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S2F

Young Earth theory

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S2F

Young Earth Creationists say the world was created anywhere from 6,000 to 10,000 years ago. They also say that radiocarbon dating methods are wrong and inconclusive. They make no reasonable explanation for dinosaurs as well, claiming that dinosaurs and man co-existed. I'm just wondering what other peoples thoughts are on this, and anyone that believes or supports this theory, please stop by and explain it.

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Belle.

Lol how could man and dinosaur co-exist - paleontologists aren't finding humans buried in the same geological layers as dinosaurs!

Purely my take is that some people would like to think that the answer to every question is contained within the Bible. It gives them a security that within the Bible is an accurate descriptor of what was, what is and what is to come.

Live can be messy and confusing and full of unknowns - but if within the Bible is everything you ever need, well it is just that much easier :) See all the drama with ‘interpreting’ the Bible? What is literal truth, what is cultural history etc. Well I suppose if you just say everything is true at least you don’t really have that problem. If one part of the Bible isn't the truth......well then what other parts can't you be sure of?

Believing is definitely seeing for this one.

Edited by Belle.

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Kryso
Lol how could man and dinosaur co-exist - paleontologists aren't finding humans buried in the same geological layers as dinosaurs!

But footprints of both humans and dinosaurs, both side by side, are constantly being found!

Human footprints lie alongside thousands of dinosaur prints on a Turkmenian plateau, a Russian newspaper has reported.

Journalist Alexander Bushev reported in the 31 January 1995 edition of Komsomolskaya Pravda (one of the most popular newspapers of the former USSR) that he had journeyed to the plateau near the village of Khodga-Pil in Turkmenistan, and had seen the fossilized prints of dinosaurs and humans together.

www.answersingenesis.org

A series of 14 human footprints with at least 134 dinosaur tracks in the bed of the Paluxy River, near Glen Rose, Texas.

www.bible.ca

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Condescending
But footprints of both humans and dinosaurs, both side by side, are constantly being found!

www.answersingenesis.org

www.bible.ca

LMAO I must have missed them all then.

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Belle.
But footprints of both humans and dinosaurs, both side by side, are constantly being found!

www.answersingenesis.org

www.bible.ca

How embarrassing.......I stand corrected :blush:

(slave2fate....you're not, you're not a sock puppet are you?? Who was that before anyway?) :rofl:

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SQLserver
But footprints of both humans and dinosaurs, both side by side, are constantly being found!

Oooh, I love debunking these!

A series of 14 human footprints with at least 134 dinosaur tracks in the bed of the Paluxy River, near Glen Rose, Texas.

1. The footprints reputed to be of human origin are not. For example:

* Some of the footprints are dinosaur footprints. Processes such as erosion, infilling, and mud collapse obscure the dinosaurian features of some footprints, making them look like giant human footprints, but careful cleaning reveals the three-toed tracks of dinosaurs (Hastings 1987; Kuban 1989).

* Some of the reputed prints are erosional features or other irregularities. They show no clear human features without selective highlighting.

* Some of the prints show evidence of deliberate alteration (Godfrey 1985).

2. The Paluxy tracks are illustrative of creationists' wishful thinking and of their unwillingness to face evidence. Although some creationists have repudiated the Paluxy claim, many others still cling to it (Schadewald 1986).

Links:

Kuban, Glen J. 1996. The Texas dinosaur/"man track" controversy. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/paluxy.html

Matson, Dave E. 1994. How good are those young-earth arguments? http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/howgood-gc.html#G4d

References:

1. Godfrey, L. R., 1985. Foot notes of an anatomist. Creation/Evolution 5(1): 16-36.

2. Hastings, Ronnie J., 1987. New observations on Paluxy Tracks confirm their dinosaurian origin. Journal of Geological Education 35(1): 4-15.

3. Kuban, Glen, 1989. Color distinctions and other curious features of dinosaur tracks near Glen Rose, Texas. In: Gillette and Lockley, 1989 (see below), pp. 427-440. http://paleo.cc/paluxy/color.htm

4. Schadewald, Robert J. 1986. Scientific creationism and error. Creation/Evolution 6(1): 1-9, http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/cre-error.html

Further Reading:

Cole, John R. and Laurie R. Godfrey (eds.). 1985. The Paluxy River footprint mystery -- solved. Creation/Evolution 5(1). (special issue devoted to the topic) http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/...__4_23_2003.asp

Gillette, David D. and Martin G. Lockley (eds.). 1989. Dinosaur Tracks and Traces, Cambridge, UK: Cambridge University Press. (technical)

Hastings, Ronnie J. 1986. Tracking those incredible creationists -- the trail continues. Creation/Evolution 6(1): 20-28. http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/...__4_23_2003.asp

Hastings, Ronnie J. 1988. Rise and fall of the Paluxy mantracks. Perspectives on Science and Christian Faith 40(3): 144-155.

Kuban, Glen J. 1986. A summary of the Taylor site evidence. Creation/Evolution 6(1): 11-19. http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/...__4_23_2003.asp

Schadewald, Robert. 1986. Scientific creationism and error. Creation/Evolution 6(1): 2-10. http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/...__4_23_2003.asp

Straight from TalkOrigins, of course.

Human footprints lie alongside thousands of dinosaur prints on a Turkmenian plateau, a Russian newspaper has reported.

Journalist Alexander Bushev reported in the 31 January 1995 edition of Komsomolskaya Pravda (one of the most popular newspapers of the former USSR) that he had journeyed to the plateau near the village of Khodga-Pil in Turkmenistan, and had seen the fossilized prints of dinosaurs and humans together.

Well, first, lets state the obvious:

From the AiG page itself:

Note: This article is a factual account of a genuine, sober report in the Russian newspaper. However, one needs to be cautious about accepting the prints described on the basis of just this report. None of our sources has been able to obtain any further information on the prints, nor any photograph to this date.

So, AiG NOR I could not find ANY more evidence, research, or anything on this. I believe they got it from an old USSR newspaper. Since then, no more sources or nothin'.

But, lets go on to the next obvious.

I just took a trip out west, to Utah. I went to a remote site in Escalante National Monument(Beautiful place, practically un-touched, tons of geology, archeology, and paleontology) to look at some dinosaur tracks. The first thing I noted, was that little to no excavation had been done on the tracks. They were not buried, just right out on the open on un-touched sandstone. However, some areas around the sandstone were still a clay mud. In this mud, one could see MANY, MANY human footprints, probably preserved for years in the mud. Eventually, that mud will harden and become sandstone. Presto, you have human tracks right next to Dino tracks!(Except, of course, the human tracks will be gortex boot and sneaker tracks...)

So, as you can see, there are MANY viable ways human tracks can appear next to or near dinosaur tracks.

Especially this Russian claim, which was backed by a JOURNALIST(who wants to make money with a crazy claim), then actual paleontologists, and the Journalist could even have been mistake if he was truthful, sounds rather unreliable and most likely not evidence of a 'Young Earth' if you ask me.

Young Earth Creationists say the world was created anywhere from 6,000 to 10,000 years ago. They also say that radiocarbon dating methods are wrong and inconclusive.

RadioCarbon cannot be super-accurately used for stuff older then about 5,700 years, its half life. However, there are TONS of other Radiometric dating methods, and DOZENS of other completely seperate methods that tell us there is no way the Earth is Young.

http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/Evidence_agai...recent_creation

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html

http://www.badastronomy.com/bablog/2008/03...lion-years-old/

http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/age.html

Not to mention YECs have no evidence of their own. Well, rather no actual evidence. There are a lot of debunked lies and frauds.

The world agrees with the Earth being 4.5 Billion years old, and the Universe being 13.7 billion years old.

It is YEC vs the World.

Cheers,

SQLserver

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churchanddestroy

SQLserver, the post about the footprints and answersingenesis was a joke.

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churchanddestroy
Young Earth Creationists say the world was created anywhere from 6,000 to 10,000 years ago. They also say that radiocarbon dating methods are wrong and inconclusive. They make no reasonable explanation for dinosaurs as well, claiming that dinosaurs and man co-existed. I'm just wondering what other peoples thoughts are on this, and anyone that believes or supports this theory, please stop by and explain it.

While I respect the fact that Young Earth Creationism is a matter of faith, it is clearly not compatible with science. Science simply does not support YE Creationism. If it did, believe me, I would not be a deist. If people want to believe in Young Earth Creationism, thats fine for them, but its not for me, and it certainly doesn't belong in our schools. From my perspective, there is nothing wrong with Creationism in the understanding that God (or whatever you believe in) worked with the universe over billions of years to eventually create us. I certainly do not believe this, but I think it is a viable theology. However, Young Earth Creationism I do not support. I support peoples rights to believe it, but I do not support those who preach about it as 'scientific' and the 'truth'. One does not need to justify Christianity by taking the word of the Bible literally. Much of the Bible is poetic in nature, or is derived from much older Mesopotamian sources, and there have been thousands of translations and interpretations. That said, I think the Bible should be used as more of a spiritual guide than as a scientific book or history. But, then again, there are those that disagree.

But would your faith really crumble once you realize that the Earth is not 6000 years old? That evolution happens? That abiogenesis likely happened? I hope not. For some reason or another these things don't bother the Catholic Church, which is the most stubborn religious institution known to man (believe me, I used to be one of them ;) ). So if the Catholic Church can do it, you YECers should be able to too. Because the Catholic Church accepting evolution is the closest thing I've ever seen to a miracle. :P

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SQLserver
SQLserver, the post about the footprints and answersingenesis was a joke.

Darn, I never get in on these things. :rolleyes:

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fullywired

Even fundamentalists in the early 20th century were unperturbed about the demise of biblical chronology. William Bell Riley, one of the fundamentalist movement's founders, declared that there was not "an intelligent fundamentalist who claims that the earth was made six thousand years ago, and the Bible never taught any such thing."

http://www.geocities.com/lclane2/steno.html

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preacherman76
Even fundamentalists in the early 20th century were unperturbed about the demise of biblical chronology. William Bell Riley, one of the fundamentalist movement's founders, declared that there was not "an intelligent fundamentalist who claims that the earth was made six thousand years ago, and the Bible never taught any such thing."

http://www.geocities.com/lclane2/steno.html

I agree that it is very possible that the bible never taught any such thing.

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churchanddestroy
I agree that it is very possible that the bible never taught any such thing.

Its not just very possible, preacherman, it isn't found in the Bible. The 6000 or so years chronology was made by a man named Bishop James Ussher. This Chronology is known as the Ussher Chronology. I'll provide you with some links before continuing :)

YEC Origins

James Ussher

Ussher Chronology

Basically, Ussher came up with this by taking the genealogies found in the Bible and working backwards to determine the age of the Earth. This is a view even the early Jews did not support, by the way. They knew it was metaphorical and poetic, but apparently Ussher did not :)

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Cradle of Fish

Every time I hear of that dinosaur and human tracks thing the theme song to the Flintstones plays in my head. Imagine my suprise when I found out that people actually believe in it.

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churchanddestroy
Darn, I never get in on these things. :rolleyes:

Eh, I was going to take it seriously too, but then I realized what I was doing while I was halfway through posting. Its too early for this...

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Kryso

Here's something interesting!

The Bible clearly states in Genesis 1:1 that the earth has been here since the beginning. Verse 2 tells us that it was formless and void and that water covered the face of the earth. The Bible allows for speculation that the earth had been destroyed by water, as it would later again be destroyed during Noah’s era. The six days of creation beginning in Genesis 1:3 mark the history of the current dispensation of the earth: How God reshaped and reformed it to accommodate His current purposes with man as the jewel of His creation. The earth predates the six days of creation, allowing for the concept of an old earth which could have accommodated any other civilizations, creatures, or events God desired over eons of time. In fact, I would argue, if anything, that, according to the Bible, the earth is older than what scientists claim.

www.authorsden.com

Here's another question. If the bible says that god created all the animals of the land air and sea, then man. Then he must of created all the dinosaurs along with all the rest?

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S2F
(slave2fate....you're not, you're not a sock puppet are you?? Who was that before anyway?) :rofl:

My name is more of a play on words, i'm a slave to a fate that I choose :D

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Cimber

Well for starters, it's not a theory.

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S2F

It seems that the dinosaurs are a problem for YE enthusiasts, i've even read somewhere that some think that Noah put dinos on the ark, only to have them go extinct later. I haven't seen any credible evidence yet for co-existence with dinos, even if radiocarbon dating is not accurate in terms of time, it is still consistent and that consistency shows that dinos and people did not exist together.

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SQLserver
It seems that the dinosaurs are a problem for YE enthusiasts, i've even read somewhere that some think that Noah put dinos on the ark, only to have them go extinct later. I haven't seen any credible evidence yet for co-existence with dinos, even if radiocarbon dating is not accurate in terms of time, it is still consistent and that consistency shows that dinos and people did not exist together.

There's no way Noah's ark and a global flood could have happened in 6,000 years.

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atom286
Young Earth Creationists say the world was created anywhere from 6,000 to 10,000 years ago. They also say that radiocarbon dating methods are wrong and inconclusive. They make no reasonable explanation for dinosaurs as well, claiming that dinosaurs and man co-existed. I'm just wondering what other peoples thoughts are on this, and anyone that believes or supports this theory, please stop by and explain it.

There is another possiblity and that is backward causality. Basically parallel universes if real not only mean all futures co-exist but all pasts do to. IIf they are real it means the past only happens when we gain infomation on it.

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Dragohunter

The Earth is not 6000 to 10000 years old. The first few chapters of Genesis was written as a poem by Moses. Each "day" could have simply been thousands to billions of years. It seems so. The Bible talks about dinosaurs or prehistoric creatures that existed long before man. I doubt 1 or 2 days count as "long before man" you know what I mean?

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churchanddestroy
The Earth is not 6000 to 10000 years old. The first few chapters of Genesis was written as a poem by Moses. Each "day" could have simply been thousands to billions of years. It seems so. The Bible talks about dinosaurs or prehistoric creatures that existed long before man. I doubt 1 or 2 days count as "long before man" you know what I mean?

I'm pretty sure it wasn't Moses who penned Genesis.

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Dragohunter
I'm pretty sure it wasn't Moses who penned Genesis.

...... yes, Moses wrote it.

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churchanddestroy
...... yes, Moses wrote it.

Traditionally, yes, but realistically? No. We know that Genesis had at least four separate authors:

Genesis: Composition

Documentary Hypothesis

Surprise of all surprises, you know where I learned about this: Catholic School.

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Dragohunter

Well my point makes no difference.

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