The True Nature of Earthlings

[angel417]

We do wonder about the mysterious.

After all, it is a natural human tendency to do so. Often times intangible elements in life that seem far beyond our ordinary perceptions cannot be immediately grasped through our average understanding, manners of thinking that are inevitably marred by individual beliefs. What we don’t see, what we can’t see, what we can’t touch, and what we simply cannot reach, all appear to us as images or scenes that are not characterized by clarity. Our place is firmly rooted in the present, the duration of current time in which we must engage with others and our surroundings.

So now it is known to us that we, as human beings, tend to both live steadily in the present – the being-centralized boundary of the now – and wander off into a distant field of memories and yearnings that sees no restrictive lines.

Are we really existing and functioning in the realm of physical reality, of substance, and of presence at the same time? Or are we being watched and monitored by an outer, supreme force, an unknown entity that identifies with or represents our beings?

This then leads me to ponder upon the possibility that we are not really all beings but, rather, these outer forces are, and that we are nothing more than physical appearances, transparent in our daily operations with no evident proof that we really are here.

Thank you for taking part in this discussion - happy discussing!

[Lady Amethyst]

Someone told me that we're not really here at all. The sun isn't real. Nothing is real. We're just figments of someone's imagination. IMHO this is a view that I find wishy washy and bizarre, as it doesn't make sense.

[Godsnmbr1]

Well it's by far the most likely situation. From a secular viewpoint, there exists one true reality and then a practically infinite number of simulated (false)realities, yes? It's simple statistics--do you think you're holding the winning ticket or one of the trillions of losing tickets? It's my personal belief that we probably can't even imagine what the true reality is like. Planets? Galaxies? Doubtful. It's our base though, so imagining something different is practically impossible.

Once, while under the influence, I came to the idea that it's the emotions we create that are actually real and we exist merely as tools to aid in their creation. Not too sure where I was going with that one, but like I said--under the influence.

Edit: nice first post btw. We need more intelligent posters like yourself on UM.

Edited June 16, 2009 by Godsnmbr1

[Leonardo]

We do wonder about the mysterious.

After all, it is a natural human tendency to do so. Often times intangible elements in life that seem far beyond our ordinary perceptions cannot be immediately grasped through our average understanding, manners of thinking that are inevitably marred by individual beliefs. What we don’t see, what we can’t see, what we can’t touch, and what we simply cannot reach, all appear to us as images or scenes that are not characterized by clarity. Our place is firmly rooted in the present, the duration of current time in which we must engage with others and our surroundings.

So now it is known to us that we, as human beings, tend to both live steadily in the present – the being-centralized boundary of the now – and wander off into a distant field of memories and yearnings that sees no restrictive lines.

Are we really existing and functioning in the realm of physical reality, of substance, and of presence at the same time? Or are we being watched and monitored by an outer, supreme force, an unknown entity that identifies with or represents our beings?

This then leads me to ponder upon the possibility that we are not really all beings but, rather, these outer forces are, and that we are nothing more than physical appearances, transparent in our daily operations with no evident proof that we really are here.

Thank you for taking part in this discussion - happy discussing!

Good post and an interesting point.

I would ask you, if we are not beings, then how can one explain the state of being without a recursive (and therefore logically false) argument?

[angel417]

Hey!

Thanks for all the responses so far!

I think I have posed a rather complicated question (which seems like a rather tough and broad concept to handle), so I hope I am able to simplify it a little with these simpler and more “understandable” questions:

Many people are positive that we “live in the Now” and that all things are physical and “real.” This may seem undoubtedly true, given our pure conceptions of the tangible elements in life. So, what makes people so sure that we actually do live in the present, the Now? What is there in life (or in anything) that supports this wide assertion?

Also, try to think about things such as blanking out or daydreaming (previously discussed in Angela’s discussion), or anything else that may possibly have to do with not being “conscious” in the present. When we do these things, where are we? Meaning, perhaps, what dimension or plan are we on? And what may possibly be the reason for us to enter these dimensions/planes?

[Leonardo]

Hey!

Thanks for all the responses so far!

I think I have posed a rather complicated question (which seems like a rather tough and broad concept to handle), so I hope I am able to simplify it a little with these simpler and more “understandable” questions:

Hi angel.

I have a question myself, about your past post.

Did you write this because the answers you received weren't what you wanted? Do you think those who replied didn't understand your questions because the responses weren't what you thought they would be?

If so, you might wish to consider that people will respond with their answers to questions of the nature you posed. It is highly unlikely they will respond with your answers to these questions.

Maybe you wish to consider discussing the responses, rather than assume no-one understood your questions?

[Lady Amethyst]

Hey!

Thanks for all the responses so far!

I think I have posed a rather complicated question (which seems like a rather tough and broad concept to handle), so I hope I am able to simplify it a little with these simpler and more “understandable” questions:

Many people are positive that we “live in the Now” and that all things are physical and “real.” This may seem undoubtedly true, given our pure conceptions of the tangible elements in life. So, what makes people so sure that we actually do live in the present, the Now? What is there in life (or in anything) that supports this wide assertion?

Also, try to think about things such as blanking out or daydreaming (previously discussed in Angela’s discussion), or anything else that may possibly have to do with not being “conscious” in the present. When we do these things, where are we? Meaning, perhaps, what dimension or plan are we on? And what may possibly be the reason for us to enter these dimensions/planes?

What makes you think we didn't understand you? Your first post was VERY easy to read.

Your above post makes it only harder for you.

[angel417]

Hey!

I really, really do apologize if some of you thought about it in thatis there way – that I doubted your understanding of my question. To tell the truth, my own question puzzled me a little initially and as a result I had to do some serious thinking about the topic at hand. Also, some of my friends thought the question was really confusing and quite difficult to discuss about, so I thought that it would help to pose some “simpler” questions in order to clarify, or expand, on my bigger question. I absolutely do appreciate all of your responses so far, and I would love to hear more of your insightful ideas.

Although our presence may be situated in the Now, we still may never know exactly, for sure, if the physical realm is the actual home of our beings, the truest and purest form inside the body. It may exist on a spiritual realm, or it may exist on another realm. Also, if it is indeed the Universal Being that is “monitoring” us, then would that also be restricting us and our potential energies (just a thought). The “fragments and energies” that we are composed of seem to linger on after we pass away, and either return to nature, or enter the bodies of other people (bringing in reincarnation) – is this still the present, then? Do these bits of the “original body” (if there is an original body at all … is there?) exist in a different “Now,” a different state of being (that has very much to do, I think, with time and the passing of time)?

Let’s talk about the possible “invisibility” of the Now, the body, the being, the ego-mind … or any other element that reassures us of our presence in the present domain. Why do they reinforce our presence (why are they there?), and what certain qualities or properties do they have that allows us to think that we really are here?

We all think (positively so, I must say) that we live in the present. And that may be so. But we never know, really, what is out there. Yes – out there. This can be referring to another realm, another world, spirits, ghosts, invisible things that float by us … things we can’t see or can’t picture clearly. A rather scientific mode is activated when we say we live in the present because everything we presently see, feel, and touch is made out of particles and materials. But what if we were to think in a non-scientific way? There are always “physical barriers,” but what could this signify about our beings? Are our beings narrow-minded (that really just came from nowhere)?

Just a really straightforward question: Do you think there can be two worlds where we exist at the same time? Why or why not? Also, how can we be so certain the ego-mind is also living in the present (except when it shows flashbacks of the past inside one’s head)? Could it be that the ego-mind is tricking us and not letting us see the real identity of things, or our own real identities?

Again, happy discussing!

Also, if you are interested, you can come join us at “The Transparent Eyeball” forum, a forum which houses many other intriguing discussions!

Here is the link: http://transparency.phpbb9.com/forum.htm

[Lady Amethyst]

Thanks for explaining your post.

[angel417]

Once, while under the influence, I came to the idea that it's the emotions we create that are actually real and we exist merely as tools to aid in their creation. Not too sure where I was going with that one, but like I said--under the influence.

As Godsnmbr1 suggested, it is actually the emotions that we create that are actually defined and characterized as reality. This is really interesting to think about! But where do emotions really come from? Are they a result of the ego-mind, the being, or a combination of both? Our perceptions are inevitably marred by our ego-minds (and their strong domination over the body), and so our emotions and feelings are also a result of our interactions with society, the surrounding environment, etc. Do our emotions represent (and this is just a thought) our consciousness, the awareness of things both within and beyond the body/physical plane? If so, where else could this consciousness interact or exist (on another plane, perhaps – one that is not the one we exist on –?)?

[Lady Amethyst]

Emotions are not restricted to human beings. Animals feel it too. So does everything else in nature. Look at storms. We're all a part of nature and not outside of it.

[behaviour???]

Summing up every creature inside the realm of nature has emotion but we being superior creatures express it

Thanks

B???

[John from Lowell]

As Godsnmbr1 suggested, it is actually the emotions that we create that are actually defined and characterized as reality. This is really interesting to think about! But where do emotions really come from? Are they a result of the ego-mind, the being, or a combination of both? Our perceptions are inevitably marred by our ego-minds (and their strong domination over the body), and so our emotions and feelings are also a result of our interactions with society, the surrounding environment, etc. Do our emotions represent (and this is just a thought) our consciousness, the awareness of things both within and beyond the body/physical plane? If so, where else could this consciousness interact or exist (on another plane, perhaps – one that is not the one we exist on –?)?

I would say it is not so much the emotion as the cultural conditioning that formulates a person's reality perceptions.

Your origional question as to the nature of the human expression is subjective. Those who see our essence as an energetic awareness beyond our human perception of reality will conclude our truest reality embraces the unseen realms. Those who see us as beings limited to provable physical expression only, will not.

In my view, it is not if we have an expanded presence but how we incorporate it in our daily life that matters most.

John

[angel417]

Our ego-minds do adapt to individual experiences and also to social conditioning. This molds its awareness, and perhaps its consciousness, too. But how would you define consciousness in the physical realm? In the spiritual realm? Again, what really is defined as real, and what is not real? Are there some things that are in between, perhaps? (There could always be a neutral state of things). Perhaps reality is also embodied in other things and forms of life, and not just restricted to human beings, the ego-mind, etc. What would be “reality” for these other forms, then?

[John from Lowell]

There are different kinds of reality, as I see it. In the physical realm we have laws of physics. In the non-physical realm these laws do not apply or at the very least are applied differenty. There is no gravity in the non-physical realm.

The same concept applies with a person's perception. Their human conditioning will determine to a large extent their perspectives and their perceptions. This forum is a wonderful example of that. So many different points of view on every subject. Each POV is the primary reality construct for the person. There is in many cases, no way to comprehend another's point of view.

John

[angel417]

The same concept applies with a person's perception. Their human conditioning will determine to a large extent their perspectives and their perceptions. This forum is a wonderful example of that. So many different points of view on every subject. Each POV is the primary reality construct for the person. There is in many cases, no way to comprehend another's point of view.

It is extremely intriguing how you mention that reality comes in the form of one’s point of view and perspectives. These individual ideas are influenced by outer surroundings and the environment, but we all have different perspectives, even though some may only differ slightly. For example, two people may live under the same circumstances and get in touch daily with the same things, the same people, and yet maintain somewhat different perspectives on things. What is this element that determines the differing of perspectives, opinions, etc.? Where does this element come from – within ourselves, our own beings?

[Lady Amethyst]

It is extremely intriguing how you mention that reality comes in the form of one’s point of view and perspectives. These individual ideas are influenced by outer surroundings and the environment, but we all have different perspectives, even though some may only differ slightly. For example, two people may live under the same circumstances and get in touch daily with the same things, the same people, and yet maintain somewhat different perspectives on things. What is this element that determines the differing of perspectives, opinions, etc.? Where does this element come from – within ourselves, our own beings?

Biology, DNA, attitude, starsign, birthsign, experiences, ideals, thoughts, memory, ect ect.

Are you suggesting that being different is wrong?

[John from Lowell]

It is extremely intriguing how you mention that reality comes in the form of one’s point of view and perspectives. These individual ideas are influenced by outer surroundings and the environment, but we all have different perspectives, even though some may only differ slightly. For example, two people may live under the same circumstances and get in touch daily with the same things, the same people, and yet maintain somewhat different perspectives on things. What is this element that determines the differing of perspectives, opinions, etc.? Where does this element come from – within ourselves, our own beings?

Excellant question. Parents often ask themself why their children are so different.

There are energetic imprints, as well as other things, that influence each of us. Some of the strongest imprints we have are from other lifetimes. Those energies sit in our subconscious as an active influence on all that we experience.

I myself see each person's life plan as the greatest influence. As life presents itself to us, our connection to our inner guidance, call it intuition, advises us on those events that are unfolding around us and to us. This is in fact how some of us escape our enviormental conditioning while others do not.

John

[angel417]

Are you suggesting that being different is wrong?

I am suggesting no such thing.

I am merely stating that it is a fact that we are all different, with differing perspectives and opinions, etc. I find that it helps to understand, rather than investigate and scrutinize, the reason behind all this difference between human beings, and therefore learn to both relate to and cooperate with each other more, utilizing the knowledge of our varying identities.

I myself see each person's life plan as the greatest influence. As life presents itself to us, our connection to our inner guidance, call it intuition, advises us on those events that are unfolding around us and to us. This is in fact how some of us escape our enviormental conditioning while others do not.

John, you’ve mentioned an excellent point. I find that lives do not depend solely on things such as fate, chance, or luck, but also depends on the steering of the individual. A person’s “life plan,” as you put it, has the greatest influence in one’s life. Our inner beings guide us into doing, making decisions, and acting – not always to their accord, but often to their voice (instinct, perhaps?). Intuition speaks to the individual, but I suppose that it is up to the individual to decide whether or not he or she shall follow this indicated “plan.” Do you think that past lives (or any other form of life that is not situated in the present) also connect to the “present” intuition? Do you think that perhaps individuals have followed the intuition of other form of life?

[John from Lowell]

John, you’ve mentioned an excellent point. I find that lives do not depend solely on things such as fate, chance, or luck, but also depends on the steering of the individual. A person’s “life plan,” as you put it, has the greatest influence in one’s life. Our inner beings guide us into doing, making decisions, and acting – not always to their accord, but often to their voice (instinct, perhaps?). Intuition speaks to the individual, but I suppose that it is up to the individual to decide whether or not he or she shall follow this indicated “plan.” Do you think that past lives (or any other form of life that is not situated in the present) also connect to the “present” intuition? Do you think that perhaps individuals have followed the intuition of other form of life?

There is an understanding or concept that all energies exist in the Now present moment. The past lives and future potentials are active energies in our subconscious. For example you can consciousally recall an event from your life and re-live the moment from your memory. You can actually re-experience that event. Your subconscious does this with all your lives and all the potential outcomes from every choice you could ever make.

The idea that we are connected to All That Is presents more than a few considerations. I recognize that individuals have followed the influences of other forms of life and other human expressions. I myself am always encouraging a person to be self empowered. A large aspect of that is the part where they are mindful of their thinking. When a thought pops into their head or their intuition suggests it is safe or unsafe to proceed with something, it is good if that person can discern exactly where that guidance or influence is coming from. Those who work in advertising products for consumers are skilled at placing suggestions into the thinking of others. Those in positions of power understand this as well. As a culture we are quite ignorent about how these things take place. There are a number of reasons for why that has happened.

John

[Mr Walker]

For me the answer is very simple.

I exist, ergo i think.

Yup, Descartes got it round the wrong way. Only my existence allows me to think, thus thinking ( and every thing else) is "real," because i am real. Ie everything has an objective reality, and i know this because, to think, i must have a real and organic base to do so. All the rest of my understanding of the known universe must flow from this basic fact. This simplifies life, and gives one a much more credible and practical approach to it, than trying to live by the cogito.

Descartes concept is very interesting, philosophically, and quite neatly/tidily expressed, but in real terms useless to help us understand the nature of ourselves, or our universe.

Whereas, in investigating the nature and reality of our material selves, made self evident by our thoughts, we can also begin to understand the nature and reality of the universe which exists beyond us, and our interconnections with it.

[Leonardo]

For me the answer is very simple.

I exist, ergo i think.

What about a rock, MW?

A rock exists, ergo does it think?

[angel417]

Reality, I believe, cannot be clearly defined now. I have never thought of defining reality, but now it seems to me that the defining agent originates from one’s own perspectives, one’s own thoughts. It is somewhat like asking the identity of things – “What is this?” It is like asking the material of things, questioning the structuring of things. Some things such as the reality of things around us cannot be labeled, and so it is the mind that must wonder, while the heart must live with something else – that is the present, I think, the Now. You define what is real, because you are real in life, whatever that may be defined as. If you believe that love is reality, it is reality. If you believe that time is what is real, then time is what is real. It is the present in which one constructs these “definitions,” these labels. I strongly believe that the Now is part of reality, if not what completely is interpreted as the core of reality. All else is really a matter of personal decision, of individual engagement with the world; the interaction that one acquires with everything outside one’s body all have the possibility of being real, of being part of what defines reality.

[jordiver]

please people grab some phylosophy books from a guy called jean-jaques rousseau and read.

In my opinion, reincarnation doesnt happen and life plans are whatever you make for yourself, there is no fate or destiny for any of us, just what you make and create for yourself (similar to terminator eh). Everyone is different from each other cause they are taught different from their parents and learn different things from the outside world as they grow up.

It is extremely intriguing how you mention that reality comes in the form of one’s point of view and perspectives. These individual ideas are influenced by outer surroundings and the environment, but we all have different perspectives, even though some may only differ slightly. For example, two people may live under the same circumstances and get in touch daily with the same things, the same people, and yet maintain somewhat different perspectives on things. What is this element that determines the differing of perspectives, opinions, etc.? Where does this element come from – within ourselves, our own beings?

I think its explained above.

[Set the Fallen]

To be or not to be...

Are we flickers of imagination? Are we a alien experiment or are humans even real? Are earthlings real?

As the time evarops over the horizion it becomes clear to some, that time is not in existence. It is only the "now", the reaction that is. Nothing can go back in the reaction, because the evolution and growth can't turn back without a oposit.

If it is about the nature of earthlings, I can say there is only one for each living thing. To live, or rather exist.

It does not mater how it starts in the end, as long as we learn how to comprehend and co-exist with the world. If we are real or not is not determind by someones imagination dreaming us along, no, it is us. We determind... or rater, we should be. Spiritual or with a body based on molocyls, in the end, we are all in one present, and that is now as energy of everything. We created this world we live in, so we should live it like we always wished for.