What does God want with 10% of cattle?

[Stellar]

JOC pointed it out in the Jesus thread. God wants 10% of each persons cattle donated to him... What does God want with cattle? Doesnt that give you the hint that there might be something mortal about him...? I mean, why one tenth of the cattle to him? what does he need it for?

[Universal Absurdity]

that makes me wonder about cattle mutilations, i'm going to look into how many cattle are mutilated in a 'wave' as that is usually how they happen, in waves.

if its around 10% of the population....well.....its just going to make me wonder.

(fun fact: in case of extreme emergency, cattle blood can be used in humans for transfusions.)

[Aslan]

God / Ronald McDonald.

Could there be a connection?

[MoonBaby]

Hmmm... that's very likely

[Fluffybunny]

Two Words: Cheese-Burger.

Heavenly.

[Chauncy]

God needed a way to get around. But the cattle were too bumpy and smelled so he commanded 10% of all the cattle and turned them into a 'BRAND NEW CAR!!!!!

with a chauffeur and the whole works. Hard-top, with A/C, burning bush in the trunk and tires made from the flesh of non-believers.

[MoonBaby]

Chauncy, you scare me . Not really, but you are an absolute frikin' nut . You're probably the dude in the cow suite, aren't you?

[Fluffybunny]

Hard-top, with A/C, burning bush in the trunk and tires made from the flesh of non-believers.

That is udderly rediculous.

That was bad even for me.

[Chauncy]

No seriously though it is the reason christians give for the tithe.

Many churches teach that Christians must give 10% of their income to their local church otherwise they are robbing God and shutting off the flow of God's blessings. So when Christians talk about "tithing," they're usually referring to this idea that giving 10% of every paycheck to their church is a Scriptural requirement or a Scriptural principle which Christians should be following.

There are differences of opinion among Christians about whether or not Christians must tithe. Many don't, some do, some insist, some leave it as an option.

Regardless if it is left up as an option then people will give to simply assist their church in its endeavors, which is cool and is their perogative.

When its a problem I believe and when it treads on moral issues, is when someone gives this amount but can't really afford it and no-one at the church lets them know that it is ok not to give this tithe.

Some people I know actually think that when they tithe god will take care of them better, the adage "give and you shall recieve" ....this is silly!!

1 Corinthians 16:2 and 2 Corinthians 9:7 is where they get this idea, check it out tell me what you think it means.

As a side note: I've witnessed two churches in my immediate area that posted the Tithe totals of every person in the church at Tax time. This I thought was very shameful and also set up for a lot of in-fighting amongst members. The 2 months that followed the posting there were many that left the church. I was there in a strictly observational capacity.

Edited May 26, 2004 by Chauncy

[MoonBaby]

As a side note: I've witnessed two churches in my immediate area that posted the Tithe totals of every person in the church at Tax time.

That is absolute bs.

I was also raised to believe (not by my parents, but church leaders) that if you gave in times when you were really hard up for money you would be more blessed or whatever.

[Venomshocker]

God asked for a 10% tithe, because he wanted to show people he can do more with 90% than they could with 100%. God asked people to this so he could demonstrate his power to them. The bible states that this is the only thing that God asked people to test him in. Kind of like asking for proof of God. God knew people would be materialistic so he uses materialism to show to people that he is capable of giving you more than you have.

God dosent need the 10%, or anything, otherwise he wouldnt be a very powerful god.

[Chauncy]

I was also raised to believe (not by my parents, but church leaders) that if you gave in times when you were really hard up for money you would be more blessed or whatever.

Its strange what people believe sometimes. The person I mentioned before that tithed, had some financial trouble but was still tithing, I offered to give them money to help them out of their tight spot,but only under the condition that none of my dollars went to the church. They flatly refused the loan after this stipulation but were all for it prior to.

Now here's where it gets weird, they still tithed, then they recieved a tax return in the mail that made up the difference in their original tax return that was calculated wrong. Immediately they started praising god for this seemingly divine gift.

I don't know about you but any Revenue agency is far from holy. Many people in my area recieved these additional cheques as a result of mistakes that were made. But there was no convincing these people of that. They wanted to believe that the cheque was from god for their diligent tithing practices.....I of course knew the truth.

It shows that people will purposely misinterprate natural occurences as divine to simply prove to themselves that God exists. To this day you ask these people to prove God and they use the Tax return as an example.

[Fluffybunny]

God asked people to this so he could demonstrate his power to them. The bible states that this is the only thing that God asked people to test him in.

Hmmm, interesting. The whole 10% aspect of the churches feels to me like an Amway type multi-level sales plan. The more churches that you have in your downline the more money you make...

Come to think of it, the marketing is very much the same too. Once a member of Amway your job is to "convert" as many friends and family as you can to fill up your downline sales force, so that you can get 10% of each of their sales. Often one must speak to complete strangers to get as many converts as you can.

Of course Amway never said that you would burn in hell for eternity if you didn't sell their wares, but I may have missed that part.

It is all about power and money...

[MoonBaby]

never mind. brain fart

Edited May 26, 2004 by MoonBaby

[Chauncy]

It is all about power and money...

I think it safe to assume that the whole of this particular religion has been about these two aspects since the beginning, first power...then money.

What I find most gut punching is what means they have went to in order to maintain and increase this power,control and profit.

[Stellar]

God asked for a 10% tithe, because he wanted to show people he can do more with 90% than they could with 100%. God asked people to this so he could demonstrate his power to them. The bible states that this is the only thing that God asked people to test him in. Kind of like asking for proof of God. God knew people would be materialistic so he uses materialism to show to people that he is capable of giving you more than you have.

What happened to Faite, and further more... what happened to morality?

[saucy]

Hey, churches need money for the same reason anyone would in running a business. Going to church is a free service, nobody has to pay a cent, but nothing is really free. Churches need resources and to repair the building, pay the pastors and people who come in a clean and mow the lawn, shovel the driveway if it snows, pay all the different rent and light bills and everything else. Churches also help out the people who attend and also give to the community. Nobody is required to tith, they just hand baskets around and ask that you do. Some churches do keep track of who does and who does not and how much each person gave and that's just wrong for them to do.

[Ozmeister]

God wanted 10% of the cattle that people owned because "He" liked having BBQ's and used to have lots of guests around to "His" pad

[MoonBaby]

Chauncy said:

1 Corinthians 16:2 and 2 Corinthians 9:7 is where they get this idea, check it out tell me what you think it means.

Hey, in 16:1 Jesus says do what he told the Galatian churches to do. Where is what he told the Galation churches or was that not written in the Bible? And...my interpretation of 16:2 is this: If you give like you were told to, when Christ comes back he won't have to collect from the naughty boys and girls that were not setting aside money for the church.

OK,OK,OK. 2 Corinthians 9:6. Can someone please explain this one to me please because to me that most definately sounds like it's being said that if you give more, you get more.

Edited May 27, 2004 by MoonBaby

[Chauncy]

1 Corinthians 16:2

" On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income,saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made"

Christian giving should be:

· Proportional to one's income (1 Corinthians 16:2, 2 Corinthians 8:12)

· Consistent (1 Corinthians 16:2)

· Sacrificial (Mark 12:43-44, 2 Corinthians 8:2-3)

· Cheerful (2 Corinthians 9:7)

Picture this back in the day, collecting money and people were happy to give, it was their duty. Taxation in the guise of Religious Duty. A sheep in a wolf's clothing.

They say oh we want to give. More like they were not only told but told how to do it.

OK,OK,OK. 2 Corinthians 9:6. Can someone please explain this one to me please because to me that most definately sounds like it's being said that if you give more, you get more.

Its most definetly implied MoonBaby! Like Vito Corleone " I'll make'em an offer they can't refuse"

Edited May 27, 2004 by Chauncy

[MoonBaby]

Picture this back in the day, collecting money and people were happy to give, it was their duty.

They were happy 'cause they weren't going to die .

[Stellar]

Hmm, but according to what Joc said... it was God who said this and he told the people to give 10% of their cattle to God, not the church, God... (be it a sacrifice or whatever...)

[Falco Rex]

I would think that back then God and the Church were'nt viewed as being too far apart. Only the priests were consecrated and trained in animal sacrifice. If you wanted to give something to God you had to go through his "middlemen"..

Convienent if you're a hungry priest..

On the other hand, maybe God just wanted a honking big leather jacket....

[Chauncy]

Hmm, but according to what Joc said... it was God who said this and he told the people to give 10% of their cattle to God, not the church, God... (be it a sacrifice or whatever...)

Joc was referring to Old Testament tithe issues, we've been mainly dealing with NT tithe issues. this what the OT says.

Genesis 14:17-20: "Then after his return from the defeat of Chedorlaomer and the kings who were with him, the king of Sodom went out to meet him at the valley of Shaveh (that is, the King's Valley). And Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; now he was a priest of God Most High. And he blessed him and said, 'Blessed be Abram of God Most High, possessor of heaven and earth; and blessed be God Most High, who has delivered your enemies into your hand.' And he gave him a tenth of all."

Genesis 28:20-22: "Then Jacob made a vow, saying, 'If God will be with me and will keep me on this journey that I take, and will give me food to eat and garments to wear, and I return to my father's house in safety, then the Lord will be my God. And this stone, which I have set up as a pillar, will be God's house; and of all that Thou dost give me I will surely give a tenth to Thee.'"

Leviticus 27:30-33: "Thus all the tithe of the land, of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's; it is holy to the Lord. If, therefore, a man wishes to redeem part of his tithe, he shall add to it one-fifth of it. And for every tenth part of herd or flock, whatever passes under the rod, the tenth one shall be holy to the Lord. He is not to be concerned whether it is good or bad, nor shall he exchange it; or if he does exchange it, then both it and its substitute shall become holy. It shall not be redeemed."

Numbers 18:21-24: "And to the sons of Levi, behold, I have given all the tithe in Israel for an inheritance, in return for their service which they perform, the service of the tent of meeting. And the sons of Israel shall not come near the tent of meeting again, lest they bear sin and die. Only the Levites shall perform the service of the tent of meeting, and they shall bear their iniquity; it shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations, and among the sons of Israel they shall have no inheritance. For the tithe of the sons of Israel, which they offer as an offering to the Lord, I have given to the Levites for an inheritance; therefore I have said concerning them, 'They shall have no inheritance among the sons of Israel.'"

Deuteronomy 14:22-27: "You shall surely tithe all the produce from what you sow, which comes out of the field every year. And you shall eat in the presence of the Lord your God, at the place where He chooses to establish His name, the tithe of your grain, your new wine, your oil, and the first-born of your herd and your flock, in order that you may learn to fear the Lord your God always. And if the distance is so great for you that you are not able to bring the tithe, since the place where the Lord your God chooses to set His name is too far away from you when the Lord your God blesses you, then you shall exchange it for money, and bind the money in your hand and go to the place which the Lord your God chooses. And you may spend the money for whatever your heart desires, for oxen, or sheep, or wine, or strong drink, or whatever your heart desires; and there you shall eat in the presence of the Lord your God and rejoice, you and your household. Also you shall not neglect the Levite who is in your town, for he has no portion or inheritance among you."

Deuteronomy 14:28-29: "At the end of every third year you shall bring out all the tithe of your produce in that year, and shall deposit it in your town. And the Levite, because he has no portion or inheritance among you, and the alien, the orphan and the widow who are in your town, shall come and eat and be satisfied, in order that the Lord your God may bless you in all the work of your hand which you do."

Nehemiah 12:44: "On that day men were also appointed over the chambers for the stores, the contributions, the first fruits, and the tithes, to gather into them from the fields of the cities the portions required by the law for the priests and Levites; for Judah rejoiced over the priests and Levites who served."

[MoonBaby]

Genesis 4:2-5

...Now Able kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil. In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the LORD. But Abel brought fat portions from some of the first born of his flock. The LORD looked with favor on Abel and his offerings, but on Cain and his offerings he did not look with favor...

Tell me what you people get out of this.

Edited May 27, 2004 by MoonBaby