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perplexedstargazer

Dancing Star In Night Sky

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toast
12 minutes ago, archer95446 said:

Watch 11:40 until 15:04, that "star" or drone like thing is erratically moving all around up there in the sky!!!

No, it isnt. It just seems to move when there is no reference point and that movement is caused by the camera movement.  Set the vid speed to 0,25 and look again, there is no movement of the object related to a.) the cables and b.), the tree tip/s.

Edited by toast
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archer95446

Well, we agree to disagree about what it is and what it isn't, and that's ok!!!  The ones I have seen, move around like the ones I've referenced to in that video.  

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ChrLzs
2 hours ago, archer95446 said:

That video that madhatmike posted totally nailed it at three different spots:  at 11:40, 16:03, and 17:38!!!  It's not caused by a "poorly focused handheld camera"!!!

Madhatmike told us to look at 15:14.... Are you arguing with *his* 'analysis'?

At 11:40, that video shows an object without any background reference, violently shaking sideways as the camera is being jerkily slewed around - it is heavily digitally zoomed which exaggerates the handshake effects.  The *rate* of the violent jumps is perfectly consistent with those caused by the Image Stabilisation system trying to keep the object steady in the frame - that's how IS works..  The movement is obviously camera shake, and someone familiar with video images and image stabilisation would recognise that effect immediately.  The blooming outwards is again obviously, bokeh effects as the camera tries to autofocus.  Cameras of that poor standard are usually unable to autofocus effectively on a distant small source of light.

At 16:03, we can see the exact same issues, and as you clearly are not familiar with camera equipment, I am not wasting further time.

Do please explain using proper technical detail why you claim that the movement is not caused by simple camera shake, and also show us some examples of your expertise in video analysis /photogrammetry.  You are welcome to check my posting history here, and if anyone else disputes these effects, I can easily duplicate them on the two low quality cameras I have, as well as as show what happens on a *decent* camera.. 

Quote

 Even though these "dancing stars" were caught on video, some of you still discredit it!!!

Yes.  Because it is unworthy of any credit.

Quote

 You are entitled to your own opinion!!

Good.  It is a highly educated opinion, and is agreed upon by all the many camera experts here of whom I am but one small voice......

Quote

 I'm just glad that someone was able to "capture" these things on video!!   I'm thinking also, that they got to be some kind of military or (?) drone!!!

Tell me, archer95446, if I was to give some quite simple instructions on how to capture one of these dancing stars and PROVE it is moving, would you be willing to do that?  In fact, whether or not you are willing to try, I'll post some hints on how it can be done, even with quite modest camera equipment - even a phone (although some phones are so awful, there may be limits..).  You may be surprised how easy it would be to verify the movement.  I'll give a small hint or two right now...  There are lots of things (some of which can be quite tall, like house roofs...) that are unmoving on the ground... and you have feet...  Do I need to go on?

And also, given that there are hundreds of thousands of amateur astronomers out there with amazingly sophisticated all-sky/all-night cams and telescopes, monitoring and checking the sky, then why aren't they posting any sightings?  If you tell us roughly where you live, I'll give you some contact numbers for your nearest enthusiasts/astronomy clubs and you'll find they love to have visitors to show off what they do and what equipment they have.  You could further discuss your claims with them....

Edited by ChrLzs

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ChrLzs

And here's an old video of mine demonstrating all this stuff, using a similarly low quality camera to film Venus. (no audio)

Note (at 0:58) in particular how much Venus shakes around once it is off tripod, even though I have a fairly steady hand..  Once you are zoomed in, tiny movements of your hand are greatly magnified.  For cameras that have Image Stabilisation (mine didn't in that video), that can help stabilise the image a bit, but as soon as the movement becomes too great, the image will 'jump' as shown in the video proffered by Madhatmike.  You will also see the same effects as the camera goes in and out of focus.  The folks using these cameras really should have encountered this before, and, like all things, it pays to understand the technology you are working with, rather than run around and claim the sky is falling, aliens or whatever else... 

Anyway, happy to answer questions or supply more examples... and still waiting for *any* of these folks to take the time to properly record these 'dancing' stars.  It's really not that difficult....  In case you didn't work it out from the hint, all you have to do is position yourself so that the star/whatever is right next to something like a roofline, tree branch, electric pylon, etc.  At the same time, steady your camera as best you can, eg by leaning it against something or sitting on the ground and jamming it up against your knee.  But even if you don't do that.. once you get that steady object into the same frame, we will be able to see if it is stationary, moving (like an aircraft)...or dancing.. by referencing it against the unmoving object.  There are even programs that will do that for you...

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archer95446

I don't have the money for a better hand-held camera phone.  I've tried to get a video of what I've seen, but my old camera phone just can't seem to pick up the image.  Your video example looks nothing like what I've seen!!!  Again, I think it's probably some kind of (maybe military or ?) drone.  Whatever it is, it appears to be in our atmosphere, and I don't see it all of the time, it's very random. I understand what your saying about having a "stationary point of reference", and if I get a better camera phone, I'll keep that in mind, when trying to get it on video!!

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ChrLzs
On ‎2016‎-‎12‎-‎01 at 10:00 AM, ChrLzs said:

given that there are hundreds of thousands of amateur astronomers out there with amazingly sophisticated all-sky/all-night cams and telescopes, monitoring and checking the sky, then why aren't they posting any sightings?  If you tell us roughly where you live, I'll give you some contact numbers for your nearest enthusiasts/astronomy clubs and you'll find they love to have visitors to show off what they do and what equipment they have.  You could further discuss your claims with them....

I notice that this bit (as *always*) seems to be ignored by every single claimant...  so all those guys/gals (like me) who have decent equipment and know how to use it, are somehow missing these things................

Forgive me if I don't hold my breath waiting for someone to successfully show these dancing stars by actually doing the logical thing and including a stationary object.  Whenever the video does include anything unmoving it verifies that what we are seeing is camera movement added to out of focus effects.

Edited by ChrLzs
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Tenakoe

I'm from New Zealand and I also saw a star zig zagging across at an extremely fast speed but still slow enough to see very clearly. It was in late December around 1am and my friend and I were star gazing - we'd only been doing it for 5 mins or so. We both saw it, clear as day and it wasn't a satellite, a shooting star ... we weren't tired and the star wasn't wobbling in the same spot. The star literally would spring up in different parts of the sky (north to east, east to south and south to west) so quickly. I'm not a big believer in UFO so this isn't something that crossed my mind, it actually just seems like a star jumping from place to place. It was really cool to see. Wish there was someone who could explain instead of all these armchair experts trying to come up with lame explanations like 'your eyes are playing tricks on you'. 

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toast
1 hour ago, Tenakoe said:

Wish there was someone who could explain instead of all these armchair experts trying to come up with lame explanations like 'your eyes are playing tricks on you'. 

I think the only armchair expert here is you. Or how do you would name it when a person saw some moving lights in the sky and judged that these blinks are from one and the same object instead of multiple?

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South Alabam

My sister and brother in law were fishing one morning, around one a.m and saw what they described as stars zipping all around straight above them. Then they sped off super fast after a few minutes. I didn't ask if they video taped it. I suppose if they are like me, I'd just be looking at it and never think of a camera. They weren't out there to do anything but fish, anyway, so the only camera they might have had would have been cell phones. I'll ask them again on this about when and where this happened. But I do know it was somewhere here in Alabama.

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Essan
On 05/12/2016 at 10:57 PM, ChrLzs said:

I notice that this bit (as *always*) seems to be ignored by every single claimant...  so all those guys/gals (like me) who have decent equipment and know how to use it, are somehow missing these things................

Forgive me if I don't hold my breath waiting for someone to successfully show these dancing stars by actually doing the logical thing and including a stationary object.  Whenever the video does include anything unmoving it verifies that what we are seeing is camera movement added to out of focus effects.

One way to prove it would be a long exposure shot - say 30 secs?   It would show stars as a very slightly elongated point of light whilst a trail of light is produced by the "dancing star"

But as you say, such things are only ever witnessed by people with poor quality cameras and no tripods.  Only.  Ever.

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South Alabam

O.K, I asked my brother in law what happened again. He said they saw one object in the night sky, that was soon joined by two more. They were so high in the air (or at least it looked that way) that they appeared to be stars. What caught their attention was they would be traveling a straight line, then make instantaneous 90 degree turns. They didn't fly in formation, just flew their own paths. They flew off after a few minutes. This was at the broken bridge on the Alabama river, near the Miller's ferry dam. And that was between 2 a.m and 3:30 a.m. And I forgot to ask when, and also how fast they seemed to be going. But the 90 degree turns are what is interesting. And what bought this conversation up, was telling him I wanted to get a pair of Star gazing binoculars to look at the stars etc.., and then that's when he told me the above.

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ChrLzs

Well, if this was me, I'd be contacting the nearest astronomy club to that region and asking who amongst them have all-sky webcams running all night so we can check their archives.  Thing is, as has been explained many times above, IF such things were happening, then astronomers , either professional or amateur (and you'd be surprised how many of the latter there are) should have caught this behavior.  While I am a bit of an astro-head meself, I don't run an all-sky webcam.. but I do have the sort of equipment to do it, and at least two people within 30km of me DO run all-night sky monitoring.  Here's a pic off my camera using a semi-fish-eye to show about 180 degrees of sky.
DSC04686_small.jpg
(click to enlarge* and you'll see the stars clearly - it was a 30 second exposure and the bright thing is the Moon, in case you hadn't worked it out...)
At the time I took it, no 'craft' were in shot, but later I'll pop back and post some similar images that include both aircraft and satellites, to show you the sort of things us astronomy folk do...

Anyway, despite us doing that sort of thing, the astronomy community have never caught one of these dancing thingies.  Can you explain that?

 

So I'd perhaps also ask my b-i-l why was he up at that time?  Was he tired?  Had he consumed any de-stabilising food or drink?  Did it go overhead (there is a common effect that causes moving objects to appear to turn sharply if they go close to overhead)?  Are there any nearby military bases that might have had aircraft criss-crossing? Has he seen the effect of an aircraft that is turning where as it faces the observer it appears to stop and then quickly heads off at another angle, simply because of the viewing angle?

 

* - I see that with this new fangled forum's imaging system, to see that full size, you have to:

  1. Click on it.
  2. Look for where it says Full Size at lower left.  Click that.
  3. It will appear in a browser window, and unless you have a large high-res screen, it still may not be full size.. so put your mouse cursor over it and if you see the plus symbol, click again.  Tada...
Edited by ChrLzs

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South Alabam

My brother and law and sister both saw them. They were catfish fishing. And neither drink.  I have no idea what these things are, just pointing out that my family had seen things too. They could be insects reflecting light up above them and making it look like they were stars, not really sure.

 

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Cmontgomery108

Hi All,

Glad i found this topic. Tonight, I saw a star on the horizon from my balcony in Tucson, AZ, facing East. I thought it blinked more like a plane than a star and it was dancing all around, moving up, down, left and right in ways that I know no aircraft could fly. I didn't want to take my eyes off it! My daughter came out and she saw the same thing! She got my wife and when she joined us, she played the Scully to my Mulder and said it was not moving, or slightly moving. I used my phone to see what night object should be in that location and it turned out to be Arcturus. I think the heat in the atmosphere by the horizon created the illusion in this case. 

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ChrLzs
46 minutes ago, Cmontgomery108 said:

Hi All,

Glad i found this topic. Tonight, I saw a star on the horizon from my balcony in Tucson, AZ, facing East. I thought it blinked more like a plane than a star and it was dancing all around, moving up, down, left and right in ways that I know no aircraft could fly. I didn't want to take my eyes off it! My daughter came out and she saw the same thing! She got my wife and when she joined us, she played the Scully to my Mulder and said it was not moving, or slightly moving. I used my phone to see what night object should be in that location and it turned out to be Arcturus. I think the heat in the atmosphere by the horizon created the illusion in this case. 

Well done!  Indeed, heat (and therefore refractive layers of air), especially when a star (..planet/aircraft with landing lights on..) is near the horizon can indeed make things not only move around, but also 'scintillate'.  In other words rapidly vary in colour and brightness - Sirius is notorious for this, and if the conditions are really bad, Venus.  Pollution /dust /fog /mist etc in the air make it worse, as does being over a lake or ocean.  Venus tends to be a bit steadier than more distant objects, as it is just large enough to be sending a small disc of bundles of photons, which average out its brightness.  More distant objects like stars are a thin, single line of photons, so any interference affects them much more dramatically (hence why stars tend to twinkle a lot more than planets).

Astronomy apps are now easy to get for phones, so you can quickly identify what's up there.. BTW, tonight in the east from mid latitudes USA an hour or two after sunset, Arcturus, the Moon, Jupiter  and Spica will make a nice little arrangement, the latter 3 forming a neat little triangle...

Happy stargazing, all.

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srishti

Sirius appears to flash different colors when it's low in the sky … really, all the stars are flashing different colors. ... It's the star Sirius in the constellation Canis Major, brightest star in the sky. The bright planets Venus and Jupiter are also up before dawn now. Hope you get the ans. And for more info. https://www.google.co.in/search?espv=2&q=What+is+the+flickering+star+in+the+sky%3F&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiIgPXpvvvSAhUBt48KHY6OCsQQzmcIEg

 

Edited by srishti

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RoxStar30
On Friday, March 08, 2013 at 7:24 AM, pbyhistorian said:

I didn't read these posts too closely but, no, no one is crazy. It could be correct however to say "you're hallucinating".

Back in my thirties, I participated in an all-night star party atop Glacier Point in Yosemite with an astronomy club. After a long night, we were waiting for the full moon to appear from behind Half Dome. I was looking at a very bright star and suddenly it began to exhibit non-ballistic motion! I pointed it out to the old-timers who, of course, could see that the star wasn't dancing.

They explained that when you're fatigued and there is no point of reference (like the horizon) in your field of view, your eyes will start making small erratic movements (perhaps looking for a point of reference?). As soon as I heard the explanation, that star really began dancing(!) which made me laugh.

There is a name for the behavior (which I've forgotten and was looking for when I found this post) that dates back to the days of sail, when sailors spent long hours on watch during the night.

So if you're trying to reproduce the effect, get good and tired, then stare at a bright star or planet with nothing else in your field of view. Or better yet, get someone else to do it and enjoy their excitement.

I do understand what you're saying because it's one of the thing's I've tried to tell myself it could be- but it's not that. I've seen these 'dancing stars' a hand full of times myself and sometimes I've been tired/ exhausted while seeing them, other times it's been while I'm fully alert and not sleep deprived in the slightest. On more than one occasion I have had the moon or branches as a reference point- and the star is still dancing. Some also change color from white to red to blue and some have been a more soft yellow glow. 

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ChrLzs
On 5/20/2017 at 6:41 PM, RoxStar30 said:

I do understand what you're saying because it's one of the thing's I've tried to tell myself it could be- but it's not that. I've seen these 'dancing stars' a hand full of times myself and sometimes I've been tired/ exhausted while seeing them, other times it's been while I'm fully alert and not sleep deprived in the slightest. On more than one occasion I have had the moon or branches as a reference point- and the star is still dancing. Some also change color from white to red to blue and some have been a more soft yellow glow. 

Explanations for all the above have been provided earlier in the thread.  In particular, while the bolded part has been claimed many times, no-one has filmed it, nor has it ever been captured by the hundreds of thousands of amateur and professional astronomers around the globe, either by chance or on the continuous footage recorded every night by the multitude of night cams...

So, buy and carry a camera!  I have, and do.  Never once seen an 'unstable' star I couldn't explain.

And if your eyes are the source, via micro-movements, your brain will not be likely to notice that the dim background is similarly dancing - your brain paints in the background picture over multiple passes of your eyes, and then it focuses (pun intended) on just the tiny area containing the object of interest. 

 

And my final recommendation to future claimants - join an astronomy club.  Learn your sky so you can tell us which star was dancing, and learn how you can best record what you are seeing with a relatively modest outlay.  Well, do that after you've spent a few hours looking into their wonderful telescopes and binoculars, that is.  Astronomers, both professional and amateur, always seem to be very lovely, calm, approachable and welcoming folks, who just love to show off their optical equipment and astronomy skills - I guess it's all that time they* spend considering the wonder and awe of the Cosmos.  You won't regret visiting a club...

 

* I said 'they' - I almost include myself!  While i do spend much time at night gazing upwards and occasionally photographing what I see, my skills and equipment are very modest.  Just wait until I fully retire..!

Here's one of mine:

med_gallery_95887_40_19548.jpg

(click here for a larger version)
That's an 'Iridium' satellite, with its solar panels brightly reflecting the Sun back to earth.  You can see the Southern Cross (Crux) slightly above right of the satellite trail, and the 'Pointers' (Alpha and Beta Centauri) are the two bright stars beneath.  As this was about a thirty second exposure, any dancing stars would have left a squiggly line...  None of the similar images I have ever taken show such a squiggly line..

Edited by ChrLzs
to add larger version link
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edaho

I've been watching a jumping or "dancing" star for the last few nights in northern Idaho. It's about half way from the eastern horizon to straight overhead. It's still for a few moments and then make small movements almost in a circle. Then it will jump about ten times it's own width in any direction.  But it always returns to its original position in relation to other stars. I've watched it several hours over several nights. One night I saw three different "stars" in widely separated areas moving like this. The last two nights there has been only one.

I remember seeing the same phenomenon many years ago, in the mid 1980s. There was no internet then to try and check things out.  Tonight I typed in "jumping star in night sky" in Google  and got over 8 million hits. So there are a lot of people seeing this.

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Timothy
6 minutes ago, edaho said:

I've been watching a jumping or "dancing" star for the last few nights in northern Idaho. It's about half way from the eastern horizon to straight overhead. It's still for a few moments and then make small movements almost in a circle. Then it will jump about ten times it's own width in any direction.  But it always returns to its original position in relation to other stars. I've watched it several hours over several nights. One night I saw three different "stars" in widely separated areas moving like this. The last two nights there has been only one.

I remember seeing the same phenomenon many years ago, in the mid 1980s. There was no internet then to try and check things out.  Tonight I typed in "jumping star in night sky" in Google  and got over 8 million hits. So there are a lot of people seeing this.

Welcome to UM,

By posting in this thread, I'm hopeful you've read it.

Surely you can appreciate the need to set up a decent camera and film this?

If you haven't, why the hell not?

>8 million hits and no decent video footage? 

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edaho
1 minute ago, Timonthy said:

Welcome to UM,

By posting in this thread, I'm hopeful you've read it.

Surely you can appreciate the need to set up a decent camera and film this?

If you haven't, why the hell not?

>8 million hits and no decent video footage? 

 

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edaho
2 minutes ago, Timonthy said:

Welcome to UM,

By posting in this thread, I'm hopeful you've read it.

Surely you can appreciate the need to set up a decent camera and film this?

If you haven't, why the hell not?

>8 million hits and no decent video footage? 

Yes, I've read both the pros and cons, the believers and the critics.  I'm not into cameras and have nothing to prove either way. I just believe my own eyes. I've sat with my head resting on a lawn chair and observed many stars, and only the one seems to move consistently. And, by the way, it's in the heavens, not hell. :)

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Timothy
9 minutes ago, edaho said:

Yes, I've read both the pros and cons, the believers and the critics.  I'm not into cameras and have nothing to prove either way. I just believe my own eyes. I've sat with my head resting on a lawn chair and observed many stars, and only the one seems to move consistently. And, by the way, it's in the heavens, not hell. :)

Well I'm glad that you've seen it, and enjoy it. But it's a bit of a shame really. If it was really a 'dancing star', not in our atmosphere, then it's a phenomena not known and could be very handy to have footage to help to gain interest and start a real study.

What you've described, 'dancing' stars, returning to original positions, sounds like it could be purely atmospheric or meteorological phenomena. 

No chance of you picking up a cheap camera to film it? Or borrow one from a friend? 

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ChrLzs
3 minutes ago, edaho said:

I've been watching a jumping or "dancing" star for the last few nights in northern Idaho. It's about half way from the eastern horizon to straight overhead. It's still for a few moments and then make small movements almost in a circle. Then it will jump about ten times it's own width in any direction.  But it always returns to its original position in relation to other stars. I've watched it several hours over several nights. One night I saw three different "stars" in widely separated areas moving like this. The last two nights there has been only one.

I remember seeing the same phenomenon many years ago, in the mid 1980s. There was no internet then to try and check things out.  Tonight I typed in "jumping star in night sky" in Google  and got over 8 million hits. So there are a lot of people seeing this.

Repeating Timonthy's comments and taking them further - WHY would you take the time to post and yet not address any of the suggestions?

Please do so.  Let us know what is the best phone / camera you have access to and I and others will happily explain how you can EASILY record this phenomena (or suggest you find a friend with  a decent camera..)

Yes, there are a *few* people claiming this, but when asked to do some really simple things to document it, they vanish.  If you also can't be bothered, then I can't be bothered to believe you are seeing what you say.

And, almost certainly within a 20 mile radius, there will be several amateur astronomers who have recording equipment of exceptional quality, and some of them may even be recording the entire sky all night.  Don't you think they might see these things?  Why not join an astronomy club and explain to them what you are seeing.  They will also help you learn your sky, so you can tell us not just that's it's vaguely up there somewhere, but also tell us exactly which constellation and at what time.  I find it rather depressing that kids these days don't learn their night sky..

Warning - educational content follows!!!  FTR, that almost horizontal milky band in the direction you say you are looking (assuming a clear night and just after sunset), is the Milky Way.  The very bright star you can see up a bit is Vega, the two next brightest in that area are Altair (lower and left) and Deneb (lower again and right), and the constellations thereabouts include Cygnus, Lyra and Hercules.  And if you follow the Milky Way down and right, towards the Southern horizon, you are then staring straight into the centre of our galaxy and at the supermassive black hole (or holes) that reside there...

 

Anyway, if you do start caring, you could start your journey hereabouts:

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/astronomy-clubs-organizations/

and you'll find places like:

http://www.spokaneastronomical.org/

Join and learn..

 

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edaho

As I said before, I don't have anything to prove. I really don't care if you believe me or not. I simply came here because I was hoping someone would have the correct explanation, but I see that no one does. The most logical guess I've seen here is atmospheric conditions. But that doesn't explain why another star very close to this one does not exhibit the same characteristics. I'd suggest that you go look for yourself. Any place in the US would show this star in the east at just about first dark. i watched it again tonight.

BTW, I have found videos showing very similar movements. You would probably say they were faked, and if I submitted a video you wouldn't believe it either. As Ben Franklin once said, "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still".

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