Will Religion be a Minority someday?

[MagicJaxon]

Of course right now and through out history non-religious people have been the minority. I have to say though that I do believe that is changing and I honestly believe that someday there will be more people that do not believe on god then who do.

Of course I have no way of knowing this for sure. Even if it does happen it won't be fore quite some time. I'm not suggesting that it'll go away completely but I do think that it'll someday be viewed as an "Old way".

I believe that many of the reasons we, as human beings, have so heavily clung to religion are slowly fading away. Not gone by a long shot but they are changing. I of course have no idea what will happen but I just feel that religion is slowly fading away in popularity.

Here is an articles I found. It doesn't make it true or false but it does show that some changes are happening and that the matter has been given some consideration. At least there are here in America.

Atheists, they lament, are the last minority in this nation that is fair game for bigotry. Experts who study religion in public life concur.

"Atheists are not very well-thought-of in America," says John Green, a senior fellow with the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. "It's still acceptable to criticize atheists in a way that's not polite. People may harbor negative views about Jews, Catholics, Muslims and evangelicals, but they know they're not supposed to voice those views, so they don't. But it's still OK to say anything bad you want about atheists."

The overwhelming majority of U.S. citizens profess some religious faith, although far fewer attend worship services on a regular basis. The public square has become increasingly dominated by religious (specifically, Christian) rhetoric, from the "values voters" of the 2004 presidential election to hot-button cultural issues that carry a religious edge -- abortion, gay rights, stem-cell research, intelligent design, the right to die.

And yet at the same time a compelling undercurrent is at work. A study done by the Graduate Center of the City University of New York found that the percentage of the population that describes itself as "nonreligious" more than doubled from 1990 to 2001, from 14.3 million to 29.4 million people. The only other group to show growth was Muslims.

"Right now, the fastest-growing religious identity in America is the nonreligious," says Dan Barker, co-president of the Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF), a Madison, Wis.-based group that champions church-state separation and works to educate the public on nontheism.

A study by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life found that 16 percent of Americans (about 35 million) consider themselves "unaffiliated" -- a category that includes "unaffiliated believers," "secularists" and atheists/agnostics.

The latter terms -- atheists and agnostics -- are lumped together, says Green, because they share so many similarities. But there is a subtle difference: Atheists forthrightly affirm that there is no God; agnostics simply say as humans we can never know. Together, they constitute about 3 percent of the American population.

Green says atheists/agnostics as a group tend to be well educated and politically liberal (although, he says, there are atheist Republicans). They tend to cluster in big cities on the East and West coasts. They tend to be younger, not older. They tend to be male more than female.

But what, exactly, do atheists believe in, if not in God?

In a nutshell, atheists believe in reason alone, in those things that can be arrived at through intellect and the scientific method. Concrete evidence for God, they argue, simply doesn't exist. They don't cotton to leaps of faith or anything that involves a supernatural being reaching into human lives. They believe you can live a happy, respectable life based on human ethics that were derived not from God handing down a tablet but from a code of rules that emerged naturally through an evolutionary process in which humans learned how to live together successfully.

Edited October 31, 2008 by MagicJaxon

[ravergirl]

The religous people will say that the world wont last that long, and the non-religious people will say yes.

[+Sherapy]

it has happened already has been happening strong for the last 10 years as a matter of fact....., religion is in its last hours as currently understood it will be taking its place with the flat earth society and one day children will be reading books in school called the mythologies of america some already are...,,

look for agnosticism to be the new paradigm .........it sthe most honest and fair and humble posit .. we just don't know so why make up stories and pretend and insist and terrorize ..that is what we are evolving into..

Edited October 31, 2008 by Tangerine Sheri

[AlexG]

Perhaps in the future, when the human race has had a chance to become comfortable with intelligence.

4 million years of evolution isn't enough.

[Bender Rodríguez]

I hope so. I'm getting tired of the special treatment they get and the heavy influence that they hold on society. I think it will happen, though.

[Splodgenessabounds]

Over here in England they reckon by 2020 church attendence will have fallen 50% since figures published in 1990. Source - http://www.whychurch.org.uk/trends.php. I went to a Roman Catholic school and we always looked forward to our Religious Education lessons because we never did anything, just mucked about. We didn't care about religion and that was 6 years ago.

The interesting thing is that faith in Islam is growing. There were 4 registered mosques in 1960, in 1985 there were 314 and in 2002 there were 618, a 15450% rise in 42 years. http://www.lausanneworldpulse.com/trendsan.../03-2007?pg=all

At least someones keeping the faith.

[Omnaka]

I don't think Belief in God and Religion are synonamous, I believe , as Many do, But not in the way that mainstreem religions do.

Heavenly Father and Mother Love all unconditionally, no matter their Rel;igion.

God is not a biggot or Predgidous IMO.

So Religion may take a Fall, To Truth about who God really is To us, His and Her Eternal Spirit Children..

Love Omnaka

[TheKnight]

I think that serious religious people already are a miniority. All the other people are just fluff, people who thnk certain things because that's how they were raised.

[Omnaka]

I think serious Spiritual People are The Minority , and This has Been, since Before Noahs' time.

I will not Go as Far as to Call My bro who does not believe as Me, Fluff, But will say He may Be a younger spirit than Iam, Or On another Path Than Iam.

Because God Love's Unconditionally, Speed in enlightening an eternal spirit Is not a requisit For The love unconditional Of the Father and Mother who created all., Or enlightening an Infinate Eternal spirit.

It's all Good!

Love Omnaka

[+Paranoid Android]

I don't think religion will become the minority. It will perhaps become the minority in America, England, perhaps Australia and other parts of the West. But while religions are decreasing in the West, in the East, religions such as Christianity are rising at phenomenal rates. China, for example, has had a 3% increase in Christian church attendance in the last 4 years. From 6%-attendance in 2004 to 9% in 2008. Taking into account the population of China, how quickly is Christianity spreading in such areas? To increase so much to not only stick with population growth but to exceed it by such figures is phenomenal.

I think we won't see a minority, rather we will see a migration of religion. Chrsitianity seems to be moving into the East, and many of the Oriental philosophies appear to be migrating into Western cultures. It will be interesting to see exactly how it happens, but I wouldn't be surprised if Christianity is considered an "Eastern Religion" in the next 50 years or so (it did start in the East, originally, so I guess we're going back to its historical roots somewhat).

That would be my observation, at least.

Regards,

[+Paranoid Android]

Over here in England they reckon by 2020 church attendence will have fallen 50% since figures published in 1990. Source - http://www.whychurch.org.uk/trends.php.

You know what's causing this to happen in England? Liberalism. It might sound contradictory, but the more liberal churches get to appeal to greater numbers, the less numbers they will actually attract. 1-in-3 pastors in England don't believe the Bible to be God's word, and more than half say that Jesus is not the only way to heaven. Such liberal attitudes might score them points for being more encompassing, but what really happens is that they have watered down what they believe so much that no one really cares anymore. If Jesus is not the only way to heaven, then what's the point in going to meet with believers of Christ once a week? If the Bible isn't God's word, what's the point in putting so much effort into studying it?

By attempting to appeal to everyone, they've really caused themselves to appeal to nobody. Ironic, isn't it.

[__Kratos__]

I don't think religion will become the minority. It will perhaps become the minority in America, England, perhaps Australia and other parts of the West. But while religions are decreasing in the West, in the East, religions such as Christianity are rising at phenomenal rates. China, for example, has had a 3% increase in Christian church attendance in the last 4 years. From 6%-attendance in 2004 to 9% in 2008. Taking into account the population of China, how quickly is Christianity spreading in such areas? To increase so much to not only stick with population growth but to exceed it by such figures is phenomenal.

I think we won't see a minority, rather we will see a migration of religion. Chrsitianity seems to be moving into the East, and many of the Oriental philosophies appear to be migrating into Western cultures. It will be interesting to see exactly how it happens, but I wouldn't be surprised if Christianity is considered an "Eastern Religion" in the next 50 years or so (it did start in the East, originally, so I guess we're going back to its historical roots somewhat).

That would be my observation, at least.

Regards,

The Chinese are growing and education is spreading as well. While it's hard to picture religion as a minority, with the rapid explosion of knowledge and easier access to understand it in the world. Having a religion spread in a void such as China isn't special at all, it's only offering a new idea to people who've had really no access to any others. If you threw scientology into China it would likely thrive just as well.

Just a few days ago the Guardian had an opinion piece about this...

A slow but certain demise

All the signs are there: religion will die. I'm just sorry I won't be around to see it

There are signs that in the western world (including the US) religion is, indeed, beginning a long, slow – although accelerating – decline. All the statistics show that congregations are falling, mass attendance is diminishing and Christian knowledge is passing inexorably from our culture.

There have been two, or in some cases, three generations of people in this country who have had no connection with church at all. It plays no part in their life or their thinking. They are what I term "the religiously indifferent" – they couldn't care less whether religion is there or not, just so long as it doesn't interfere with their lives. Such people make up a vast and increasing swath of the population of Britain.

Why is this? In order to survive, a religion's mythology must be imbued into the next generation at an early age, before critical faculties that might prompt resistance develop. This is Richard Dawkins' meme theory. It is also the reason that most Church of England schools are primary schools and that madrassas start the process so early on in children's lives.

Evangelists know that it takes only three or four generations of unchurched people for the mythology to fall from consciousness, to disappear from the culture. People find that actually they can manage perfectly well without it.

Religious leaders may despair about how difficult it is to reach "Generation Y" (roughly, 16-25 year olds), but if children have reached adolescence and they have not been infected with the religious meme, they will be mainly immune to it. The only way is to get gentle Jesus into their heads when they're four or five.

In the developing world we are told that religion is strong and, apparently, unassailable. We see people in great crowds passionately defending their beliefs from insult, or walking round a giant stone in Mecca. But one needs to ask: do they really believe what they purport to believe? Or is the religious meme so strong in poor countries that it is inescapable? Does religion control so much of the culture that it is simply not possible to function as anything other than a religious adherent, whether sincere or not?

More of the article here: Link

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I think one day followers of mythologies and their sky faeries will be a minority but in reality it won't happen for a very long time. Billions of people from all different backgrounds aren't just going to accept reason overnight. Mainly because we don't have an Ark of Truth on hand to fight against the evils of the Ori. Sure we can keep killing off the Goa'uld leaders as mythology heads but the believers will keep moving along until a good group of them sees they need to be free from the slavery.

[Karlis]

~~~ ... (snip) ...

... someday there will be more people that do not believe on god then who do.

... I believe that many of the reasons we, as human beings, have so heavily clung to religion are slowly fading away. ...

... I just feel that religion is slowly fading away in popularity.

I agree with you MagicJaxon -- and strange as it is, perhaps (???) Jesus suggested that this would be the case:

Luk 18:8 … when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?

On the other hand, religions opposed to "Biblical Christianity" could perhaps grow stronger, as "true Christianity" diminishes -- but that's simply my guess.

This is in the realm of speculation, as I see it.

Kind regards,

Karlis

[Karlis]

~~ ... (snip) ...

... look for agnosticism to be the new paradigm ...

Hhmmm -- may I suggest the Muslim faith may be the new "paradigm"?

Kind regards,

Karlis

[Karlis]

Perhaps in the future, when the human race has had a chance to become comfortable with intelligence.

4 million years of evolution isn't enough.

Hi AlexG -- what's your opinion that "evolution" may take an unexpected leap, if Jesus returns?

Just a thought to tweak a different paradigm.

Kind and provoking regards,

Karlis

[behaviour???]

It can be true....Lets hope the world stays that long.........

[zandore]

Will religion die out?

No I don't think it will entirely die out. There will be some people that need the comfort that religion provides but they will end up being a minority but end...no.

[Bez]

The interesting thing is that faith in Islam is growing. There were 4 registered mosques in 1960, in 1985 there were 314 and in 2002 there were 618, a 15450% rise in 42 years. http://www.lausanneworldpulse.com/trendsan.../03-2007?pg=all

At least someones keeping the faith.

I think this is due to terrorism's effect on people trying to understand Islamic Extremist's mindsets. Dare I say it's becoming a "fad" religion due to terrorism and the media. The unfortunate thing about this (if my theory is true) is that Islam =/= Islamic Extremists.

Then of course there is immigration(sp?)

[Bez]

Will religion die out?

No I don't think it will entirely die out. There will be some people that need the comfort that religion provides but they will end up being a minority but end...no.

I agree with you 100%. Religion will never completely end because it's based on faith. No one can prove or disprove it, therefore it remains one of those things that will be believed forever.

[dsm_luck]

You know what's causing this to happen in England? Liberalism. It might sound contradictory, but the more liberal churches get to appeal to greater numbers, the less numbers they will actually attract. 1-in-3 pastors in England don't believe the Bible to be God's word, and more than half say that Jesus is not the only way to heaven. Such liberal attitudes might score them points for being more encompassing, but what really happens is that they have watered down what they believe so much that no one really cares anymore. If Jesus is not the only way to heaven, then what's the point in going to meet with believers of Christ once a week? If the Bible isn't God's word, what's the point in putting so much effort into studying it?

By attempting to appeal to everyone, they've really caused themselves to appeal to nobody. Ironic, isn't it.

You have it backwards. The "liberalism" that you speak of in the churches of England was not changed in an attempt to increase their already healthy numbers. They did so because the ship of organized religion is full of holes and sinking fast in that country, and that was the only way the churches could see as viable in preventing absolute hemorrhaging. America is many years behind England in this matter, but I believe this current younger generation we have is much less prone to practicing classical religion. I don't think the change is on us yet. Give the American youth time to mature and get power and I believe we will be looking at a much different America. Hopefully one where being an Atheist does not make you an abomination against god, as our current religious majority would have you believe.

The type of believers you speak of are biblical literalists. They take the Bible and every word in it as absolute facts. You espouse this type of believer as what the church needs to garner support in England. Never mind the immorality of taking the Bible (esp the Old Testament) as a guide of justice, love, or morals, but to then expect this type of hard lined ideology to INCREASE attendance in this day and age when rational thought and logic are becoming more widespread....is well preposterous. It was the utter immorality of the biblical literalists, that drove me from Christianity a few years back. A life long quest to understand my religion ended with my own moral compass leading me to believe that the religion I had followed for soo many years was indeed immoral. Hopefully we are entering a new age of enlightenment.

Edited November 1, 2008 by dsm_luck

[MagicJaxon]

Great discussion everyone.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to express what I have in mind right now but I'll give it a shot.

This all brings me to wonder what exactly is it that makes religion so appealing. I admit that my thoughts right now are mostly on Christianity because that's the main religion practiced here in the states as far as I know.

For example we are less divided now then we ever where. What I mean but that is with today's technology it's very easy to meet, talk to and make friends with people all over the world. The fact that you are reading this now is proof of that. We wouldn't be having this discussion right now if it weren't for the internet and I know some of you in this thread alone span around the globe.

I guess what I'm getting at is that I think one of the reasons religion came to be was because it helped us to not feel to isolated from the rest of the world. I underlined part of that last sentence for I know this is only a small part of it. But I do feel this aspect of our present age does have an effect on religion.

Another thought is that religion is in some regards a way of explaining thing that we do not understand. Where did we come from is a good question and religion, if you believe in it, presents an answer to that question. But we now know more then we ever have about the world around us. We still have a lot to learn but we know more now then we did before. And I'm sure this also effects religious belief.

I'm trying not to turn this discussion in the religion and evolution argument but a society is constantly evolving. All society's do and I'm pretty sure we, in America, are evolving away from religion.

So what else do you all think will or could effect the size of the religious population? To answer that I think we need to look at what religion provides and if those needs are still not meet by non-religious aspect of the world.

Edited November 2, 2008 by MagicJaxon

[Oderint]

it has happened already has been happening strong for the last 10 years as a matter of fact....., religion is in its last hours as currently understood it will be taking its place with the flat earth society and one day children will be reading books in school called the mythologies of america some already are...,,

look for agnosticism to be the new paradigm .........it sthe most honest and fair and humble posit .. we just don't know so why make up stories and pretend and insist and terrorize ..that is what we are evolving into..

agreed. In many communities religion is already a minority. In Norway for example, if it wasn't for the "bible belt" in the southern part of the country the non-religious Norwegians would probably be the majority. That means only a section of the country is "very religious". Of course you also have the people that believe in God (for examplt), but don't pray, go to church or anything like that. They just believe he/she/it exists.

About agnosticism: I'm agnostic myself, and what worries me a little is that I've seen people like me be called cowards, fence-sitters, weak, flip-flopping and many worse things (that would get me banned if I said it) by "good" religious people. Simply because we chose not to say yes or no.

Messy post, but I'm at work

[Splodgenessabounds]

I think this is due to terrorism's effect on people trying to understand Islamic Extremist's mindsets. Dare I say it's becoming a "fad" religion due to terrorism and the media. The unfortunate thing about this (if my theory is true) is that Islam =/= Islamic Extremists.

Then of course there is immigration(sp?)

I don't necessarily agree with that because the mosques were still increasing before Islamic Extremism as wide spread as it is now, it was because of the immigration of muslims from africa in the 50's and 60's which to be fair you did bring up. Since 9/11 on the other you may have a point, the backlash against muslims and bombardment from British tabloids may have swung young muslims who before had not been strict or devout to rally and defend Islam. I also think extremism is a result of religion as a whole not just Islam.

[+Paranoid Android]

You have it backwards. The "liberalism" that you speak of in the churches of England was not changed in an attempt to increase their already healthy numbers. They did so because the ship of organized religion is full of holes and sinking fast in that country, and that was the only way the churches could see as viable in preventing absolute hemorrhaging. America is many years behind England in this matter, but I believe this current younger generation we have is much less prone to practicing classical religion. I don't think the change is on us yet. Give the American youth time to mature and get power and I believe we will be looking at a much different America. Hopefully one where being an Atheist does not make you an abomination against god, as our current religious majority would have you believe.

The type of believers you speak of are biblical literalists. They take the Bible and every word in it as absolute facts. You espouse this type of believer as what the church needs to garner support in England. Never mind the immorality of taking the Bible (esp the Old Testament) as a guide of justice, love, or morals, but to then expect this type of hard lined ideology to INCREASE attendance in this day and age when rational thought and logic are becoming more widespread....is well preposterous. It was the utter immorality of the biblical literalists, that drove me from Christianity a few years back. A life long quest to understand my religion ended with my own moral compass leading me to believe that the religion I had followed for soo many years was indeed immoral. Hopefully we are entering a new age of enlightenment.

I'm not speaking of "biblical literalists". If there is a name, I would call them "biblical realists". Why must there only be two extremes - those who believe every word to be absolutely literal, or those who believe that Jesus/the Bible are not the only way to God. Believe it or not, there is a massive middle-ground there for people to consider.

In areas that have adopted liberal beliefs that Jesus isn't the only way to God, religion is dying because no one sees any need to go to church. In my area, when I see people still holding to biblical principles, I have seen massive growth - my church has had a near-500% increase in attendance in the past six years (I have been a Christian for only 8 years, myself). I put that increase down to our reliance on the Bible as the word of God and the primacy of Jesus as the only way to salvation. Unlike England, Anglicanism in Australia is distinct and different from other pluralistic views.

Don't always push things into an either/or category - there's much more of a middle ground to belief than the liberalist/literalist dichotomy.

Regards,

[karl 12]

I hope so. I'm getting tired of the special treatment they get and the heavy influence that they hold on society. I think it will happen, though.

Bender good point -perhaps this new London bus idea may be a step in the right direction for ´secular equality´.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/londons-b...4351253266.html

"LONDON: Buses emblazoned with advertisements declaring "there's probably no God" will soon be travelling through the streets of London after the prominent atheist Professor Richard Dawkins agreed to help pay for them.

Campaigners say the messages will provide a "reassuring" antidote to religious ads that "threaten eternal damnation".

Professor Dawkins, the author of The God Delusion, said: "Religion is accustomed to getting a free ride - automatic tax breaks, unearned 'respect' and the right not to be 'offended', the right to brainwash children.

"Even on the buses, nobody thinks twice when they see a religious slogan plastered across the side. This campaign to put alternative slogans on London buses will make people think - and thinking is anathema to religion."

As for the idea of organised religion being a minority some day-it already is in most places if just don´t lump all the conflicting opinions together under one banner and divide them into the separate sects and cults that they actualy are.

Secularism far outweighs most individual religious sect/cult opinion in the UK anyway-perhaps this is why people are so tired and fed up of these organisations getting a ´free ride´ and unfair preferential treatment in the form of automatic tax breaks,unearned respect,the right not to be offended and the right to brainwash children.

Dur to the fact of there being no evidence whatsoever for any of the fantastical claims of the 3000+ religions alive in the world today,I dont think any of their members should be treated any better (or worse) than anybody else.

Perhaps its high time organised religions were just restricted to their places of worship and had nothing else other to do with society.

Cheers Karl