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Muslim Europe


DC09
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Lottie

I said "maybe work". I want a European passport mainly for education, and maybe for business in the future (if i'll start my own startup, i'll need a European passport to more easily do business with other Europeans, cause Europe is a large market).

I do not intent to leave my homeland for good because I love it and it's quite good to live here, despite what you see in the news. Israel is a very successful country in terms of high-tech and startups.

The Nazi's however were not Europe.

Many nations collaborated happily with the Nazi beasts, only to get rid of their Jewish population.

Europe is a great place to live and work and raise our generations.

Not for the French Jews, who can no longer walk freely on the streets, and which their graveyards are being disicrated and their schools burnt. This actions are mainly caused because of large muslim population in France.

If it wasn't why do we have thousands of immigrants on our doorsteps seeking asylum?

If you'll notice, most of these immigrants are from third-world countries or dictatorships (Arabs, Chinese, Pakistanians, Iranians), so ofcourse they will immigrate to Europe and the U.S, because there the conditions are better than their own countries.

But the fact that you compare me to other immigrants, isn't that fair. Let me give you an example:

In the future, Britain is become a dictatorship. A British couple is fleding outside the country to America, and they are forced to give their British citizenship on their way out, together with all their personal property. A child is being born in the U.S to that couple. Meanwhile, 20 years later, Britain is again liberated and becomes a democracy. It offers all it's former citizens to get back their citizenships. The British couple get's back their British citizenship, so that their child could learn in a British university.

Will you consider the couple and their offspring a foriegn immigrants?!

If not, why would you consider me and my mother (who was born in Europe) foriegn immigrants, "of the worst kind"?!

Edited by Erikl
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Many nations collaborated happily with the Nazi beasts, only to get rid of their Jewish population.

I'm sorry, what version of World War 2 is this? huh.gif Does the very concept of "the war in Europe" not suggest that European powers were actually fighting Hitler? rolleyes.gif

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I'm sorry, what version of World War 2 is this?  Does the very concept of "the war in Europe" not suggest that European powers were actually fighting Hitler?

Some countries fought Hitler (USSR and Britian), all other were occupied by or allied with him, except from Spain, Portugal, Sweden and Swiss who were neutral states.

On a positive note, Denmark should be mentioned as the only one of the only countries, together with Finland, that altough were occupied (Denmark) or allied with the Nazis (Finland), protected their Jews in all cause, in every level of the population.

Edited by Erikl
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I said "maybe work". I want a European passport mainly for education, and maybe for business in the future (if i'll start my own startup, i'll need a European passport to more easily do business with other Europeans, cause Europe is a large market).

Aha! So Europe is a great place to live in then. See you have contradicted yourself yet again.

Not for the French Jews, who can no longer walk freely on the streets, and which their graveyards are being disicrated and their schools burnt. This actions are mainly caused because of large muslim population in France.

I feel as badly as you about this. As you may have read in another post there was a subtle hint I added about Jewish connections. This makes me feel very sad that this is happening in France.

However this is a small minority of mindless scumbags creating this problem. It is not the general population of France. And France by the way is only one small part of Europe.

Will you consider the couple and their offspring a foriegn immigrants?!

If not, why would you consider me and my mother (who was born in Europe) foriegn immigrants, "of the worst kind"?!

I have never said that you were the worst kind. I did not see that you and your mother are desendants of a European state. I would consider you and your mother in that case to have the legal right to live in Europe as a citizen of Europe.

However there is one small problem here. Your and others total dislike for what Europe is and stands for and yet you want a passport? This is what I cannot tolerate. This in turn makes it harder for the people who want to genuinely live in Europe again to gain that privalidge because of a minority who totally dis-respects and shows anger and hatred towards our nations.

Edited by Lottie
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Aha! So Europe is a great place to live in then. See you have contradicted yourself yet again.

I never said it wasn't , I said I dont envy Europeans for being Europeans. I said it wasn't a great honour to be European, as that there is nothing special in it (except that in this period of time Europe is on the rise, just as 1,000 years ago China and the Islamic world were).

It is not the general population of France. And France by the way is only one small part of Europe.

The problem is, that the general population there don't care about it and the politicians are anti-Israeli to win Muslim vote.

And France is one of the most important countries in the EU.

However there is one small problem here. Your and others total dislike for what Europe is and stands for and yet you want a passport? This is what I cannot tolerate. This in turn makes it harder for the people who want to genuinely live in Europe again to gain that privalidge because of a minority who totally dis-respects and shows anger and hatred towards our nations.

My only problem is that the EU is so anti-Israeli and pro-Arab, to the point that it sickens me, because of Arab oil and large Arab minorities.

I hope that the new EU members will balance this policy out because they don't have large Arab minorites nor do they depenence on Arab oil.

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Some countries fought Hitler (USSR and Britian), all other were occupied by or allied with him, except from Spain, Portugal, Sweden and Swiss.

I think you need to read up on World War II.

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Because you seem to have very little knowledge of what you are talking about.

Some countries fought Hitler (USSR and Britian), all other were occupied by or allied with him, except from Spain, Portugal, Sweden and Swiss.
Here are some details you may be interested in:

World War II is the most extensive and costly armed conflict in the history of the world, involving the great majority of the world's nations, being fought simultaneously in several major theaters, and costing approximately 50 million lives. The war was fought mainly between an alliance of the United States, the Soviet Union, China and Britain (known as the Allies), and the Axis Powers, an alliance between Germany, Italy and Japan. Most of the fighting occurred in the European theater in and around Europe, and in the Asian theater in the Pacific and East Asia.

Axis Powers (signers of the Tripartite Treaty)

* Germany

* Italy

* Japan

Co-signatories of the Tripartite Treaty

* Hungary (November 20th, 1940)

* Romania (November 23rd, 1940)

* Slovakia(1) (November 24th, 1940)

* Bulgaria (March 1st, 1941)

* Yugoslavia (March 25th, 1941)(3)

Countries that were annexed by, or at war with, Axis Powers before World War II

* Austria (annexed by Germany, "Anschluss", March 13th, 1938)

* Czechoslovakia (Sudetenland annexed by Germany, October 10th, 1938)

* Ethiopia (annexed by Italy in 1936, after the Abyssinia crisis, independence restored in 1941)

* Korea (made a colony of Japan in 1910)

* Republic of China (at war with Japan since 1931)

Allied Powers

* Australia

* Brazil (from August 1942)

* Canada

* France and her colonies

* New Zealand

* Poland

* South Africa

* Soviet Union (from June 1941)

* United Kingdom and the British Empire.

* United States (from December 1941)

Countries that were attacked, occupied, or switched sides during the war

(Most countries below had declared their neutrality before being assaulted. )

* Albania (occupied by Italy April 7th 1939, by Germany September 26th 1943)

* Belgium (invaded by Germany May 10th 1940)

* Czechoslovakia(1) (Bohemia and Moravia occupied by Germany March 15th 1939)

* Denmark (occupied by Germany April 9th 1940, Greenland occupied by USA April 9th 1941)

* Estonia (annexed by the Soviet Union June 18th 1940, occupied by Germany September 5th 1941, re-annexed by the Soviet Union in 1944)

* Finland (attacked by the Soviet Union November 30th 1939 and June 26th 1941)

* Greece (invaded by Italy October 28th 1940, German occupation from April 6th 1941)

* Iceland (occupied by Britain May 10th 1940, by USA from July 1941)

* Iran (occupied by Britain and the Soviet Union, August 1941 to May 1946)

* Latvia (annexed by the Soviet Union June 18th 1940, occupied by Germany June 25th 1941, re-annexed by the Soviet Union in 1944)

* Lithuania (annexed by the Soviet Union June 18th 1940, occupied by Germany June 22nd 1941, re-annexed by the Soviet Union in 1944)

* Luxembourg (invaded by Germany May 10th 1940)

* The Netherlands (invaded by Germany May 10th 1940)

* New Guinea (occupied by Japan, September 1942-August 1945)

* Norway (invaded by Germany April 9th 1940)

* Philippines (occupied by Japan, December 1941-June 1945)

* Syria (occupied by Free French and British, June 1940-April 1946

* Thailand (Occupied by Japan, declared war on the United States and United Kingdom on January 25, 1942)

* Tunisia (Used by Italian and German troops to attack Egypt. Later occupied by Allied forces)

Supporters of the Allies

* Argentina

* Bolivia

* Chile

* Colombia

* Costa Rica

* Cuba

* Dominican Republic

* Ecuador

* Egypt

* El Salvador

* Guatemala

* Haiti

* Honduras

* Iraq

* Lebanon

* Liberia

* Mexico

* Mongolia

* Nicaragua

* Panama

* Paraguay

* Peru

* Saudi Arabia

* Turkey

* Venezuela

Countries that remained nominally neutral

* Andorra

* Ireland

* Liechtenstein

* Portugal

* Spain

* Sweden (with exception for the Winter War)

* Switzerland

* Uruguay

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There is really nothing else that I can say. I see this thread now only as a desperate attempt by yourself to try and salvage something...

Game over, I am out of hee for now...

Edited by Lottie
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* Sigh *... Lottie, you should pay more attention... me and Sera were talking about the European campaign, not the entire global balance of powers.

Sera said:

Does the very concept of "the war in Europe" not suggest that European powers were actually fighting Hitler?

And I corrected her by saying that except the USSR and Britain, all "other [states] were occupied by or allied with him, except from Spain, Portugal, Sweden and Swiss who were neutral states."

Ofcourse there were many other countries involved in this war, this is why it is called WORLD war.

But the Nazis only worked in Europe, Western Asia, and North Africa. This is where them and their collaborators butchered Jews.

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And I corrected her by saying that except the USSR and Britain, all "other [states] were occupied by or allied with him, except from Spain, Portugal, Sweden and Swiss who were neutral states."

You didn't "correct me" on any such thing tongue.gif I just saw no more fun in arguing with someone who was obviously so far out of their league.

For a start, most of the European powers that joined with Hitler did not do so out of a "desire to get rid of their Jewish population"; they did so because there were either terrified of Hitler, or even more terrified of the U.S.S.R.

You know, I think it's time you realised the world doesn't revolve around Jews, and the persecution of it huh.gif

Also "occupied by" does not mean "cooperating with". Most of the countries mentioned that were occupied were taken by force, and it was Hitler's regime that continued the butchering there, not the state itself. You can't exactly claim the countries are to blame if you're physically overpowered, and their own people are executed by a hostile occupation force huh.gif

In any event, as has been stated, Europe owes you and your people absolutely nothing. In fact, when Israil was returned to your people, it has gone on to be the centre of almost all of the problems in the middle east, evolving into a violent, blood thirsty nation, just as (if not more) eager to annihilate its neighbours as any fundamentalist Islamic regime.

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Wrong Wrong Wrong

For a start, most of the European powers that joined with Hitler did not do so out of a "desire to get rid of their Jewish population"; they did so because there were either terrified of Hitler, or even more terrified of the U.S.S.R.

I didn't talked about countries that allied themselves with Hitler, I talked about nations who killed their own Jewish population and found the Nazi cause to be on the same line as their's in regarding the treatment of their Jewish population.

I obviously mentioned Finland which was an ally to Nazi Germany but didn't annihilate it's Jews.

Romania, on the other hand, and Hungary, most of the Baltic states and Yugoslavsia were all glad to get rid of their Jewish minorities.

You know, I think it's time you realised the world doesn't revolve around Jews, and the persecution of it

This just shows youre understanding about WW2. That war was about ideology, nothing more. There was no real excuse to it other than Nazi ideology to revange the world and conquer it.

Hitler executed his ideology down to little details. He wanted to creat a New World Order, where Jews do not exist and all Slavs are slaves to what he considered the "Superb Aryan Race", which included all Germanic languages speakers and the Finns and Balts.

So that war was revolving around Jews and their distruction.

You could see it very clearly in the end of the war, when Hitler knew he is going to lose it all, but didn't cut any resources from the death-camp machine, even though he needed everything in order to fight the Soviets and the Allies.

Also "occupied by" does not mean "cooperating with". Most of the countries mentioned that were occupied were taken by force, and it was Hitler's regime that continued the butchering there, not the state itself. You can't exactly claim the countries are to blame if you're physically overpowered, and their own people are executed by a hostile occupation force

Again, no knowledge of WW2 events.

The countries that were occupied by Germany were either annexed to the Third Reich (Poland and Czechoslovakia) or became Nazi states ruled by local Nazi Parties. The Ustashe in Yugoslavia, the fascist regimes of Hungary and Romania (who was a Fascist state even before the war), the Balts, the Vishi regime etc..

All those local Nazi regimes executed the "Final Solution" in their own states, except Denmark, and to some degree Bulgaria.

The most hurrible collaborators were the Ukrainians, Polish (even the partisan militias shot Jews that escaped death camps... the Polish partisans hated Jews more than they hated the Nazis, even though the Nazis killed 3 million non-Jewish Polish people), Romanians, Croats and Balts.

Even after the war, jews that tried to get back to their houses were lynched by hostile local mob.

As for youre last paragraph, I'm not even going to respect that bunch of lies and rubbish with an answer.

It's just saddens me to see that some Europeans found a way to feel less bad about the Holocaust by equating Israelis to Nazis. I guess that is one way of collective therapy. I'm just glad not all (and I hope most) Europeans act this way.

Edited by Erikl
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So that war was revolving around Jews and their distruction.

Actually, it was revolving around Hitler trying to take over the world (or at the very least Europe) The "final solution to the Jewish problem", the holocaust, was not aimed solely at Jews, but just about anyone who disagreed with Hitler's definition of his master race. It wasn't Hitler's primary objective to annihilate the Jews...it was simply part of his eventual plan for racial purity.

Certainly, he hated Jews...but his attempt at conquest was motivated by many other factors...wanting revenge for the first world war...feeling that Germany had become "weak", and wanting to disprove this...nationalism stretching into the realm of insanity were far larger contributers to Hitler's motivation than simply "I really hate those Jews...I think I'll wipe them out."

It's my observation that Jewish people in general love to remind people about how much they've suffered, and how they've been persecuted here there and everywhere...in the case of World War two, you were just one group among many who Hitler saught to annihilate.

The countries that were occupied by Germany were either annexed to the Third Reich (Poland and Czechoslovakia) or became Nazi by itself by local Nazi Parties. The Ustashe in Yugoslavia, the fascist regimes of Hungary and Romania (who was a Fascist state even before the war), the Batls, the Vishi regime etc..

Those aren't countries that were "occupied", as Lottie's source states directly, there were Co-signatories of the Tripartite Treaty.

It's just saddens me to see that some Europeans found a way to feel less bad about the Holocaust by equating Israelis to Nazis. I guess that is one way of collective therapy. I'm just glad not all (and I hope most) Europeans act this way.

For one, I have no reason t feel bad about the holocaust in the first place; while I believe it was a tragic example of genuine evil, and while I the possibility of it ever happening again, neither myself, nor my country, are in any way to blame for it. I say again, we owe you nothing.

In any event, in that instant, I wasn't equating you to nazis, I was equating you to religious fundamentalists; your country has attacked almost every single one of its neighbours, and is currently attempting to ethnicly cleanse the palistinians....don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge fan of your opposition either, however I do see a huge difference in acts of violence from a few minority terrorist cells, and the acts of genocide commited directly by your government and military.

I don't expect a responce from you...to be quite frank, if I lived in your country, I think I'd be as defensive as you are. However, since I'm an outside observer, I work with the facts as I see them...and those facts don't speak very well for your government, or what little effort is being made on either side for even a semblance of peace.

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Final opportunity to get back and stay on topic. thumbsup.gif

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Okay, back on topic then tongue.gif

Is Europe turning into an Islamic state?

No huh.gif That's the short answer...the long answer would probably include an addressing of the assylum seeker inssue, posative discrimination, and so on and so forth...but it would still come out as a "no".

Just to know where we stand, is there anyone who actually thinks it IS turning into an Islamic state?

See, I can help get back on topic when I try cool.gif Try reeeeaaal hard.

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Phantom, I'll get back to topic very soon...

just one last response... OK?

It wasn't Hitler's primary objective to annihilate the Jews...it was simply part of his eventual plan for racial purity

Ofcourse, I forgot the Gypsies and Homosexuals and mentaly ills.

But Hitler and the Nazis saw Jews and Communists (being Jews as they saw it) as their primary enemy. If you want to understand this hatred, you should see the movie "Europa Europa" (Germany, 1991) and read "The rise and fall of the Third Reich" by William Shirer.

The Nazis saw that war as a war against the Jews, as he saw they saw them as the main enemy of the "Aryan Race". Surely, other "lower" races were to be mass murdered, like Poles and Slavs in general (who had to be mass-murdered inorder to be inslave the remainers to the Germans).

It's my observation that Jewish people in general love to remind people about how much they've suffered, and how they've been persecuted here there and everywhere...in the case of World War two, you were just one group among many who Hitler saught to annihilate.

Not "here and there and everywhere", but mainly in Europe. In Asia, Africa and other places, we lived pretty good untill the last century.

In the case of WW2 - the facts are against youre words.

Those aren't countries that were "occupied", as Lottie's source states directly, there were Co-signatories of the Tripartite Treaty.

Poland and Czechoslovakia were occupied and annexed into the Third Reich. They no longer were a soveign states.

As for Yugoslavia - it was occupied by German and Italian forces and the local Nazi party (they called themselves "Ustashe") took over the country.

Hungary was filled with German troops.

Romania indeed was an (Axis) ally, but German troops were there too.

France was occupied and splitted into two parts: the north that was annexed to Germany, and the south that was to become "The Vishi government", who was a local Nazi party that built there a Nazi state.

I say again, we owe you nothing

You know what? you are right. We don't want from you anything, but just leave us alone and stop messing in our politics.

As for my European passport - I have every right to get one, and it doesn't matter if I'm not living in Europe right now. More than 60 generations (at least) of my forefathers are burried in Europe. I have every right to get the benefits you get.

your country has attacked almost every single one of its neighbours, and is currently attempting to ethnicly cleanse the palistinians

Simply not true and lack of knowledge in the middle-east conflict's history.

I work with the facts as I see them...

You said the magic word "as I see them". You obviously don't see the truth.

Anyway, after getting this out of my system, I'm ready to get back to topic... next post tongue.gif

Edited by Erikl
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So, will Europe become muslim?

Only the future can answer that...

Just remeber that it was done a couple of times in the past:

Spain became Islamic state in the 8th century and became Christian again only in 1492.

The Byzantine Empire, the once strong hold of Eastern Christianity, became Muslim in 1453, and never became Christian again.

So there is an historic presenedce to such possibility...

The question is, will it happen again, and in what state will it happen?

Edited by Erikl
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Its not gonna become a mulslim state. END OF.

I think you should close this thread as its just a vehicle for anti-muslim FANATICS to scaremonger with no real fact or reason.

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I think you should close this thread as its just a vehicle for anti-muslim FANATICS to scaremonger with no real fact or reason.

Agreed. It became a thread of Muslim and IMMIGRANTS-in-general bashing by racists and other backwarded people.

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Im glad you admit to yourself being a racist as your views on muslims clearly is.

An your views on anti-muslim immigration, which you seem to justify by the pointing out that the governments become anit-jewish.

BY THE WAY ONE LAST HILARIOUS POINT FOR YOU. IMMIGRANTS CANT VOTE IN THIS COUNTRY . LOL LOL LOL.

So how they could influence the government is beyond me.

Just highlighting your blind ignorance.

Remmeber the world doesnt revolve around Jews. Believe it or not i could go for weeks without even thinking about jews. SHOCK HORROR. lol

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LOL!

Im glad you admit to yourself being a racist as your views on muslims clearly is

LOL! tongue.gif

Look at your earlier posts and see who is the real racist:

Hes the worst kinda sponger. Exactly the type of immigrant that you yourself lottie are so dead against.

They are the immigrants i am against as well.

New laws are in place for the UK now neway so people from these new member states cannot come to sponge.

LOL...

An your views on anti-muslim immigration, which you seem to justify by the pointing out that the governments become anit-jewish.

BY THE WAY ONE LAST HILARIOUS POINT FOR YOU. IMMIGRANTS CANT VOTE IN THIS COUNTRY . LOL LOL LOL.

So how they could influence the government is beyond me.

Just highlighting your blind ignorance.

I wasn't talking about Britain. Remmeber the world doesnt revolve around Brits. Believe it or not i could go for weeks without even thinking about Britain. SHOCK HORROR. lol

I was talking about Europe in general, mainly France, who it's muslim population can vote. Other members are simply bought by Arab oil.

And I'm not the one getting panic by muslim immigration, Mr. "Its not gonna become a mulslim state. END OF.

". I don't care wether or not Europe does become muslim, because I don't live there.

What I do care for, is that Jewish life in Europe won't become harsh by muslim immigrants who taking the middle-east violance into Europe's streets.

And ofcourse as long as Europe has international influence, I wouldn't like the muslim immigration to influence European attitude towards Israel, which is already pretty bad.

We already have the OPEC influence on the UN and Western Europe. We don't need other factors to make Europe even more biased in the conflict (that's why I'm glad the new members got into the EU. They do not dependnce their economy on Arab oils and they do not have large muslim voice).

EDIT: For example, I would support the EU's decision to let Turkey into the EU, because the Turkish people are largely pro-Israeli and Turkish government is pro-Israeli. So it's really not an issue of religion or race (as I stated several times here but you continue to ignore this, it's a question of wether I find it usefull for me and my country, and for peace of all.

Edited by Erikl
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Hes the worst kinda sponger. Exactly the type of immigrant that you yourself lottie are so dead against.

They are the immigrants i am against as well.

New laws are in place for the UK now neway so people from these new member states cannot come to sponge.

Im not racist im anti-sponger whatever their race whether their from my own country or an immigrant. do u actually know what a sponger is?

It isnt a racist term lol.

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The fact that you call immigrants "spongers" show your true colors.

It's like some racist American sotherners call immigrants "aliens".

Calling immigrants "spongers" isn't better than calling 'em PARASITES.

That WAS a racist comment.

Edited by Erikl
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