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SoulFire

pierced kittens

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sarah snow
by the way, i didn't know you could say dick on here. dick, dick dick, :lol:

:lol::lol::lol:

Those poor kitties- and I don't even like cats, but that is a seriously sicko thing to do.

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Neognosis
I have had declawed cats before and logically speaking it was better than being dropped off at the human society to be euthanized. Humans are vain creatures no doubt and my leather couch wasn't cheap lol. If I had claws that cost me money repeatedly

There's the rationalization. We have TWO intact cats. And a very nice sofa which they don't ruin. And even if they did, we would never declaw a cat.

Or debark a dog.

What harm does the piercing do? It's surely less painful then recovering from declawing. And the choice is not between declawing or the humane society. Both our cats were rescues, and we didn't declaw either one.

It would seem that for this person, piercing the cats made them easier to sell. Maybe if he couldn't sell them, he would send them to the humane society.

You are also fooling yourself if you think that a cat would rather never be able to go outside. Most cats love to go outside. Ours do every chance they get. Declawing them does one thing and one thing only: it mutilates an animal so that you can keep that animal around for amusement without worrying about your furniture.

You people that have declawed your cats have no right to be angry at what this person did. You've done worse to your animal.

http://www.declawing.com/

Edited by Neognosis

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SoulFire
There's the rationalization. We have TWO intact cats. And a very nice sofa which they don't ruin. And even if they did, we would never declaw a cat.

Or debark a dog.

What harm does the piercing do? It's surely less painful then recovering from declawing. And the choice is not between declawing or the humane society. Both our cats were rescues, and we didn't declaw either one.

It would seem that for this person, piercing the cats made them easier to sell. Maybe if he couldn't sell them, he would send them to the humane society.

You are also fooling yourself if you think that a cat would rather never be able to go outside. Most cats love to go outside. Ours do every chance they get. Declawing them does one thing and one thing only: it mutilates an animal so that you can keep that animal around for amusement without worrying about your furniture.

You people that have declawed your cats have no right to be angry at what this person did. You've done worse to your animal.

that's crazy. of course your cats like to go outside. i bet they always want to come back in though, don't they. they don't want to have to fend for themselves out in the harsh world after having a taste of the inside life. declawing a cat doesn't mean it can NEVER go outside. you take everything to the extreme. i love to go outside too, but i don't want to live out there.

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Helen of Annoy

I smell a PETA member prowling this thread undercover… sort of. :rofl:

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Neognosis
that's crazy. of course your cats like to go outside. i bet they always want to come back in though, don't they.

Yes, they do. Sometimes not for hours or days though. And they come back without the condition that we cut the last quarter of each digit off.

I smell a PETA member prowling this thread undercover… sort of.

Actually, as the son of a Dairy farmer, I have no love for Peta.

But thanks for reaffirming my point and exposing more of your silly and emotional double-standard. Some of the same people who willingly had part of their cat's digits cut off want to shoot a guy for piercing some cat's ears.... please. The US is one of the last developed countries to even allow declawing of cats, because it is unnecessary and cruel.

Take an objective look at what you're saying. You want to shoot some guy for doing something not nearly as bad as what you've done. Because the article had a picture of a fluffy, cute kitten and it mad you sad.

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Helen of Annoy
Yes, they do. Sometimes not for hours or days though. And they come back without the condition that we cut the last quarter of each digit off.

Actually, as the son of a Dairy farmer, I have no love for Peta.

But thanks for reaffirming my point and exposing more of your silly and emotional double-standard. Some of the same people who willingly had part of their cat's digits cut off want to shoot a guy for piercing some cat's ears.... please. The US is one of the last developed countries to even allow declawing of cats, because it is unnecessary and cruel.

Take an objective look at what you're saying. You want to shoot some guy for doing something not nearly as bad as what you've done. Because the article had a picture of a fluffy, cute kitten and it mad you sad.

What have I done? :wacko: My cats are not declawed, and I have not one but three leather sofas to prove it. Seriously :lol: But I neutered my cats, and it was heartbreaking and expensive, but very logical thing to do, that made both their and my life better.

This is how my mind works, emotions and logic together.

This is also why I want to shoot the degenerate from the OP. Logic tells me to defend, emotions to retaliate. One moron less, millions more left to continue the line of greed and stupidity.

But we had this discussion before. It was equally fruitless like this one and it equally reeked of your pompous self-righteousness.

When on Earth, do as Earthlings do, you holly Vulcan, or I’ll slap your pointy ears. :P

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Neognosis

I didn't mean it as an attack on you. I meant "you" in the general sense.

This is how my mind works, emotions and logic together.

That's good. Most people don't really think logically, but only emotionally.

Shooting the person who pierced the cat's ears will only cause more misery and contribute to a more violent society in which things like animal abuse are likely to occur.

Do you also want to shoot vets that declaw kittens? You wouldn't REALLY torture a human being for piercing kittens ears, would you? Seriously, would you? I mean, it makes you feel better to talk like that, but would you really torture someone for doing that to a cat?

I'm just curious. I'm interested in the rationalization that occurs when an emotional response happens.

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Neognosis
One moron less, millions more left to continue the line of greed and stupidity.

Hm, sounds pretty pompous and self-righteous.

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PhoenixBird88

Pierce kittens? Horrible.

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Helen of Annoy
I didn't mean it as an attack on you. I meant "you" in the general sense.

That's good. Most people don't really think logically, but only emotionally.

Shooting the person who pierced the cat's ears will only cause more misery and contribute to a more violent society in which things like animal abuse are likely to occur.

Do you also want to shoot vets that declaw kittens? You wouldn't REALLY torture a human being for piercing kittens ears, would you? Seriously, would you? I mean, it makes you feel better to talk like that, but would you really torture someone for doing that to a cat?

I'm just curious. I'm interested in the rationalization that occurs when an emotional response happens.

First of all, if we are going to have humorous comments equalized with serious statements we better give up right now.

But lets assume you are really capable only of literal understanding of sentences. Here goes: People ready to torture animals for fun or profit are repulsive (emotional reaction) and dangerous (logical conclusion). It’s up to respective countries to decide through democratic process of decision making what to do with such human fails.

Personally, I would like to afflict pain to those who torture animals. First time, only pain. Second time, death. Because even they deserve a warning before kicking out of the gene pool. That’s the law that would give some real results.

This brings me to your opinion of society that would become more violent if deviant people are given a taste of their own medicine. It wouldn’t. The reason why criminals are so numerous and rampant in both your and mine respective parts of the world is the upside-down treatment – I can’t even shoot a burglar anymore?! But he can shoot me and cry in the court how mommy didn’t love him. Really.

And vets. No, I wouldn't shoot vets because they do procedures for benefit of animals, under anesthesia.

Piercing is not contributing to quality of life. It's ugly, yucky, potentionally dangerous, primitive and so on. My cats don't even want to accept collars and now I should believe they wouldn't mind piercing??? I'm not that stupid.

If someone wants to mutilate him or herself with piercing, cropping ears or anything that's his/her problem. Animals are simply out of the question, because inflicting unneccessary pain without written agreement of the one to be subjected to it is unacceptable. And yes, I am aware I have put cropped ears toghether with piercing. I did that because I meant to imply mutilation is mutilation, no beauty in it - in my personal opinion.

I hope I was detailed and literal enough.

Hm, sounds pretty pompous and self-righteous.

I’ve touched the spot, ha? Yes, emotions find their way. Suppress them all you want, but they will emerge. Especially vanity, that’s a monster among emotions.

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Neognosis
First of all, if we are going to have humorous comments equalized with serious statements we better give up right now.

Well, that's why I asked. So I take it then that you answer is "No" and it was just bravado.

People ready to torture animals for fun or profit are repulsive (emotional reaction) and dangerous (logical conclusion). It’s up to respective countries to decide through democratic process of decision making what to do with such human fails.

What about declawing? Isn't that mutilating an animal for the sake of human vanity?

Personally, I would like to afflict pain to those who torture animals. First time, only pain. Second time, death. Because even they deserve a warning before kicking out of the gene pool. That’s the law that would give some real results.

So do you think that what this person did was "torture?" And if so, you would torture a human being in retaliation for torturing an animal.

This brings me to your opinion of society that would become more violent if deviant people are given a taste of their own medicine. It wouldn’t. The reason why criminals are so numerous and rampant in both your and mine respective parts of the world is the upside-down treatment – I can’t even shoot a burglar anymore?! But he can shoot me and cry in the court how mommy didn’t love him. Really.

hm, interesting. You are wrong, of course. Punishment for the sake of punishment does not reduce crime, nor does it make a society less violent. In fact, the opposite is quite possibly true. How can you expect a person to respect the life of a cat when you don't respect the lives of our criminals?

And on another count, you seem to be exaggerating and confusing the idea that we should understand the cause of crime in order to redcuce it with the absurd idea that we should excuse all crime because of those reasons...

Although, by your own admittance, you have the potential to be a criminal yourself. YOU said you would like to torture another human being in retaliation for what they did to an animal. Sounds like you're making an excuse for your potential behavior. "but judge, I only shot the man because he pierced a cat's ears and that made me sad and angry..."

And vets. No, I wouldn't shoot vets because they do procedures for benefit of animals, under anesthesia.

so then you are under the impression that ear cropping and declawing are for the benefit of the animal then? How exactly is declawing for the benefit of the animal? It's for OUR benefit. Same with ear cropping. Why should ear cropping remain legal in the US, but the guy should go to jail?

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Rhincewind

heres a question. what happens when the rings get caught on something? also the animals doe not know whats happening.

Peircings, declawing tail docking and ear cropping shoulld be out lawed. (at least they are in the uk)

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Neognosis

Piercing a household pet MIGHT be against the law in the US... not sure though. But tail docking and ear cropping is not. And you are right, it should be. It should be illegal to mutilate any household pet for the sake of vanity.

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hetrodoxly
heres a question. what happens when the rings get caught on something? also the animals doe not know whats happening.

Peircings, declawing tail docking and ear cropping shoulld be out lawed. (at least they are in the uk)

It's still legal to take off the dewclaw's and dock working (hunting) breeds in the UK, vets charge £5 to dock a pup, that's how superficial it is, Australia have covered the insignificant, but still allow the ripping apart of wild pigs using pitbulls, etc.

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The Silver Thong
There's the rationalization. We have TWO intact cats. And a very nice sofa which they don't ruin. And even if they did, we would never declaw a cat.

Or debark a dog.

Good for you, however sometimes for people to keep pets they have to make the pet more compatible to the owner. The out come from declawing means the cat will be uncomfortable for about a week but will have many many years of caring ownership. Beats the alternative don't it.

What harm does the piercing do? It's surely less painful then recovering from declawing. And the choice is not between declawing or the humane society. Both our cats were rescues, and we didn't declaw either one.

What harm does a piercing do hmmm I could give you a couple hundred examples of botched human piercings and then we can times that by a 100. Do cats scratch there ears and neck? Yes and what can happen whan a cat starts scratching a pierced ear or neck. Bleeding, inflimation, soarness and most likely infection. Yup me to, I have rescued two cats from the humane society as well, much better than getting a cat from a nut job out of the paper that has a new litter every few months and wants make 5 bucks a cat.

It would seem that for this person, piercing the cats made them easier to sell. Maybe if he couldn't sell them, he would send them to the humane society.

Probably would have been better if he had taken the to the humane society, there they might have had a chance to find a CARING home.

You are also fooling yourself if you think that a cat would rather never be able to go outside. Most cats love to go outside. Ours do every chance they get. Declawing them does one thing and one thing only: it mutilates an animal so that you can keep that animal around for amusement without worrying about your furniture.

Most cats do like to go outside, however where I live, a city of over a million people we are incuraged to not have outdoor cats. Indoor cats lead a longer less stress life. I raised most of my cats as stricktly indoor cats and I will tell you they never suffered a min of there life for it. Cats are a harmful species to most native birds and small creatures, to be a responsible pet owner in a city you shouldn't have outdoor cats. Here we have cat catchers just like dog catchers, it's illegal to have out door cats in the city but most ignore the rule. :rolleyes:

You people that have declawed your cats have no right to be angry at what this person did. You've done worse to your animal.

What a load of crap if I ever heard it, holy frakin hell. Most people that have had there cat declawed was to give the cat a better lifestyle and to make that cat a part of the family more so than befor. Docking tails and cropping ears does not make a better pet but declawing a cat can. Be a responsible pet owner is what it boils down to and this guy that pierced his kittins certinly is not...

http://www.declawing.com/

Cheers

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Rhincewind

if you think docking tails for cosmetic reasons is ok then you clearly don't know or care what the tail is for. It has many uses that are vital to the animals welfae and health

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Helen of Annoy
Well, that's why I asked. So I take it then that you answer is "No" and it was just bravado.

What about declawing? Isn't that mutilating an animal for the sake of human vanity?

So do you think that what this person did was "torture?" And if so, you would torture a human being in retaliation for torturing an animal.

hm, interesting. You are wrong, of course. Punishment for the sake of punishment does not reduce crime, nor does it make a society less violent. In fact, the opposite is quite possibly true. How can you expect a person to respect the life of a cat when you don't respect the lives of our criminals?

And on another count, you seem to be exaggerating and confusing the idea that we should understand the cause of crime in order to redcuce it with the absurd idea that we should excuse all crime because of those reasons...

Although, by your own admittance, you have the potential to be a criminal yourself. YOU said you would like to torture another human being in retaliation for what they did to an animal. Sounds like you're making an excuse for your potential behavior. "but judge, I only shot the man because he pierced a cat's ears and that made me sad and angry..."

so then you are under the impression that ear cropping and declawing are for the benefit of the animal then? How exactly is declawing for the benefit of the animal? It's for OUR benefit. Same with ear cropping. Why should ear cropping remain legal in the US, but the guy should go to jail?

Listen, sunshine, we got all those points explained, re-explained and then explained again. I’m not interested in repeating myself like broken record. Bring on at least one fresh argument because those old ones are not impressive.

You are obviously fond of twisting sentences until they resemble logical pretzels, which is fine game for an hour but no more than that.

About the criminal potential, it's almost off-topic but here it goes: every living breathing person has potential to become criminal. But I will not take preaching from you in that department of life. I went through one little but truly ugly war with my conscience clear as Mother Theresa’s, and risked my life to preserve my principles (that covers preserving other people’s lives).

Just how dare you explain to me what human life is and how it should be valued?? How many times you’ve put your head on the block for the sake of complete stranger? My morality passed the ultimate test in real life, how about yours?

We, humans, are not saint and not the same. Some of us don’t need repression at all because we are born with sense of right and wrong. Others don’t respond to anything but brute force. I don’t like that fact, but it is a fact.

So when I want to shoot thief or sadist this is self-defense and defense of my society. The difference between their and my motif is enormous, it is what makes one violence a crime (because it’s motivated by greed or sick desires) or a good deed (intention to stop further pain or destruction).

I will never accept the extremist understanding of human rights, that puts criminals before decent people. We have right to live without fear more than b******* who go through life thinking only about their basic instincts.

So, yes, the prick who is torturing cats for few bucks should be poked with hot iron as a warning and killed if he tries the same scheme next time. Screw him and ultra-liberal maniacs who lost touch with reality.

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Neognosis
So when I want to shoot thief or sadist this is self-defense and defense of my society. The difference between their and my motif is enormous, it is what makes one violence a crime (because it’s motivated by greed or sick desires) or a good deed (intention to stop further pain or destruction).

IN YOUR MIND maybe. Don't you think that the thief that you want to shoot believes in his own mind that what they are doing is justified? So you think that shooting this person is a good deed? Why can't they be put in jail, or rehabilitated? You don't even want to try? No. Because your response is emotional and not rational. Saying you want to shoot them makes you feel good because the poor kitties made you sad and angry.

Good for you, however sometimes for people to keep pets they have to make the pet more compatible to the owner. The out come from declawing means the cat will be uncomfortable for about a week but will have many many years of caring ownership. Beats the alternative don't it.

There are many other alternatives to declawing a cat. the choice is not between mutilation or abandonment. The outcome from piercing means the cat will be uncomfortable for about 10 minutes but could then have many years of caring ownership.

What harm does a piercing do hmmm I could give you a couple hundred examples of botched human piercings and then we can times that by a 100.

Apparently you've never seen the result of a botched declawing. This is probably because it is so debilitating to the cat that they just get put down.

What a load of crap if I ever heard it, holy frakin hell. Most people that have had there cat declawed was to give the cat a better lifestyle and to make that cat a part of the family more so than befor. Docking tails and cropping ears does not make a better pet but declawing a cat can.

Right, right... piercing the cat makes the cat novel and will make certain people want one... chopping off 1/4 of a cat's digits makes the sofa safe. A piercing can be taken out and will heal. You can't regrow the last knuckle of a cat's paw.

And again, our clawed cats are perfectly manageable. Declawing is a vain, savage practice which Americans justify with our unbridled materialism. We convince ourselves it's for the cat's good, when really it's for our own good because we don't want to risk our furniture getting scratched up. (there are very reliable methods that prevent this anyway, but that's another hallmark of american rationalization... if it takes effort, we would rather just mutilate an animal and be done with it.)

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Flamemagic

What is the point of putting bits of metal in mammals that cannot consent to it?

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Helen of Annoy
IN YOUR MIND maybe. Don't you think that the thief that you want to shoot believes in his own mind that what they are doing is justified? So you think that shooting this person is a good deed? Why can't they be put in jail, or rehabilitated? You don't even want to try? No. Because your response is emotional and not rational. Saying you want to shoot them makes you feel good because the poor kitties made you sad and angry.

...

So when some day someone attacks you (I don't wish it happens, god forbid) you will not defend yourself, you will sit and ponder what is going on in his mind?

First-time offenders should be talked to, offered help and so on, but persistent criminals should be hanged, not shot. Bullets cost money.

And I would feel good about it, cat or no cats involved. Read the damned post if you are going to reply on it.

Other quotes are not from my post, so I’ll keep it short and sweet: only a moron would pierce a cat. Morons are the cause of every man-made evil in this world. If a new, deadly disease that attacks only stupid people would emerge – I would start believing there is a god.

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Saru
Come on folks lets keep it civil please.

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Neognosis
So when some day someone attacks you (I don't wish it happens, god forbid) you will not defend yourself, you will sit and ponder what is going on in his mind?

Of course not. But after, I will want to know what contributed to this person's decision to attack me so that we might prevent other people from being attacked.

Oh, bullets cost more money than rope... what chest thumping bravado...

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Helen of Annoy
Of course not. But after, I will want to know what contributed to this person's decision to attack me so that we might prevent other people from being attacked.

Oh, bullets cost more money than rope... what chest thumping bravado...

God, what annoying, shallow pond of stale holly water...

He will prevent violence with examining the genesis of *******ness... :lol: Good luck.

Now, as I said my piece, and since we've been kindly asked to keep it civil I promise to shut up, because I just can't talk calmly about such topic.

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Neognosis

I can see you can't talk calmly about such a topic... which is why your responses are largely emotional and might make you feel good, but I encourage you to really examine them. Torturing a human being because they pierced some kitten's ears (something humans do to their OWN CHILDREN) is not very compassionate.

He will prevent violence with examining the genesis of *******ness... Good luck.

Yes, I believe that visiting violence upon violent people does not end violence, but perpetuates it. Without understanding and addressing the causes and contributing factors of violent crime, we will never even reduce violent crime. I know it's not as exciting as making comments about the killing people and the price of bullets, but it is more productive and respects life.

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johnk81
I can see you can't talk calmly about such a topic... which is why your responses are largely emotional and might make you feel good, but I encourage you to really examine them. Torturing a human being because they pierced some kitten's ears (something humans do to their OWN CHILDREN) is not very compassionate.

Yes, I believe that visiting violence upon violent people does not end violence, but perpetuates it. Without understanding and addressing the causes and contributing factors of violent crime, we will never even reduce violent crime. I know it's not as exciting as making comments about the killing people and the price of bullets, but it is more productive and respects life.

Someone causing cruelty to a helpless animal knows exactly what there doing and should be punished accordingly - I hope that they gets what's coming to them , be it compassionate to pierce a small animals ears? I think not!! this person is getting some kick out of this and should get the kick straight back at them.

I personally react if I see an animal being treated with cruelty , they give nothing but affection knowing that they will be looked after I have pets so I know , this person deserves a good hiding!

ME

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