Spirits & Limestone

[Scarling]

Over the course of several years, I have come across several instances in which the presence of limestone seems to increase paranormal activity in a given area. I remember reading an account of an apparent haunting about a woman who was being terrorized by a poltergeist. Furniture was being rearranged, loud noises would awaken her during the night, doors and windows would open and close; the average poltergeist behavior. Eventually she decided she had enough, and called for an investigation of the home. It turns out that the haunting was credited to a small underground river running somewhere below where the house was built, and a deposit of limestone. This was probably the first I had heard of limestone given part of the credit for a haunting, and couldnt figure out how this could be.

While watching an episode of Scariest Places on Earth, they did a show about Alton, Illinois. Credited as being one of the more haunted towns in America, it was the home of the first civil war prison, which was conveniently constructed out of limestone. You can imagine the horrors that would have gone on in that prison, so you can probably also imagine the potential for a haunting. The strange part is, the town did not experience all that much out of the ordinary until the prison was closed and tore down. What did they do with all that excess limestone after tearing down the prison? They used it to aid construction in the town, and ever since they have been plagued with strange occurrences.

Could limestone in some way be carrying or amplifying energies of some sort?

Opinions, discussion and more information is encouraged.

Im also providing a link to the episode on Alton Illinois.

Edited May 7, 2010 by OppOse

[Ignus Fatuus]

I have been down this path for so long about not only limestone but other geological conditions and their correlations with "haunted" places that it is can be a nuisance for me to even bring it up.

Yet, I will give you some info that I have picked up over the past ten years of studying the reasons to why my land is so screwed up ... and I do not personally believe that the hundreds of Native American gravesites on my land has anything to do with it.

1. Limestone ... just one geo condition which is correlated with many haunted spots. Most of the time it has nothing to do with the limestone itself .. though the quartz in the limestone has been brought up and maybe a clue. It is the underground streams "springs" which pass through the limestone. Where you find underground streams in limestone ... you usually find hauntings.

2. Mineral concentrations such as oil, "quartz", coal for example are known to slightly spike the Earths natural Electromagnetic frequencies.

3. Fault lines ... just like on my land I have found that most of the graves are situated directly above or very, very near this fault line. Coincidence??? Fault lines are also known to slightly spike the Earths EMF's.

These are but a few of the geological conditions known to give of increased EMF's. I have a few links to some websites which verify these correlations. Again, correlations mean nothing in the world of squat but I have noticed so many connections between my land and other places known to be haunted.

Easier way to do this is for you to visit my profile, click on find topics below my "shadow figure" and then read my topic Ignus Fatuus: Earthquakes, shadows & science and Ignus Fatuus: Alien, ghost or bioplasmic life.

These two topics have many links to some really hardcore correlations. You will find that any attempt to post knowlege about this will bring out the SEPTICS from their tanks. This is a problem when you have seen more and heard more and studied up more than others. Even bringing scientific research into the equation will not be enough as they will come for you like killer bees.

Good luck to you and happy haunti ... hunting!!!

Edited May 7, 2010 by Ignus Fatuus

[Pauly Dangerously]

No, there is no real connection between geological make up and increased spiritual activity. It's just an observation that someone made that hasn't even been verified. It's just a poular trope common among ghost hunting types. People claim that this has something to do with hauntings, but there doesn't seem to be any real explanation of what, why or how. It just "does".

Also I wouldn't put much faith in the claims of "Most Haunted _______" either.

[Ignus Fatuus]

No, there is no real connection between geological make up and increased spiritual activity. It's just an observation that someone made that hasn't even been verified. It's just a poular trope common among ghost hunting types. People claim that this has something to do with hauntings, but there doesn't seem to be any real explanation of what, why or how. It just "does".

Also I wouldn't put much faith in the claims of "Most Haunted _______" either.

God just spoke with all his noise ... there is no connection between geological makeups and hauntings!!!

Only thing I will agree on is the "haunted" parts of the claim. With all that I have seen I still believe that something scientific is missing from the equation.

Nevertheless ... all that I have seen means squat, all that I have heard means squat, all the other places where the same phenomenon occurs means squat. Even if they are underlying the same geologic equations.

Open your mind Paul ... I have heard the noise!!! I am not a ghost hunting type and have never once went out on an investigation. One day, science will catch up with me and all this bulldung will be just common "noise". Until that day keep spewing the ignorance. As for myself, I will keep trying to understand the things that go bump in the night. Hell ... they go bump in the daytime here!!!

[Ignus Fatuus]

To Paul Noise,

Sorry for my aggrevation ... just been a bad day. I mean no harm or insult to you. If I were wearing the same shoes, I would also call myself an idiot. Yet, I am looking for an answer. All I have found are correlations and some of them are hard.

No offense ... please do not take any.

Edited May 7, 2010 by Ignus Fatuus

[Pauly Dangerously]

No worries. I understand that people believe a lot of things that seem to be correlated, but you have to understand that just because some things mave have a certain characteristic in common, doesn't mean that that is a cause or in any way related to event taking place. There has to be studies, data, research into whether this claim has any merit. There are a lot of things that we could point to and say that this is a cause or is in some way related to increased hauntings. For instance, the report mentions Indiana, so can we infer that people from Indiana are more haunted than people from anywhere else? Or Americans are more haunted? What if 90% of the cases had a person with black hair living within a mile of the activity, does that mean that people with black hair cause hauntings? It's not enough to simply state that something may be related, there has to be some sort of critical reasoning as to why. I have an open mind Ignus, believe me. But an open mind does not mean much if you refuse to use that openness to analyze what you are seeing and hearing to help yourself understand your world. I wish that there was a way to simply "know" all the little intricacies of the universe. There isn't. Science is the best way that we as humans have for understanding causality. It simply is the best way. Faith is fine, I myself believe a great many thing that people would be suprised to hear, but I also admit that I may be wrong. Understand that there are charlatans out there that will knowingly lie to people to make money. Hell, they'll lie just to make themselves feel important, even if they know what they are saying is a lie. They will write entire books about what causes a haunting, and they can't be stopped from spreading ignorance unless they are called to task. Sometimes I myself am guilty of playing the game of trying to stop a conversation if I see that it is going to end up being something that is not proven or provable. It's not right, but it does happen. I apologize if I come off as harsh and condescending sometimes, it is not intentional.

Edited May 7, 2010 by Paul Noise

[Scarling]

Thanks for the feedback from both of you. Regardless of whether you are agree or disagree with this claim, it is always good to present both sides of an argument. This topic was never meant to express that I was in any way sure of the subject, but that I wanted to expand upon it.

I dont take any offense, Paul, if you have strong opinions toward it, or even if you find it to be just down right stupid.

Science does not seem to to be very close to giving us the answers we crave about paranormal disturbances and such. I remember watching

that was posted on these forums several months ago about a scientist who had created a helmet which stimulated a part of the brain that was theorized to be responsible for out of body experiences and spirit sightings. This was the closest thing to science really giving an explanation for a paranormal experience that I have ever seen. It is repeatable, and accurate; two things crucial to scientific studies.

This would suggest that these phenomena are nothing more than products of our own brain trying to process difficult information. Excuse me for going sort of off topic here, but how does that credit multiple people seeing the same apparition in an area, or things moving due to an unseen force?

Much like Paul seems to be, Im a great believer in science, and Im unlikely to believe something until it is scientifically proven. However, I do not discredit theories until they are disproven, or seem just too unlikely to be true.

It is a common practice among paranormal investigators to bring along an EMF detector during their expeditions. As you probably already know, it is believed that EMF aids a spirit into manifesting itself. With that said, if it could be scientifically proven that water flowing through limestone creates an increase in EMF, that would at least bring science one step closer to an explanation. For all I know, this has already been scientifically proven. Im really not sure, thus the reason my questions arise.

Edited May 8, 2010 by OppOse

[Ignus Fatuus]

No worries. I understand that people believe a lot of things that seem to be correlated, but you have to understand that just because some things mave have a certain characteristic in common, doesn't mean that that is a cause or in any way related to event taking place. There has to be studies, data, research into whether this claim has any merit. There are a lot of things that we could point to and say that this is a cause or is in some way related to increased hauntings. For instance, the report mentions Indiana, so can we infer that people from Indiana are more haunted than people from anywhere else? Or Americans are more haunted? What if 90% of the cases had a person with black hair living within a mile of the activity, does that mean that people with black hair cause hauntings? It's not enough to simply state that something may be related, there has to be some sort of critical reasoning as to why. I have an open mind Ignus, believe me. But an open mind does not mean much if you refuse to use that openness to analyze what you are seeing and hearing to help yourself understand your world. I wish that there was a way to simply "know" all the little intricacies of the universe. There isn't. Science is the best way that we as humans have for understanding causality. It simply is the best way. Faith is fine, I myself believe a great many thing that people would be suprised to hear, but I also admit that I may be wrong. Understand that there are charlatans out there that will knowingly lie to people to make money. Hell, they'll lie just to make themselves feel important, even if they know what they are saying is a lie. They will write entire books about what causes a haunting, and they can't be stopped from spreading ignorance unless they are called to task. Sometimes I myself am guilty of playing the game of trying to stop a conversation if I see that it is going to end up being something that is not proven or provable. It's not right, but it does happen. I apologize if I come off as harsh and condescending sometimes, it is not intentional.

Thanks and no harm done either way is a good thing. I just wish from time to time two things. One that others could experience what I have seen and heard on many an occassion and two that I even had a remote clue on why these things happen. I do know from talking to scientists such as Persinger and such that Earthlights such as the ones that I have seen seem to occur in the same type of geology. The accoustic bangs that I have heard seem to happen around fault lines and rollin hills ... like on my land.

With writting entire books on a cause of haunting ... I also think this is ridiculous. As I have stated many times before, even with all that I have seen and heard I still do not believe in ghosts. There is a scientific expanation for these phenomenons and I wish somebody could get a true grasp on them before it drives me insane. From what I read I only take in what connects with my experiences and even though there has been some correlations ... most seems so far fetched that Pluto .. "the planet" would have a hard time retrieving it.

On the harsh bit ... I understand as I am so skeptical about 80 percent of the posts even written on here. I believe it is time to allow paranormal groups on my land with equipment to better get a grasp on the few realities on my land. On my land it is not just I who have experienced these phenomenons. Grandfathers, grandmothers, fathers, uncles, neighbors their family and friends who have been here with me. Even had one friend who was allowed to camp on my land with his girlfriend and her brother ... they won't be back!!! .... nope ...

Until then keep up with the skeptisism and keep up with the open mind ... they are the two keys to understanding.

Edited May 8, 2010 by Ignus Fatuus

[Ignus Fatuus]

Thanks for the feedback from both of you. Regardless of whether you are agree or disagree with this claim, it is always good to present both sides of an argument. This topic was never meant to express that I was in any way sure of the subject, but that I wanted to expand upon it.

I dont take any offense, Paul, if you have strong opinions toward it, or even if you find it to be just down right stupid.

Science does not seem to to be very close to giving us the answers we crave about paranormal disturbances and such. I remember watching

that was posted on these forums several months ago about a scientist who had created a helmet which stimulated a part of the brain that was theorized to be responsible for out of body experiences and spirit sightings. This was the closest thing to science really giving an explanation for a paranormal experience that I have ever seen. It is repeatable, and accurate; two things crucial to scientific studies.

This would suggest that these phenomena are nothing more than products of our own brain trying to process difficult information. Excuse me for going sort of off topic here, but how does that credit multiple people seeing the same apparition in an area, or things moving due to an unseen force?

Much like Paul seems to be, Im a great believer in science, and Im unlikely to believe something until it is scientifically proven. However, I do not discredit theories until they are disproven, or seem just too unlikely to be true.

It is a common practice among paranormal investigators to bring along an EMF detector during their expeditions. As you probably already know, it is believed that EMF aids a spirit into manifesting itself. With that said, if it could be scientifically proven that water flowing through limestone creates an increase in EMF, that would at least bring science one step closer to an explanation. For all I know, this has already been scientifically proven. Im really not sure, thus the reason my questions arise.

Coincedences can be interesting ... as I just replyed to Paul Noise and mentioned Dr. Michael Persinger, I read your post and walah ... you talk about the God Helmet. This helmet on which you watched your video about for one thing was never named the Gods Helmet by Persinger. He has told me through Email that he is not that stupid. Even though I and Persinger argue so very, very much on some issues, he has taught me more than anyone on the supposive causes of these phenomenons.

Then your next paragraph cracks me up that much more as you argued the same point that I argue with Persinger. How do more than one see the same thing??? His reply is that not all phenomenon are products of "brain malfuntions" and that some things such as Earthlights are as real as you or I. Shadow people on the other hand he is very skeptic of.

I myself belive that these phenomeons are everywhere and that these EMF's do affect our minds ... yet just in a way that puts us on a wavelength "so to say" that allows them to manifest or for a person to witness them. With limestone and such ... read up on Shumann "spelling" waves. This was proven mathmatically way back in the 1950's and makes much sense if you have experienced the things that I have.

Good luck in your search for answers!!! Wish me luck as well!!! We both need it!!!