Doctor claims he has evidence of the afterlif

[TRUEYOUTRUEME]

The near-death experience story is so common that it has become a bit of a cliché: A medical patient, hanging in a murky limbo between life and death, is drawn through a tunnel of bright light, meets their maker, and is told they must return to the land of living.

But that scenario played out letter-perfectly for Mary Jo Rapini.And her story is getting firm backing by a doctor who has studied some 1,300 near-death experiences. Medical doctor Jeffrey Long chronicles Rapini’s story, along with his own research, in a new book: “Evidence of the Afterlife: The Science of Near-Death Experiences.

Read more...

Though the initial experience of people seems to follow a very similar experience (light at the end of the tunnel) I would have to wonder about any experience beyond that being the same for all. In the article it mentions conversations with a god-like figure even taking place. Yet of course this is coming from people who did not actually die so it can be very similar to dreaming.

[~Onyx~]

Nice story, but much like how I feel about letting god deal with "sinners" and the "immoral", I'll form my own opinion about the afterlife when I get there. I hope the book does just swell for the doctor.

[Agent. Mulder]

seems just like dreaming (as onyx said). people who have siezures, or pilots spinning around in those testing wheels see the same lights when they black out or have a siezure.

[eqgumby]

I recently read a book that alluded to these same experiences being replicated in a laboratory study. It's pretty hard to say.

[supervike]

It just goes to show you that even Doctors aren't immune to non-scientific research.

[thefinalfrontier]

This was featured on the NBC news just yesterday,

[TheBloom]

A doctor should know better, sadly.

[Ignus Fatuus]

A doctor should know better, sadly.

Doctors do know that we somehow lose 21 grams at death. Not from excretion, or air but two grams and they state that they have no idea to what is going on.

Some doctors joke that it is your soul leaving the body. 21 grams is not much yet so much ... why???

Edited January 21, 2010 by Ignus Fatuus

[The Silver Thong]

Doctors do know that we somehow lose 21 grams at death. Not from excretion, or air but two grams and they state that they have no idea to what is going on.

Some doctors joke that it is your soul leaving the body. 21 grams is not much yet so much ... why???

Actual thats a very popular urban legend. 21 grams of matter converting into energy instantly would blow up an entire city.

[~Onyx~]

Actual thats a very popular urban legend. 21 grams of matter converting into energy instantly would blow up an entire city.

I volunteer Fargo, ND for that experiment, I mean, would you miss it? Anybody?

[TheBloom]

Doctors do know that we somehow lose 21 grams at death. Not from excretion, or air but two grams and they state that they have no idea to what is going on.

Some doctors joke that it is your soul leaving the body. 21 grams is not much yet so much ... why???

Ok, time to wrap this little misconception up.

'DOCTORS' do NOT claim we lose 21 grams at death. It was actually just ONE person who made this outrageous claim. This gentleman was Dr, Duncan MacDougall of Haverhill, Massachusetts.

He attempted to weigh the human soul.

In 1907 he developed a homemade scale. Which acted as a bed for 6 dying patients. He recorded their weights before and after death.

According to him, the difference was 21 grams after death. (Note: His first patients weight -at moment of death- decreased by three-fourths of an ounce, which is 21.3grams, not 21g.)

He also did the same experiment on 15 dogs and found no loss of weight. Apparently, he believed this was due to the fact he didn't believe animals had souls. Convenient, isn't it, that there should be no record of weight loss for a dog after death.

It's also important to note that two of his tests had to be discarded and the level of error was incredibly high.

In addition, noone has been able to repeat the results of this experiment.

In closing, there is no physiological evidence of a soul. That's assuming a soul would weigh anything in the first place. The experiment was conducted by a doctor in order to prove his pre-belief that he could prove a human had a soul.

I say this time and time again, and I will continue to say it.... RESEARCH GOES A LONG WAY. Research before assuming you know the facts over one urban legend.

Edited January 21, 2010 by DukeofNoodleness

[Ignus Fatuus]

Ok, time to wrap this little misconception up.

'DOCTORS' do NOT claim we lose 21 grams at death. It was actually just ONE person who made this outrageous claim. This gentleman was Dr, Duncan MacDougall of Haverhill, Massachusetts.

He attempted to weigh the human soul.

In 1907 he developed a homemade scale. Which acted as a bed for 6 dying patients. He recorded their weights before and after death.

According to him, the difference was 21 grams after death. (Note: His first patients weight -at moment of death- decreased by three-fourths of an ounce, which is 21.3grams, not 21g.)

He also did the same experiment on 15 dogs and found no loss of weight. Apparently, he believed this was due to the fact he didn't believe animals had souls. Convenient, isn't it, that there should be no record of weight loss for a dog after death.

It's also important to note that two of his tests had to be discarded and the level of error was incredibly high.

In addition, noone has been able to repeat the results of this experiment.

In closing, there is no physiological evidence of a soul. That's assuming a soul would weigh anything in the first place. The experiment was conducted by a doctor in order to prove his pre-belief that he could prove a human had a soul.

I say this time and time again, and I will continue to say it.... RESEARCH GOES A LONG WAY. Research before assuming you know the facts over one urban legend.

Do not make assumptions!!! ... I did my research and years ago actually three. I am not up on believing yet I have asked a few scientists of which you or neither anyone else here have. They do not have a clue, as do I not.

Dogs??? No soul as far as I know.

Are more of these tests needed??? Yes they are. Are you so quick to assume that you know this is not true??? Yes you are.

Just to let you know some tests by germans trying to measure the same concept have been done since that time yet no conclusive evidence was given.

Reseach does go a long way ... this is exactly the problems to which I have had with this particular forum. Assumptions. I did not say that I was right .. all I stated is that doctors and I have talked with them state that they do not know what to think.

I will stay away from the soul buisness for now and stick to what I know ... Geophysics, shadow people and Earthlights. To tell me different on these like I have been told is simply to call me a liar. Did not state this as fact but I will state the Ignus Fatuus and SP's as truth.

Sorry for being brash but you jogged in on me like I am a typical dum dum.

With that if I was like most people here I would say "dum dum ... I am no sucker but anyways lick me" ... sorry I like that metaphor.

We will never get anywhere with anything paranormal by disbelieving everything and making assumptions. I have tried to get debate on SP's and especially Earthlights only to be told you are wrong without debate. Want to give that a try??? I know squat about 21 ".3" grams as you did some research after reading my post "see that could be an assumption". I do know enough to try anyone here out on the others.

We know diddly squat about the universe and even our Earth. Some screwy things need to be researched.

A soul or no soul .. only time will tell.

Edited January 21, 2010 by Ignus Fatuus

[Ignus Fatuus]

Actual thats a very popular urban legend. 21 grams of matter converting into energy instantly would blow up an entire city.

Obviously not too popular Silver ... try contacting Dr. Michael Persinger about this. If it was just a legend scientists would not waste their time trying to disprove it. Only words have disproved it. I do not know if I am right, only what I have learned from others ... who do their homework.

Yes converting matter into energy would blow up much ... yet if we do have a soul how strong then is it???

[WoIverine]

I think they should do a mythbusters ep on NDE's. There has to be some intelligent forms of testing that can be utilized for this. Like blindfold a dying patient (you could actually use many people in this expirement...if they're terminally ill), take him to a room with weird objects in it. He dies. They resuscitate him, (if possible) and wheel him out of the room with said blindfold still on. Then they ask him what kind of objects he saw when he left his body...it really shouldn't be that difficult to pull something like this off.

Edited January 21, 2010 by SpiderCyde

[Big Chief]

Of course there is life after death you morons. Where do you think ghost and spirits and such come from? Why is there even research being done on this? Who actually believes we die and that's it.. Some of you peoples are just stern unbelievers....

[TheBloom]

Do not make assumptions!!! ... I did my research and years ago actually three.

Then you will know that only one gentleman claimed this, not 'doctors' as a collective. One doctor.

I have asked a few scientists of which you or neither anyone else here have.

Now who's assuming? You don't know anyone here or anything about them.

Are you so quick to assume that you know this is not true??? Yes you are.

I believe he was a fraud, yes. That is my opinion. There's no need to throw a hissy fit just because it doesn't share yours.

Just to let you know some tests by germans trying to measure the same concept have been done since that time yet no conclusive evidence was given.

Exactly. Don't make me explain to you what stands out about this statement. If you're not a typical 'dum dum' you should know.

Assumptions. I did not say that I was right .. all I stated is that doctors and I have talked with them state that they do not know what to think.

Talking to a couple of doctors does not put you in a position to collectively group the belief in a soul as 'doctors' opinions. You could have stated that the couple of doctors you have spoken to believed there was something in it. I can only judge you on what you said, and you said 'doctors'. Collectively.

... Geophysics, shadow people and Earthlights. To tell me different on these like I have been told is simply to call me a liar. Did not state this as fact but I will state the Ignus Fatuus and SP's as truth.

I didn't say anything about your knowledge on geophysics and shadow people, nor do I care. I simply explained a misconception you had made.

Sorry for being brash but you jogged in on me like I am a typical dum dum.

With that if I was like most people here I would say "dum dum ... I am no sucker but anyways lick me" ... sorry I like that metaphor.

We will never get anywhere with anything paranormal by disbelieving everything and making assumptions. I have tried to get debate on SP's and especially Earthlights only to be told you are wrong without debate. Want to give that a try??? I know squat about 21 ".3" grams as you did some research after reading my post "see that could be an assumption". I do know enough to try anyone here out on the others.

We know diddly squat about the universe and even our Earth. Some screwy things need to be researched.

A soul or no soul .. only time will tell.

You carry on with your 'research'. It doesn't affect my life. Personally, I believe you are wasting your time, but I do agree that things need to be researched before they are described as fact or false. However, you seem to be researching these things because you have a want for them to exist, not because you feel it's the right thing to do.

That is only my assumption.

Good luck with it all. Sorry to have touched such a nerve. I was merely correcting your story.

Edited January 21, 2010 by DukeofNoodleness

[The Silver Thong]

Ya, what Noodleness said

[Ignus Fatuus]

Then you will know that only one gentleman claimed this, not 'doctors' as a collective. One doctor.

Now who's assuming? You don't know anyone here or anything about them.

I believe he was a fraud, yes. That is my opinion. There's no need to throw a hissy fit just because it doesn't share yours.

Exactly. Don't make me explain to you what stands out about this statement. If you're not a typical 'dum dum' you should know.

Talking to a couple of doctors does not put you in a position to collectively group the belief in a soul as 'doctors' opinions. You could have stated that the couple of doctors you have spoken to believed there was something in it. I can only judge you on what you said, and you said 'doctors'. Collectively.

I didn't say anything about your knowledge on geophysics and shadow people, nor do I care. I simply explained a misconception you had made.

You carry on with your 'research'. It doesn't affect my life. Personally, I believe you are wasting your time, but I do agree that things need to be researched before they are described as fact or false. However, you seem to be researching these things because you have a want for them to exist, not because you feel it's the right thing to do.

That is only my assumption.

Good luck with it all. Sorry to have touched such a nerve. I was merely correcting your story.

A little bit of psychology for you ... I tried to ring your bell and it sounded "ding dong". I am not one of the trolls on this website. I am wasting my time??? I do not want them to exist ... I know they exist. That is fact and I will be my "soul" on it.

SP's, Ignus Fatuus ... rung your bell. You are out to disprove anything that anybody believes and yet I only believe what I have seen, not 21.3 grams bulldung which I have not.

Skeptics or Septics??? ... One questions the truth and the other questions others. I know squat, yet you wasted your time on me talking souls and I wasted my time getting a ring out of you for unexplainable purposes.

People know nothing about the reality of the universe. Do not pretend you know anything about the unexplainable. Just because you have not seen or disagree with someone does not give you the right to purposely offend them. A simple ... "I belive you are wrong" would suffice!!!

Yes, by the way you are right on one thing ... I could have explained what and who I have asked this particular question with in the past. My beef is that you attacked when this was just pudding on a hamburger. O'K to disagree ... not O'K to attempt to make a mockery.

A complex you are dumb, I know all just shows true colors. Your color is red. By the way, study up on Earthlights and give me a message ... a reasonable message. Want to debate??? This is good, as it questions the questions. Does not affect my life ... this is just as more than likely with you a hobby, yet I question to answer ... you have answers to complex questions.

One last note ... communicating with those who study the unexplainable. This does give me a heads up on things. They know more on many things than I or you. Every great discovery of science came from those who thought outside of the box. In the future do not get boxed in.

[The Silver Thong]

Every great discovery of science came from those who thought outside of the box.

Don't you mean coffin lol Dude this is a myth. The experiment was done in 1911 and not done very well. If this were the case (21 grams) then it would be very well documented and it is not. Unless you can find another source to post stating otherwise this is pretty much a moot topic.

Edited January 22, 2010 by The Silver Thong

[eqgumby]

Obviously not too popular Silver ... try contacting Dr. Michael Persinger about this. If it was just a legend scientists would not waste their time trying to disprove it. Only words have disproved it. I do not know if I am right, only what I have learned from others ... who do their homework.

Yes converting matter into energy would blow up much ... yet if we do have a soul how strong then is it???

I just read a RECENT book and this topic was covered.

There is no current proof of ANY sort that this is true, unless you have a link to information generated in the last year or two.

[Eldorado]

Hate talk of of people "dying and coming back". People don't die and then come back to life, they "nearly die"........ hence the saying "near-death"!!!!

Once you're dead, you're dead....no comebacks, no encores.

Edited January 22, 2010 by Eldorado

[The Silver Thong]

Can't argue with that. I had a near death experience when I was about 11 or 12 and ya it was weird and not really all that scary hence drowning no longer frightens me.

opss speelt weird wierd lol

Edited January 22, 2010 by The Silver Thong

[CausticGnostic]

I'm just glad that that bastion of exemplary intellection, Big Chief, has solved this problem for all of us "morons." All we need to do now is merely sit back and wait patiently for him to mine his next great nugget of infallible omniscience with his trusty little Ouija board. I can scarcely bear the anticipation.

Edited January 22, 2010 by CausticGnostic

[Kimi81]

I think they should do a mythbusters ep on NDE's. There has to be some intelligent forms of testing that can be utilized for this. Like blindfold a dying patient (you could actually use many people in this expirement...if they're terminally ill), take him to a room with weird objects in it. He dies. They resuscitate him, (if possible) and wheel him out of the room with said blindfold still on. Then they ask him what kind of objects he saw when he left his body...it really shouldn't be that difficult to pull something like this off.

I'm pretty much a sceptic as far as this stuff goes but I did personally witness my Mom "talking" to her Mother a day before she died from Cancer and I found it very interesting. Many terminally ill patients have had these expieriences and maybe there is something behind it. Or it could be that when people's bodies are shutting down they have hallucinations that cause these types of things....who knows. I'm undecided

[Paranormalcy]

Ignus Fatuus, is this actually the same person that has been posting under this name previously? Because these last few posts of yours seem beyond bizarre and nearly unidentifiable as yours. Since I can't actually comprehend a large portion of what you wrote, I'll only address what I think I grasped, and that is that you were making posts to "try to ring someone's bell" or get a reaction from them or something. This is also very much against UM policy, so please do not do this anymore - either add informative or interesting relevant information or opinion to the topic ITSELF or settle for reading the thread.

Also, I would strongly urge people to quit calling others NAMES - that is NOT proper and civil behavior.

I'd also like to say that everything I've ever read on this subject, either historically or new, all indicate that 21 grams thing was pure bad science, and I agree while you can believe whatever you want to, just because you claim to know two doctors who support this idea (which I highly doubt), doesn't mean "doctors" hold this to be true.