Dragons in Ireland

[Dariune99 0]

Hello there

I thought i would start my own topic of conversation. Im not sure this is the right place but im sure it can be moved if its not.

In Ireland the legend goes that there are no snakes or indeed dragons (mythologically speaking) in Ireland. This is half true.

There are several dragon myths in ireland, even relating to how there are no longer Dragons in Ireland.

Some people say these myths were conjured up after the "there are no dragons in Ireland" legend by people who want dragons to be everywhere.

Some people, myself included, take the stance that there were in deed dragon myths from Ireland dating hundreds and thousands of years back and the "there are no dragons in Ireland" legend is just an expansion on the "there are no snakes in Ireland" story.

i realise this may not be interesting to many of you but i find this debate interesting so i thought id see if anyone else did.

[draconic chronicler 15]

Hello there

I thought i would start my own topic of conversation. Im not sure this is the right place but im sure it can be moved if its not.

In Ireland the legend goes that there are no snakes or indeed dragons (mythologically speaking) in Ireland. This is half true.

There are several dragon myths in ireland, even relating to how there are no longer Dragons in Ireland.

Some people say these myths were conjured up after the "there are no dragons in Ireland" legend by people who want dragons to be everywhere.

Some people, myself included, take the stance that there were in deed dragon myths from Ireland dating hundreds and thousands of years back and the "there are no dragons in Ireland" legend is just an expansion on the "there are no snakes in Ireland" story.

i realise this may not be interesting to many of you but i find this debate interesting so i thought id see if anyone else did.

But what is the point of even starting the thread, since you claim dragons never existed in the first place? With your mentality, then you are right, this topic is out of place. You are denying dragons are cryptids from the onset, and this forum is about cryptids. Now if your point was, "we know there are no small reptiles in Ireland because of Ice Age glaciers as the scientists state, but since large dragons have been recorded in legends long before St. Patrick, this suggests that since dragons could swim and fly, they repopulated Ireland after the Ice Age".

And if real, did St. Patrick drive them out or destroy them? No. By the dark ages, dragons had long since gave up the charade they were gods, and were only infrenquently seen, much like lake monster accounts everywhere. If a dragon had been killed, its remains woulud have been preserved as treasured artifiacts, exactly like the fake remains and fossils thought to be dragon remains.

Of course there were dragon legends in Ireland before St. Patrick, and some prove St. Patrick is a nonsense, because of dragon/lake monster sighting have occured for centuries AFTER St. Patrick supposedly drove the out. If there had been ANY real interaction between St. Patrick and Dragons it would probably have been non-combatitive since even the Catholic Chruch of St. Patrick's time acknowledged that dragons were seraphim, the highest of all heavenly creatures.

Edited April 18, 2008 by draconic chronicler

[667-Neighbor of the Beast 8]

But what is the point of even starting the thread, since you claim dragons never existed in the first place? With your mentality, then you are right, this topic is out of place. You are denying dragons are cryptids from the onset, and this forum is about cryptids. Now if your point was, "we know there are no small reptiles in Ireland because of Ice Age glaciers as the scientists state, but since large dragons have been recorded in legends long before St. Patrick, this suggests that since dragons could swim and fly, they repopulated Ireland after the Ice Age".

And if real, did St. Patrick drive them out or destroy them? No. By the dark ages, dragons had long since gave up the charade they were gods, and were only infrenquently seen, much like lake monster accounts everywhere. If a dragon had been killed, its remains woulud have been preserved as treasured artifiacts, exactly like the fake remains and fossils thought to be dragon remains.

Of course there were dragon legends in Ireland before St. Patrick, and some prove St. Patrick is a nonsense, because of dragon/lake monster sighting have occured for centuries AFTER St. Patrick supposedly drove the out. If there had been ANY real interaction between St. Patrick and Dragons it would probably have been non-combatitive since even the Catholic Chruch of St. Patrick's time acknowledged that dragons were seraphim, the highest of all heavenly creatures.

About 95% of this is completely off topic. Do not turn this into a debate on the existance of dragons, proof of their existance, dragons portrayed as gods, lake monsters being dragons, etc.

HE asked about the LEGENDS of dragons in Ireland, being related to the legend of St. Patrick driving the snakes out. Nothing more. IF you want to argue the other topics, go back to the other thread. Those are not relevant here, except to you for some reason.

[draconic chronicler 15]

About 95% of this is completely off topic. Do not turn this into a debate on the existance of dragons, proof of their existance, dragons portrayed as gods, lake monsters being dragons, etc.

HE asked about the LEGENDS of dragons in Ireland, being related to the legend of St. Patrick driving the snakes out. Nothing more. IF you want to argue the other topics, go back to the other thread. Those are not relevant here, except to you for some reason.

you seem to forget this forum is dedicated to Crytozoology, so all of the threads should be related to cryptic animals. This is the topic of these forums.

If the poster does not believe they are cryptid animals, then there are many other forums where this is better suited, Like Spirituality, Religion and BELIEFS. And since you cannot contribute anything to this discussion anyway, why to you even come here to make your pointless remarks?

[667-Neighbor of the Beast 8]

you seem to forget this forum is dedicated to Crytozoology, so all of the threads should be related to cryptic animals. This is the topic of these forums.

If the poster does not believe they are cryptid animals, then there are many other forums where this is better suited, Like Spirituality, Religion and BELIEFS. And since you cannot contribute anything to this discussion anyway, why to you even come here to make your pointless remarks?

I never said it wasn't a crypitc topic. You, once again, are trying to turn it into an argument on the existance of dragons. That is not the topic. Stick to the topic.

[Dariune99 0]

But what is the point of even starting the thread, since you claim dragons never existed in the first place? With your mentality, then you are right, this topic is out of place. You are denying dragons are cryptids from the onset, and this forum is about cryptids. Now if your point was, "we know there are no small reptiles in Ireland because of Ice Age glaciers as the scientists state, but since large dragons have been recorded in legends long before St. Patrick, this suggests that since dragons could swim and fly, they repopulated Ireland after the Ice Age".

And if real, did St. Patrick drive them out or destroy them? No. By the dark ages, dragons had long since gave up the charade they were gods, and were only infrenquently seen, much like lake monster accounts everywhere. If a dragon had been killed, its remains woulud have been preserved as treasured artifiacts, exactly like the fake remains and fossils thought to be dragon remains.

Of course there were dragon legends in Ireland before St. Patrick, and some prove St. Patrick is a nonsense, because of dragon/lake monster sighting have occured for centuries AFTER St. Patrick supposedly drove the out. If there had been ANY real interaction between St. Patrick and Dragons it would probably have been non-combatitive since even the Catholic Chruch of St. Patrick's time acknowledged that dragons were seraphim, the highest of all heavenly creatures.

I am getting sick of this DC. The text in bold is nothing but bitter ramblings.

I believe dragons should beh headed under the mythology heading, yes. But many believe them as cryptids and by defonition they are so this (i think) is an adequate place to put them.

I also asked a well mannered genuine question with a subject i am currently struggling with. I thought with the combination of intelligent minds that use these forums someone might be able to help me in my own debate.

yes i asked about the mythology surrounding dragons. And i expect someone to reply, at least somewhere on the same vain.

Please do NOT ruin my thread DC. It served no purpose.

Anyone else? Do you have an opinion on my original post? Please?

[draconic chronicler 15]

I never said it wasn't a crypitc topic. You, once again, are trying to turn it into an argument on the existance of dragons. That is not the topic. Stick to the topic.

If it does not relate to thier existence as a cryptic animal then "dragons in Ireland" has nothing to do with cryptozoology. Why don't you understand that?

[Dariune99 0]

If it does not relate to thier existence as a cryptic animal then "dragons in Ireland" has nothing to do with cryptozoology. Why don't you understand that?

Therefore the mods will move it if that is the case. What gives you the right to destroy the thread and its meaning just because it might be placed in the wrong place. Infact, who the hell are you to decide whether it is the wrong place? You are NOT a mod!!!!

[The One Who Is 5]

If it does not relate to thier existence as a cryptic animal then "dragons in Ireland" has nothing to do with cryptozoology. Why don't you understand that?

Out of curiosity, how long before you notice that the second part of this forum's name is "Myths and Legends"?

Besides, the topic fits nicely here whether or not Dariune66 personally believes in dragons.

[1.618 4]

Dragons were extremely important in Irish mythology, however most of the legends were affected by the arrival of Chritianity. Irish dragons were almost universally portrayed as evil satanic beasts and it is difficult to get to the original stories.

When Saint Patrick reached Ireland, he began by ridding the country of snakes then went on to imprisoning the serpents and dragons.

One of the last dragons in Ireland was Paiste (Lig-na-Baste), a fire-breathing serpent from the beginning of time. He was still around when St Patrick died and was eventually subdued by the trickery of Saint Murrough. He still lives in the waters of Lough Foyle. From

http://www.dragonorama.com/western/celtic.html

More links...

http://www.fantasy-ireland.com/Celtic-dragons.html

http://www.blackdrago.com/famous_irish.htm .....this has some good stuff

[Dariune99 0]

Dragons were extremely important in Irish mythology, however most of the legends were affected by the arrival of Chritianity. Irish dragons were almost universally portrayed as evil satanic beasts and it is difficult to get to the original stories.

When Saint Patrick reached Ireland, he began by ridding the country of snakes then went on to imprisoning the serpents and dragons.

One of the last dragons in Ireland was Paiste (Lig-na-Baste), a fire-breathing serpent from the beginning of time. He was still around when St Patrick died and was eventually subdued by the trickery of Saint Murrough. He still lives in the waters of Lough Foyle. From

http://www.dragonorama.com/western/celtic.html

More links...

http://www.fantasy-ireland.com/Celtic-dragons.html

http://www.blackdrago.com/famous_irish.htm .....this has some good stuff

mr nobody (i dont like calling you that ) i apreciate your answer. I am aware of two of those websites but i had missed the last. thats great stuff, many many thanks.

Paiste seems very similar to Ollipeist who was also supposedly the last dragon.

[Mattshark 57]

you seem to forget this forum is dedicated to Crytozoology, so all of the threads should be related to cryptic animals. This is the topic of these forums.

Actually it is "Cryptozoology, MYTHS AND LEGENDS" So Legends are a perfectly acceptable topic on this forum. Being such an esteemed writer I would have thought you would have noticed that.

Edited April 18, 2008 by Mattshark

[1.618 4]

Some more... http://www.theserenedragon.net/Tales/England.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/dinosaurs/j-dragon6.html

http://www.habitas.org.uk/larne/seadragon.html

[Dariune99 0]

Some more... http://www.theserenedragon.net/Tales/England.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/dinosaurs/j-dragon6.html

http://www.habitas.org.uk/larne/seadragon.html

Wow how did you find those last two sites? Im genuinly impressed considering you have only been looking for a few minutes. Thanks very much mate

Im going to go through those with a fine tooth comb and then post here in a moment. (or a few)

[Saru 9,424]

you seem to forget this forum is dedicated to Crytozoology, so all of the threads should be related to cryptic animals. This is the topic of these forums.

This thread is perfectly suited to the crytozoology board, please don't derail the topic.

Thank you.

[1.618 4]

You must 'see' when you are looking:P hehehe

[Dragon Seeker 0]

I never said it wasn't a crypitc topic. You, once again, are trying to turn it into an argument on the existance of dragons. That is not the topic. Stick to the topic.

He's right DC, this is a cryptic topic, but this is dealing with the myths and legends around ireland about the dragons of ireland

I am getting sick of this DC. The text in bold is nothing but bitter ramblings.

I believe dragons should beh headed under the mythology heading, yes. But many believe them as cryptids and by defonition they are so this (i think) is an adequate place to put them.

I also asked a well mannered genuine question with a subject i am currently struggling with. I thought with the combination of intelligent minds that use these forums someone might be able to help me in my own debate.

yes i asked about the mythology surrounding dragons. And i expect someone to reply, at least somewhere on the same vain.

Please do NOT ruin my thread DC. It served no purpose.

Anyone else? Do you have an opinion on my original post? Please?

Well i do, its very interesting and i'd really like to know a bit more about this, why? mostly because its a favor to my sister who is moving to ireland after she graduates

This thread is perfectly suited to the crytozoology board, please don't derail the topic.

Thank you.

Agreed

And on a final note thanks to Mr. Nobody for the sites they look interesting, and when i have more time i'll check them out.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast 8]

If it does not relate to thier existence as a cryptic animal then "dragons in Ireland" has nothing to do with cryptozoology. Why don't you understand that?

Why don't you understand that this topic is under cryptozoology, MYTHS, AND LEGENDS!!! He is perfectly well in the right category. Is that so hard to understand??

[667-Neighbor of the Beast 8]

Some more... http://www.theserenedragon.net/Tales/England.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/dinosaurs/j-dragon6.html

http://www.habitas.org.uk/larne/seadragon.html

Great findings!! Thanks for the info.

[JoeyBombs 0]

I saw a dragon yesterday

But it wasn't in ireland it was Wales

It was red and flapping at the top of a pole

pretty scary

[Saru 9,424]

Why don't you understand that this topic is under cryptozoology, MYTHS, AND LEGENDS!!! He is perfectly well in the right category. Is that so hard to understand??

I've already made a post about this, lets keep the thread on topic please.

[Dariune99 0]

I saw a dragon yesterday

But it wasn't in ireland it was Wales

It was red and flapping at the top of a pole

pretty scary

Ahhh Y Ddraig Goch, my personal favorate legend.

mr nobody the sites were great, i now have enough information to buy a few books on the subject which i will be ordering later on tonight. Armed with those i should have enough info to satiate my mind on the Irish legends. I really apreciate that.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast 8]

I've already made a post about this, lets keep the thread on topic please.

Check. I responded before reading further.

[Dragon Seeker 0]

Ahhh Y Ddraig Goch, my personal favorate legend.

mr nobody the sites were great, i now have enough information to buy a few books on the subject which i will be ordering later on tonight. Armed with those i should have enough info to satiate my mind on the Irish legends. I really apreciate that.

So what is that legend? it sounds interesting allready

Edited April 18, 2008 by Dragon Seeker

[WiCkEdWENDIGO 1]

yeah i want to know more about it