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Study: UK Muslim youth feel demonized


acidhead
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Oh man you can't pull out one example and call that progress. Ya she's pretty but I bet there are also alot of pretty girls being kept under tablecloths as well. Actually I would bet the majority are kept in the dark. You just posted a propaganda beauty pic. She is hot no doubt about it yummm LOL I bet her father was and is being paid well for this LOL

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Oh dude I hear ya I really do. I live in a community that is maybe 20% of the white so called Christan faith. I have Muslim friends as well and all the little stores around me are owned by some other faith or another. You probably know I have no religion so being surrounded by it is interesting to say the least.

Islam does not really try to convert Matt they just expand through procreation hence no need to convert. They don't believe in conversion as they believe as most Christians that when the time comes the none believers go to hell.

They do however and I hate saying they but they do want change and they are doing it. The UK will be an example of just how efficient there belief and influence can and will be. We have reached a point of no return.

Mate, they make up about 2.8% of the population.

We have considerable more none religious people.

UK religion statistics.

Also clearly Jordan's Queen is way better than ours.

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Your Paranoia is Disturbing =/

this is seriously getting ridiculous now, what you said there is no differant from the NWO taking over the world just another silly conspiracy.

Im sorry all i can say to this is laughing25smiley.gif

I'm sorry all i can say to this is >>

Edited by momentarylapseofreason
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What arguments can still be made in favor of immigration? The supposed benefits of diversity were never articulated and have been shown to be wishful thinking. The economic argument, with the numbert of poor European ghettos in any given country being directly proportionate to the number of nonwhites they've let in, has been thoroughly discredited. Democratic arguments can't be made; whenever the issue has been put to the voters they've always come out on the "wrong" side. The ruling class seems to be hoping that we all simply shut up until natives are so outnumbered that they can't complain any more. These common sense observations have been recorded in several books. The recent Reflections on the Revolution in Europe is the latest.

An analysis of Europe's predicament has to start with a look at the numbers. The British politician Enoch Powell rallied against nonwhites settlement in the British Isles back in the 1960s. From a descriptive perspective, there's no question that he was clear-sighted. In 1968, Powell shocked Britons by claiming that by 2002 there could be 4.5 million nonwhites in their country (the 2001 census reported over 4.6 million). He said that between 20 and 25 percent of Birmingham and Inner London could be composed of immigrants and their descendants (the numbers are 29.6 and 34.4 respectively). Caldwell states that if people at the time knew what immigration entailed they would've never stood for it in the first place. But what's done is done.

To the author's credit, for the purposes of his analysis he differentiates between people moving within Europe and those coming from outside it. 37 percent of Luxembourg's inhabitants were born abroad, but the small country is basically a playground for the continent's elites. The book's main focus is Islam. Britain has about 2 million Muslims (2% of the population), Germany 4 million (5%) and France 5 million (8%).

This influx has been widely unpopular. Only 19 percent of Europeans say that their country has benefited from immigration. 57 percent of Europeans say that their country has "too many foreigners" (73 percent in France and 69 percent in Britain). Despite this, there has been no slow down. 1.7 million people arrive in Europe each year. They mostly come as refugees and through family reunification.

The European Union allows freedom to travel between member countries, but each nation gets to set its own immigration laws. That means that in reality migration policy is set by the country with the laxest laws. In 2005, that was Spain. Socialist prime minister José Rodriguez Zapatero announced that illegal aliens would be given amnesty months in advance of carrying it out. Some people traveled from other countries in the EU in order to take advantage. By decree, 700,000 new "Spanish" citizens were created.

By any projection, things are getting worse. Even if immigration were cut off, the higher nonwhite birth rate would mean that their numbers would continue to grow. By 2020, around 14 percent of those living in Denmark will have roots in "authoritarian countries and cultures." By 2050, Britain will have between 7 and 16 million nonwhites, depending on immigration policy. French women have 1.7 children each; foreign born French women 2.8. "By midcentury in most of the major European countries, foreign-origins populations will be between 20 and 32 percent." Compared to America, that's not so bad. Europeans still have time to recover.

What's interesting is the dance that Caldwell does to avoid being called "racist." He acknowledges that it's completely legitimate to want to admit only those that come from a similar culture. He approvingly cites Robert Putnam's work showing diversity destroys civic trust. But as long as it's culture, and not race, we care about, we're ok. Spain has been more open to Latin American immigrants than they have been to Middle Eastern or African ones. They're entitled to do so, and since many of these migrants aren't white, it shows that the motivation for rejecting Arabs and blacks isn't racial. More problematic cases, like the socioeconomic failure of Christian English speaking West Indians, are ignored.

Although Muslims are the cause of most interethnic tension, making laws singling them out isn't politically feasible. So when the French wanted to ban the head scarf in schools, yarmulkes had to go as well. The Dutch made it more difficult to import foreign brides but the law has to apply regardless of whether the wife is Pakistani or Australian. A Swedish minister suggested that all female infants be checked for signs of genital mutilation, a practice only found amongst Somalian refugees.

In Austria, Catholic women have 1.32 children each, Protestants 1.21 and non-affiliated 0.86. Muslims have a birth rate of 2.34. Italy's native population will almost be half of what it is by the middle of the century. No European country save Muslim Albania has replacement fertility. Obviously, it is secularism and women's liberation that has destroyed the West. Islam is filling the void.

Despite that, gender equality seems to be the only value Europeans will unconditionally defend.

"Adapting to European styles of sexuality and gender relations is the only nonnegotiable demand that Europe makes of its immigrants...Europeans may be reluctant to proclaim any preference for their own high culture and cuisine over foreign ones, eager to give way on freedom of speech when it hurts Muslim sensibilities, and willing to tar as extremist or fascist anyone who holds that Islam poses an especial danger of terrorism. Sex is different...It is the one area where Europeans retain both a deep suspicion of Muslim ways and a confidence in their own institutions that is free of self-doubt.

What is more, the suspicion falls directly and uneuphemistically on Islam the religion, and not any epiphenomenon, such as "poverty" or 'segregation' or 'tradition.'"

This is quite amazing. One would think that if the West's system of gender relations was so obviously superior other cultures would be quick to recognize that. In reality, it's the one thing from the West that many people across the globe seem not to want. "Modernization without Westernization" has been a popular slogan from the Middle to the Far East. The most fundamental criticism of the Western matriarchy that one can make is that even if it provided all the happiness in the world, the low birthrates ensure that it can't survive. Only a culture as infantile as Europe's is unable to see that.

The Dutch government has made a video for potential citizens showing homosexual kissing and informing them that women are expected to work. Needless to say, no other "values" are worth mentioning.

While outraged about the way Muslims treat their women, Europeans are forgiving about crimes committed against themselves. In many French prisons Muslims make up 50 to 80 percent of the inmates. Italy's jails are 47 percent foreign-origin. In Sweden, 26 percent of those in jail are citizens of other countries (not including children of immigrants). Only politically incorrect gender practices are blamed on the perpetrators themselves, the rest is excused in the normal liberal way.

By 2050, the US will be on its way to becoming a second world country if not already there. It won't be the world's policeman anymore. France's Muslim population will have doubled from now until then and the ghettos will remain a perpetual powder keg. Across the European continent, it's no longer possible to deny that, just as surly as communism was, diversity has been a colossal failure. In some places at least, voters are starting to act on that realization.

"May you live in interesting times," as the Chinese curse says. For generations, Europeans have worked to make that a reality for the few descendants they're leaving behind. Reflections on the Revolution in Europe will let you know how bad things are, but leaves little room for optimism.

http://www.thenativegaze.com/HistoryBooks16-5035-0385518269-Reflections_on_the_Revolution_In_Europe_Immigration_Islam_and_the_West.html

Suggested reading:

Reflections on the Revolution In Europe: Immigration, Islam, and the West

Author: Christopher Caldwell is a journalist and senior editor at The Weekly Standard, as well as a regular contributor to the Financial Times and Slate. His writing also frequently appears in The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, where he is a contributing editor to the paper's magazine, and The Washington Post. He was also a regular contributor to The Atlantic Monthly and The New York Press in the past.

Caldwell is a graduate of Harvard College, where he studied English literature. His father-in-law was the journalist Robert Novak. He has five children.

Edited by momentarylapseofreason
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If people weren't bigoted we would far less problems.

Lets see now............ Islam represses women,check,seems to spawn terrorism, check, is prone to violence, check, resists democracy, check, anti-semetic, check. So it's time to defend the bigotry of Islam? Do you really think I'm going to defend this massive, sexist male cult? I will only defend liberal Muslims. And yes, we have our own religious bigotry right here in the USof A also. Islam just scares me more.

Edited by momentarylapseofreason
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lol... its entertaining reading the usual comments from the pro-english UK people...

You know who you are... no need to name names... you guys love sticking it to muslim countries yet offer no solution to your self absorbed problems at home.

Meaning: most of your posts indicate you people do not know what you want.... you crave the death and destruction of Afghanistan and Iraq.... Iran too...

yet, the resulting factor is you people than have to adopt the immigrants and refugees from these western invasions of Islamic countries... AND offer them the same humanitarian rights

and privileges promised to the english people of the UK....

You shoot yourselves in the foot by agreeing to globalization through force... and you cannot handle the criticism that follows because of it....

Well I agree and disagree. I agree, people in the west shouldn't think its OK to go on and support an invasion in countries like Afghanistan and Iraq and then hypocritically expect migrant and refugee muslims to shrug their shoulders and skip away as if it doesn't effect all of them. And anyone that believes the west went there because of 9/11 is totally naive or worse...

I don't agree they aren't been given the same humanitarian rights as the english or people from other western countries have. They themselves feel marginalised because people in the west do not understand their archaic religion and the majority are not interested in following it, they don't understand how they can claim discrimination against their religion yet discrimination against women is acceptable and their Bible claims discrimination against other religious believers who they call infidels, they don't understand why they migrate to another country yet they won't accept to mingle with the residents from their adopted country, marginalising themselves and then blame others for feeling marginalised, they don't understand how they can live in a country with people from a different culture, beliefs and morality yet dislike their culture, beliefs and morality.

The moral of the story is: The west should butt out of the ME and let them live in peace (or in war amongst themselves if they prefer), muslims who don't accept to live under the western culture should p...s off back home.

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The moral of the story is: The west should butt out of the ME and let them live in peace (or in war amongst themselves if they prefer), muslims who don't accept to live under the western culture should p...s off back home.

And that's my whole point. If you don't like the west get the hell out-don't try to change it by whining about almost everything claiming discrimination, offense, and it's my religion so I can do anything I wish, cry if i want to...lie if i want to...die if i want to..........hey sounds like that song "it's my party" in the name of my religion-religion is no excuse to remain ignorant! >>not in this day and age with what we know. How have Muslims (in Europe) ever shown their thankfulness & appreciation? I see no gratefulness. I see too often passive aggression at play, disapproving looks, mistrust, disgust, disrespect, ecspecially of western women & values.

Yes, we know we aren't perfect here in the west but we do our best to be progressive & better ourselves. (and some Muslim countries are trying to do the same-but the fundementalists they are surrounded by are like an angry swarm of wasps that just keep attacking) And quit taking advantage of europe's good will and tolerance (you know who you are). Europe is literally tolerating intolerannce and being too tolerant-tolerance needs to have limits. Oh what irony!

Here in Hawaii we take pride in our diversity-and it works. It's wonderful. But we have no intensely oppressive ideologies. No ones hands get cut off, women aren't whipped for being raped etc. (of course we have some dometic violence also)

Mostly, women, lifestyles and other beliefs are respected. People adapt but keep some of their traditions & beliefs. They all respect free speech (even if they do not agree with what is expressed).

Edited by momentarylapseofreason
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Muslims feel demonized? LOL!!

Edited by momentarylapseofreason
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Maybe its not the religious cultists but the actual literature that should be openly criticised.

333 References of death to disbelievers in the Quran:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/index.htm

As for the comparative extremist 'minority' in the UK - its interesting that The Times has reported that up to halfof UK mosques are now under hardline control:

Almost half of Britain’s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to “shed blood” for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain.The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

The Times investigation casts serious doubts on government statements that foreign preachers are to blame for spreading the creed of radical Islam in Britain’s mosques and its policy of enouraging the recruitment of more “home-grown” preachers.

Mr ul Haq, 36, was educated and trained at an Islamic seminary in Britain and is part of a new generation of British imams who share a similar radical agenda. He heaps scorn on any Muslims who say they are “proud to be British” and argues that friendship with a Jew or a Christian makes “a mockery of Allah’s religion”.

...A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that “blind ignorance” on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain’s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said:“The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You’ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2402973.ece

How can a specific organised religion's opinion that its followers are somehow more chosen/special/saved/superior to other non-cult members not be inherently bigoted?

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Maybe its not the religious cultists but the actual literature that should be openly criticised.

333 References of death to disbelievers in the Quran:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/index.htm

As for the comparative extremist 'minority' in the UK - its interesting that The Times has reported that up to halfof UK mosques are now under hardline control:

Almost half of Britain’s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to “shed blood” for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain.The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

The Times investigation casts serious doubts on government statements that foreign preachers are to blame for spreading the creed of radical Islam in Britain’s mosques and its policy of enouraging the recruitment of more “home-grown” preachers.

Mr ul Haq, 36, was educated and trained at an Islamic seminary in Britain and is part of a new generation of British imams who share a similar radical agenda. He heaps scorn on any Muslims who say they are “proud to be British” and argues that friendship with a Jew or a Christian makes “a mockery of Allah’s religion”.

...A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that “blind ignorance” on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain’s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said:“The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You’ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2402973.ece

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Maybe its not the religious cultists but the actual literature that should be openly criticised.

333 References of death to disbelievers in the Quran:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/index.htm

As for the comparative extremist 'minority' in the UK - its interesting that The Times has reported that up to halfof UK mosques are now under hardline control:

Almost half of Britain’s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to “shed blood” for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain.The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

The Times investigation casts serious doubts on government statements that foreign preachers are to blame for spreading the creed of radical Islam in Britain’s mosques and its policy of enouraging the recruitment of more “home-grown” preachers.

Mr ul Haq, 36, was educated and trained at an Islamic seminary in Britain and is part of a new generation of British imams who share a similar radical agenda. He heaps scorn on any Muslims who say they are “proud to be British” and argues that friendship with a Jew or a Christian makes “a mockery of Allah’s religion”.

...A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that “blind ignorance” on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain’s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said:“The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You’ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2402973.ece

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Maybe its not the religious cultists but the actual literature that should be openly criticised.

333 References of death to disbelievers in the Quran:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/index.htm

As for the comparative extremist 'minority' in the UK - its interesting that The Times has reported that up to half of UK mosques are now under hardline control:

Almost half of Britain�s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to �shed blood� for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain.The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain�s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

The Times investigation casts serious doubts on government statements that foreign preachers are to blame for spreading the creed of radical Islam in Britain�s mosques and its policy of enouraging the recruitment of more �home-grown� preachers.

Mr ul Haq, 36, was educated and trained at an Islamic seminary in Britain and is part of a new generation of British imams who share a similar radical agenda. He heaps scorn on any Muslims who say they are �proud to be British� and argues that friendship with a Jew or a Christian makes �a mockery of Allah�s religion�.

...A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that �blind ignorance� on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain�s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said:"The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You�ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can�t run multiculturalism like that, because that�s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It�s mind-boggling."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2402973.ece

Edited by karl 12
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Maybe its not the religious cultists but the actual literature that should be openly criticised.

333 References of death to disbelievers in the Quran:

http://www.skepticsa...quran/index.htm

As for the comparative extremist 'minority' in the UK - its interesting that The Times has reported that up to half of UK mosques are now under hardline control:

http://www.timesonli...icle2402973.ece

Geez. Thanks for posting this 4 times. I only understood it at the 4th attempt! By the way did you get 3 free posts? :unsure2:

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If Muslims refuse to assimilate into their adopted nations than they deserve persecution and discrimination. If they cannot tolerate not having their Shariah law then they should have stayed in their countries.

No one deserves persecution or discrimination.

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Yes, they do. Not needlessly but only if they refuse to assimilate. If they don't want to assimilate why did they leave their home nations in the first place?

Society and culture is not about assimilation. Did you get your ideals off the Victorian Borg?

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We are the Bloughrg. :rolleyes:

And yes, it is to an extant. Any immigrant must adopt to the culture of their adopted nation. If they shall not do that and push things like Shariah law why do they not stay in their country? Because they immigrate for the express purpose of spreading their religion.

Regardless in the ideal Synarchist state people like that wouldn't be persecuted but just deported back to their countries. But as it stands now civil persecution at the hands of disgruntled citizens I can't help but feel sympathy for.

Well you are assuming that most of these Muslims are immigrants, I think a lot of these teens will have been born in the UK, the vast majority of them do not want Shariah law and could care less about the beliefs of others.

Some people will always sadly try and push their religion, America has it a lot with the Christian right for example.

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Mate, they make up about 2.8% of the population.

Well if you believe the official figures, many think it's a gross underestimation, because they only take into consideration, those officially registered.

but let's use them anyway, it's something..like 2.7%-3.3% 1,640,958 - 2,000,000 muslims.

And look at the tensions we already have.

And if we look at France, official estimations 6.9% - 10%.. and explosion of riots which took place in..2005 2006 2007.

My theory is, when it gets to 10%-20% in the UK, onwards we're going to have real problems.

The clash of cultures is going to be even more apparent.

I could see a situation where a Bosnian type civil war could happen.

Started by the Radicals and the moderates unfortunately getting sucked in..

I'm not talking about Mr Patel and his cornershop,

I'm talking about these guys..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKsgHo9j43I

yes it was filmed in England.

Edited by Bill Hill
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Well if you believe the official figures, many think it's a gross underestimation, because they only take into consideration, those officially registered.

but let's use them anyway, it's something..like 2.7%-3.3% 1,640,958 - 2,000,000 muslims.

And look at the tensions we already have.

And if we look at France, official estimations 6.9% - 10%.. and explosion of riots which took place in..2005 2006 2007.

My theory is, when it gets to 10%-20% in the UK, onwards we're going to have real problems.

The clash of cultures is going to be even more apparent.

I could see a situation where a Bosnian type civil war could happen.

Started by the Radicals and the moderates unfortunately getting sucked in..

I'm not talking and Mr Patel and his cornershop,

I'm talking about these guys..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKsgHo9j43I

yes was filmed in England.

As I said there are always going to be idiots. It shows why education is important and why we should not segregate communities (just like in Northern Ireland).

Edited by Mattshark
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Well if you believe the official figures, many think it's a gross underestimation, because they only take into consideration, those officially registered.

but let's use them anyway, it's something..like 2.7%-3.3% 1,640,958 - 2,000,000 muslims.

And look at the tensions we already have.

And if we look at France, official estimations 6.9% - 10%.. and explosion of riots which took place in..2005 2006 2007.

My theory is, when it gets to 10%-20% in the UK, onwards we're going to have real problems.

The clash of cultures is going to be even more apparent.

I could see a situation where a Bosnian type civil war could happen.

Started by the Radicals and the moderates unfortunately getting sucked in..

I'm not talking and Mr Patel and his cornershop,

I'm talking about these guys..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKsgHo9j43I

yes was filmed in England.

Bill your theory will no doubt become a reality. Its like a gathering storm far off on the Horizon.

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"Sorry but thats just about the most amount of bull**** ive heard in a long time, Notice how everyone has suddnely developed their own peorsonnel views of islam since 9/11, i mean how many of you actually talked about islam before that?"

AKUMA166

Um...well murdering 3500 innocent civilians in one fell swoop, in the name of Allah will have that effect. :hmm:

Edited by itsnotoutthere
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It shows why education is important

Always a vague throw-away for me.. eduction is important or eduction is the answer.

Depends, if it's eduction based on fact, knowledge showing the reality of the situation..

Objective.

or a wash-over, pas propaganda.., I've been through the UK education system and when it comes to these matters you're far from getting the truth.. or a true perspective.

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"More Bull*** if you do live in the uk than look out of your window and take a look at islamic women of today, islamic women of britain are independant thinking, i live in britain so i know i dont knwo what planet you live on. and most islamic countries of today have given women just as much rights as men."

AKUMA166

Did you actually manage to type that with a straight face? :huh: Now who's talking Bull***

"take a look at islamic women of today, islamic women of britain are independant thinking" Yes, just so long as they don't vocalize.

Edited by itsnotoutthere
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As I said there are always going to be idiots. It shows why education is important and why we should not segregate communities (just like in Northern Ireland).

To be honest and I see it here as well and that is "they" Muslims and yes even some Christians of the Chinese and African variaty segregate themselves. Thats what happens when immigration allows immigrants with no work skills and little english skills to enter the country. They find themselves isolated so they gather into communities with other low skilled non english speaking immigrants and there the bigotry grows and festers. For the most part Matt westerners are pretty accepting of immigrants and you have to agree with that man it's when they segregate themselves that there becomes a problem. Ill informed un-educated immigrants whinning about the country that took them in and gave them everything there home country couldn't and they form communities that gather and complain how they are not given a fair shake and we all know thats not true.

It is nothing like Northern Irland as both sides were and are of Christian beliefs. To me in northern Irland it wouldn't really of mattered who had won that it would have been the same LOL however when Islam takes the reins it will be a far different story my friend.

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"Sorry but thats just about the most amount of bull**** ive heard in a long time, Notice how everyone has suddnely developed their own peorsonnel views of islam since 9/11, i mean how many of you actually talked about islam before that?"

AKUMA166

Um...well murdering 3500 innocent civilians in one fell swoop, in the name of Allah will have that effect. :hmm:

See thats the problem with some people. They seem to think it took 9/11 to wake up to the middle east and it backwards thinking. The middle east has been an issue forever really LOL The end of WWII really kicked things off though with the UN and Israel opps did I say Israel. *better hide now* To say the west hasn't had a hand in kicking up trouble in the ME would be lieing as we have made a mess of the ME. However taking into account Islam it was just a matter of time befor the expansion took place. 9/11 just gave them an excuse to move faster and for us to move slower.

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