It's not recession, it's depression

[SoCrazes]

No it doesn't...who ever told you that? A recession and an economic slow down are quite different.

That's right Dan!

The central bank has control of the money supply and thereby can exert some influence on inflationary pressures....but they don't control the economy.

Aztec, the Fed has more controls over the economy than what you've asserted here. Yes, the Fed does control the money supply(M3). The Fed also controls the credit markets through the making of the discount rate, establishing bank rules, and by putting pressures on regulatory agencies. The Fed also indirectly affects the financial markets via the discount rate and its "Open Market Operations".

The Fed does more to control the economy other than through M3. Investors know this and that is why many FRB Chairmen "fedspeak" and investors "fedwatch". The president appoints and conjoles/supports the FRB chairman, approves laws, makes treaties, oversees the military, etc., and therefore is responible for the economy as well.

Aztec, if you don't think one is economically controlled if another controls the amount of money they had, its potential return, as well as the amount of credit they could get, I want to be your next financial planner.

[Dr. D]

So, does that mean other countries would simply allow their economy to be determined by the privately owned Fed Chairman?

Then gives us the list of South and Central American Kings and dictators.

and then tell us what the kings and dictators do to a product that consumers won't buy.

Hmmmm . . . . kings in Central and South America???? What nations, please . . . .

[SoCrazes]

Hmmmm . . . . kings in Central and South America???? What nations, please . . . .

Queen Lativa?

[Aztec Warrior]

Aztec, the Fed has more controls over the economy than what you've asserted here. Yes, the Fed does control the money supply(M3). The Fed also controls the credit markets through the making of the discount rate, establishing bank rules, and by putting pressures on regulatory agencies. The Fed also indirectly affects the financial markets via the discount rate and its "Open Market Operations".

The Fed does more to control the economy other than through M3. Investors know this and that is why many FRB Chairmen "fedspeak" and investors "fedwatch". The president appoints and conjoles/supports the FRB chairman, approves laws, makes treaties, oversees the military, etc., and therefore is responible for the economy as well.

Aztec, if you don't think one is economically controlled if another controls the amount of money they had, its potential return, as well as the amount of credit they could get, I want to be your next financial planner.

SoC, I didn't say that the FED has absolutely no control over the economy. Let's review.

In many cases yes the government has little to no control over their economies, they leave it up to their central banks.

Now here is what I stated.

The central bank has control of the money supply and thereby can exert some influence on inflationary pressures....but they don't control the economy.

Now that we straightened that out...I mostly agree with your description of the Federal Reserve and allow me to be clearer. If a Govt has no macro-economic policy then I would agree they have no control over their economy. But, macro-economics is much more complicated than just the Federal Reserve.

FYI, the Federal Reserve no longer publishes M3 data.

Edited August 1, 2008 by Aztec Warrior

[AROCES]

So you are saying that since the war's in the middle east have not changed the economy of the whole planet by one nation is a myth. Bush changed the world's economy huge. What planet do you live on? There was no need for the Iraqi war period... It was oil my little ill informed friend not wmd's as you so much want it to be about. Bush and his forieghn policies changed the world's economy and will last a lifetime. Get with it. Yes one man did change it. Oh and for you information the Roman's never did control the world.

Oh no, Oil price did not shoot up the way it did the last few months during the first Gulf War(even when Saddam burned the Oil fields) and when we invaded Iraq.

Oil futures due to the expanding economy of China and India is the main reason, in other words, CONSUMPTION. Tell us then how China and India did not get affected by Bush ruining the world's economy?

As you can see, you blaming Bush for it is just a feel good talking point for you and the Bush haters.

[SoCrazes]

SoC, I didn't say that the FED has absolutely no control over the economy. Let's review.

Now here is what I stated.

Now that we straightened that out...I mostly agree with your description of the Federal Reserve and allow me to be clearer. If a Govt has no macro-economic policy then I would agree they have no control over their economy. But, macro-economics is much more complicated than just the Federal Reserve.

FYI, the Federal Reserve no longer publishes M3 data.

Aztec, sorry that I missed construed you asserting <i>"The central bank has control of the money supply and thereby can exert some influence on inflationary pressures....but they don't control the economy."</i> Yes I know they don't publish M3 data no more...just thought it interesting that they don't publish this datum since the surge in inflation in recent times. Kind of reminds me when the U.S. government decided to include the military in the unemployment figures and the attempt to make fast food restuarants part of the manufacturing industry.

Thanks for clearning that up Aztec.

[ninjadude]

Oh no, Oil price did not shoot up the way it did the last few months during the first Gulf War(even when Saddam burned the Oil fields) and when we invaded Iraq.

Oil futures due to the expanding economy of China and India is the main reason, in other words, CONSUMPTION. Tell us then how China and India did not get affected by Bush ruining the world's economy?

As you can see, you blaming Bush for it is just a feel good talking point for you and the Bush haters.

No in the first gulf war we were not invading Iran and threatening to turn the persian gulf into a firestorm. huge difference.

[SoCrazes]

Oh no, Oil price did not shoot up the way it did the last few months during the first Gulf War(even when Saddam burned the Oil fields) and when we invaded Iraq.

Oil futures due to the expanding economy of China and India is the main reason, in other words, CONSUMPTION. Tell us then how China and India did not get affected by Bush ruining the world's economy?

As you can see, you blaming Bush for it is just a feel good talking point for you and the Bush haters.

A typical chinese person lives in slave-like conditions. The wealth there, and in India is going to a very small pct. This is the capitalism the "NWO" is driving for.

[AROCES]

No in the first gulf war we were not invading Iran and threatening to turn the persian gulf into a firestorm. huge difference.

Saddam burned a lot of Oil Fields and Saddams Army was at it's mightiest then, what do you mean huge difference?

We are threatening Iran now? While an actual war did happened before, you telling us a threat causes the price of Oil to go up than an actiual war?????

Do you have a clue at all what you are trying to argue about?

[AROCES]

A typical chinese person lives in slave-like conditions. The wealth there, and in India is going to a very small pct. This is the capitalism the "NWO" is driving for.

Mayber it is still better than before for them, who knows.

[Trixipixi]

Mayber it is still better than before for them, who knows.

ya, theirs nothing wrong with being a NWO slave. as long as it benefits an elite ruling class. It probably is better for them.

[ninjadude]

We are threatening Iran now? While an actual war did happened before, you telling us a threat causes the price of Oil to go up than an actiual war?????

Absolutely. It happened again today. Oil prices went up again on "fears" about a US/Israel/Iran war. The price of oil is driven based on fear not reality. The first Iraq war was done and over in a very short time. Even the oil well fires were extinquished quickly. Little of the supply of oil was choked off. This will not be the case with Iran who very clearly understands that choking off the flow of oil is our jugular vein and has the means to cause problems in the flow.

[ninjadude]

Mayber it is still better than before for them, who knows.

Aroces putting his hands over his eyes and hears. "I know nothing". It is not "better" and we certainly do know.

[Aztec Warrior]

Absolutely. It happened again today. Oil prices went up again on "fears" about a US/Israel/Iran war. The price of oil is driven based on fear not reality. The first Iraq war was done and over in a very short time. Even the oil well fires were extinquished quickly. Little of the supply of oil was choked off. This will not be the case with Iran who very clearly understands that choking off the flow of oil is our jugular vein and has the means to cause problems in the flow.

Not only does the price of oil fluctuate with fear, but also with information. For example, if a large oil field is discovered or when the US inventory shrinks it effects the price. So, you should know that when Bush said he would rescind the EO banning offshore drilling.........the price of oil dropped hedging against future increases in supply.

I tried to explain that to you previously but I guess..................ffftttttt.........over the head.

[SoCrazes]

Not only does the price of oil fluctuate with fear, but also with information. For example, if a large oil field is discovered or when the US inventory shrinks it effects the price. So, you should know that when Bush said he would rescind the EO banning offshore drilling.........the price of oil dropped hedging against future increases in supply.

I tried to explain that to you previously but I guess..................ffftttttt.........over the head.

Perceptions drive the price of everything as well as the conjecture of perceptions and, may I add, the cultivation of perceptions.

[danielost]

ya, theirs nothing wrong with being a NWO slave. as long as it benefits an elite ruling class. It probably is better for them.

If their getting paid a competitive wage, whatever that is in India and China, then it is not slavery.

[AROCES]

ya, theirs nothing wrong with being a NWO slave. as long as it benefits an elite ruling class. It probably is better for them.

So, you telling us they we better off before?

[AROCES]

Absolutely. It happened again today. Oil prices went up again on "fears" about a US/Israel/Iran war. The price of oil is driven based on fear not reality. The first Iraq war was done and over in a very short time. Even the oil well fires were extinquished quickly. Little of the supply of oil was choked off. This will not be the case with Iran who very clearly understands that choking off the flow of oil is our jugular vein and has the means to cause problems in the flow.

Who told you the Oil field fire were extinguished quickly??? It burned for days before they were able to control them. Saddam did excatly what Iran is doing now, threaten the supply of Oil.

If the Demand in China and India have not gone up because of their expanding economy, does not matter if there was an Iran threat. Just like the first gulf war and the second, oil price won't be affected much.

Edited August 3, 2008 by AROCES

[Trixipixi]

So, you telling us they we better off before?

how do you know they werent?

[AROCES]

how do you know they werent?

And how do you know they were?

What we know is the country is more properous now.

[Dr. D]

And how do you know they were?

What we know is the country is more properous now.

Tell the people of Baghdad about this incredible “prosperity.” The same people in urban centers who now face disease and death because they do not have access to sufficient water sources.

Tell the people of southern and central Iraq about their imaginary prosperity as they suffer the most serious humanitarian emergency of the war. UNICEF has stated, “, “this conflict will have more people dying from water treatment plants going down than from war itself.”

This Alice in Wonderland prosperity is unknown to doctors who find that the lack of refrigeration makes their efforts ineffective as UNICEF also reports, “increased demand and consumption of medical supplies and drugs, render the existing stocks inadequate.”

2 million people have been displaced and another 900,000 have sought refuge in neighboring nations. Many of these are unaccompanied minors and landmines and unexploded ordinance has claimed the lives of many.

This prosperity exists only in White House press releases and nowhere else.

[danielost]

Tell the people of Baghdad about this incredible “prosperity.” The same people in urban centers who now face disease and death because they do not have access to sufficient water sources.

Tell the people of southern and central Iraq about their imaginary prosperity as they suffer the most serious humanitarian emergency of the war. UNICEF has stated, “, “this conflict will have more people dying from water treatment plants going down than from war itself.”

This Alice in Wonderland prosperity is unknown to doctors who find that the lack of refrigeration makes their efforts ineffective as UNICEF also reports, “increased demand and consumption of medical supplies and drugs, render the existing stocks inadequate.”

2 million people have been displaced and another 900,000 have sought refuge in neighboring nations. Many of these are unaccompanied minors and landmines and unexploded ordinance has claimed the lives of many.

This prosperity exists only in White House press releases and nowhere else.

Maybe they should have bought freezers instead of big screen tvs with they government checks.

[SoCrazes]

http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/go...hp?q=1216843008

This is Cheney's, Bush's, and Thomas Friedman's NWO? I beleive these guys, and others, are/were trying to make economic/political scam of all history.

[AROCES]

Tell the people of Baghdad about this incredible “prosperity.” The same people in urban centers who now face disease and death because they do not have access to sufficient water sources.

Tell the people of southern and central Iraq about their imaginary prosperity as they suffer the most serious humanitarian emergency of the war. UNICEF has stated, “, “this conflict will have more people dying from water treatment plants going down than from war itself.”

This Alice in Wonderland prosperity is unknown to doctors who find that the lack of refrigeration makes their efforts ineffective as UNICEF also reports, “increased demand and consumption of medical supplies and drugs, render the existing stocks inadequate.”

2 million people have been displaced and another 900,000 have sought refuge in neighboring nations. Many of these are unaccompanied minors and landmines and unexploded ordinance has claimed the lives of many.

This prosperity exists only in White House press releases and nowhere else.

We are not talking about Baghdad here really.

[SoCrazes]

Mayber it is still better than before for them, who knows.

"NWO" motto = "Riches for the few equates to progress for the many."