If you can prove your abilities...

[Cybele]

And just why would that do either myself, or the world, a favour in any way?

If you did turn out to have these abilities, scientists could study the mechanisms responsible for them, as well as their potential uses. It would be a revolutionary discovery that could have huge implications for many scientific fields.

I did undergo an online test for remote viewing and scored almost 100% accuracy on describing the contents of a office. But again, it is; random, intermittent, and not often producable on demand. My point is that physically it should NEVER be possible. Even one clear example is physically impossible except through coincidence. A sequence or numnber of accurate "events" also greatly reduces the statistically probability that it can be coincidence.

If it's random and not producable on demand, can you really say that your powers of prediction are greater than would be expected by chance? This is your perception, not based on the results of statistical analyses. In general, people have a very poor understanding of probability. In terms of things like predictions, they tend to remember the hits and forget the misses.

Personally, I wouldn't rely on online tests for validation. If you at least allowed yourself to be subjected to repeated trials of a controlled scientific experiment, you'd know for certain whether there is anything to this; you'd have proof to show the world. Then again, seeing as you are already confident in your perceived powers, I'm sure that isn't a great motivator for you.

[Mr Walker]

name='Cybele' date='05 June 2010 - 06:48 AM' timestamp='1275686336' post='3440091']

If you did turn out to have these abilities, scientists could study the mechanisms responsible for them, as well as their potential uses. It would be a revolutionary discovery that could have huge implications for many scientific fields.

If i knew how to make an atomic bomb back inthe 1930s do you believe handing that knolwedge over to science would be entirely a good thing to do.? If today i had the knowledge to make all men immortal is it a certaintity that making that knowledge common is either right, proper or woud have only good effects.

No im not arguing that this is why one should not"prove" their abilities. I actually want science to unlock the physics and mechanisms behind them. My gripe is that far too little science in the west is funded to do this. However while psychic abilities remain "wild" they are reagarded differntly and so are those who claim them. If i had provable (in terms of scientific method) psychic abilities i would not tell any one ever. In some ways the nature of the abilities i HAve protects me from being of interest to govt or scientists while still remaining interesting and useful to me and those around me.

MAybe i read too many comic books and science fiction books as a child /adolescent, but i know what happens to mutant kids and people with harnessable powers

If it's random and not producable on demand, can you really say that your powers of prediction are greater than would be expected by chance? This is your perception, not based on the results of statistical analyses. In general, people have a very poor understanding of probability. In terms of things like predictions, they tend to remember the hits and forget the misses.

Thats an excellent question and the answer is yesOf course that answer contains some elements of subjectivity but alos elements of logic For example these things have happened to me for a life time(nearly 60 years) They dont happen to other peolpe and some peoe never expereince one of them Coincidence/randomness would spread the abilities around well randomly Secondly there is the number and consistency of them. Twice is coincidence multiple times implies conscious purpose(or enemy action)

Third there is the absolute accuracy of some things and the almost impossibilty of them being a coincidence.

For example a dvd quality dream which occurs many hours before an actual event and yet which is an exact replica of the news report of that event over 24 hours later.

In other wors i witnessed the event through the camera lens of a heliecopter cameraman but i did so over 12 hours before the event took place and 24 hours before it was filmed on air.

Or more commonly Some one has lost something and i just know precisely where it is I dont know how it got there but i can just see it as if i had found it there in real life.

Some cases are possibly coincidence Eg knowing the correct combination to a lock with 10000 combinations. Or knowing that the next roll of the dice will bring a yahtzee in fives. Yet I dont "know" things and then not have them come true.

If that sort of knowledge comes to me, then it ALWAYS comes true. On the other hand it is comparatively rare spontaneous and often results from a strong emotioanl need from a person nearby. (as in the case of lost/ stolen objects)

Personally, I wouldn't rely on online tests for validation. If you at least allowed yourself to be subjected to repeated trials of a controlled scientific experiment, you'd know for certain whether there is anything to this; you'd have proof to show the world. Then again, seeing as you are already confident in your perceived powers, I'm sure that isn't a great motivator for you.

I m skeptical of online tests my self I just mentioned that one because it intrigued me. I answered the quesions intuitively through "knowing" the answers. Usually i cant do that at a distance or remotely from a live person so i dont know if the results were a con to get me to sign up to lessons for example or dinki di

On the other hand i run an experiment with my school kids. I get them to set up a room out of my sight and then i try to describe it to them. That involves knowing the number of chairs they have placed etc, any unusual contents,. and the general layout of the room Sometimes i get nothing. Other times i describe it with precision. I suspect i don't so much see the room but read the minds of the people/person who set it up, and see it through their eyes. But i dont know.

For myself, i have all the knowledge and validation i require for my sanity and logic. (as you suggest) I do not want to be known for being unusual outside of people who know, love, and trust me. My students and community know i am "weird" and "eccentric" but they also know i am harmless and helpful. Some have benefitted from my help. I have nothing to fear from them. I dont know that to be so about the wider world.

Having been once nearly "locked up" (by the police, not an institution) as a teenager for exhibiting psychic abilities, and having had a number of people run away from me, physically, over the years, in fear from such exhibitions, i intend to play it safe.

My colleagues and students humour me, but even with them i dont overtly advertise or push my differences.

[puridalan]

The only decent online test, are the ones you can't cheat on, by that I mean they give you a blank black box infront of you and you have to figure out what the picture is, and then after you are done drawing, the picture comes up and you match how close you were..that is about the only ones I personally would use because you have to draw it yourself, and it's not a multiple choice answer, it's like an essay question you either know it or you don't.

Though online tests I agree are usually a sham, it's best to do real live expierments with total strangers, I do that by offering free readings to the public on occasion (offline) that way I do not know the person, and it's totally random...or random as a 'lacking-non-fund' can be.

One expierment that I have not done a lot, is that I would like to test out is doing readings in person, but with a twist. I want to be sitting in blank room, then I want another person who I am suppose to read outside of the room. I want nothing else with that person, I want someone via speaker only to tell me when my next person is sitting/standing outside of the door or close other room.

Even though I do online, I want to see if I will improve or do worse when the person is not infront of me, a part of me thinks I could possibly do better seeing as I may not have sensory overload. But that is something I am willing to try in the future, especially in a few years. I think that would be a decent idea? I think it's good because it cuts out the oo you read their body language, so if you can't see them that rules that out, along with various other things.

Edited June 5, 2010 by puridalan

[Gwynbleidd]

Even though I do online, I want to see if I will improve or do worse when the person is not infront of me, a part of me thinks I could possibly do better seeing as I may not have sensory overload. But that is something I am willing to try in the future, especially in a few years. I think that would be a decent idea? I think it's good because it cuts out the oo you read their body language, so if you can't see them that rules that out, along with various other things.

Eliminates using any cold reading abilities, so I personally think thats a marvellous idea. I'd love to hear how it goes puridalan.

[puridalan]

Thanks Pixii

I plan to start on doing a few expierments during either fall semester or spring, I know I'll be busy with Nursing School; however; I think one of the best places I could start would be at my college. I figure people already find me a bit 'weird' why not go all out and do readings, as I've done readings for various people it is not anything different. The only differnce is that I will probably post it mainstream on campus with flyers, I will select a few individuals randomly and do the expierment, I am also thinking of getting possibly a psychology professor to take watch, if not more.

I am okay with being wrong, I'm not god, yet at the same time I want to see how off or on I am from not being able to see the person. I always look forward to such things and since I am already in the program I've decide it's okay to do this expierment now. I was scared to do it when we didn't know who was accepted because I thought if one of the 'judges' heard of what I did they might frown. So, far though I have done scanning and done readings for 2 practioners on campus who were pleased and one wanted me to do more work on her, alone with the nursing advisor of the college.

So, I am not shy, and no I don't think the government will take me away, personally I don't think they have the balls and really could give a ratts behind When I do it I will certianly post all the data up here, all of the data including what I was wrong on as well as right.

If you have any tips/ideas on constructing such an expierment, advice is always welcome.

Thank you

Edited June 5, 2010 by puridalan

[A Shadow]

I would not take the randi challenge to prove such abilities. I feel it would paint an unwanted target on my back. I would not care about giving science new things to study.(call me selfish)

I know some "gifted" folks who claim they only do enough to get by. Some of them are set for life so to speak. They usually keep to themselves what they "know".

[Agent. Mulder]

I would not take the randi challenge to prove such abilities. I feel it would paint an unwanted target on my back. I would not care about giving science new things to study.(call me selfish)

I know some "gifted" folks who claim they only do enough to get by. Some of them are set for life so to speak. They usually keep to themselves what they "know".

how set for life? you mean, money wise somehow?

im not sure i buy that.

[Gwynbleidd]

Someone like John Edwards is set for life so to speak (moneywise etc) I would think?

[A Shadow]

how set for life? you mean, money wise somehow?

Well I am not certain but by the way they blow money and none of them have jobs I tend to assume they are. They claim to do "spells" and then win big at casinos. But I cannot confirm these big wins.

Edited June 8, 2010 by silentshadow

[A Shadow]

John Edwards is set for life so to speak (moneywise etc) I would think?

I would think so too. Him and others alike. Unless they blew it all somehow.

Some don't even need real "gifts" to make lots of money off such things.

[PsiPup]

I think that any psychic who goes on TV (except one, but I can't remember her name, so I obviously don't care that much) is full of it. Seriously, all that seems like to me is flaunting. And besides, it's amazing what a camera can do along with a teleprompter.

[Kevin_U]

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

This is a challenge set forth by this organization. So far the prize lays unclaimed. Are you the one to prove that the paranormal exists?

Ok listen. Nobody can win this. lol. If you can prove it, he isnt going to put you on the show. Also if you did happen to prove it, on the show, they would do something to make sure that it seemed like it is impossible.

James Randi is paid by the government to ensure that the message to all the people, that "We do not have an special abilities, We a dull simple beings, put on this planet work, breed and die."

The government knows that everybody has these abilities. They are even using people that have these abilities for military purposes.

Its all a big lie. and the truth is gonna be told in 2012.

[ships-cat]

I have the power to teleport, but it only works between specific OUTDOOR locations, and at specific times. I can't teleport to an arbitary location (though I may be able to get close).

Let me demonstrate....

<stands at specific outdoor location, and holds out hand stiffly>

<waits>

Umm... it sometimes takes a while to summon The Power.

<waits>

Oh no... here we go.. I think its working....

<puts hand down, steps into bus, and purchases ticket>

See you on the Other Side

<dissapears in cloud of diesel smoke>

meow purr

Edited June 12, 2010 by ships-cat

[Kevin A.]

When asked to "prove" your abilities, are struck with the remarkable inability to do so and all else fails, it is always best to give one of the following excus.....reasons:

1. Personal/spiritual/cosmic code of conduct does not allow me to display my abilities at random

2. Personal/spiritual/cosmic code of conduct does not allow me to profit from said abilities in any way

3. State that all tests are given by skeptics and are rigged so as not to ever work in favor of practitioner/believer

4. State that you have conducted tests and the information has been suppressed

5. State that you are terribly busy right now but will be conducting some above-board tests soon (said while hoping everyone will forget this statement soon)

6. The government is suppressing all knowledge and will hunt you down should you prove said abilities

7. State that said abilities do work in a manner that is very real but may not be scientifically provable

8. Randi is a biased old coot who would never give the money out no matter what.

9. Science is wrong, spirituality is right so I will not fall prey to skeptics or scientists and their evil know-it-all ways.

10. The Trump Card = Using the most complicated words and analogies, state that said abilities simply "don't work that way"

Did I miss anything?

Also Randi may be old, he may be bitter and jaded against all forms of "abilities" but I do believe him to be an honest man. I firmly believe that if someone who legitimately has some sort of ability would sit down in front of Randi and prove said ability (which is very possible if the abilities really exist), Randi would be floored/inspired/thrilled/awestruck. I think he would be happy as hell to hand over the money and shake their hand.

He may not like or enjoy dealing with claims anymore, but I believe the would be thrilled to find a claim proven real.

Kevin

[goldie08]

I personally met Randi about 35 years ago in Canada when I arranged for a psychic, Olaf Jonsson, of Chicago to appear on a TV station in Toronto at the time. It was a weekend all-day session of pretaping the show to be aired later. When I first met Olaf he demonstrated to me the Zener cards which I wasn't very good at guessing but he decided to send me the thought directly and it was like an explosion in my mind's eye that I could see the image and guessed it right (the star, circle, square, waves). Then he did not help me by sending and I was back to normal wrong, lol. So it is real to me what psychics can do.

=============

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

This is a challenge set forth by this organization. So far the prize lays unclaimed. Are you the one to prove that the paranormal exists?

[puridalan]

Randi an honest man..now that I cannot believe, while I do not find him to be an utter liar...a total honest man, erm I do not see that. Laughs Personally, I do not think randy would be happy or 'amazed' in fact I think he'd be rather normal about the whole thing.

goldie

glad you had an expierence, some of those people are very strong indeed, funny thing is if he hadn't of told you, you would of thought you were doing it. Now think of that out in a field expierment where a person is able to covertly put random thoughts in peoples minds, now that's funny.

Reminds me of my aunt winning the lotto, now she is a bit uh 'crazy' lol, but erm somethings you just can't bs in my own opinion, after all why do I know people who work with the gov't/for them that get paid to do what they do and admit they are quote , 'inuititive' lol..they don't keep them around for nothing.

Edited June 21, 2010 by puridalan

[_Only]

Ok listen. Nobody can win this. lol. If you can prove it, he isnt going to put you on the show. Also if you did happen to prove it, on the show, they would do something to make sure that it seemed like it is impossible.

James Randi is paid by the government to ensure that the message to all the people, that "We do not have an special abilities, We a dull simple beings, put on this planet work, breed and die."

The government knows that everybody has these abilities. They are even using people that have these abilities for military purposes.

Its all a big lie. and the truth is gonna be told in 2012.

First of all, there is no "show" people are put on. It's a challenge privately organized (well, for any who views the forum to see) and held.

The rest of your post is pretty ridiculous and not worth commenting on.

[_Only]

I personally met Randi about 35 years ago in Canada when I arranged for a psychic, Olaf Jonsson, of Chicago to appear on a TV station in Toronto at the time. It was a weekend all-day session of pretaping the show to be aired later. When I first met Olaf he demonstrated to me the Zener cards which I wasn't very good at guessing but he decided to send me the thought directly and it was like an explosion in my mind's eye that I could see the image and guessed it right (the star, circle, square, waves). Then he did not help me by sending and I was back to normal wrong, lol. So it is real to me what psychics can do.

=============

That type of thing can be done easily to susceptible people using NLP and subliminal suggestion. I'm sure he was talking to you the entire time. These are techniques that some phsychics use, and there are skeptics (Derren Brown for instance) who know how these methods work and show people how they can be used. I find the phsychological trickery used far more fascinating than if it were truly psychic. Here's a general example:

And explained in more detail:

Keep in mind these are fairly tricky stunts, and usually the charlatan would have to pre-select or feel out the subject before attempting something like this with assurance it will be successful. But as you can see in this case, he could have easily claimed he used psychic powers and people would believe him, because there couldn't possibly be any other explanation. Not saying this is what happened in your case, just saying it is very possible it could be done. So sometimes personal experiences can't be taken as solid proof.

[Eldorado]

"Fury as top psychic Derek Acorah cancels show due to 'unforeseen circumstances'"

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/showbiz/celebrity-news/2010/06/17/fury-as-top-psychic-derek-acorah-cancels-show-due-to-unforeseen-circumstances-86908-22339276/

[aquatus1]

"Fury as top psychic Derek Acorah cancels show due to 'unforeseen circumstances'"

Ironic!

[Johnny Truant]

First of all, there is no "show" people are put on. It's a challenge privately organized (well, for any who views the forum to see) and held.

The rest of your post is pretty ridiculous and not worth commenting on.

From the FAQ on the Randi site:

4.6 How much of my application is confidential?

It isn’t. The JREF reserves the right to publish any and all materials regarding the Challenge.

Here is a list of common issues:

Issue 1: I don’t want the publicity.

Response: You will get the publicity if you pass the Challenge, which you believe you can do. If you don’t want publicity, it’s best not to apply at all.

And from the rules:

4. Applicant agrees that all data (photographic, recorded, written, etc.) gathered as a result of the setup, the protocol, and the actual testing, may be used freely by the JREF.

8. When entering into this challenge, as far as this may be done by established legal statutes, the applicant surrenders any and all rights to legal action against Mr. Randi, and/or against any persons peripherally involved, and/or against the James Randi Educational Foundation. This applies to injury, and/or accident, and/or any other damage of a physical and/or emotional nature, and/or financial and/or professional loss, and/or damage of any kind. However, this rule in no way affects the awarding of the prize, once it is properly won in accord with the protocol.

No, it's not a television show, but they do let everyone know all your bidness, and you can't do a thing about it.

[Sakari]

Funny. If psychics existed, the same people would keep winning the lottery over and over again and Vegas casinos would go out of business.

Not to mention , no more missing children ( at least not for very long) , no 9/11 , no mass murders , no serial killers,missing hikers ,bad presidents ( trusted psychics would know who we should vote for) , plane crashes , Tsunami deaths , .....You get my point

Edited July 8, 2010 by Sakari

[Sakari]

I think that any psychic who goes on TV (except one, but I can't remember her name, so I obviously don't care that much) is full of it. Seriously, all that seems like to me is flaunting. And besides, it's amazing what a camera can do along with a teleprompter.

This has been posted , but it should answer q few things here....Also , Sylvia is still making major $$$ to the poor ( dumb) people who pay her.....

[puridalan]

One person can't see eevvery event, you could only stop some events...no one can see alll worldy events, 'importance' depends on the viewpoint..some might not give a ratts butt about 9/11 and view something like a flood in their country as more dire. It really depends, expecting one individual to see all is ludacris, that's like telling one person in the CIA to catch every terrorist. Then at the end of the day, be like, "Why didn't you catch 309482304 terrorist bill? you only caught 3293!!"

I mean come on really, if you think a "psychic" is a superhero..you have issues, we are all human beings and we all have flaws. I don't care what Slyvia does that is in her own time, people come to her on their own free will, she must be pleasing someone to still be making money, if she wasn't pleasing anyone she wouldn't be known at all. Not all of them feel dumb for paying her, some of them feel blessed..all about how yo usee things. Granted she may not be the person for you or I to see, but we can make those descions on our own, without insulting other peoples integrities.

[Sakari]

One person can't see eevvery event, you could only stop some events...no one can see alll worldy events, 'importance' depends on the viewpoint..some might not give a ratts butt about 9/11 and view something like a flood in their country as more dire. It really depends, expecting one individual to see all is ludacris, that's like telling one person in the CIA to catch every terrorist. Then at the end of the day, be like, "Why didn't you catch 309482304 terrorist bill? you only caught 3293!!"

I mean come on really, if you think a "psychic" is a superhero..you have issues, we are all human beings and we all have flaws. I don't care what Slyvia does that is in her own time, people come to her on their own free will, she must be pleasing someone to still be making money, if she wasn't pleasing anyone she wouldn't be known at all. Not all of them feel dumb for paying her, some of them feel blessed..all about how yo usee things. Granted she may not be the person for you or I to see, but we can make those descions on our own, without insulting other peoples integrities.

Can you point me to a news link of one confirmed "prediction" of a Tsunami/Earthquake ,etc. that saved peoples lives , or could have?...A specific date and warning?

As for Sylvia , Montel Williams and others are to blame , and the people who do not investigate things before buying...She charges somethiong like $700.00 for a 30 minute phone call ( I called to check on this , and it is true , was a while back)...Her son does this with her also , charges same or close to it fee...