totally agree, but he had the country under control, now we have the alleged most power ful nation there and they can barely look after it and themselves. If America has any sense of real justice, then why not invade Korea, Iran, China, Russia (chechnya humanrights), India, etc etc, well because they are capable of fighting back, so ot quite ready for them.

...the Iraqis want us there. They are rising up against Al Qaeda and the wacko insurgents who re TERRORIZING THEM. They support us. We, for our part, are trying to help them do just that, while killing as many of the morons as we possibly can.

Ofcourse they want you there, that why they set up roadside bombs to greet you.

Kindly recall that WE WERE ATTACKED BY THESE SAME LUNATICS. The sleeping giant, for the most part, woke up on 9-11-01.

Some of them, it seems, are still asleep...like you...despite the fact that you are from the UK, you ought to know better, as you have been targeted by these same kooks.

Sleeping gaint, are you having a laugh.............. mate 9-11 has some many holes in it, you had not proof of who did it. When afghanistian and the naive taliban asked you for proof, so then they could execute bin ladin or hand him over to pakistan as a nuetral country, you showed the evidence to Tony blair and his mates, you had not truthfulness or justice in you, to show the afghans, look here is the proof, its a passport, which landed on top of the 9-11 rubble, after all that chaos, perfectly preserved, see, he is arab, see he is linked withbin ladin, nothing no evidence shown to any of them. Infact, i think the aemrican forces should use the material from the passport to make uniforms, that way your soldiers will survive anything.LOL

Apparently you haven't yet learned to quote properly so as to provide a nice flow of dialogue, but I can understand that.

I also understand your somewhat skewed positions....

Is that a dig, well i dont care what you think. Because i normally take on more than one here, alone so i have alot to do and alot to write back mostly rushed, but you need to stick to the topic, this is the last time i am anwsering you. Set up an appropriate thread and we can discuss it there in more detail.

Based upon this comment:

Well, that explains alot about your positions overall.

Well, that my opinion, based on some sound evidence and some is ambigious, just like the landing itself.

What?!

Okay, first off, this is from the OP:

Someone IS trying to say that these definitely prove that Islam is the truth. If it is considered proof that Allah is the creator of the heavens and earth, wouldn't that be exactly the same as saying that Islam is true?

No, Allah means god, if we establish that god is there and the creator, this does not autmatically mean islam is true, Allah is the arabic word for god, the best name for god.

Secondly, you not only contradict the OP, you contradict yourself. A few times. You act like no one is trying to say that Islam is the truth, but I could pull about 20 threads you started that were started for no other reason than for you to "prove" your religion is the right one.

I do believe islam is the truth, but this type of evidence is not always as convincing, as you said, and i agree, but amongst them are some which you cannot explain or a mysterious in cause and nature. I know islam is the truth, the quran is gods word, due to what it contains as we have discussed several times and the fact, it challenges the whole of mankind and the universe to simply produce to verses like it, well put us out of our misery then.

Also, please show me why the Quran is any more believable than the Bible, or the Torah, or the Mahabharata, or Sumerian texts about Ea and Enlil, or heiroglyphic spiritual texts from ancient Egypt. As of the present, no one has been able to find anything about any of those examples, including the Quran, that can prove it's legitimacy regarding the 'true' religion. It hasn't happened. There isn't reason to believe the Quran is based off truth any more so than any other spiritual employee handbook.

The quran is the legtiamte truth, because the other are unlike it, they are full of errors, mistakes, contradictions, scientific errors etc etc, the quran is free of all of them, and infact unlike any of the books you mentioned, its ask you to find a mistake in it, tell me whether any of the others do. Its perfection, its logical rational, scientifically verifiable, modern scientific established facts agree with it, its law is practical and gets results, unlike the other which look and sound pretty on paper. i could go on all day, but you know most of it anyway.