Is there a Life On Mars Conspiracy?

[thefinalfrontier]

And the people you remember saying that were and still are wrong. You can gauge the color of Mars with a good amateur telescope from Earth, which many has done already. And the lenses on cameras in space are all different and rarely made to capture a true color photograph as your own pocket camera here on Earth. They have many different purposes besides making pretty color pictures for your mantel piece.

Cheers,

Badeskov

Hi Badeskov;

You are exactly correct,, I have looked at Mars a good many times with my telescope and its even red looking at it, Heck even with an unaided eye you can see red in it, There is no coverup on nasa"s part or anyone else, Its a red planet plain and simple,

Regards;

TFF

[badeskov]

All-right, but I am still wondering if they would honestly want the general public to see ET bases on Mars.

I am convinced that if there were ET bases on Mars we'd know about it. Scientists wouldn't be able to keep that quiet - they talk too much.

Our bodies contain the same elements found in the cosmos. That leads me believe that if we can exist, as can other civilizations.

Oh, we are complete agreement here. I would be very, very surprised if we were the only life in the vastness of space. And I also believe that Mars could once have and maybe even still harbor microbial life. I do, however, have very serious doubts about higher lifeforms. To me, even the tiniest microbe found on Mars that can be proven not to have hitched a ride on the investigating space craft from Earth would be incredible news.

Cheers,

Badeskov

[shaka5]

And the people you remember saying that were and still are wrong. You can gauge the color of Mars with a good amateur telescope from Earth, which many has done already. And the lenses on cameras in space are all different and rarely made to capture a true color photograph as your own pocket camera here on Earth. They have many different purposes besides making pretty color pictures for your mantel piece.

Cheers,

Badeskov

whats good badeskov...think you took what i said a lil wrong, its like if we were to stand on mars, it would not look all red, not saying it looks like earth, but not to different...the article i read stated that they used special lens for certain experiments, i'm not saying that they are purposely hiding it from us for a special reason, its just why wouldn't they just tell us, or just show us the true color

[bee]

That isnt the only thing hoagland believes, He also says there is life on Mars, Saturn.> Jupiter,> and > Pluto, His credibility is useless to any scientific comunity, He even made it on the the ufo Hall of shame,

I don't know who is supposed to have created the UFO Hall of Shame rubbish...probably some

disinformation-agent?

But to balance up this attack on Hoagland....Let's not forget that he gave a briefing to the United Nations

in 1992.

http://movies.nytimes.com/movie/79277/Hoag...ection/overview

This documentary records Richard C. Hoagland's talk before U.N. delegates on February 27, 1992. Speaking before an audience comprised of staff, delegates, press, and guests, Hoagland expounded on his theory that intelligent life existed on Mars millennia ago. With amazing slides and film clips, as well as computer graphics, Hoagland presents his evidence of the Martian Sphinx, or face, plus pyramids, ancient cities, and crop rings. In addition, the film contains an extraordinary video from September 15, 1991, when the U.S. space shuttle Discovery broadcast live over NASA's own broadcast channel footage of aircraft flying over the Indian Ocean at several hundred thousand miles an hour. The video was suppressed by the U.S. government. This film provides a thought-provoking inquiry into a possible reality that the establishment would like to remain a secret.

[shaka5]

heres 1 site i just looked up real quick to try to explain what i mean

http://xfacts.com/spirit2004/

[aquatus1]

A HUGE structure of some kind...with other massive structures (of some kind) around it.

That's rather vague.

[badeskov]

whats good badeskov...think you took what i said a lil wrong, its like if we were to stand on mars, it would not look all red, not saying it looks like earth, but not to different...the article i read stated that they used special lens for certain experiments, i'm not saying that they are purposely hiding it from us for a special reason, its just why wouldn't they just tell us, or just show us the true color

Shaka, if I misunderstood you I apologize

They have shown us the true color - it is red. If we stood on Mars and looked, it would be red to us. The reason is that the top layer of Mars is full of various Iron Oxides (basically rust) which makes it red.

The use of various color filters is done to look for different things. I.e. some things is seen better in the blue spectrum, others better in another wavelength range and so on. Compiling a true color image from that is difficult and that is why you see various color nuances.

Cheers,

Badeskov

[badeskov]

A HUGE structure of some kind...with other massive structures (of some kind) around it.

Really? What is the scale?

Cheers,

Badeskov

[bee]

I am convinced that if there were ET bases on Mars we'd know about it. Scientists wouldn't be able to keep that quiet - they talk too much.

They don't talk if it is highly classified information...and they stand to loose their jobs, pensions, reputation

and even their liberty. (in the extreme..Maybe...even their life!)

And I also believe that Mars could once have and maybe even still harbor microbial life. I do, however, have very serious doubts about higher lifeforms. To me, even the tiniest microbe found on Mars that can be proven not to have hitched a ride on the investigating space craft from Earth would be incredible news.

Actually....haven't you heard...??? Mike Robe lives in this huge huge structure on Mars...........

[DONTEATUS]

Now I think bee is in Real estate ? I have some Texas land for sale!

Keep-em-comeing bee ! Nice to See ya!

[Mr Supertypo]

There is hardly any conspiracy on Mars. First at all there is absolutely no reason for it. Just think the all the support NASA and similar organitation would gain, if they find life. Think about all the money they will recive.

There is simply no room for conspiracyes since everybody are are holding they'r breath in hope the probes find something.

But the only reason some people write about conspiracies on mars, are just because the notoriety and the money. So good people, dont listen to them.

[bee]

That's rather vague.

It's the best I can do under the circumstances....with it being a mega classified secret and all....

And the fact that the SITE it came from is suffering

ahem 'problems'.

Really? What is the scale?

See above......about Website 'problems.

[bee]

Now I think bee is in Real estate ? I have some Texas land for sale!

Keep-em-comeing bee ! Nice to See ya!

We visited said building during last Christmas' UM Interdimensional Day Trip to Mars...remember...

There is hardly any conspiracy on Mars. First at all there is absolutely no reason for it. Just think the all the support NASA and similar organitation would gain, if they find life.

What if some of them (NASA people and associates) ARE the life on Mars?????

(apart from any OTHER kind life...or ancient remains/ruins.)

One angle to contemplate. If you dare.....

edit for spelling.

Edited June 16, 2009 by bee

[DONTEATUS]

Thats right I thought I remembered that place,We need to all go back and look for my crocks I must of left them whilst we were jumping around in those Big Alien Rooms.

[aquatus1]

The interesting thing is that, while I can't imagine how keeping life on Mars a secret would be any sort of an advantage to...anyone, if structures and such did exist, then yes, I can only imagine that alien technology would be something worth hoarding.

However, I'm still not seeing anything in that picture. It looks like pretty much any of a hundred shots I could take of Hill country canyons.

[shaka5]

Shaka, if I misunderstood you I apologize

They have shown us the true color - it is red. If we stood on Mars and looked, it would be red to us. The reason is that the top layer of Mars is full of various Iron Oxides (basically rust) which makes it red.

The use of various color filters is done to look for different things. I.e. some things is seen better in the blue spectrum, others better in another wavelength range and so on. Compiling a true color image from that is difficult and that is why you see various color nuances.

Cheers,

Badeskov

i'm not saying its not red, but just not as red as we think, but your right about the color filters, i'm trying to find the other site where i 1st say it, it explains it so well, they go through lots of experiments to get the true color

[Noteaph]

[aquatus1] Quid quid latine dictum sit, altum videtur

Basing a call to SERIOUSLY question, well, everything as untrue based on the assumption that it is untrue is a somewhat circular argument.

"We should question the truth of this report!"

"Why?"

"Because this report is untrue!"

Now, there's plenty of reasons to ask questions, but if out of all those reasons you choose such a logically weak one as that, the rest of the argument is going to suffer.

Quite true, for some. Others might find it eloquent.

Indeed, question everything is somewhat of a personal guideline.

Questioning something however, does not mean the subject is untrue.

In the case of the subject matter of this thread, one should question and conclude the official story

(like so many others, hence my former comment) is poppycock.

(*edit: added [aquatus1])

Edited June 16, 2009 by Noteaph

[Mr Supertypo]

What if some of them (NASA people and associates) ARE the life on Mars?????

(apart from any OTHER kind life...or ancient remains/ruins.)

One angle to contemplate. If you dare.....

edit for spelling.

alien invaders? colonist? shapeshifter? is that what u mean?

BTW Bee, I really love your avatar....where did u find it?

[mcrom901]

Hi Badeskov;

You are exactly correct,, I have looked at Mars a good many times with my telescope and its even red looking at it, Heck even with an unaided eye you can see red in it, There is no coverup on nasa"s part or anyone else, Its a red planet plain and simple,

Regards;

TFF

our earth looks like a 'blue marble'.......... so???????????

[DONTEATUS]

Looking at Mars is Like Looking at Earth in the Not so Distant Future.

We better take care of It.

[Space Commander Travis]

I don't know who is supposed to have created the UFO Hall of Shame rubbish...probably some

disinformation-agent?

Oh no, not again. People have different opinions. Those who disagree with those you choose to believe don't have to be paid by the government to mislead seekers after truth.

Edited June 16, 2009 by 747400

[Space Commander Travis]

our earth looks like a 'blue marble'.......... so???????????

because, I suppose, of the oceans, and clouds, and what not. So therefore Mars would look red because of the red soil and stuff.

[andy4]

i'm not saying its not red, but just not as red as we think, but your right about the color filters, i'm trying to find the other site where i 1st say it, it explains it so well, they go through lots of experiments to get the true color

I think I know what you mean... Mars IS red but it is more earth like in appearence than what it seems, but more like the picture to the right in the link you posted before.

[mcrom901]

A cover-up is possible, though - think about it. Before we get to see the footage, who does it go to? NASA - and anything the military/government doesn't want us to see does not get shown to us. It sort of makes you wonder what, exactly, the government is hiding? Not just in terms of ET life either, but regarding other things (top-secret projects, operations, etc.)

contrary to their 'claims' and what most people 'believe' here...........

The Road to Area 51

After decades of denying the facility's existence, five former insiders speak out

by Annie Jacobsen

Area 51. It's the most famous military institution in the world that doesn't officially exist. If it did, it would be found about 100 miles outside Las Vegas in Nevada's high desert, tucked between an Air Force base and an abandoned nuclear testing ground.

Then again, maybe not-- the U.S. government refuses to say. You can't drive anywhere close to it, and until recently, the airspace overhead was restricted--all the way to outer space. Any mention of Area 51 gets redacted from official documents, even those that have been declassified for decades.

It has become the holy grail for conspiracy theorists, with UFOlogists positing that the Pentagon reverse engineers flying saucers and keeps extraterrestrial beings stored in freezers. Urban legend has it that Area 51 is connected by underground tunnels and trains to other secret facilities around the country. In 2001, Katie Couric told Today Show audiences that 7 percent of Americans doubt the moon landing happened--that it was staged in the Nevada desert. Millions of X-Files fans believe the truth may be "out there," but more likely it's concealed inside Area 51's Strangelove-esque hangars--buildings that, though confirmed by Google Earth, the government refuses to acknowledge.

The problem is the myths of Area 51 are hard to dispute if no one can speak on the record about what actually happened there. Well, now, for the first time, someone is ready to talk--in fact, five men are, and their stories rival the most outrageous of rumors. Colonel Hugh "Slip" Slater, 87, was commander of the Area 51 base in the 1960s. Edward Lovick, 90, featured in "What Plane?" in LA's March issue, spent three decades radar testing some of the world's most famous aircraft (including the U-2, the A-12 OXCART and the F-117). Kenneth Collins, 80, a CIA experimental test pilot, was given the silver star. Thornton "T.D." Barnes, 72, was an Area 51 special-projects engineer. And Harry Martin, 77, was one of the men in charge of the base's half-million-gallon monthly supply of spy-plane fuels. Here are a few of their best stories--for the record:

On May 24, 1963, Collins flew out of Area 51's restricted airspace in a top-secret spy plane code-named OXCART, built by Lockheed Aircraft Corporation. He was flying over Utah when the aircraft pitched, flipped and headed toward a crash. He ejected into a field of weeds.

Almost 46 years later, in late fall of 2008, sitting in a coffee shop in the San Fernando Valley, Collins remembers that day with the kind of clarity the threat of a national security breach evokes: "Three guys came driving toward me in a pickup. I saw they had the aircraft canopy in the back. They offered to take me to my plane." Until that moment, no civilian without a top-secret security clearance had ever laid eyes on the airplane Collins was flying. "I told them not to go near the aircraft. I said it had a nuclear weapon on-board." The story fit right into the Cold War backdrop of the day, as many atomic tests took place in Nevada. Spooked, the men drove Collins to the local highway patrol. The CIA disguised the accident as involving a generic Air Force plane, the F-105, which is how the event is still listed in official records.

As for the guys who picked him up, they were tracked down and told to sign national security nondisclosures. As part of Collins' own debriefing, the CIA asked the decorated pilot to take truth serum. "They wanted to see if there was anything I'd for-gotten about the events leading up to the crash." The Sodium Pento-thal experience went without a hitch--except for the reaction of his wife, Jane.

"Late Sunday, three CIA agents brought me home. One drove my car; the other two carried me inside and laid me down on the couch. I was loopy from the drugs. They handed Jane the car keys and left without saying a word." The only conclusion she could draw was that her husband had gone out and gotten drunk. "Boy, was she mad," says Collins with a chuckle.

At the time of Collins' accident, CIA pilots had been flying spy planes in and out of Area 51 for eight years, with the express mission of providing the intelligence to prevent nuclear war. Aerial reconnaissance was a major part of the CIA's preemptive efforts, while the rest of America built bomb shelters and hoped for the best.

"It wasn't always called Area 51," says Lovick, the physicist who developed stealth technology. His boss, legendary aircraft designer Clarence L. "Kelly" Johnson, called the place Paradise Ranch to entice men to leave their families and "rough it" out in the Nevada desert in the name of science and the fight against the evil empire. "Test pilot Tony LeVier found the place by flying over it," says Lovick. "It was a lake bed called Groom Lake, selected for testing because it was flat and far from anything. It was kept secret because the CIA tested U-2s there."

When Frances Gary Powers was shot down over Sverdlovsk, Russia, in 1960, the U-2 program lost its cover. But the CIA already had Lovick and some 200 scientists, engineers and pilots working at Area 51 on the A-12 OXCART, which would outfox Soviet radar using height, stealth and speed.

Col. Slater was in the outfit of six pilots who flew OXCART missions during the Vietnam War. Over a Cuban meat and cheese sandwich at the Bahama Breeze restaurant off the Las Vegas Strip, he says, "I was recruited for the Area after working with the CIA's classified Black Cat Squadron, which flew U-2 missions over denied territory in Mainland China. After that, I was told, 'You should come out to Nevada and work on something interesting we're doing out there.' "

Even though Slater considers himself a fighter pilot at heart--he flew 84 missions in World War II--the opportunity to work at Area 51 was impossible to pass up. "When I learned about this Mach-3 aircraft called OXCART, it was completely intriguing to me--this idea of flying three times the speed of sound! No one knew a thing about the program. I asked my wife, Barbara, if she wanted to move to Las Vegas, and she said yes. And I said, 'You won't see me but on the weekends,' and she said, 'That's fine!' " At this recollection, Slater laughs heartily. Barbara, dining with us, laughs as well. The two, married for 63 years, are rarely apart today.

"We couldn't have told you any of this a year ago," Slater says. "Now we can't tell it to you fast enough." That is because in 2007, the CIA began declassifying the 50-year-old OXCART program. Today, there's a scramble for eyewitnesses to fill in the information gaps. Only a few of the original players are left. Two more of them join me and the Slaters for lunch: Barnes, formerly an Area 51 special-projects engineer, with his wife, Doris; and Martin, one of those overseeing the OXCART's specially mixed jet fuel (regular fuel explodes at extreme height, temperature and speed), with his wife, Mary. Because the men were sworn to secrecy for so many decades, their wives still get a kick out of hearing the secret tales.

Barnes was married at 17 (Doris was 16). To support his wife, he became an electronics wizard, buying broken television sets, fixing them up and reselling them for five times the original price. He went from living in bitter poverty on a Texas Panhandle ranch with no electricity to buying his new bride a dream home before he was old enough to vote. As a soldier in the Korean War, Barnes demonstrated an uncanny aptitude for radar and Nike missile systems, which made him a prime target for recruitment by the CIA--which indeed happened when he was 22. By 30, he was handling nuclear secrets.

"The agency located each guy at the top of a certain field and put us together for the programs at Area 51," says Barnes. As a security precaution, he couldn't reveal his birth name--he went by the moniker Thunder. Coworkers traveled in separate cars, helicopters and airplanes. Barnes and his group kept to themselves, even in the mess hall. "Our special-projects group was the most classified team since the Manhattan Project," he says.

Harry Martin's specialty was fuel. Handpicked by the CIA from the Air Force, he underwent rigorous psychological and physical tests to see if he was up for the job. When he passed, the CIA moved his family to Nevada. Because OXCART had to refuel frequently, the CIA kept supplies at secret facilities around the globe. Martin often traveled to these bases for quality-control checks. He tells of preparing for a top-secret mission from Area 51 to Thule, Greenland. "My wife took one look at me in these arctic boots and this big hooded coat, and she knew not to ask where I was going."

So, what of those urban legends--the UFOs studied in secret, the underground tunnels connecting clandestine facilities? For decades, the men at Area 51 thought they'd take their secrets to the grave. At the height of the Cold War, they cultivated anonymity while pursuing some of the country's most covert projects. Conspiracy theories were left to popular imagination. But in talking with Collins, Lovick, Slater, Barnes and Martin, it is clear that much of the folklore was spun from threads of fact.

As for the myths of reverse engineering of flying saucers, Barnes offers some insight: "We did reverse engineer a lot of foreign technology, including the Soviet MiG fighter jet out at the Area"--even though the MiG wasn't shaped like a flying saucer. As for the underground-tunnel talk, that, too, was born of truth. Barnes worked on a nuclear-rocket program called Project NERVA, inside underground chambers at Jackass Flats, in Area 51's backyard. "Three test-cell facilities were connected by railroad, but everything else was underground," he says.

And the quintessential Area 51 conspiracy--that the Pentagon keeps captured alien spacecraft there, which they fly around in restricted airspace? Turns out that one's pretty easy to debunk. The shape of OXCART was unprece-dented, with its wide, disk-like fuselage designed to carry vast quantities of fuel. Commercial pilots cruising over Nevada at dusk would look up and see the bottom of OXCART whiz by at 2,000-plus mph. The aircraft's tita-nium body, moving as fast as a bullet, would reflect the sun's rays in a way that could make anyone think, UFO.

In all, 2,850 OXCART test flights were flown out of Area 51 while Slater was in charge. "That's a lot of UFO sightings!" Slater adds. Commercial pilots would report them to the FAA, and "when they'd land in California, they'd be met by FBI agents who'd make them sign nondisclosure forms." But not everyone kept quiet, hence the birth of Area 51's UFO lore. The sightings incited uproar in Nevada and the surrounding areas and forced the Air Force to open Project BLUE BOOK to log each claim.

Since only a few Air Force officials were cleared for OXCART (even though it was a joint CIA/USAF project), many UFO sightings raised internal military alarms. Some generals believed the Russians might be sending stealth craft over American skies to incite paranoia and create widespread panic of alien invasion. Today, BLUE BOOK findings are housed in 37 cubic feet of case files at the National Archives--74,000 pages of reports. A keyword search brings up no mention of the top-secret OXCART or Area 51.

Project BLUE BOOK was shut down in 1969--more than a year after OXCART was retired. But what continues at America's most clandestine military facility could take another 40 years to disclose.

ANNIE JACOBSEN is an investigative reporter who sat for more than 500 interviews after she broke the story on terrorists probing commercial airliners. When she isn't digging into intelligence issues for the likes of the National Review, she's snapping together Legos with her two boys.

Black Projects at Groom Lake: Into the 21st Century

Fifty Years of Secret Flight Testing in Nevada

[mcrom901]

because, I suppose, of the oceans, and clouds, and what not. So therefore Mars would look red because of the red soil and stuff.

and what do you exactly mean by "stuff"?