The Strange Tale of "Dr. 58"

[Davedini]

Hey IronGhost quick question for you.

What type of Ouija Board do you use?

A store bought crappy one or an actually nice hand made one?

[Sakari]

Iron Ghost , I have been reading , and I am sorry if you took that wrong.Someone posted above me that you are a writer in Minnesota , and of course I saw you wrote you are there.That is what your story is all about.

I do like the story , and I do not know why you are upset because I do not believe it came from a Ouiji board.

You said you record them because the letters go to fast , I asked you to post or send a mp3 , or any file for that matter of one of your sessions.I really would like to hear it and see how it matches up to the story.You said you do not keep or share them.

Look , I just know a Ouiji board is a worthless piece of card board.Posting a story as such would not get near as much attention as posting it as a Ouiji Board session.Thus, more people seeing it , especially while " Googling".

Nothing wrong with free advertisement , I just do not like "false" advertisement.

I know you feel no need to show "proof" , and I guess I will stop asking for it , I just wish someone would.Trust me , it would knock my socks off to actually find someone brave enough to do that....Finally prove something paranormal exists.People that truly believe this should only want the same if you ask me.If I were in your position , I sure the heck would post anything I had , just to stop people like me having my opinion I have.

Not only that , I guarantee I would have been on the news with this , and had verifiable evidence from outside sources...I mean , who wouldn't?....It would be the same as finding BigFoot , it would be a huge find that would change the way everyone thinks....Oh well.

Anyway , it is a cool story , and sorry if I make you upset with how I view it.

[Mysterioushusky]

Wow, really? I'm sorry.

But why a Ouija board? They are, after all made by a toy company. So why does a "spirit" or an "entity" from another "dimension" choose to communicate through a frickin' toy instead of some alternate means?

Sorry but there's nothing supernatural about a mass produced plastic board. It's phoney. Just like this trite, ridiculous story.

No offence taken. I understand you are acting as a critic for the material posted and nothing is personal. As for why that board would be a gateway, it comes down to belief, and to some degree, hype. There has been so much hype about the "Ouija board" and I have heard countless encounters where people have experienced strange events such as chairs randomly moving, when using it. As a side, it once told my father the name of the person who is now my mother and they have been married for 25-years and counting. With so much history, it seems like the subconcious is almost wishing to have something happen and that interest translates into energy which according to physics cannot be destroyed but transferred. When you examine the "weird" encounters people have had using this tool, much of it comes from the mind. The fact that it is in English is especially interesting as one can argue how is it really possible for King Tut's ghost, for example, to communicate via the board. Whatever it is, it appears to bridge the mind which is in charge of communication, with some other reality which could be a fabrication of the mind, or actual in a parallel universe.

It is hard to explain the logic behind believing a story like this, and as I said earlier, I doubt all the details are true believe he could be manipulated via the board or his mind, even with years of experience. However, simply saying this is all a hoax is always the easiest option which is why I always try to look for a hint of logic in these submissions.

[000000000000000]

I know you feel no need to show "proof" , and I guess I will stop asking for it , I just wish someone would.Trust me , it would knock my socks off to actually find someone brave enough to do that....Finally prove something paranormal exists.People that truly believe this should only want the same if you ask me.If I were in your position , I sure the heck would post anything I had , just to stop people like me having my opinion I have.

Not only that , I guarantee I would have been on the news with this , and had verifiable evidence from outside sources...I mean , who wouldn't?....It would be the same as finding BigFoot , it would be a huge find that would change the way everyone thinks....Oh well.

Honestly, a Ouija board transcript is nowhere even near the same as finding bigfoot. I doubt the news would even take this as a story. Because, it is amazingly easy to write it off as the subconscious mind. This guy has contributed many other things to this site and has been here for quite some time. I doubt he would make something up like this. Just enjoy the story. The real argument is over whether it is from his subconscious mind or an alternate reality.

[SlimJim22]

I imagine it works in a similar sort of way to tarot cards or augury sticks and runes. That is they allow the practitioner to tap into their subconscious in all sorts of powerful ways. take for example you are posed a question but you cannot immediately think of the answer but know that you hold the answers in your head. These tools allow you to look at it from another angle rather than just straight on. If it is coming out of IronGhosts subconscious unconsciously then that is still just as impressive. We can't specualte of what is real and unreal, we can only see a fraction of the realities out there and there rest is unknow to most of us. I am fond of these stories as they harness a creativity that seems beyond human. Maybe not a good phrasing but if they are nothing but made up stories then he has a truly remarkable imagination. Either way still very enjoyable reading (Manthings!!)

Edited May 23, 2010 by SlimJim22

[Davedini]

I imagine it works in a similar sort of way to tarot cards or augury sticks and runes. That is they allow the practitioner to tap into their subconscious in all sorts of powerful ways. take for example you are posed a question but you cannot immediately think of the answer but know that you hold the answers in your head. These tools allow you to look at it from another angle rather than just straight on. If it is coming out of IronGhosts subconscious unconsciously then that is still just as impressive. We can't specualte of what is real and unreal, we can only see a fraction of the realities out there and there rest is unknow to most of us. I am fond of these stories as they harness a creativity that seems beyond human. Maybe not a good phrasing but if they are nothing but made up stories then he has a truly remarkable imagination. Either way still very enjoyable reading (Manthings!!)

AGREED!

[kirstylou]

Very good point above.

Whether you are a believer of ouija, and the truths behind contacting the alternate world / demons / ghosts or spirits or other entities which exist beyond our world or whether you are a complete skeptic with a perfectly logical explanation to this writings is mixed in this topic.

I am very intrigued to see more of this work. I know that a persons reluctance to fully divulge recordings or further info regarding this throws doubt and more "ammunition" for skeptics.

However i am loving this so cant wait to read more

Keep it up!!

[Davedini]

Sakari quick question for you as well. I just read through your link about you trying to summon a spirit and all that junk could you just be saying what you said above because you have had no luck and therefor you have become a nonbeliever in any of this because i read that you used a ouija but had no luck. Could you be taking your frustration out on this topic? IG has clearly stated over and over that he is not saying this story is fact. At no point has he said that any of it is real so like you said its a cool story so just sit back and enjoy it because if it is real its pretty awesome and if its not its still pretty awesome!!!

[Sakari]

Sakari quick question for you as well. I just read through your link about you trying to summon a spirit and all that junk could you just be saying what you said above because you have had no luck and therefor you have become a nonbeliever in any of this because i read that you used a ouija but had no luck. Could you be taking your frustration out on this topic? IG has clearly stated over and over that he is not saying this story is fact. At no point has he said that any of it is real so like you said its a cool story so just sit back and enjoy it because if it is real its pretty awesome and if its not its still pretty awesome!!!

You did not read through my link far enough...Topics like this are what started that experiment , well , not like this..more the "demons and spirits"....So , to answer you....No , I am not taking my frustration out on anyone.I am stating in a different topic, my opinion.I have not seen "him" post anywhere that this is fiction or fake , exact opposite actually......Here is a direct quote from page 1.

"I assure you, this is all from the Ouija board. Keep in mind, I have been practicing the Ouija board for 43 years. I think if anyone sticks with anything for 43 years, one might come up with results that seem remarkable."

Contradicts your: "IG has clearly stated over and over that he is not saying this story is fact"

My topic is about doing what so many asked for " prove it does not exist"....I am doing my part , now I would just like to see once "prove it does exist"....Make sence now?

I do get frustrated when I read topics that are just so wayyyyy out there ( for myself anyway)...The story is a great story.I just feel the "ouiji" part is being used to get more viewers....

Read back on my replies and answer me this:

Why wouldn't someone having this happen to them release the recordings they have made , to the corresponding manuscripts?....Or , make a video of this...If anything , that would add to the greatness of this story , and change some people feelings I am sure....

Again , NO , I found this topic interesting , and I also get the priveledge to reply to topics,(just as any should) my views on them

Edited May 23, 2010 by Sakari

[Davedini]

No i didnt read all 20 some pages because the whole first part of it was people just arguing nonstop so i skipped around and i honestly have never tried to summon a demon or anything like that and like you i would also love to see some real proof but im not gonna ask IG to go against his beliefs and views on things and i understand that by him not showing us the tapes that i cant say this is real but then again i cant say its not real at the same time. I can see why he wouldnt want to make a video because people will just bash him saying oh you were moving it or something along those lines and from what i have gotten from this so far these are long sessions on the ouija board and to please the people he would then have to edit them to make them shorter and then his face is out there and for anyone who is not on this forum would bash him even more because there are so many people out there who look at the stuff we talk about as if we are worshiping the devil himself. So maybe someday he might release a tape but maybe once he gets some real answers on whats going on

[+susieice]

Wow, really? I'm sorry.

But why a Ouija board? They are, after all made by a toy company. So why does a "spirit" or an "entity" from another "dimension" choose to communicate through a frickin' toy instead of some alternate means?

Sorry but there's nothing supernatural about a mass produced plastic board. It's phoney. Just like this trite, ridiculous story.

Actually Ouiji boards were first used by the Victorians to conduct seances and were then known as letter boards. They took them very seriously for many years until people like Houdini and Sir Arthur Conan Doyle exposed so many physical mediums as fakes. Then they became the plastic toys we know today.

I still don't know what to think of this story, if it's IG subconcious telling the story or not. I do know he's posted several times that he's not saying it's true or false or in fact where it's coming from, only that this is what he received on the board. Either way, it makes an interesting read.

[Sakari]

No i didnt read all 20 some pages because the whole first part of it was people just arguing nonstop so i skipped around and i honestly have never tried to summon a demon or anything like that and like you i would also love to see some real proof but im not gonna ask IG to go against his beliefs and views on things and i understand that by him not showing us the tapes that i cant say this is real but then again i cant say its not real at the same time. I can see why he wouldnt want to make a video because people will just bash him saying oh you were moving it or something along those lines and from what i have gotten from this so far these are long sessions on the ouija board and to please the people he would then have to edit them to make them shorter and then his face is out there and for anyone who is not on this forum would bash him even more because there are so many people out there who look at the stuff we talk about as if we are worshiping the devil himself. So maybe someday he might release a tape but maybe once he gets some real answers on whats going on

I think you just broke the world record for the longest sentence ever ...Joke , smile now !

Please remember , there is a difference between "bashing" , and questioning someones statements....

I do not want to take from the topic here, let's let it go now..As I said , I have my opinion , and I stated it , others have stated their's also....

[Davedini]

Yes the opinion has been made and i agree lets let the topic go now

So IronGhost I WANT TO READ MORE :angry2:

[Elixer]

Actually Ouiji boards were first used by the Victorians to conduct seances and were then known as letter boards. They took them very seriously for many years until people like Houdini and Sir Arthur Conan Doyle exposed so many physical mediums as fakes. Then they became the plastic toys we know today.

I still don't know what to think of this story, if it's IG subconcious telling the story or not. I do know he's posted several times that he's not saying it's true or false or in fact where it's coming from, only that this is what he received on the board. Either way, it makes an interesting read.

An Ouija board can be almost anything anyway... you could scribble the alphabet and numbers on a piece of paper and use a clear glass to communicate. How it's made and who by is kind of irrelevent.

[+susieice]

An Ouija board can be almost anything anyway... you could scribble the alphabet and numbers on a piece of paper and use a clear glass to communicate. How it's made and who by is kind of irrelevent.

That's right. I've actually seen an old letter board from @1900. They were heavy wood with 2 rows of letters across the top, a row of numbers under that, and yes and no on the bottom. The planchette was wooden also, shaped like a narrow spade and had no glass. It just pointed.

Edited May 24, 2010 by susieice

[Sleestak Lightning!]

Actually Ouiji boards were first used by the Victorians to conduct seances and were then known as letter boards. They took them very seriously for many years until people like Houdini and Sir Arthur Conan Doyle exposed so many physical mediums as fakes. Then they became the plastic toys we know today.

I still don't know what to think of this story, if it's IG subconcious telling the story or not. I do know he's posted several times that he's not saying it's true or false or in fact where it's coming from, only that this is what he received on the board. Either way, it makes an interesting read.

Is the dude in this fairy tale using one of those?

And you proved my point...Houdini proved that stuff was phoney.

It's CLEARLY fiction. 100% made up.

[+susieice]

Is the dude in this fairy tale using one of those?

And you proved my point...Houdini proved that stuff was phoney.

It's CLEARLY fiction. 100% made up.

IG has said he's using a Ouija board. Houdini did expose many mediums in his career, usually the type that used table rappings, floating musical instruments, ectoplasm and other physical "parlor tricks". I don't know if he ever disproved the letter board. These types of mediums were very popular in the late 1800's into the early 1900's. The Victorians were obsessed with contacting the deceased and seances were commonly held. This could well be 100% made up in IG's mind. I don't think he's said otherwise. He just said this is what the board told him.

[kiddglock]

It may well be fiction. That isn't the point. The point is IG claims he is getting this from a Ouija board. This is his claim, just as valid as anyone who comes on here claiming that they saw, or photographed a ghost, or a bigfoot, or a seamonster. Or that they were abducted by aliens. Their claims may be true, or they may not be. They maybe nothing more than a misguided attempt to impress people or hoodwink them. They may be experienced as totally real to the poster, and yet be completely hallucinated.

The story of Dr 58 is merely a bonus. The point is, and the reason why this post should be here, is that the claim is they are coming from an UNEXPLAINED MYSTERIOUS source. the Ouija board. If he'd claimed he met a bigfoot in the woods that told him this stuff directly, it'd go in the cryptozoology section. If a native Venusian gave him this info via inter-planetary telepathy, it'd be in the UFO section. Of course, we'd all be far more dubious of his claim if any of this was the case. It wasn't.

So, is the claim bogus? Is IG hoaxing us for attention? Possibly. I personally can't say he his or not. I can't similarly say that the last ghost photo posted here was real or a hoax. I think hoax, but I just don't actually know.

Personally, I am in the same position with IG. I simply just do not know.

however, I would say that it does look likely his claim is truthful, that he is getting this from his Ouija board. I would say this because he has a long history of this activity that is recorded and varified, and his explanations and details about this process is open-minded and fair. He is not pushing an agenda, or asking us to believe. This adds to the over-all credibilty. He may be surreptitiously testing material for a novel. Even so, he is asking us neither to believe or otherwise (other than his process. He isn't saying Dr 58 is real.) he wants us to make up our own minds. He probably wants information himself. the fact that it entertains most of us as well as, obviously, himself, doesn't detract from the importance of his claim.

Still, I do not know for sure.

Now supposing his claim is 100% true. Then all we have to analyse is the story itself. It is beyond belief that such a character as Dr58 or his world could exist. So, if HIS CLAIM IS TRUE, then we have to ask ourselves, where does this tale come from. A trickster spirit? His own sub-conscious? How can we know? Maybe we can't ever know.

Ok, so supposing his claims are true, and indeed it is his subconscious. This is by no means disappointing and no one should feel ripped off. In fact it would show us so much about this mysterious device, the Ouija board, and about how the human mind works.

Forget all the mumbo jumbo about spirits, trans-dimensions etc etc. Even if this is totally mundane, it is still very profound.

Only slightly less profound should his claim be a lie. If this is the case, it offers a powerful case study of how the mystique of the Ouija board encourages credulity in people, and also how a master sucks his audience in with a totally engaging narrative and cunning execution.

For ANY ONE OF THOSE REASONS, this post deserves some respect.

Finally I'll just say that in the likely event IG is recieving this from the Ouija board, then it belongs in the category of Auto-matic writing. That belongs firmly in the Ghosts, Hauntings and the Paranormal section. If it was in the fiction section it would annoy people who would complain he is NOT making it up, that it isn't a conscious attempt to write fiction, and therefore he is cheating.

Now, I ask all IG's detractors, how can it be possible that this thread doesn't belong here, and isn't as worthy as any other post of more or less dubious claims?

the story is a complete bonus. So enjoy it.

More like completely bogus. I come here to read true accounts or those that are supposedly true. A good BS detector helps. I take a lot of stuff that's posted here at face-value. Then again sometimes there is a post that just hits a person wrong. This is that post. I've attempted to help a lot of people on these boards. Not saying this for some sort of pat on the head, but just stating fact. I also didn't say I'd helped them. Only attempted. It's obviously a question for the mods as to where the thread belongs, but I am legitimately commenting on it and saying I call BS.

[_Only]

More like completely bogus. I come here to read true accounts or those that are supposedly true. A good BS detector helps. I take a lot of stuff that's posted here at face-value. Then again sometimes there is a post that just hits a person wrong. This is that post. I've attempted to help a lot of people on these boards. Not saying this for some sort of pat on the head, but just stating fact. I also didn't say I'd helped them. Only attempted. It's obviously a question for the mods as to where the thread belongs, but I am legitimately commenting on it and saying I call BS.

Agreed. A very weird topic. Usually, a claim is made, and we discuss it trying to make sense of it (one way or the other usually; i.e. supernatural or not). This one, a few people like me and you aren't buying it, some sort of believe it and allude to it being automatic writing and that discussion goes nowhere past the statement of that idea, and then endless fans gushing over the ongoing saga to see the next installment. Then there's the OP's cryptic playful explanations and rebuttals, and double talk statements about the validity of this whole thing.

Like I said, an odd topic this one.

[cameojoe]

Come on people. Lighten up.

[kirstylou]

I have heard some weird **** that has happened to people who have dabbled with ouija... hence i will leave it to the people that feel confident enough to use it.... not me personally... But its intriguin to find out what people gain from them

[21st Century]

I can't believe this made me sign in. I'm not really a paranormal person, but really, in this case, who the hell cares? This is an entertaining story using a Ouija board to frame the story.

I honestly can't believe so many people are flocking to this to claim that it's not true and impossible and Ouija Boards don't work. This is a goddamn Paranormal forum. I would guess most skeptics, most people who can't stand people who talk about things that are unexplained by the normal world, wouldn't hang around here.

I mean, come on... This is an entertaining story and you literally lose nothing for suspending your disbelief for it. ironGhost isn't claiming to discovering the secrets of the universe, isn't selling anything, isn't really saying anything that's particularly revolutionizing for us. He's relating what a person from an alternate universe is saying, and it's entertaining.

So, yeah, if you can't stand this kind of stuff, why do you come at all to say how much you can't believe it?

[KIM IS CANADIAN]

IG,thanks for all your amazing posts! I have been a fan of this thread from the start.I was wondering if you ever asked Dr58 about Canada in your sessions,since it is next door to Minnesota? Am curious to know if in his dimention are Canadians considered nice.

[21st Century]

IG,thanks for all your amazing posts! I have been a fan of this thread from the start.I was wondering if you ever asked Dr58 about Canada in your sessions,since it is next door to Minnesota? Am curious to know if in his dimention are Canadians considered nice.

It probably depends on if they live near Minnesota.

[Davedini]

Im gonna say that all the Canadians is Dr.58 universe are giants with super freeze breath and they freeze the great lakes weekly so they can play hockey because its the only sport they are good at. Im starting to think Halak is from that universe which how good he played against the penguins.... How about that one aye? LOL

Edited May 24, 2010 by Davedini