What would it take.

[Mr Walker]

Many of the people I know in real life thought that I would certainly lose my faith over the negative personal events that have befallen me this past year. In fact, I was directly questioned about it on numerous occasions, especially by those who do not believe in God. Over and over I was asked, how can you still believe in God as your life falls apart around you??? Indeed, the life that I had known, and been accustomed to for the past several years was suddenly and viciously uprooted. I quite literally see myself in a position that I thought I would never be in. At first I was silent to these questions. My answer was that of Job "Though You slay me, yet will I trust in You." But this did little to help the bitterness, the anger, and the loneliness that I was suddenly facing. My faith did not waver in the slightest, yet still, I could not understand WHY these things were happening to me. I had never been in this position before. I had suffered pain without God, as a former atheist. But never WITH God. Yet, that WITH, in capital letters, was the answer to my own question. The God who I know, the God who I follow, faced solitude and despair; the God I know, the God I follow, was rejected, spat upon, beaten and humiliated in the streets. The God who I know, the God who I follow, was nailed to the tallest tree, the highest hill, outside of the city.

A strange thing began to happen to me. I began to rejoice in my suffering. I began to THANK God for it. For it was in this darkness, that I truly began to see the power of His Light. People I know were asking me 'how can you be so happy?' 'I don't see how you can be dealing with all of this so well.'

I had spent so many years chasing after the gods of other religions, so many years trying to explain away the concept of suffering....but it was not until I began to suffer myself, that I realized MY God, is not only the God who suffered FOR me, but who suffers WITH me. I never understood the power of the Cross until I was raised to my own. I praise God every day for sending me these trials, as it was in the midst of them that He brought me back to the foot of the Cross. At the worst devestations in my life I did not find my solace in Krishna. I did not find it in Buddha. I found it in Christ. THEY told me how to escape or master my pain. Christ told me I SUFFER WITH YOU.

Ironic that someone who studied comparative religions for over a decade would come to a point when all of it meant nothing.

But this is the way of the God I have been dodging for so long. He wounds so that He might heal. I praise God for every trial, and every suffering, for in this comes faith. Faith that when all the things I have read, and all the words I have written over the years are so much straw.

CS Lewis once said that pain is God's megaphone to rouse a deaf world. I am living proof of this, in spite of all I THOUGHT I knew.

What is faith WITHOUT suffering? Indeed, we suffer either with God or without Him. But the God I truly know, above all the others I have sought, is the one who comes down and suffers with us. It only takes me a disaster to realize it lol.

What would it take for me to lose my faith? I don't think it is possible. Even if I fall to a Job like state again. And I have been an atheist. So no argument would ever convince me. I've lost people I love to illness and death. I've lost a close friend to suicide. I've watched my relationship fall apart. I know that I will die; that this body will suffer, but I know that I am not this body. I really can't think of anything. Though I fail in my walk with Him as often as not, I will always love God.

Thats a powerful, intelligent, and articulate, personal revelation. It doesnt matter if it is a personal truth, or a wider social one, in that it has served a very real and effective purpose in your life.

It also puts the lie to some personal opinions that faith /belief, because it may not be perceived as rational, can not serve real and effective purposes . It aso exposes, as a false understanding, the belief that an intelligent, logical, person, capable of self examination, reflection and analysis will reject the spiritual elements of life as; unworkable, unrealistic, and unhelpful.

Perhaps, also, the other faiths were right for your life as it was then, but you have found the specfic revelations offered by christianity to have specific relevance to your life now. Christianity began as the faith of a persecuted minority; and it still offers, perhaps, more to the suffering and needy than it does to those to whom life appears good and contented.

[IamsSon]

Many of the people I know in real life thought that I would certainly lose my faith over the negative personal events that have befallen me this past year. In fact, I was directly questioned about it on numerous occasions, especially by those who do not believe in God. Over and over I was asked, how can you still believe in God as your life falls apart around you??? Indeed, the life that I had known, and been accustomed to for the past several years was suddenly and viciously uprooted. I quite literally see myself in a position that I thought I would never be in. At first I was silent to these questions. My answer was that of Job "Though You slay me, yet will I trust in You." But this did little to help the bitterness, the anger, and the loneliness that I was suddenly facing. My faith did not waver in the slightest, yet still, I could not understand WHY these things were happening to me. I had never been in this position before. I had suffered pain without God, as a former atheist. But never WITH God. Yet, that WITH, in capital letters, was the answer to my own question. The God who I know, the God who I follow, faced solitude and despair; the God I know, the God I follow, was rejected, spat upon, beaten and humiliated in the streets. The God who I know, the God who I follow, was nailed to the tallest tree, the highest hill, outside of the city.

A strange thing began to happen to me. I began to rejoice in my suffering. I began to THANK God for it. For it was in this darkness, that I truly began to see the power of His Light. People I know were asking me 'how can you be so happy?' 'I don't see how you can be dealing with all of this so well.'

I had spent so many years chasing after the gods of other religions, so many years trying to explain away the concept of suffering....but it was not until I began to suffer myself, that I realized MY God, is not only the God who suffered FOR me, but who suffers WITH me. I never understood the power of the Cross until I was raised to my own. I praise God every day for sending me these trials, as it was in the midst of them that He brought me back to the foot of the Cross. At the worst devestations in my life I did not find my solace in Krishna. I did not find it in Buddha. I found it in Christ. THEY told me how to escape or master my pain. Christ told me I SUFFER WITH YOU.

Ironic that someone who studied comparative religions for over a decade would come to a point when all of it meant nothing.

But this is the way of the God I have been dodging for so long. He wounds so that He might heal. I praise God for every trial, and every suffering, for in this comes faith. Faith that when all the things I have read, and all the words I have written over the years are so much straw.

CS Lewis once said that pain is God's megaphone to rouse a deaf world. I am living proof of this, in spite of all I THOUGHT I knew.

What is faith WITHOUT suffering? Indeed, we suffer either with God or without Him. But the God I truly know, above all the others I have sought, is the one who comes down and suffers with us. It only takes me a disaster to realize it lol.

What would it take for me to lose my faith? I don't think it is possible. Even if I fall to a Job like state again. And I have been an atheist. So no argument would ever convince me. I've lost people I love to illness and death. I've lost a close friend to suicide. I've watched my relationship fall apart. I know that I will die; that this body will suffer, but I know that I am not this body. I really can't think of anything. Though I fail in my walk with Him as often as not, I will always love God.

Brahmana,

Thank you for sharing this testimony with us! Any thing else I say will take away from the strength of it.

[+Sherapy]

Many of the people I know in real life thought that I would certainly lose my faith over the negative personal events that have befallen me this past year. In fact, I was directly questioned about it on numerous occasions, especially by those who do not believe in God. Over and over I was asked, how can you still believe in God as your life falls apart around you??? Indeed, the life that I had known, and been accustomed to for the past several years was suddenly and viciously uprooted. I quite literally see myself in a position that I thought I would never be in. At first I was silent to these questions. My answer was that of Job "Though You slay me, yet will I trust in You." But this did little to help the bitterness, the anger, and the loneliness that I was suddenly facing. My faith did not waver in the slightest, yet still, I could not understand WHY these things were happening to me. I had never been in this position before. I had suffered pain without God, as a former atheist. But never WITH God. Yet, that WITH, in capital letters, was the answer to my own question. The God who I know, the God who I follow, faced solitude and despair; the God I know, the God I follow, was rejected, spat upon, beaten and humiliated in the streets. The God who I know, the God who I follow, was nailed to the tallest tree, the highest hill, outside of the city.

A strange thing began to happen to me. I began to rejoice in my suffering. I began to THANK God for it. For it was in this darkness, that I truly began to see the power of His Light. People I know were asking me 'how can you be so happy?' 'I don't see how you can be dealing with all of this so well.'

I had spent so many years chasing after the gods of other religions, so many years trying to explain away the concept of suffering....but it was not until I began to suffer myself, that I realized MY God, is not only the God who suffered FOR me, but who suffers WITH me. I never understood the power of the Cross until I was raised to my own. I praise God every day for sending me these trials, as it was in the midst of them that He brought me back to the foot of the Cross. At the worst devestations in my life I did not find my solace in Krishna. I did not find it in Buddha. I found it in Christ. THEY told me how to escape or master my pain. Christ told me I SUFFER WITH YOU.

Ironic that someone who studied comparative religions for over a decade would come to a point when all of it meant nothing.

But this is the way of the God I have been dodging for so long. He wounds so that He might heal. I praise God for every trial, and every suffering, for in this comes faith. Faith that when all the things I have read, and all the words I have written over the years are so much straw.

CS Lewis once said that pain is God's megaphone to rouse a deaf world. I am living proof of this, in spite of all I THOUGHT I knew.

What is faith WITHOUT suffering? Indeed, we suffer either with God or without Him. But the God I truly know, above all the others I have sought, is the one who comes down and suffers with us. It only takes me a disaster to realize it lol.

What would it take for me to lose my faith? I don't think it is possible. Even if I fall to a Job like state again. And I have been an atheist. So no argument would ever convince me. I've lost people I love to illness and death. I've lost a close friend to suicide. I've watched my relationship fall apart. I know that I will die; that this body will suffer, but I know that I am not this body. I really can't think of anything. Though I fail in my walk with Him as often as not, I will always love God.

well brahmana

when we love without conditions all that ever matters is that the object of our love is happy and it may not include us one day....

probably as a parent it gives me an edge in this as we do not posses anyone or anything and its in the times we let go with no strings we begin to understand the essence of love.....

in unconditional love we never lose or suffer , if we do then we have not truly loved.....nor do we understand what love is and these moments are truly gifts we send ourselves.....enjoy your moments as its in these that we realize its only about letting go,its in the letting go you will meet love....and it will not ask you to suffer for it.........

i appreciate your post, ......and its really admirable how much you are trying to understand yourself and question where your faith fits in.... .all the best.

[Irish]

Brahmana; Thanks for the wonderful and inspiring post, we as humans cannot truly appreciate joy if we have never experienced suffering.

We should welcome even adversity and live our lives to the fullest as Jesus promised to help us achieve with lots of fun and challenges, laughter, joy sorrow, pain and tears are all about being human being. He became human to experience what we go through in the fullest extent.

As for the OP question, one can not stop believing if they truly have experienced God because it is now a memory as well as an ongoing experience.

You can not stop believing what you have seen and felt and experienced, no matter what you do or think because it is a part of what you are inside.

If I personally wanted to deny the existence of God I would first have to deny my own truth and existence which is not possible because I am sitting here replying to this thread.

Once you enter into a personal relationship with Him there is No going back, No doubts, and No regrets. I could no more deny His existence and love than I could my own earthly father.

[Lt_Ripley]

Brahmana; Thanks for the wonderful and inspiring post, we as humans cannot truly appreciate joy if we have never experienced suffering.

We should welcome even adversity and live our lives to the fullest as Jesus promised to help us achieve with lots of fun and challenges, laughter, joy sorrow, pain and tears are all about being human being. He became human to experience what we go through in the fullest extent.

As for the OP question, one can not stop believing if they truly have experienced God because it is now a memory as well as an ongoing experience.

You can not stop believing what you have seen and felt and experienced, no matter what you do or think because it is a part of what you are inside.

If I personally wanted to deny the existence of God I would first have to deny my own truth and existence which is not possible because I am sitting here replying to this thread.

Once you enter into a personal relationship with Him there is No going back, No doubts, and No regrets. I could no more deny His existence and love than I could my own earthly father.

and yet could you trust enough to give up all you have ? or do you doubt there ?

[+Sherapy]

and yet could you trust enough to give up all you have ? or do you doubt there ?

good question,good observation ? I'd include beleifs in this because beliefs to many are loved ones some are having relationships with their beleifs.........

[Irish]

and yet could you trust enough to give up all you have ? or do you doubt there ?

If I gave up all I have I would have nothing left to give to those that need! I have walked that path before with nothing but the shirt on my back and if asked again by God I would do the same again. All that I have now is what He has given me, I have more time than money, so mostly what I share is that “time”, (volunteer work)

[Lt_Ripley]

If I gave up all I have I would have nothing left to give to those that need! I have walked that path before with nothing but the shirt on my back and if asked again by God I would do the same again. All that I have now is what He has given me, I have more time than money, so mostly what I share is that “time”, (volunteer work)

if you gave up all you had you'd be open to receiving more to give. trust !

[Marcus Aurelius]

and yet could you trust enough to give up all you have ? or do you doubt there ?

My answer to this? Absolutely. Years and years ago, when I was studying the Church Fathers, I found one of particular influence on my view of possessions, one that I have often quoted, even in my earlier gnostic essays. Saint John Chyrsostom. He said in a sermon once, "I posesss nothing, all things are on loan to me from my Lord." I have never stopped agreeing with and believing that statement. I like the things I have, my HD LCD, my car....etc.....but all of it is from God. The only thing I require in life is Him. The rest is truly optional. Would I give all I have? Indeed. All that I have is, in reality, worthless.

[Lt_Ripley]

Many of the people I know in real life thought that I would certainly lose my faith over the negative personal events that have befallen me this past year. In fact, I was directly questioned about it on numerous occasions, especially by those who do not believe in God. Over and over I was asked, how can you still believe in God as your life falls apart around you??? Indeed, the life that I had known, and been accustomed to for the past several years was suddenly and viciously uprooted. I quite literally see myself in a position that I thought I would never be in. At first I was silent to these questions. My answer was that of Job "Though You slay me, yet will I trust in You." But this did little to help the bitterness, the anger, and the loneliness that I was suddenly facing. My faith did not waver in the slightest, yet still, I could not understand WHY these things were happening to me. I had never been in this position before. I had suffered pain without God, as a former atheist. But never WITH God. Yet, that WITH, in capital letters, was the answer to my own question. The God who I know, the God who I follow, faced solitude and despair; the God I know, the God I follow, was rejected, spat upon, beaten and humiliated in the streets. The God who I know, the God who I follow, was nailed to the tallest tree, the highest hill, outside of the city.

A strange thing began to happen to me. I began to rejoice in my suffering. I began to THANK God for it. For it was in this darkness, that I truly began to see the power of His Light. People I know were asking me 'how can you be so happy?' 'I don't see how you can be dealing with all of this so well.'

I had spent so many years chasing after the gods of other religions, so many years trying to explain away the concept of suffering....but it was not until I began to suffer myself, that I realized MY God, is not only the God who suffered FOR me, but who suffers WITH me. I never understood the power of the Cross until I was raised to my own. I praise God every day for sending me these trials, as it was in the midst of them that He brought me back to the foot of the Cross. At the worst devestations in my life I did not find my solace in Krishna. I did not find it in Buddha. I found it in Christ. THEY told me how to escape or master my pain. Christ told me I SUFFER WITH YOU.

Ironic that someone who studied comparative religions for over a decade would come to a point when all of it meant nothing.

But this is the way of the God I have been dodging for so long. He wounds so that He might heal. I praise God for every trial, and every suffering, for in this comes faith. Faith that when all the things I have read, and all the words I have written over the years are so much straw.

CS Lewis once said that pain is God's megaphone to rouse a deaf world. I am living proof of this, in spite of all I THOUGHT I knew.

What is faith WITHOUT suffering? Indeed, we suffer either with God or without Him. But the God I truly know, above all the others I have sought, is the one who comes down and suffers with us. It only takes me a disaster to realize it lol.

What would it take for me to lose my faith? I don't think it is possible. Even if I fall to a Job like state again. And I have been an atheist. So no argument would ever convince me. I've lost people I love to illness and death. I've lost a close friend to suicide. I've watched my relationship fall apart. I know that I will die; that this body will suffer, but I know that I am not this body. I really can't think of anything. Though I fail in my walk with Him as often as not, I will always love God.

why couldn't you just answer as you did in your last paragraph ? your always dime store preaching !

[Beckys_Mom]

What would it take for you to lose your faith in your God(s)?

For you to give me a few million to keep me going and then meh I just might LMAO

[Beckys_Mom]

Many of the people I know in real life thought that I would certainly lose my faith over the negative personal events that have befallen me this past year. In fact, I was directly questioned about it on numerous occasions, especially by those who do not believe in God. Over and over I was asked, how can you still believe in God as your life falls apart around you??? Indeed, the life that I had known, and been accustomed to for the past several years was suddenly and viciously uprooted. I quite literally see myself in a position that I thought I would never be in. At first I was silent to these questions. My answer was that of Job "Though You slay me, yet will I trust in You." But this did little to help the bitterness, the anger, and the loneliness that I was suddenly facing. My faith did not waver in the slightest, yet still, I could not understand WHY these things were happening to me. I had never been in this position before. I had suffered pain without God, as a former atheist. But never WITH God. Yet, that WITH, in capital letters, was the answer to my own question. The God who I know, the God who I follow, faced solitude and despair; the God I know, the God I follow, was rejected, spat upon, beaten and humiliated in the streets. The God who I know, the God who I follow, was nailed to the tallest tree, the highest hill, outside of the city.

A strange thing began to happen to me. I began to rejoice in my suffering. I began to THANK God for it. For it was in this darkness, that I truly began to see the power of His Light. People I know were asking me 'how can you be so happy?' 'I don't see how you can be dealing with all of this so well.'

I had spent so many years chasing after the gods of other religions, so many years trying to explain away the concept of suffering....but it was not until I began to suffer myself, that I realized MY God, is not only the God who suffered FOR me, but who suffers WITH me. I never understood the power of the Cross until I was raised to my own. I praise God every day for sending me these trials, as it was in the midst of them that He brought me back to the foot of the Cross. At the worst devestations in my life I did not find my solace in Krishna. I did not find it in Buddha. I found it in Christ. THEY told me how to escape or master my pain. Christ told me I SUFFER WITH YOU.

Ironic that someone who studied comparative religions for over a decade would come to a point when all of it meant nothing.

But this is the way of the God I have been dodging for so long. He wounds so that He might heal. I praise God for every trial, and every suffering, for in this comes faith. Faith that when all the things I have read, and all the words I have written over the years are so much straw.

CS Lewis once said that pain is God's megaphone to rouse a deaf world. I am living proof of this, in spite of all I THOUGHT I knew.

What is faith WITHOUT suffering? Indeed, we suffer either with God or without Him. But the God I truly know, above all the others I have sought, is the one who comes down and suffers with us. It only takes me a disaster to realize it lol.

What would it take for me to lose my faith? I don't think it is possible. Even if I fall to a Job like state again. And I have been an atheist. So no argument would ever convince me. I've lost people I love to illness and death. I've lost a close friend to suicide. I've watched my relationship fall apart. I know that I will die; that this body will suffer, but I know that I am not this body. I really can't think of anything. Though I fail in my walk with Him as often as not, I will always love God.

You could have just said to sum all of that right up - Nothing could ever make me loose my faith in god.....for thats all you have said

[Lt_Ripley]

You could have just said to sum all of that right up - Nothing could ever make me loose my faith in god.....for thats all you have said

it's called addiction. ego.