You can't legislate beauty

[Mademoiselle]

http://www.nationalpost.com/opinion/story.html?id=456103

"I had dinner last weekend with a model. She was clearly engineered for the part: Tall, dark, straight hair, bangs cut to just above her eyelids, all-black outfit, looked a few years older than her actual age (a plus career-wise, considering how young she actually is). And she was skinny. Not rail, unhealthy, two tic-tacsa-day-dieting gaunt, but still far, far thinner than the average early-20-something female.

Yet, she seemed totally healthy. Or at least she was eating like a normal person -- some BBQ chicken, a beer and a slice of cake for dessert.

I relate this story not to hint at my utter coolness (though how many of you can say you've dined with a model, huh?). There is a loftier point here -- which is that French lawmakers are a bunch of boneheads.

On Tuesday, France's lower house of parliament lent its support to a new law that would punish those in the country who encourage "extreme thinness." Under the bill, fashion magazine publishers and fashion designers can be fined $70,000 and receive as much as three years in jail if they are deemed to be promoting images of "extreme thinness."

What is "extreme thinness"? The French law doesn't specify it but let's imagine for a moment that it applied the standards of a similar Spanish rule from 2007, banning models whose body mass index (BMI) was below 18, from strutting down the catwalk at fashion shows. Based on those calculations, I could easily be deemed too sickly for public consumption, according to French lawmakers. My BMI ratio is 20 -- and I'm not in shape; If I committed to tightening up, I could easily be under 18. I would probably be healthier, but banned from the runway nonetheless.

That's ridiculous, and just goes to show how limited a measure BMI is. The test is too simplistic to really tell us anything about personal health because it makes no distinction between different kinds of mass -- for example, fat and muscle count equally as weight in BMI. Besides, thinness is just as often a symptom of illness (i.e. people with cancer or anorexia will often lose weight) as it is the cause of illness.

But the math isn't the point here. Legislating beauty is.

Beauty -- or the concept of what and who each of us deems to be beautiful -- is one of the last remaining strongholds of individual judgment. Marketers, economists and doctors are constantly telling us what clothes we should wear, where to invest our funds and how to stay healthy. But beauty remains the province of poets and romantic daydreamers."

[LadyHay]

http://www.nationalpost.com/opinion/story.html?id=456103

"I had dinner last weekend with a model. She was clearly engineered for the part: Tall, dark, straight hair, bangs cut to just above her eyelids, all-black outfit, looked a few years older than her actual age (a plus career-wise, considering how young she actually is). And she was skinny. Not rail, unhealthy, two tic-tacsa-day-dieting gaunt, but still far, far thinner than the average early-20-something female.

Yet, she seemed totally healthy. Or at least she was eating like a normal person -- some BBQ chicken, a beer and a slice of cake for dessert.

I relate this story not to hint at my utter coolness (though how many of you can say you've dined with a model, huh?). There is a loftier point here -- which is that French lawmakers are a bunch of boneheads.

On Tuesday, France's lower house of parliament lent its support to a new law that would punish those in the country who encourage "extreme thinness." Under the bill, fashion magazine publishers and fashion designers can be fined $70,000 and receive as much as three years in jail if they are deemed to be promoting images of "extreme thinness."

What is "extreme thinness"? The French law doesn't specify it but let's imagine for a moment that it applied the standards of a similar Spanish rule from 2007, banning models whose body mass index (BMI) was below 18, from strutting down the catwalk at fashion shows. Based on those calculations, I could easily be deemed too sickly for public consumption, according to French lawmakers. My BMI ratio is 20 -- and I'm not in shape; If I committed to tightening up, I could easily be under 18. I would probably be healthier, but banned from the runway nonetheless.

That's ridiculous, and just goes to show how limited a measure BMI is. The test is too simplistic to really tell us anything about personal health because it makes no distinction between different kinds of mass -- for example, fat and muscle count equally as weight in BMI. Besides, thinness is just as often a symptom of illness (i.e. people with cancer or anorexia will often lose weight) as it is the cause of illness.

But the math isn't the point here. Legislating beauty is.

Beauty -- or the concept of what and who each of us deems to be beautiful -- is one of the last remaining strongholds of individual judgment. Marketers, economists and doctors are constantly telling us what clothes we should wear, where to invest our funds and how to stay healthy. But beauty remains the province of poets and romantic daydreamers."

But the average person with a low BMI is not necessarily promoting "images of extreme thinness" or working for one as a model in order to promote extreme thinness. Not personal BMI, but those in the industry who promote it as the proper body image.

It is claimed that the reasons for using models is because the body of a model (the bone thin kind) makes the clothing look best. So the powers that be are actually going for a particular kind of body. If just anyone or people of all shapes and sizes and all body types could be models, we wouldn't have this issue at all.

Edited April 20, 2008 by LadyHay

[Lotus Flower]

I am glad that the French are taking this stand. Hopefully other countries will follow suit!

Too many models, starving themselves in the name of fashion.

A size 0, for the vast majority of females is unhealthy, ribs showing, their intake of nutrients being virtually zero - hence the size 0.

The vanity and pompousness of designers make me feel sick, some of the watwalk models look virually anorexic - not good.

However, if somebody is naturally thin, they will not look starved, they will not look as if they have just left some sort of concentration camp. There is a difference!

Too much emphasis placed on weight, not enough on toned bodies.

I have seen a would-be model rejected because size 36 inch hips were deemed "too big". They were advised to lose two inches - what crock of pooh! 34 inch hip is not in the possibility of the vast majority of females, maily because if they did so, they could end up looking like either, a bloke in drag or a concentration camp victim.

Things need to change, chancing that some would-be models could end up with anorexia or bulimia in the name of fashion is surely the most vainest and most self-centred way to go.

Anorexia kills, if it doesn't, it can cause life-long complications including infertility, heart, liver and kidney problems. Teeth and hair loss are virtually certain and are the least of the worries of an anorexic.

[kenshinx]

yay !

i hate skinny chick !

[InHuman]

yay !

i hate skinny chick !

*raises hand*

hrmrmmr... I would like to second that motion...

EAT RIBS, DON'T SHOW THEM!

[Mademoiselle]

I am glad that the French are taking this stand. Hopefully other countries will follow suit!

Too many models, starving themselves in the name of fashion.

A size 0, for the vast majority of females is unhealthy, ribs showing, their intake of nutrients being virtually zero - hence the size 0.

The vanity and pompousness of designers make me feel sick, some of the watwalk models look virually anorexic - not good.

However, if somebody is naturally thin, they will not look starved, they will not look as if they have just left some sort of concentration camp. There is a difference!

Too much emphasis placed on weight, not enough on toned bodies.

I have seen a would-be model rejected because size 36 inch hips were deemed "too big". They were advised to lose two inches - what crock of pooh! 34 inch hip is not in the possibility of the vast majority of females, maily because if they did so, they could end up looking like either, a bloke in drag or a concentration camp victim.

Things need to change, chancing that some would-be models could end up with anorexia or bulimia in the name of fashion is surely the most vainest and most self-centred way to go.

Anorexia kills, if it doesn't, it can cause life-long complications including infertility, heart, liver and kidney problems. Teeth and hair loss are virtually certain and are the least of the worries of an anorexic.

I totally aree with you Lotus .. hoping other countries will follow France in this .

[Bunny Munro]

I agre very much with what the author has said, if someone wants to be extremely thin they should be able to.

[LadyHay]

I agre very much with what the author has said, if someone wants to be extremely thin they should be able to.

No one is disputing people's right to be extremely thin. I don't think the author of that article gets that either.

What is at hand and the reason for the new France bill is that thinness is not to be promoted. You can be thin. No one is arguing that, but you cannot promote thinness. Like in Canadian laws, you cannot have cigarette ads. Not as big a deal, I think.

[Rosewin]

I think the law is foolish. The media shows all kinds of images that are not realistic that induce people to act in foolish ways. We cannot legislate everything. Sometimes parents have to do their jobs and instill a certain sense of appropriateness and if they fail that is their fault. In this case it would seem because a few lack self confidence and want to starve that we need laws? There are many naturally thin people and they are very beautiful. If the model industry select these, and by chance some who have to starve to achieve the same image, we cannot blame the industry but the individual. Self responsibility. Many writers are at risk of alcoholism and other addictions. Should we not allow publishers to publish them?

[Bunny Munro]

No one is disputing people's right to be extremely thin. I don't think the author of that article gets that either.

What is at hand and the reason for the new France bill is that thinness is not to be promoted. You can be thin. No one is arguing that, but you cannot promote thinness. Like in Canadian laws, you cannot have cigarette ads. Not as big a deal, I think.

well...you are right, haha.

Although i can't help but feel that this may be a way of applying indirect pressure onto modeling agencies and such to change their standards.

[Mademoiselle]

well...you are right, haha.

Although i can't help but feel that this may be a way of applying indirect pressure onto modeling agencies and such to change their standards.

maybe they should , indeed .

[Mr Honeybadger]

Personally, I don't like seeing governments getting involved in issues such as this one. Society in general usually takes care of things like this without govenment interference. Anti-thinness groups could easily change popular opinion through things like : ad-campaigns, commercials, and wellness programs.

[swtp]

Personally, I don't like seeing governments getting involved in issues such as this one. Society in general usually takes care of things like this without govenment interference. Anti-thinness groups could easily change popular opinion through things like : ad-campaigns, commercials, and wellness programs.

I agree that society needs to set a healthier standard, and quit letting government try to force the issues! And there are some good ad campaigns out there, but this will take some time since we've all been thinking skiiiiiny for too long! But whatever people do to the extreme wether getting too fat or skinny isn't the exsample i'd like the younger generation to grow up with. Just live life in moderation, be healthy for your individual body type! Some will be slimmer, others heavier, but healthy is the key for everyone!

[wolfknight]

*raises hand*

hrmrmmr... I would like to second that motion...

EAT RIBS, DON'T SHOW THEM!

I agree skinny is a turn off

[Bella-Angelique]

What is at hand and the reason for the new France bill is that thinness is not to be promoted. You can be thin. No one is arguing that, but you cannot promote thinness. Like in Canadian laws, you cannot have cigarette ads.

Most excellent comparison.

Sound logic, TY.

[LadyHay]

Most excellent comparison.

Sound logic, TY.

thanks!

[Sthenno]

Hmm... I'm in two minds about this.

It's fair enough to say you shouldn't 'promote thinness', but what should you promote instead? An 'average' BMI isn't healthy for everyone... my BMI is 18, but I'm not by any stretch of the imagination 'super skinny'... if I put on more weight, I would be overweight.

I think the problem here is that BMI isn't a fair indicator of how healthy/unhealthy a person is.

[LadyHay]

Hmm... I'm in two minds about this.

It's fair enough to say you shouldn't 'promote thinness', but what should you promote instead? An 'average' BMI isn't healthy for everyone... my BMI is 18, but I'm not by any stretch of the imagination 'super skinny'... if I put on more weight, I would be overweight.

I think the problem here is that BMI isn't a fair indicator of how healthy/unhealthy a person is.

No, but this is what people aren't grasping. Its not that France is saying people can't be skinny. They are saying that its wrong (and now illegal) to use skinny models as they are sending the wrong message that skinny is ALWAYS good.

I think perhaps, that in a perfect world, we could use an assortment of sizes (and shapes) of models. That would appease everyone.

I used to hate shopping at "plus" size shops because I was actually perfectly average. Just that the Gap and Benetton did not carry my size. Now savvy stores like Old Navy carry ALL sizes, as this is how people's sizes come.

[Sthenno]

No, but this is what people aren't grasping. Its not that France is saying people can't be skinny. They are saying that its wrong (and now illegal) to use skinny models as they are sending the wrong message that skinny is ALWAYS good.

I think perhaps, that in a perfect world, we could use an assortment of sizes (and shapes) of models. That would appease everyone.

I used to hate shopping at "plus" size shops because I was actually perfectly average. Just that the Gap and Benetton did not carry my size. Now savvy stores like Old Navy carry ALL sizes, as this is how people's sizes come.

I don't think I agree. The fashion industry uses thin models because 'couture' clothes look better on people of a thin frame. I don't understand how that is implying skinny is 'always good'. Doesn't the blame lie more with celebrities and magazines who constantly yabber on about weight and diet tips? Surely young girls look more to these then they do to models on a catwalk?

[nativechick1989]

*raises hand*

hrmrmmr... I would like to second that motion...

EAT RIBS, DON'T SHOW THEM!

Yep.....showing ribs or the backbone....*shivers*

[Mademoiselle]

quote :

"'couture' clothes look better on people of a thin frame"

This is not true .

[tigger]

yay !

i hate skinny chick !

*raises hand*

hrmrmmr... I would like to second that motion...

EAT RIBS, DON'T SHOW THEM!

I agree skinny is a turn off

thats all quite flamatory.. im a "skinny chick" and i cant help it.. its as much of an insult to be called skinny as it is to someone called fat. i eat, i dont exercise much but find it hard to keep weight on.. and no. i am not lucky..

incidently, some models do look like walking skeletons, and in australia they arent letting undersized models on catwalks or underaged models.

[Mademoiselle]

thats all quite flamatory.. im a "skinny chick" and i cant help it.. its as much of an insult to be called skinny as it is to someone called fat. i eat, i dont exercise much but find it hard to keep weight on.. and no. i am not lucky..

incidently, some models do look like walking skeletons, and in australia they arent letting undersized models on catwalks or underaged models.

australia rocks!