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Why people are skeptical of psychic claims

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
In spite of years of research by Drs. Joseph and Margarite Rhine at Duke University, the program investigating psychic powers was dropped and never re-instated. The University of Virginia has an on-going project under Dr. Ian Stevenson investigting reincarnation but few, if any, universities consider psychic "powers" a topic that can be scientifically validated.

hell comeover or look up loyola U

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Moonie2012
hell comeover or look up loyola U

A Jesuit Catholic university, teaching mysticism. Something doesn't sound right about that.

Edited by Moonie2012

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Nucular
In spite of years of research by Drs. Joseph and Margarite Rhine at Duke University, the program investigating psychic powers was dropped and never re-instated. The University of Virginia has an on-going project under Dr. Ian Stevenson investigting reincarnation but few, if any, universities consider psychic "powers" a topic that can be scientifically validated.

The investigation of psychic powers can indeed be conducted in a scientific fashion (that's the point of the sceptics on here I guess). Personally I think it's rather a shame that more investigation isn't conducted by universities (although someone should sit down and have a long talk about methodology with many of those who are). In my country (UK) there are a few centres with active programmes of research into these areas - for instance, the University of Northampton and Goldsmith's College.

What I was trying to find out from Weregirl was why she considers psychic powers themselves to be 'science', as she put it (I assume her to mean 'scientific fact' or something similar).

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
hell comeover or look up loyola U

lol i dont agree its real or not infact this class is mostly based on its not but the thing is i know it is but to many people make a sham of it here look ais man is a great writer http://www.cfpf.org.uk/articles/background...pf_rational.pdf

it explaines all the so called psychic phemomion (cant spell right now) but my prof theory is every one has a part of the brain where you can see a parallel world may it be the world of the dead or not idk nor do i care. but i find it interesting that it is a science

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
lol i dont agree its real or not infact this class is mostly based on its not but the thing is i know it is but to many people make a sham of it here look ais man is a great writer http://www.cfpf.org.uk/articles/background...pf_rational.pdf

it explaines all the so called psychic phemomion (cant spell right now) but my prof theory is every one has a part of the brain where you can see a parallel world may it be the world of the dead or not idk nor do i care. but i find it interesting that it is a science

its not a fact its all a theory everything is a theory because there will always be people out to dis prove things. it can be this...religon..even this world itself

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Moonie2012

Off topic, but how can you attend college, yet have such horrible grammar and spelling?

Edited by Moonie2012

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Dr. D
hell comeover or look up loyola U

Loyola in Chicago or New Orleans?

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
Off topic, but how can you attend college, yet have such horrible grammar and spelling?

I'm in class writing notes and having a debate plaese understand.

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
Loyola in Chicago or New Orleans?

chicago Lake Shore campus

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WiCkEdWENDIGO

i graduate on friday ^_^

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Nucular
lol i dont agree its real or not infact this class is mostly based on its not but the thing is i know it is but to many people make a sham of it here look ais man is a great writer http://www.cfpf.org.uk/articles/background...pf_rational.pdf

it explaines all the so called psychic phemomion (cant spell right now) but my prof theory is every one has a part of the brain where you can see a parallel world may it be the world of the dead or not idk nor do i care. but i find it interesting that it is a science

The definition of science isn't 'something that comes out of a professor's mouth'. I don't know what your professor basing his, erm, eccentric 'theory' on.

Thanks for the interesting link. Roll is a well-known investigator of NDEs, and his stuff (whilst being highly criticisable for the way it is conducted) has contributed to the study of the field. This doesn't make his findings right, nor does it make them 'science fact'.

Don't mistake the scientific use of the term 'theory' to mean that everything is on the same level of acceptance. The term has a special usage in science, and things can be both theory and fact, or entirely unevidenced theory.

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
Don't mistake the scientific use of the term 'theory' to mean that everything is on the same level of acceptance. The term has a special usage in science, and things can be both theory and fact, or entirely unevidenced theory.

on that i do agree

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Nucular
i graduate on friday ^_^

Congratulations :) What's your major?

Weregirl, these debates, like this one, so often descend (or start out!) in that 'believer versus sceptic' dichotomy... if you're at a decent university studying these sorts of topics, take the opportunity to go beyond all of that; don't uncritically believe, and don't dismiss anything without looking at it properly. Surely that's the way to go? Doing courses like that one are the best chance you'll ever get to try sorting the wheat from the chaff.

Edited to add: I didn't mean that quite as patronisingly as it came across ;) I stand by the sentiment though.

Edited by Nucular

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WiCkEdWENDIGO
Congratulations :) What's your major?

Weregirl, these debates, like this one, so often descend (or start out!) in that 'believer versus sceptic' dichotomy... if you're at a decent university studying these sorts of topics, take the opportunity to go beyond all of that; don't uncritically believe, and don't dismiss anything without looking at it properly. Surely that's the way to go? Doing courses like that one are the best chance you'll ever get to try sorting the wheat from the chaff.

my major is Psychology ^_^

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DfizzleShizzle
Oh, Heartagram, I think even you realised how wrong that was while you typed it didn't you?

Replication as part of the scientific method is about the consistent repeatability of results, not keeping on having a crack at something until you get the result you're looking for. :rolleyes:

I never said that...But the few skepptics who have tried it on here recetly, have done it once...Got some results, but havent tried it again...

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Drayno

I believe that one should attempt to have an understanding from both perspectives. To believe in the paranormal, but find the science behind it. We cannot explain everything, both sides shouldn't detest the others opinions either. Sometimes people with self-proclaimed abilities disrespect a skeptical opinion, but also, skeptics do as well.

Someone will have to prove it one day, but until someone can actually prove it and have numerous witnesses, people should not parade and claim they do have them. Why want the attention if you TRULY have them. And I do mean, in all honesty, have "powers". It is not necessary, and you will only get judged and labeled a fraud by many. I myself am a believer in the supernatural, but it does not hurt to have a bit of skepticism - to get a basic concept from both sides of the track, and to have the ability to explain what your "powers" are and not just to say you have them. Despite what you say, what you state, and what examples you back it up with, you cannot ever prove you absolutely have them.

The human brain itself, is an extraordinary thing. What people with "powers" do see, feel, touch, hear...it may be images created by the brain due to a specific problem, mentally. But that does not mean that automatically everything you see, or touch, hear, that is not normal, does not exist. The world is wonderful , vast, so there are many unexplainable things. So it would not surprise me that many things people claim to see, etc, are real. We will find out eventually, but until then I suppose the endless cycle of believers telling their stories and skeptics trying to disprove them will not stop.

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Moonie2012
I never said that...But the few skepptics who have tried it on here recetly, have done it once...Got some results, but havent tried it again...

Yeah, I got some results - static cling, air currents, and the heat from my hands messing it up. Perhaps this is what you are seeing when you claim to have powers.

When I cut these false factors out and did a real, controlled experiment, there was nothing to be found.

Where is YOUR proof?

Edited by Moonie2012

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Papaver
Why do you refuse to understand about proof and who needs to provide it? It's been laid out pretty well in the last few posts.

IT IS UP TO THE CLAIMANT TO PROVIDE PROOF - NOT THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T BELIEVE IT.

I'm afraid you are totally wasting your time with Heartagram, just like I did. He's a fantasist and full of nothing but excuse after excuse and a great disappointment.

I worked with him and gave him some very reasonable tests to perform, test he agreed to do I may add. Then he backed out and started with the excuses again. He cannot do what he claims to do and I'm just letting you know that whilst it is temporarily interesting to debate and work with him it ultimately leads to disappointment. The reason he did not do the test was for the simple reason that he has no supernatural ability.

Heart's greatest ability is that of self delusion. He is also fond of excuses.

One redemption for him is his age and that he's got time to grow out of this fantasy.

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Moonie2012
I'm afraid you are totally wasting your time with Heartagram, just like I did. He's a fantasist and full of nothing but excuse after excuse and a great disappointment.

I worked with him and gave him some very reasonable tests to perform, test he agreed to do I may add. Then he backed out and started with the excuses again. He cannot do what he claims to do and I'm just letting you know that whilst it is temporarily interesting to debate and work with him it ultimately leads to disappointment. The reason he did not do the test was for the simple reason that he has no supernatural ability.

Heart's greatest ability is that of self delusion. He is also fond of excuses.

One redemption for him is his age and that he's got time to grow out of this fantasy.

I'm realizing this, but I'll be damned if I'm not interested in hearing his next excuse/comment as to why he doesn't need to provide proof - they're just so WACKY.

It's like if logic could barf - it would barf up these excuses.

Edited by Moonie2012

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drakonwick
I never said that...But the few skepptics who have tried it on here recetly, have done it once...Got some results, but havent tried it again...

You are wrong, yet again. I practiced these supposed abilities almost everyday for about four years

when I was young, I believed in it so much that I was sure something would become of it. But, alas,

NOTHING ever did. So, I eventually let it go, and grew out of it.

Recently, I practiced with the psiball for about two weeks; I also done the same for the pin/psiwheel.

But, again, NOTHING became of it that could not be explained.

You are talking about Psi-shields Heart...

Psi-Shields:

Gather psi to yourself, like making a psi ball. Imagine the psi coming out of your head as water comes out of a fountain.

Visualize the psi coming down your physical body, and as it touches your skin, it solidifies. Put several layers on top of the first one. You have just made your first shield.

Bubble Shield:

Gather the psi again, but this time, form it around yourself.

Visualize it forming around you like an egg shell. Like a Psi ball, you must program it. You must program it to not dissipate until you dispel it yourself, and program it to hold back what you want to hold back (this shield cannot hold back physical objects).

Marshmallow Shield:

Make a bubble shield, but this time, instead of visualizing an egg shell, visualize layers of melted marshmallows (make sure they stick together)

Put several bubble shields on the outside and inside to keep the layers from falling apart.

Program the shield to absorb and hold all incoming attacks.

Cloaking Shield:

Start out by making a bubble shield.

Program it to make your energy invisible.

When you're ready to get rid of your shield (this goes for any of these) simply visualize it disintegrating into particles and floating away.

Turtle Shell Shield:

Start by making a marshmallow shield, but program it to let you mold it into a turtle shell, big enough for you to hide in.

Mirror Shield:

This is a simple, but effective shield. Imagine your psi forming into a bubble around you, but instead of a bubble shield, imagine it turn into a mirror in front of you. This is a very good shield.

Sorry Heart! I find this Psi-Shield stuff to be nothing more than new age anime. That is nothing

more than fantastical nonsense when it is trying to be applied to reality.

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John from Lowell
I'm realizing this, but I'll be damned if I'm not interested in hearing his next excuse/comment as to why he doesn't need to provide proof - they're just so WACKY.

It's like if logic could barf - it would barf up these excuses.

Who was it that said, "There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of by the minds of men"?

I can only imagine what that comment was in reguard to.

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bee

We don't yet know the full power of our own brain.....and I think a lot of it has to do with

the willingness to believe......or at least open the door for belief and let nature take it's course....one

way or the other.

In a book I have about Remote Viewing....by Tim Rifat.....he talks about the 'Paranormal Damping Field'

" A creation of the entire human population's Psi-fields which is used to suppress all paranormal

abilities, to make agreed upon things and events real, while strongly exorcising events and phenomena

that do not agree with the common consensus."

Part of the training for remote viewing, he says, is to step outside, to overcome, the Paranormal Damping

Field.

Imagine......if enough people opened themselves up to belief.....it could be like the 'hundredth monkey' syndrome. :yes:

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Drayno

Heart may be lying, but he may also be telling the truth. You have to open your eyes to the reasons other than the lack of an ability. Falsely assuming that he backed out due to the possibility that he does not have any "powers" seems to be somewhat arrogant. Do not get me wrong, he still may not, but then again , he may. I am not saying he does have abilities, nor that he does not, but keep in mind some people tell the truth.

You may also hold the concept of people moving things with their mind, objects, people - in the stereotypical fashion spread by media. That is merely an exaggerated version of the possible powers people have. You stated his age could compensate for the "delusional belief" in so-called "powers". Well, he is older than me? Well have you ever considered that majority of people in our age group do not like being judged and are tired of being put down? Not to mention that if he recently discovered them, he would have somewhat a hard time attempting to maintain control over them?

I am not making excuses for him, but open your eyes to every possibility.

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bee
Well have you ever considered that majority of people in our age group do not like being judged and are tired of being put down? Not to mention that if he recently discovered them, he would have somewhat a hard time attempting to maintain control over them?

Well said!!!

I'm not a young person...but I think that older people CAN learn from

younger people.....and not just the other way round. Older people can sometimes

get stuck in their ways.....and have trouble changing their established belief-system.

I am not making excuses for him, but open your eyes to every possibility.

Amen, to that........ :tu:

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bee
Who was it that said, "There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of by the minds of men"?

I can only imagine what that comment was in reguard to.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in

your philosophy."

Hamlet....to Horatio.....in Shakespeare's 'Hamlet'.......... :tu:

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