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[Archived]Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood


Riaan
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Joelen has a different etymology from joel-yule.

In OLB it is spelled with "JOL-" (JOLDON, JOLANDE).

The old Dutch spelling is "jolen".

If there would be an English version, it would be "to yool"?

It's obvious the words are related, just like jolig/ jolich/ jolly.

'Official' etymology is founded mostly on wild guesses.

When OLB is accepted to not be a hoax (as I am sure will happen), etymology as we know it will make a HUGE leap forward.

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The investigations into the OLB over the last 140 years by others mainly concentrated on the language it was written in.

If this was true, the mystery would have been solved a long time ago.

Since the aggressive nonsense published by Beckering Vinckers in the 1870s, no scholar of reputation has dared to burn fingers on the subject, because even considering that the manuscript might possibly be authentic was/is taboo and will lead to ridicule and excommunication from the 'scientific' community.

Jensma (in 2004) focused on who might have been behind the assumed conspiracy and what might have been their motives.

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Dutch - English

jolig - jolly

prettig - pretty

zonnig - sunny

fruitig - fruity

jolif in Old French def. sounds like joi+lif

But maybe as in all things OLB there is 2 different words reall - I don't think jolif is akin to jol but maybe that is the French version, English could be akin to jol, so jolly in English and Frisian is from Jol but jolly in French and some others is actually joy (of) life, possibly NOT akin to the English jolly.

Edited by The Puzzler
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'Official' etymology is founded mostly on wild guesses.

I agree.

Obviously they put massive amounts of work into it but the conclusions always come to to 'possibly', 'probably', 'perhaps' and re-contructed words.

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That would be JOL-LIK; Jol-like

The only Jol word in the Frisian dictionary takes you to jahwelik http://www.koeblergerhard.de/germanistischewoerterbuecher/altfriesischeswoerterbuch/afries-J.pdf

jõ-hwe-lik 28, jÐ-we-lik, jæ-l-lik, jæ-we-lik, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder; ne. everyone;

ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), singulus L 14; Q.: H, R,

S, W, E, AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), L 14; E.: s. *jõ (3), hwe-lik; L.:

Hh 52a, Rh 837b

Those first 3 words are jewelik, jollik, jowelik

Then it means everyone. Jah-we, Jew, Jol .....

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If this is true:

Some claim "Friar's Heel" is a corruption of "Freyja's He-ol" or "Freyja Sul", from the Nordic goddess Freyja and (allegedly) the Welsh words for "way" and "Sunday" respectively.

..then Freya's star would be the Sun.

I think the interpretation of "Heel" or "He-ol" being the sun is influenced by what they later found out using archeoastronomy and by reconstructing Stonehenge.

If you look at images of Stonehenge in the 19th century and earlier, not many stones are standing upright, and how long ago did they fall down?

That Stonehenge (=the megalithic stones) was inside a large circle has always been visible as far as I know. I can imagine that whoever gave it the name "Freya's Hall" must've assumed that the stones in the middle of the complex were the remnants of some huge temple.

If the figurines do indeed depict Freya in her hall Sessrúmnir then that 'hall' must have been circular and huge, just like the Stonehenge complex.

.

The next is not proof of my idea, but at least someone else on the internet appears to have the same idea (and it is a Fin):

Sessrumnir:

kartta.jpg

http://koti.mbnet.fi/njmythos/sessrumnir/index.html

The figurine:

iconurl.jpg

Stonehenge:

stonehenge_map.jpg

OLB citadel (the largest):

OVERWIJN3.jpg

Edited by Abramelin
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Not done with Freya yet:

The Sacred Marriage of Frey and Freya are shown on the Brisingamen Disk, which dates from 500BCE discovered in Maltagarden, Denmark. Carved upon the sandstone lid of a cremation urn, Freya’s ornate necklace Brisingamen may have symbolized the Sun, whose thawing of winter ice gave its solar disc feminine qualities in the Norse/Germanic traditions. Note the phallic god, and the goddess identified by her crescent moon. The fir tree fertility symbol that adjoins Freya has also been identified as an ear of grain. (see pic)

brisingamen_disc.jpg

It is said that when Od vanished Freya cried tears of gold as she mourned his lose. Freya is said to live in the palace Folkvang (“field of folk”), a place where love songs are always played, and is said to have a hall called Sessrúmnir (Old Norse “seat-room” or “seat-roomer”) where she receives half of those that have died in battle while the other half go to Valhalla. All women go to her Hall.

Freya is associated with the precious necklace of the Brisings, which was a fluid gold choker with a woven pattern created by the dwarfs and was purchased by sleeping with four dwarfs. This necklace was then stolen at Odin’s command by Loki. Odin agreed to return the necklace is if she created hatred and war causing two kings of Midgard to fight to the death, then rise from the dead and fight again, which she did.

http://www.cybercauldron.co.uk/tag/freya

A while ago I was reading a collection of articles by Karl Theodor Weigel. The man speaks about folkloristic habbits and symbolism that goes back to the prechristian religion. He gives symbols representing the years, such as I have shown you in my article “Odhinn, God of the year”. Towards the end there is an image of a Christmas-bread from Lauterbach Hessen, Germany (left) “that strongly reminds of the god in the wheel, in the course of the year”. That is the same symbolism as that I gave to Odin with his two arms on the hips. The Christmas bread made me think of the famous statue of Freya with a gigantic necklase, her Brisingamen, around her neck. Freya as Goddess of the year, not such a strange idea, because she is connected to fertility and therefor the cycle of the crops, death and rebirth, the changing seasons and thus the year. So might this be the reason that the Brisingamen has such enormous propertions? Let us see what is said about the Brisingamen.

Freya.jpg

http://www.gangleri.nl/articles/69/freya-or-brisingamen/

Edited by Abramelin
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The only Jol word in the Frisian dictionary takes you to jahwelik...

Which demonstrates that the (online) Frisian dictionaries do not give a complete account of the Oldfrisian language. Perhaps from the words that occur in the known written medieval sources, but the spoken language must have contained an equivalent for "yule", as all (or most) north-European languages seemed to have known this word.

I would not be surprised if the word (and related words) were taboo here in the (Christian) Middle Ages, as all sacred symbols of the old culture were fanatically destroyed.

Wiki (a quick sample):

Scandinavian languages: Jul/ Jol

German: Julfest

English: Yule

Finnish: Joulu

Estonian: Jõulud

Sölring (Sylter Frisian): Jül/ Jööl

Dutch: Joelfeest

Old-English: ġéol, ġéohol, ġéola, ġéoli

German Wiki:

"Die älteste Erwähnung des Wortes Jul findet sich im gotischen Kalenderfragment Codex Ambrosianus A aus dem sechsten oder siebenten Jahrhundert nach Christus." etc.

Translated:

"The earliest mention of the word Jul is found in the Gothic Calendarfragment Codex Ambrosianus A from the sixth or seventh century AD." etc.

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Good stuff Abe.

It nicely shows that OLB was not "based on Nordic mythology" (as was suggested before), but rather that it makes much more sense that OLB and Nordic mythology have a shared origin.

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The only Jol word in the Frisian dictionary takes you to jahwelik http://www.koeblergerhard.de/germanistischewoerterbuecher/altfriesischeswoerterbuch/afries-J.pdf

jõ-hwe-lik 28, jÐ-we-lik, jæ-l-lik, jæ-we-lik, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder; ne. everyone;

ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), singulus L 14; Q.: H, R,

S, W, E, AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), L 14; E.: s. *jõ (3), hwe-lik; L.:

Hh 52a, Rh 837b

Those first 3 words are jewelik, jollik, jowelik

Then it means everyone. Jah-we, Jew, Jol .....

Nothing Jew or Jahweh here:

It is the same word as "iegelijk", meaning 'everyone' ("eenieder" in Dutch):

http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/iegelijk

-g- tends to change into a -w- in Frisian/English or visa versa.

Example:

zeug - sow

zorg - sorrow

wilg - willow

zaag - saw (noun)

boog - bow

and so on.

"iegelijk" would the same as "iewlik"

Edited by Abramelin
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Good stuff Abe.

It nicely shows that OLB was not "based on Nordic mythology" (as was suggested before), but rather that it makes much more sense that OLB and Nordic mythology have a shared origin.

You know we think differently about that: I'd say someone 'cherry-picked' from Nordic mythology.

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Nothing Jew or Jahweh here:

It is the same word as "iegelijk", meaning 'everyone' ("eenieder" in Dutch):

http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/iegelijk

OK. Saw edit too, thanks.

I notice that the previous word - jo-hwe-der has the same - jo-hwe with it's meaning being each of 2 - then the next word - which has jo-l-lik(everyone)

jõ-hwe-der 1 und häufiger?, jõ-hwe-d-d-er, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder von beiden;

ne. each of two; ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (88, 17); Hw.: s. êid-er; Q.: AB (88, 17); E.:

s. *jõ (3), hwe-der (1); L.: Hh 52a, Hh 162

jõ-hwe-lik 28, jÐ-we-lik, jæ-l-lik, jæ-we-lik, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder; ne. everyone;

ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), singulus L 14; Q.: H, R,

S, W, E, AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), L 14; E.: s. *jõ (3), hwe-lik; L.:

Hh 52a, Rh 837b

I couldn't help but think this sounded like when at every Juultime, their was twins born - like 'each of two'. - juul might mean all/every or something like that. A complete circle - the all. Pan is said to maybe be from 'all': This myth reflects the folk etymology that equates Pan's name (Πάν) with the Greek word for "all" (πᾶν).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_(god)

all

O.E. eall "all, every, entire," from P.Gmc. *alnaz (cf. O.Fris., O.H.G. al, O.N. allr, Goth. alls), with no certain connection outside Germanic. Comb. forms with all meaning "wholly, without limit" were common in O.E. (e.g. eall-halig "all-holy," eall-mihtig "all-mighty") and the method continued to form new compound words throughout the history of English.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=all

Here's Jew anyway: joth-a 1 und häufiger?, juth-a*, jud-a, jod-a, jud-e, jod-e, afries., sw. M. (n): nhd.

Jude; ne. Jew; I.: Lw. lat. Iðdaeus; E.: s. lat. Iðdaeus, PN, Jude; L.: Hh 141b, Hh

Sounds like juttar.

Edited by The Puzzler
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I do think you're onto something Abe, with Freya. Too bad it's 3am here and I've run out of time to read more, back tomorrow

Just wanted to share this first.

The name Wega[10] (later Vega) comes from a loose transliteration of the Arabic word wāqi meaning "falling" or "landing", via the phrase an-nasr al-wāqi "the alighting vulture". The term "Al Nesr al Waki" appeared in the Al Achsasi Al Mouakket star catalogue and was translated into Latin as "Vulture Cadens".[80][note 6] The constellation was represented as a vulture in ancient Egypt,[81] and as an eagle or vulture in ancient India.[82][83] The Arabic name then appeared in the western world in the Alfonsine Tables,[10] which were drawn up between 1215 and 1270 by order of Alfonso X.

Vega is a vulture

The Assyrians named this pole star Dayan-same, the "Judge of Heaven", while in Akkadian it was Tir-anna, "Life of Heaven". In Babylonian astronomy, Vega may have been one of the stars named Dilgan, "the Messenger of Light". To the ancient Greeks, the constellation Lyra was formed from the harp of Orpheus, with Vega as its handle.[11] For the Roman Empire, the start of autumn was based upon the hour at which Vega set below the horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vega

Falling or landing star.

So this gets me thinking about the Vultures on Egyptian headdresses and if this represents Vega

The Vulture Goddess is Nekhbet.

OT somewhat but maybe not. When Vega set below the horizon it was Autumn.

---------------------

I'm still thinking jolly is from joi-lik/lif - here's GAU again.

joy

c.1200, "feeling of pleasure and delight;" c.1300, "source of pleasure or happiness," from O.Fr. joie (11c.), from L. gaudia, pl. of gaudium "joy," from gaudere "rejoice," from PIE base *gau- "to rejoice" (cf. Gk. gaio "I rejoice," M.Ir. guaire "noble").

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=joy

O.Fr joie - jo+lif = rejoice in life. Ho Ho Ho!! Sounds like he's rejoicing, jolly St Nick, happy, rejoiceful, bringing joy to the world.

BUT that is not to say I think JOL is the same etymology.

Edited by The Puzzler
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OK. Saw edit too, thanks.

I notice that the previous word - jo-hwe-der has the same - jo-hwe with it's meaning being each of 2 - then the next word - which has jo-l-lik(everyone)

jõ-hwe-der 1 und häufiger?, jõ-hwe-d-d-er, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder von beiden;

ne. each of two; ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (88, 17); Hw.: s. êid-er; Q.: AB (88, 17); E.:

s. *jõ (3), hwe-der (1); L.: Hh 52a, Hh 162

jõ-hwe-lik 28, jÐ-we-lik, jæ-l-lik, jæ-we-lik, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder; ne. everyone;

ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), singulus L 14; Q.: H, R,

S, W, E, AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), L 14; E.: s. *jõ (3), hwe-lik; L.:

Hh 52a, Rh 837b

I couldn't help but think this sounded like when at every Juultime, their was twins born - like 'each of two'. - juul might mean all/every or something like that. A complete circle - the all. Pan is said to maybe be from 'all': This myth reflects the folk etymology that equates Pan's name (Πάν) with the Greek word for "all" (πᾶν).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_(god)

all

O.E. eall "all, every, entire," from P.Gmc. *alnaz (cf. O.Fris., O.H.G. al, O.N. allr, Goth. alls), with no certain connection outside Germanic. Comb. forms with all meaning "wholly, without limit" were common in O.E. (e.g. eall-halig "all-holy," eall-mihtig "all-mighty") and the method continued to form new compound words throughout the history of English.

http://www.etymonlin...ex.php?term=all

Here's Jew anyway: joth-a 1 und häufiger?, juth-a*, jud-a, jod-a, jud-e, jod-e, afries., sw. M. (n): nhd.

Jude; ne. Jew; I.: Lw. lat. Iðdaeus; E.: s. lat. Iðdaeus, PN, Jude; L.: Hh 141b, Hh

Sounds like juttar.

It is not enough, that words sound similarly or even are written similarly. Such words should have a commob root and a common meaning. If not, one has to decide that these are separate words with no interconnection.

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It is not enough, that words sound similarly or even are written similarly. Such words should have a commob root and a common meaning. If not, one has to decide that these are separate words with no interconnection.

That's pretty much what I'm doing and my opinion is jolly and jul/jol appear to be different etymologies.

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Maybe I'm wrong, Wiki contradicts the other link I gave -

EtymologyFrom Middle English joli, jolif (“merry, cheerful”), from Old French joli, jolif[1], of North Germanic origin, from Old Norse jōl (“a midwinter feast”) [2], later Christmas (Danish jul), itself akin to Gothic ( (fruma)) (jiuleis, “(month) July”)[3], Old English ġeōl (“Yuletide, Christmas”). More at Yule.

The other said from jolif - PERHAPS from jol but note the line over the o in Old Norse jol - I think it's different.

I'll have to think about it more tomorrow.

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OK. Saw edit too, thanks.

I notice that the previous word - jo-hwe-der has the same - jo-hwe with it's meaning being each of 2 - then the next word - which has jo-l-lik(everyone)

jõ-hwe-der 1 und häufiger?, jõ-hwe-d-d-er, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder von beiden;

ne. each of two; ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (88, 17); Hw.: s. êid-er; Q.: AB (88, 17); E.:

s. *jõ (3), hwe-der (1); L.: Hh 52a, Hh 162

jõ-hwe-lik 28, jÐ-we-lik, jæ-l-lik, jæ-we-lik, afries., Pron.: nhd. jeder; ne. everyone;

ÜG.: lat. quÆlibet AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), singulus L 14; Q.: H, R,

S, W, E, AB (82, 15), AB (82, 21), AB (88, 17), L 14; E.: s. *jõ (3), hwe-lik; L.:

Hh 52a, Rh 837b

I couldn't help but think this sounded like when at every Juultime, their was twins born - like 'each of two'. - juul might mean all/every or something like that. A complete circle - the all. Pan is said to maybe be from 'all': This myth reflects the folk etymology that equates Pan's name (Πάν) with the Greek word for "all" (πᾶν).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_(god)

all

O.E. eall "all, every, entire," from P.Gmc. *alnaz (cf. O.Fris., O.H.G. al, O.N. allr, Goth. alls), with no certain connection outside Germanic. Comb. forms with all meaning "wholly, without limit" were common in O.E. (e.g. eall-halig "all-holy," eall-mihtig "all-mighty") and the method continued to form new compound words throughout the history of English.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=all

Here's Jew anyway: joth-a 1 und häufiger?, juth-a*, jud-a, jod-a, jud-e, jod-e, afries., sw. M. (n): nhd.

Jude; ne. Jew; I.: Lw. lat. Iðdaeus; E.: s. lat. Iðdaeus, PN, Jude; L.: Hh 141b, Hh

Sounds like juttar.

A (in Dutch) "jutter" is a beach comber, someone who collects thing s/he finds on a beach.

On the Dutch 'etymologiebank' site there is someone who thinks it might be related to "jatten", which is slang for 'to steal'. "Jat" ('yad') is the Jewish (or Jiddish) word for 'hand'.

Your 'holy' might come close to the old meaning of 'yule', imo ( eall-halig "all-holy").

And Juul in the meaning of 'twins'.. in Dutch twin is 'tweeling' (German: Zwilling) ... lol, and I know you would read it as 'tweel-ing'. Thwayl-ing? Heh.

Edited by Abramelin
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This is jol with the line over the o -

Faroese[edit] EtymologyFrom Old Norse jól, cognate with Danish, Norwegian, Swedish jul, Icelandic jól, Old English geōl and English Yule

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/j%C3%B3l#Old_Norse

I thought all before, from the Fryan dictionary.

geol in Old English quite sounds like our old word gaol, for jail - which seems to me to be an enclosure - an 'all' - a complete enclosed circle.

So, again jol is leading me to 'all.' -

Apparently it's (gaol) Anglo-Norman : Noungaole f. (oblique plural gaoles, nominative singular gaole, nominative plural gaoles)

1.prison; jail  [quotations ▼]

circa 1170, Wace, Le Roman de Rou: Fu truvé mors en la gaole He was found dead in the prison

[edit] DescendantsEnglish: gaol; jail

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gaole#Old_French

Gaol could have evolved from geol imo - the all, enclosure - cage

But I just don't see jolly like this, which appears to be joi/lif-joi/lik-joy/like. English and Fryan 'jolly' might even come from all, maybe even round, rotund, jolly/fat. Again, too late, think more tomorrow.

Edited by The Puzzler
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It is not enough, that words sound similarly or even are written similarly. Such words should have a commob root and a common meaning. If not, one has to decide that these are separate words with no interconnection.

I agree with you Menno, and I have told Puzz a zillion times.

But that doesn't mean she is always wrong, lol.

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Maybe I'm wrong, Wiki contradicts the other link I gave -

EtymologyFrom Middle English joli, jolif (“merry, cheerful”), from Old French joli, jolif[1], of North Germanic origin, from Old Norse jōl (“a midwinter feast”) [2], later Christmas (Danish jul), itself akin to Gothic ( (fruma)) (jiuleis, “(month) July”)[3], Old English ġeōl (“Yuletide, Christmas”). More at Yule.

The other said from jolif - PERHAPS from jol but note the line over the o in Old Norse jol - I think it's different.

I'll have to think about it more tomorrow.

The Yule time was a period of festivities, or simply a period at the end of the year when everyone was having a good time.

The Yule time was a period of festivities, or simply a period at the end of the year when everyone was having a good time.

Like we still have now (I hope).

We went full circle (= a year round), and we celibrate the end of the old circle/year, and wish eachother good wishes for the new circle/year.

.

Edited by Abramelin
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A (in Dutch) "jutter" is a beach comber, someone who collects thing s/he finds on a beach.

On the Dutch 'etymologiebank' site there is someone who thinks it might be related to "jatten", which is slang for 'to steal'. "Jat" ('yad') is the Jewish (or Jiddish) word for 'hand'.

Your 'holy' might come close to the old meaning of 'yule', imo ( eall-halig "all-holy").

And Juul in the meaning of 'twins'.. in Dutch twin is 'tweeling' (German: Zwilling) ... lol, and I know you would read it as 'tweel-ing'. Thwayl-ing? Heh.

Juttar imo might come from jut, as in the amber jutted out, sticks out of the sand, people pick the things up. The word appears to be from jetty, again Old French if I remember correctly.

Not holy but the all in all-holy. Well, actually holy probably is related too.

Tweeling, strange words you have.... :rolleyes::sleepy:

Edited by The Puzzler
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The Yule time was a period of festivities, or simply a period at the end of the year when everyone was having a good time.

The Yule time was a period of festivities, or simply a period at the end of the year when everyone was having a good time.

Like we still have now (I hope).

We went full circle (= a year round), and we celibrate the end of the old circle/year, and wish eachother good wishes for the new circle/year.

.

Yeah, so Happy Yule Abe! Or maybe Jolly Yule!! or Jul Yule or Jol Yuul or Jol Juul or Happy Jol who freakin' knows? Man, I'm outta here, this topic is driving me nuts. :wacko:

Plus I need sleep.

Edited by The Puzzler
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Juttar imo might come from jut, as in the amber jutted out, sticks out of the sand, people pick the things up. The word appears to be from jetty, again Old French if I remember correctly.

Not holy but the all in all-holy.

Tweeling, strange words you have.... :rolleyes::sleepy:

Tweeling, it means nothing more than "two ones" (twee=two), a pair of look-alikes or something.

Jetty?? That's a harbour thing, right?

I think you better forget about that one.

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Yeah, so Happy Yule Abe! Or maybe Jolly Yule!! or Jul Yule or Jol Yuul or Jol Juul or Happy Jol who freakin' knows? Man, I'm outta here, this topic is driving me nuts. :wacko:

Plus I need sleep.

Jij ook een Jolige Juul met veel jolijt, Puzz !

Don't drive yourself nuts, just go to sleep.

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