Mayan Calendar does not end in 2012 after all

[Marby]

TheSearcher, thank you for saving me a bit of time by posting what you did regarding the so called prophecies.

I continue to find it mind boggling that any of these "prophecies" are given any credence beyond that of historical curiosity and understanding.

Edited November 19, 2009 by Marby

[TheSearcher]

No problem, everyone has their ups and downs, but the same thing gets under my skin. People who will just be one sided, one directional, and perpetualy throwing themselves into glass windows, getting bigger and bigger, as they get deeper and deeper into their self conceived versions of the world.

I'f your interested in how I post and the subjects I touch on you should visit my thread called Waisting Time? - Skeptics vs. Believers. A lot of information is given and I'm sure you will understand where I'm coming from after reading my posts there.

Don't mind if I do . I'll check it once I get a chance.

TheSearcher, thank you for saving me a bit of time by posting what you did regarding the so called prophecies.

I continue to find it mind boggling that any of these "prophecies" are given any credence beyond that of historical curiosity and understanding.

I know, it is amazing how these things seem to take a life of their own and even more amazing to see how many people hold them to be the ultimate truth, set in stone.

[Marby]

TheSearcher, that's what I think makes this sort of thing dangerous to a certain extent. In another one of the ten million 2012 threads, I posted a National Geographic article link that basically debunked all the theories about it. It mentions that scientists are concerned about the letters they are getting from teenagers and others regarding this "end of world" panic, asking whether they should go ahead and commit suicide.

In fact, here is the link.

Just because the Mayans said that this date is the end of the "long cycle", doesn't mean the world will end, and they never said it would anyway, nor does it mean that there will be some dramatic shift in the collective consciousness. Apparently, one need only to be dead and ancient to gain credibility in the prophecy business. Suddenly, the Mayans or *insert ancient culture of choice* know more because portions of modern society feel guilty for being modern. It's comical really, because it totally gets played up by Hollywood every time you see the "wise shaman" or "the ancient curse". Big difference between reality and celluloid, y'know? And people don't care to make the distinction because apparently, irrational panic or wishful thinking are more fun.

[Alienated Being]

You know, before this becomes "official", many other scientists are going to have to reach the same calculation in order to be able to reinforce this claim. Otherwise, it's obsolete.

[TheSearcher]

You know, before this becomes "official", many other scientists are going to have to reach the same calculation in order to be able to reinforce this claim. Otherwise, it's obsolete.

Of course, that's how it works and to be honest I would not want it any other way. This said, I should have rephrased it properly too, apologies for that, "the long count on the mayan calendar restarts a cycle in .... (2012 - 2220 or not)", because the mayan calendar does not end at all, in fact. Saying that the calendar itself ends, is a misinterpretation as such.

[therealist]

i just wanted to add that nor the Mayans, Egyptians or even the palestinians (where the people who wrote the bible lived) where in fact aliens, gods or any other form of higher being ( the apostles wrote the bible not Jesus), they were infact men and in some cases women, the same people who infact believed the world was flat, darker skinned people where only good as slaves, people who worshipped the dung beetle and of course not forgetting that their belief that the spanish where gods!

this leads me to my point that no matter how much "proof" that Google, Ask or the well known disaster of an encylopiedia that is wikipiedia! can create, it does not 'prove' anything as all that is presented is written by man (not to mention less intelligant man)which basically means it is open to incorrections,'to error is human'. therefore i believe that the claims of dooms day are false and hugely twisted, if we are to believe everything these people believed wouldn't that mean that we all would have fallen off the end of the earth? and that all the royal families and people in postitions of great power are in fact gods/ related to gods??

Why therefore do we choose to believe in certain beliefs of thier cultures simply because it mildly corresponds with the idea of dooms day in our life time, i merely believe that this over hype is due to hollywood, clever minipulation of old texts and of course people being bored of thier own lives.

whom propably believe that vampires, werewolves and zombies exisit merely because ancient people believed in them!

[TheSearcher]

i just wanted to add that nor the Mayans, Egyptians or even the palestinians (where the people who wrote the bible lived) where in fact aliens, gods or any other form of higher being ( the apostles wrote the bible not Jesus), they were infact men and in some cases women, the same people who infact believed the world was flat, darker skinned people where only good as slaves, people who worshipped the dung beetle and of course not forgetting that their belief that the spanish where gods!

this leads me to my point that no matter how much "proof" that Google, Ask or the well known disaster of an encylopiedia that is wikipiedia! can create, it does not 'prove' anything as all that is presented is written by man (not to mention less intelligant man)which basically means it is open to incorrections,'to error is human'. therefore i believe that the claims of dooms day are false and hugely twisted, if we are to believe everything these people believed wouldn't that mean that we all would have fallen off the end of the earth? and that all the royal families and people in postitions of great power are in fact gods/ related to gods??

Why therefore do we choose to believe in certain beliefs of thier cultures simply because it mildly corresponds with the idea of dooms day in our life time, i merely believe that this over hype is due to hollywood, clever minipulation of old texts and of course people being bored of thier own lives.

whom propably believe that vampires, werewolves and zombies exisit merely because ancient people believed in them!

OMG vampires, werewolves and zombies don't exist??? You've shattered my belief in the world!!

On a more serious note, nicely said.

[Harakuro]

I would first like to credit Thesearcher and G3nom3 for their intelligent arguments provided to us on this thread. So Kudos on that one guys.

Here is my opinion of this matter, that most likely a lot of you possibly already know.

The Mayan calendar does not actually say "The world will come to an end at 2012" These people were so advanced, intelligent wise, their knowledge of astronomy was so precise that they could predict a solar eclipse hundreds of years in the future.

They studied how the earth and sun moved including the whole solar system, and they studied the stars and our galaxy. And in terms created a calendar to simply keep count on the major cosmic events that would befall our solar system.

That being said, no one has proof that it was indeed their intent to predict cosmic events on the calendar, however, looking at evidence to what we can see from it, we can assume that it was indeed their intent.

Most scientist who have studied this calendar and worked on breaking it down, have come to the conclusion that they wanted to end their calendar to mark the Galactic alignment. Which in a very broad definition is when the sun aligns itself with the equator of the galaxy.

Thinking back at what we can assume the Mayan purpose was with respect to their calendar, it was to predict major cosmic events. A Galactic Alignment is something that only happens every 25,800 something years. In my view, that would be classified as a major cosmic event.

I believe that the Mayan predicted this, but did not have the intention of a doomsday. I believe people think that the Mayan calendar should be infinite, and when or if it ever ends would be the end of time. Which is why we think if their calendar ends at that time it is the end.

It is not impossible for a Galactic Alignment to have some sort of effect on our planet, or even psychological effect. It has been proven that lunar activities can have some sort of effect on some people. We simply cannot know what can happen.

The fact is, yes our planet is one day going to come to an end. We simply do not have date on it. The very thing that gives us life, the sun, could one day destroy the very nature of life. But we cannot predict such a cataclysm events. And like every other Calendar, when one ends, another begins. I am fairly sure that we are all going to buy a 2013 Calendar after then end of the year 2012.

And if by any chance it is then end of the world. It is the end of the world, we cannot do anything. We cannot hide from it. If it happens it happens. Enough said.

But I seriously doubt a Galactic Alignment can bring upon the Apocalypse/ doomsday/ judgment day/ end of the world etc.

And to Conclude, This is but my opinion on this matter. Their not facts, their opinions, based on countless source all put together and creating one opinion.

[Ikki]

The problema with the precise galactic alignment stuff is that it happens every 36 year or so -- around 1980-2016 it just happens to fall on the day of the winter solstice. And since the most accurate alignment already happened in 1998, it wouldn't be that precise. Besides, it appears to be a visual effect only, resulting from the precession of the Earth.

There's also another important point: The Long Count restarts every 5,126 years, and the last Day Zeros didn't fall on galactic alignment days. Maybe they chose the date because of a prediction of the alignment -- or maybe just because the winter solstice is a nifty astronomical event. There's nothing to suggest that 21-12-12 is any different from all the previous 13.0.0.0.0s, so it would be arbitrary to posit that the calendar is based on or revolves around an alignment with the Dark Rift.

[Marby]

i just wanted to add that nor the Mayans, Egyptians or even the palestinians (where the people who wrote the bible lived) where in fact aliens, gods or any other form of higher being ( the apostles wrote the bible not Jesus), they were infact men and in some cases women, the same people who infact believed the world was flat, darker skinned people where only good as slaves, people who worshipped the dung beetle and of course not forgetting that their belief that the spanish where gods!

I'm glad someone pointed all of this out. I will only take exception to the point about darker skinned people being slaves. While this was true in later times, slavery was never dependent upon skin color before, but rather upon who happened to be on the losing side of the battle.

Nit picking out of the way, this goes back to the point I have been trying to make in many of my own posts. I find it almost insulting when people insist that the ancient *pick a culture* couldn't have possibly made the technological or philosophical advances that they achieved without other worldly help. They were no less intelligent, capable, and creative as people are today. They may have had ideas and prejudices that are alien to us now, but it hardly means that they were stupid. That said, the "predictions" they made were no more special or valid than the ones every crackpot, new age psychic have made in modern times.

[TheSearcher]

Lets also not forget that most calendars were first made in order to keep track with seasons, for agricultural reasons (start of the rain season, when is it a good period to start planting, etc.) and nothing else.

This calendar was then often highjacked by the clergy and / or the rulers of the time and culture, added with some predictions and used to keep the people in check.

Any prediction or prophecy, makes sense only to the people living in the time and culture, that made it. We tend to forget that. We also tend to forget that prophecies are a means to control the people and are in fact a geo-political tool, often used by clergy and rulers alike.

[DrunkDwarf]

Most scientist who have studied this calendar and worked on breaking it down, have come to the conclusion that they wanted to end their calendar to mark the Galactic alignment. Which in a very broad definition is when the sun aligns itself with the equator of the galaxy.

Please, give me one example of a actual "scientist" that says that they wanted it to end on the "Galactic Alignment".

The Mayans based their calendar on surprisingly accurate calculations of the cycle of the seasons, solstices, eclipses, venus etc in the night sky, they only had the movements of the naked eye objects in the sky to work with. Their information about the time intervals of these cycles was impressively precise, equal to what we know today. They did not know much about the greater galaxy, and of our position within it, so couldn't calculate any "alignment" with the equator of the galaxy. They may have had very impressive astronomical knowledge, but they didn't know everything that we know now.

The 21st December 2012 date that we see so often falls precisely upon the Winter Solstice of that year, this is intentional, it holds no other relevance. There is no prophecy.