Atlantis

[The_Spartan]

"peer reviewed science"???

Oh my! Thats a laugh!

When you wont accept anything else that what you consider as evidence or proof or cannot produce even a single evidence to back up you claim, in real life "peer reviewed science", buddy, you would be un-cermoniously be given the boot!

[Agonaces of Susa]

not really gonna bother with this one, as you rip on wiki, then go bust our your big guns using 'the free library'

*slow clap* bravo...Bravo....

besides, this link doesnt mean anything. it just states how some geologists disagree with that theory, but didnt prove it.

Ignoring something doesn't make it cease to exist.

Ignoring evidence is not a scientific attitude. Are you a theologian by any chance?

The Free Library article is from Science News. Ever heard of it?

[Agonaces of Susa]

"peer reviewed science"???

Oh my! Thats a laugh!

When you wont accept anything else that what you consider as evidence or proof or cannot produce even a single evidence to back up you claim, in real life "peer reviewed science", buddy, you would be un-cermoniously be given the boot!

Do you know what peer reviewed science is?

Have you ever heard of Astronomische Nachrichten?

[The_Spartan]

Do you know what peer reviewed science is?

Have you ever heard of Astronomische Nachrichten?

Are you the only one who understands what 'peer reviewed science" is?

In peer reviewed science, every theory gets knocked around and that too, knocked around very hard!

if one cant provide evidence to back up his theory, its straight to the garbage pail, plain truth!

no, i havent heard of "Astronomische Nachrichte"..i dont dig astronomy.

But i subscribe to "IEEE and IEEE Xplore" ever heard of those?huh?

[Agonaces of Susa]

But i subscribe to "IEEE and IEEE Xplore" ever heard of those?huh?

Yes.

They say General Relativity and gravitation are myths.

Alfvén, H., Double Layers and Circuits in Astrophysics, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume 14, Issue 6, Pages 779-793, Dec 1986

Peratt, A.L., Evolution of the Plasma Universe: II. The Formation of Systems of Galaxies, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume PS-14, Number 6, Dec 1986

Alfvén, H., Cosmology in the Plasma Universe: An Introductory Exposition, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 18, Number 1, Feb 1990

Peratt, A.L., The Evidence For Electrical Currents in Cosmic Plasma, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 18, Number 1, Feb 1990

Meierovich, B.E., and Peratt, A.L., Equilibrium of Intergalatic Currents, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 20, Number 6, Dec 1992

Thornhill, W., The Electrical Nature of Comets, IEEE 34th International Conference on Plasma Science, Page 1000, Jun 2007

Scott, D.E., Real Properties of Electromagnetic Fields and Plasma in the Cosmos, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume 35, Number 4, Aug 2007

Edited November 17, 2009 by Agonaces of Susa

[Abramelin]

No.

http://www.nytimes.c...&pagewanted=all

It's not my fault if you don't believe in peer reviewed science.

It's not a proven theory, it are just his assumptions.

You have assumptions, and so do I, but no proof.

He just believed that map to be a true depiction of Antartica , free of ice ,and a zillion others (also scientists) believe it doesn't.

All they have to do is drill into the rock bed below the present ice sheets, and tell us that they found proof of life in an ice free environment of around 10,000 BP.

And as far as I know they didn't find any proof of life from that age.

So what does your hero base his 'knowledge' on?

Edited November 17, 2009 by Abramelin

[The_Spartan]

dont beat around the bush!

so whats with the "Do you know what peer reviewed science is? Have you ever heard of Astronomische Nachrichten?" stuff?

Technical People subscribe to peer review journals of their own field.

Just throwing around "Have you ever heard of Astronomische Nachrichten?" serves what purpose?

Coming to the point, you dont have a single evidence to support your theory. So, off it goes to garbage pail for me. have a nice day.

[Abramelin]

Agonaces, show me a scientific report that will prove that there was an ice free part of Antarctica in 10,000 BC, AND that there was some kind of civilization there.

No opinions, no theories, PROOF.

[digitalartist]

No.

http://www.nytimes.com/1984/09/25/science/new-analysis-hints-ancient-explorers-mapped-antarctic.html?&pagewanted=all

That article is filled with many what if's, maybe's and perhaps all based on speculations concerning the Piri Reis map. The map appears to show antarctica free of ice. If that is antarctica it wasn't 10,000 years ago. antarctica separated from south america more than 30 million years ago and the map appears to show them connected. That map does nothing to support the atlantis theory that antarctica is atlantis.

[questionmark]

That article is filled with many what if's, maybe's and perhaps all based on speculations concerning the Piri Reis map. The map appears to show antarctica free of ice. If that is antarctica it wasn't 10,000 years ago. antarctica separated from south america more than 30 million years ago and the map appears to show them connected. That map does nothing to support the atlantis theory that antarctica is atlantis.

In fact it does not. Piri Reis ends somewhere in Brazil. The rest is what was supposed to be Terra Australis Incognita. And we know that it was a mirage.

[Emma_Acid]

Agonaces of Susa, you might find that a lot of the hostility here will subside when you stop posting link after link after link and form your own coherent argument (which no, you haven't done).

[Agent. Mulder]

Ignoring something doesn't make it cease to exist.

Ignoring evidence is not a scientific attitude. Are you a theologian by any chance?

The Free Library article is from Science News. Ever heard of it?

exactly.

and please explain to me how this is different than people on wiki showing the footnotes and bibliographies from articles for the claims on it?

also, ive ignored nothing, just stated how what you posted was just a differing opinion, yet to be proved.

accept it kid.

Edited November 17, 2009 by Agent. Mulder

[Harte]

Same style, same lack of class, same twisting when questioned.

Same position on my ignore list.

There's nothing this idiot can say that I haven't refuted over and over here and at other sites.

I'm not gonna repeat myself anymore. At least, not for people that aren't really interested, like this guy.

Harte

[digitalartist]

Yes.

They say General Relativity and gravitation are myths.

Alfvén, H., Double Layers and Circuits in Astrophysics, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume 14, Issue 6, Pages 779-793, Dec 1986

Peratt, A.L., Evolution of the Plasma Universe: II. The Formation of Systems of Galaxies, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume PS-14, Number 6, Dec 1986

Alfvén, H., Cosmology in the Plasma Universe: An Introductory Exposition, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 18, Number 1, Feb 1990

Peratt, A.L., The Evidence For Electrical Currents in Cosmic Plasma, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 18, Number 1, Feb 1990

Meierovich, B.E., and Peratt, A.L., Equilibrium of Intergalatic Currents, IEEE Transactions On Plasma Science, Volume 20, Number 6, Dec 1992

Thornhill, W., The Electrical Nature of Comets, IEEE 34th International Conference on Plasma Science, Page 1000, Jun 2007

Scott, D.E., Real Properties of Electromagnetic Fields and Plasma in the Cosmos, IEEE Transactions on Plasma Science, Volume 35, Number 4, Aug 2007

As I do not have the opportunity at this time to read through the pdf files, I did a search for the terms gravity, gravitation and relativity in each file and found that none of the files reference any kind of relativity and only the last one references gravitation as it deals with the strength of earth's magnetic field. In no search did I find any part of those reports indicating that General Relativity and gravitation were myths. Perhaps you can narrow down where in each report it supports your assertion.

[Agonaces of Susa]

Agonaces, show me a scientific report that will prove that there was an ice free part of Antarctica in 10,000 BC, AND that there was some kind of civilization there.

No opinions, no theories, PROOF.

Your opinion is not a scientific theory but rather a religious belief which cannot be questioned. Therefore, according to you, there is no such thing as proof which can falsify your opinion. This thread demonstrates that fact.

[questionmark]

As I do not have the opportunity at this time to read through the pdf files, I did a search for the terms gravity, gravitation and relativity in each file and found that none of the files reference any kind of relativity and only the last one references gravitation as it deals with the strength of earth's magnetic field. In no search did I find any part of those reports indicating that General Relativity and gravitation were myths. Perhaps you can narrow down where in each report it supports your assertion.

Why bother, all he does is google and post, he cannot explain his own evidence.

[Agonaces of Susa]

And we know that it was a mirage.

Antarctica is not a mirage. I promise you.

Agonaces of Susa, you might find that a lot of the hostility here will subside when you stop posting link after link after link and form your own coherent argument (which no, you haven't done).

So let me get this straight, everyone here is telling me to provide evidence and you're saying not to provide any?

Hmmm. I'm not sure what to do.

accept it kid.

This is ad hominem flame bait.

[questionmark]

This is ad hominem flame bait.

No, it is pointing out a fact...but feel free to report it.

[Agonaces of Susa]

There's nothing this idiot can say that I haven't refuted

Calling someone an idiot is ad hominem attack and a violation of the rules. Of course, even though I'm the victim, I'll be presented as the violator.

So if I say the sky is blue. You've refuted that?

Edited November 17, 2009 by Agonaces of Susa

[digitalartist]

In fact it does not. Piri Reis ends somewhere in Brazil. The rest is what was supposed to be Terra Australis Incognita. And we know that it was a mirage.

I am not supporting his view just using the map as an example that if (though it does not) show antarctica, it could not have been the antarctica of 10,000 years ago. Actually if you look at the map piri reis map it extends down below brazil with argentinan coastline along the bottom of the image

Edited November 17, 2009 by digitalartist

[questionmark]

I am not supporting his view just using the map as an example that if (though it does not) show antarctica, it could not have been the antarctica of 10,000 years ago. Actually if you look at the map piri reis map it extends down below brazil with argentinan coasl=tlins along the bottom of the image

You are right, should have read that inscription, it ends near the Rio de la Plata. But that does not change the validity of my statement: There is no Antarctica on that map.

Edited November 17, 2009 by questionmark

[Qoais]

I agree actually, that science is not always right and I've said it so many times already, that the timelines have to be changed for things to fit the way we're supposed to accept that they actually were. I thought I understood that quantum physics did refute Einstein's theory of relativity, but I can't say as I've totally researched the subject so I can't say for sure.

Now Agaonaces, I'm not disagreeing with your ideas because I've used all the same information myself (more or less) in another forum, over the last three years, and have argued the very self same things you are discussing for. I'm not adverse to the idea of pre-historic civilizations that rose and died without a trace. I'm not even against alien intervention. I mean, whether the Piri Ries map shows Antarctica or not, what I'd like to know, is how he knew there were mountains up the west coast of S. America? I don't think anyone has answered that yet.

What I am arguing - is that Plato's Atlantis never existed. At least, not with the information he gives and in the timeline he says it happened. Now if you want to say that perhaps Atlantis existed as per Edgar Cayce, that's a different matter. I am personally not satisfied with a lot of the suggested answers that are given in regard to things from the past and ancient beliefs and writings and don't necessarily accept the explanations given by academics.

Regarding the Atlantis of Plato being in the Antarctica, so far - we know of no ships having been invented in the timeframe that Plato talks about that could travel the ocean, especially the distance they would have had to travel if Atlantis was in Antarctica. Plato says there were Triremes in her harbours and goods from numerous other countries. As far as we know, there were no other organized countries in that time frame. Only in scattered patches here and there, was man even piling rocks to make shelters that far back, not building mega cities with wharves and docks and Triremes. If there were such civilizations, we have yet to discover them.

[questionmark]

What I am arguing - is that Plato's Atlantis never existed. At least, not with the information he gives and in the timeline he says it happened. Now if you want to say that perhaps Atlantis existed as per Edgar Cayce, that's a different matter. I am personally not satisfied with a lot of the suggested answers that are given in regard to things from the past and ancient beliefs and writings and don't necessarily accept the explanations given by academics.

Finally somebody who makes sense.

[Agonaces of Susa]

I agree actually, that science is not always right and I've said it so many times already, that the timelines have to be changed for things to fit the way we're supposed to accept that they actually were. I thought I understood that quantum physics did refute Einstein's theory of relativity, but I can't say as I've totally researched the subject so I can't say for sure.

Now Agaonaces, I'm not disagreeing with your ideas because I've used all the same information myself (more or less) in another forum, over the last three years, and have argued the very self same things you are discussing for. I'm not adverse to the idea of pre-historic civilizations that rose and died without a trace. I'm not even against alien intervention. I mean, whether the Piri Ries map shows Antarctica or not, what I'd like to know, is how he knew there were mountains up the west coast of S. America? I don't think anyone has answered that yet.

A pleasure to meet you.

What I am arguing - is that Plato's Atlantis never existed.

I get it and I disagree.

At least, not with the information he gives and in the timeline he says it happened.

Perhaps. And also our dating techniques are flawed.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091110135411.htm

Now if you want to say that perhaps Atlantis existed as per Edgar Cayce, that's a different matter. I am personally not satisfied with a lot of the suggested answers that are given in regard to things from the past and ancient beliefs and writings and don't necessarily accept the explanations given by academics.

I am not familiar with Cayce's work although I am told it has to do with the paranormal.

Regarding the Atlantis of Plato being in the Antarctica, so far - we know of no ships having been invented in the timeframe that Plato talks about that could travel the ocean, especially the distance they would have had to travel if Atlantis was in Antarctica. Plato says there were Triremes in her harbours and goods from numerous other countries. As far as we know, there were no other organized countries in that time frame. Only in scattered patches here and there, was man even piling rocks to make shelters that far back, not building mega cities with wharves and docks and Triremes. If there were such civilizations, we have yet to discover them.

Then I take it you don't know about all the thousands of mummies that tested positive for tobacco and cocaine.

Balabanova, S., Parsche, S., and Pirsig, W., First Identification of Drugs in Egyptian Mummies, Naturwissenschaften, Volume 79, Number 8, Page 358, Aug 1992

Balabanova, S., Teschler-Nicola, M., Strouhal, E., Evidence of Nicotine in Scalp Hair of Naturally Mummified Bodies From the Christian Sayala (Egyptian-Nubian), Anthropologischer Anzeiger; Bericht über die Biologisch-Anthropologische Literatur, Volume 52, Number 2, Pages 167-173, Jun 1994

Corliss, J.R., Evidence of Tobacco In Ancient Egypt, Science Frontiers, Number 95, Sep-Oct 1994

Parsche, F., and Nerlich, A., Presence of Drugs In Different Tissues of an Egyptian Mummy, Ferensius' Journal of Analytical Chemistry, Volume 352, Number 3-4, Pages 380-384, Jan 1995

Mystery of the Cocaine Mummies Transcript, Discovery Channel, 1996

Corliss, J.R., Tobacco and Cocaine In Ancient Egypt, Science Frontiers, Number 111, May-Jun 1997

[Agonaces of Susa]

Finally somebody who makes sense.

I had the exact same feeling.