Money = Freedom (try not to get too upset)

[MasterPo]

Like it or not (and I suspect many of you won't like it), a person with more spendable money has greater Freedom than someone with out.

Money - the hard earned fruits of your own labors - gives you the individual more power and Freedom than any law or government program. With your own money you can make the decisions as to what is best for you and your family then have the means to execute those decisions. You don't have to take what someone else (e.g. government) gives your, or won't give you.

And that's why taxation for the sake of financial redistribution is so morally and ethically wrong.

When the government takes away your hard earned money, perhaps taking years and years to achieve, to the point you can't spend it as you please for your benefit then you have no choice but to take whatever government gives you.

And this is why any politician who sets some arbitrary figure like $250,000 as "rich" is dangerous and any tax plan that is purposely designed to take just because there is more to take is inherently dangerous and the antithesis of Freedom and Liberty.

When you work so hard, take so much risk, and yet can't make your own decisions for yourself and your family then you have lost your Freedom and Liberty.

[BlindMessiah]

If tax increases are un-American, then tax decreases should be pro-American. Ron Paul wants to remove the income tax. So based on your own statements, I'm forced to conclude that Ron Paul is the most pro-American candidate that ran. It's funny because I recall you said you didn't vote for him. If that's the case, then you voted for the more un-American candidates. So I take this as an endorsement of Barack Obama. I never thought you'd switch sides.

[Cradle of Fish]

Technically shouldn't there be no taxation for money to equal freedom?

And people should be allowed to spend it on whatever they want, including prostitutes, drugs and guns?

(Not to mention a marriage license if you're a homosexual.)

Edited October 22, 2008 by Cradle of Fish

[Godsnmbr1]

So you're saying that an income of at least $250,000 doesn't qualify as upper class? I think you might be alone on that one.

Believe it or not but the rich don't work any harder than the poor for their money, they were just born into circumstances where it was easier for them to get it. If someone has worked their way up from the lower class to make over a quarter million a year then I'm sure they still feel pretty damn good about their situation, higher taxes or not.

[Guardsman Bass]

If what you really want is Freedom, Liberty, and Absolute Control of Your Money, you are always capable of going to Somalia. Of course, you might have to pay a little in extortion fees, but hey - that's better than having to "share the wealth" to pay for a police force, am I right?

[BlindMessiah]

Technically shouldn't there be no taxation for money to equal freedom?

And people should be allowed to spend it on whatever they want, including prostitutes, drugs and guns?

(Not to mention a marriage license if you're a homosexual.)

:tu:

[Mr Honeybadger]

If tax increases are un-American, then tax decreases should be pro-American. Ron Paul wants to remove the income tax. So based on your own statements, I'm forced to conclude that Ron Paul is the most pro-American candidate that ran. It's funny because I recall you said you didn't vote for him. If that's the case, then you voted for the more un-American candidates. So I take this as an endorsement of Barack Obama. I never thought you'd switch sides.

I totally agree. Ron Paul was and is the most pro-American candidate. Which is so sad that he didn't get more votes than he did. ( He got mine though. )

[MasterPo]

ZOOOM! (the sund of the point going over everyone's head)

Having some extra money to be able to spend as you please enables you to get what you want, when you want it.

You are not dependent on government or anyone else for what you get.

But taking away that extra money via economic sanctions on hard work and success does make you dependent and that destorys Freedom and Liberty

[Godsnmbr1]

ZOOOM! (the sund of the point going over everyone's head)

Having some extra money to be able to spend as you please enables you to get what you want, when you want it.

You are not dependent on government or anyone else for what you get.

But taking away that extra money via economic sanctions on hard work and success does make you dependent and that destorys Freedom and Liberty

But taking away only a portion of that extra money will greatly help out those less fortunate. Since when has greed become a part of freedom and liberty?

[questionmark]

But taking away only a portion of that extra money will greatly help out those less fortunate. Since when has greed become a part of freedom and liberty?

Now, let me explain this to you, freedom is always the freedom of greed and envy... Ok... now write it 200 times!

[Incorrigible1]

But taking away only a portion of that extra money will greatly help out those less fortunate. Since when has greed become a part of freedom and liberty?

Please send your next paycheck to me. It will help me out greatly. Thanks in advance.

[MasterPo]

But taking away only a portion of that extra money will greatly help out those less fortunate. Since when has greed become a part of freedom and liberty?

By what moral or ethical stance can you possible have for reaching into another person's pocket?! How dare you sir! How dare you!!

[little_dreamer]

I enjoy my money as much as anyone. I want to build up my go-to-hell fund (freedom to quit my job, or to try a new career).

Taxes are bad in the Northeast USA but better in some other parts of the country. New Jersey = highest property taxes in the nation.

US income taxes are much better than other European nations. Don't forget about all those excemptions too.

I am not happy about my 28% - 35% tax bracket but I am in no mood to start my own government.

Also I am somewhat afraid of the I.R.S.

[Fluffybunny]

By what moral or ethical stance can you possible have for reaching into another person's pocket?! How dare you sir! How dare you!!

Oh please stop with the melodramatics...we all pitch in in this country, to make it a better, safer place to live. It has been that way for a very very long time. Without "reaching into another persons pocket" we would not have the infrastructure we have, the roads, the utilities... we would not have the security that we enjoy, we would not have police to look for the criminals or firefighters to put out fires, or help sick and injured people...We would not have health services to stop diseases before they spread. We would not have research for technology and sciences that make the advancements that have allowed us to rid us of things like polio...

Are you so quick to have a kneejerk reaction about taxes that you cant see what good things they have provided for you?

Perhaps if you were to spend some time in a country that has no taxes at all...no infrastructure, none of the things that you take for granted everyday, you might see that a little bit of a good thing...is indeed a good thing...

[Guardsman Bass]

Oh please stop with the melodramatics...we all pitch in in this country, to make it a better, safer place to live. It has been that way for a very very long time. Without "reaching into another persons pocket" we would not have the infrastructure we have, the roads, the utilities... we would not have the security that we enjoy, we would not have police to look for the criminals or firefighters to put out fires, or help sick and injured people...We would not have health services to stop diseases before they spread. We would not have research for technology and sciences that make the advancements that have allowed us to rid us of things like polio...

Are you so quick to have a kneejerk reaction about taxes that you cant see what good things they have provided for you?

He does this in virtually every thread. Very troll-like.

Perhaps if you were to spend some time in a country that has no taxes at all...no infrastructure, none of the things that you take for granted everyday, you might see that a little bit of a good thing...is indeed a good thing...

I notice Masterpro ignored my point about how he's always welcome to move to Somalia.

[MasterPo]

Still waiting for someone to site the moral or ethical basis for taking money out of my pocket and giving it to someone else just because I may have a bit more than they.

If that's being a troll, then ban me now and show the world what you really stand for.

[BlindMessiah]

Still waiting for someone to site the moral or ethical basis for taking money out of my pocket and giving it to someone else just because I may have a bit more than they.

If that's being a troll, then ban me now and show the world what you really stand for.

Martyr much?

[AztecInca]

Come on people, please don`t get personal. Simply discuss the topic at hand and avoid making comments about one another.

[Cradle of Fish]

Still waiting for someone to site the moral or ethical basis for taking money out of my pocket and giving it to someone else just because I may have a bit more than they.

If that's being a troll, then ban me now and show the world what you really stand for.

Go live in the wilderness if you're so afraid of paying a little bit more than someone on minimum income.

[Incorrigible1]

"The budget should be balanced, the treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt.

People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.'" -- Cicero , 55 BC

[questionmark]

People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.'" -- Cicero , 55 BC

Said the guy who at the same time advocated spreading free bread and games among the people.

[BlindMessiah]

Go live in the wilderness if you're so afraid of paying a little bit more than someone on minimum income.

That's such a weak argument. "Agree with me or get out." I'm convinced.

[Tiggs]

Still waiting for someone to site the moral or ethical basis for taking money out of my pocket and giving it to someone else just because I may have a bit more than they.

You're in for a long wait, I'd imagine.

If you'd have asked what the moral and ethical basis is for refusing to extend the legal deadline for the phasing out of the current Bush tax cuts which have financially crippled the American economy, then I expect you'd have got a reply.

[BlindMessiah]

You're in for a long wait, I'd imagine.

If you'd have asked what the moral and ethical basis is for refusing to extend the legal deadline for the phasing out of the current Bush tax cuts which have financially crippled the American economy, then I expect you'd have got a reply.

Bush's tax cuts are just as wrong as Obama's plan. What we need is a flat tax rate or a national sales tax.

[Tiggs]

Bush's tax cuts are just as wrong as Obama's plan. What we need is a flat tax rate or a national sales tax.

Flat tax sounds good. Realistically, however - you're not going to get either of those, this election, at least.