[Archived]Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood

[Abramelin]

Another hint at printing/ Stadermann?

Subsequently, Gordon invented a new press in which the platen was stationary and set at an angle of about 45 degrees. The bed was vertical and hinged at its lower edge. In operation, a cam tilted the bed forward through the 45 degree angle, pressing the type form against the platen which held the sheet of paper. It was called "the Alligator," because of its vicious habit of nipping the fingers of pressmen who failed to remove their hands immediately after feeding a sheet. Only a few were manufactured.

http://www.apa-letterpress.com/T%20&%20P%20ARTICLES/Press%20&%20Presswork/Gordon%20Press.html

http://letterpressprinting.com.au/page88.htm

© (Printing) a kind of job press, called also alligator press.

http://onlinedictionary.datasegment.com/word/alligator+press

.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

I showed an article before where the Gharial was being called an alligator. Typically not a huge scavenger of carcasses, nevertheless, we don't know, maybe they were really hungry at the time...

Abe might have got confused, I didn't say all-getter - although all-getter is pretty good.

I said 'all-gate', at the time.

gate (n.)

"opening, entrance," O.E. geat (pl. geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from P.Gmc. *gatan (cf. O.N. gat "opening, passage," O.S. gat "eye of a needle, hole," O.Fris. gat "hole, opening," Du. gat "gap, hole, breach," Ger. Gasse "street"),

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=gate

Frisian gat - Old English geat

Meaning, all-open (mouth) imo.

I don't know how many big lizards you have there but I'm quite familiar with them including crocodiles, large lizards have huge mouths, they can appear to be all mouth as they hiss loudly, especially frill lecked lizards, who have developed frilled necks that frill out to make their heads and mouths appear even larger. Let alone crocs, I can see how this kind of animal could be called an 'all-open/gate, mouth passage'.

Alligators (and crocs) even rest in this manner, with an open mouth. It's mouth is actually 'hinged' as well.

Edited January 23, 2012 by The Puzzler

[Abramelin]

The motto 'leaver dea as sleaf' is derived from the OLB. However the meaning changed. The OLB says, that one should rather let free prisoners or kill them than make slaves of them. dea is a verb - to kill, the adjective would be dead. Nothing heroic.

We already talked about this motto, but I found something today.

A reminder:

The Battle of Warns was annually celebrated on September 26 until the 16th century, than it moved to the last Saturday of September on which it is celebrated nowadays by nationalistic Frisians. There is a monument on the Red Cliffs in Warns since 1951, a large glacial erratic with the text leaver dea as slaef [sic] (rather dead than slave). The road to Scharl is still called the ferkearde wei (the wrong way) by the local inhabitants because this was the way the Dutch knights chose and led to their downfall.

The Battle of Warnsveld was the inspiration for the historical novel De Roos van Dekama by Jacob van Lennep.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Warns

Now this:

dâ-d (1) 50, afries., Adj.: nhd. tot; ne. dead (Adj.); Vw.: s. -hal-s; Hw.: s. dê-da;

vgl. got. dauþs (1), an. dauOEr (2), ae. déad, as. dæd, ahd. tæt; Q.: H, E, S, W, R,

Schw; E.: germ. *dauda- (1), *daudaz, *dauþa-, *dauþaz, Adj., tot; s. idg. *dheu-

(2), V., Sb., hinschwinden, sterben, Tod, Pokorny 260; W.: nfries. dea, Adj., tot;

W.: nnordfries. ded, Adj., tot; L.: Hh 13b, Rh 677a

http://www.koeblergerhard.de/germanistischewoerterbuecher/altfriesischeswoerterbuch/afries-D.pdf

"Dea" happens to be New Frisian (=nfries) or Modern Frisian for "dead". No suprise here: the monument dates from 1951.

[Abramelin]

No, I'm not confused:

I haven't checked the original text but the e in algaettar seems to be an insertion into the transliteration.

Really an algattar. It could be all-getter - snaps and gets everything - gets all?

Yes, maybe they were really hungry, there may have been overpopulation, little fish etc, I can't know the exact reasons of their dietary behaviour back then.

++

EDIT:

Btw, the extra -E- is not an insertion, it's because - like I told Knul today - a transliteration of one of those special -A's - , one with an elongated right upright which transliterates as -AE-. But as you can see on the scan of that page, the elongation is more of a blob of ink, so maybe Ottema simply chose to interpret it as an elongation of the upright.

.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[Abramelin]

I showed an article before where the Gharial was being called an alligator. Typically not a huge scavenger of carcasses, nevertheless, we don't know, maybe they were really hungry at the time...

I know the gharial is NOW called an alligator by some, and that's by Americans and Australians, and Indians who love to sound 'cool' or 'western', lol.

[The Puzzler]

No, I'm not confused:

++

EDIT:

Btw, the extra -E- is not an insertion, it's because - like I told Knul today - a transliteration of one of those special -A's - , one with an elongated right upright which transliterates as -AE-. But as you can see on the scan of that page, the elongation is more of a blob of ink, so maybe Ottema simply chose to interpret it as an elongation of the upright.

.

lol fair enough, I must have forgotten I said that.

But prior to that I did say all-gate, back on 16th May 2011.

"Alligator - bet it's cause it's mouth opens up like a big gate. gator - gadir"

22nd December 2011, I also said:

"You are only looking at one etymology for alligator - from Spanish. el lagarto - I'd bet anyway, that that word is equal to 'garter'- also gate - as in GADES, which I say, is a Phoenician word which will mean gate as in English words that lead to Garden/garter - an enclosed area - the complete circle, with gate."

[Abramelin]

lol fair enough, I must have forgotten I said that.

But prior to that I did say all-gate, back on 16th May 2011.

"Alligator - bet it's cause it's mouth opens up like a big gate. gator - gadir"

22nd December 2011, I also said:

"You are only looking at one etymology for alligator - from Spanish. el lagarto - I'd bet anyway, that that word is equal to 'garter'- also gate - as in GADES, which I say, is a Phoenician word which will mean gate as in English words that lead to Garden/garter - an enclosed area - the complete circle, with gate."

And I said a day or so ago we maybe must look to Arab because of the "AL" article.

But it would be nice if we found a Phoenician word for crocodile, or better, an Arab word of before the discovery of America by the Europeans.

+++

EDIT:

Arab:

crocodile = timsah

http://www.unilang.org/viewtopic.php?t=6024

They use the same word for alligator:

alligator = temsaah

http://arabic.speak7.com/arabic_vocabulary_animals.htm

.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[Van Gorp]

I showed an article before where the Gharial was being called an alligator. Typically not a huge scavenger of carcasses, nevertheless, we don't know, maybe they were really hungry at the time...

Abe might have got confused, I didn't say all-getter - although all-getter is pretty good.

I said 'all-gate', at the time.

gate (n.)

"opening, entrance," O.E. geat (pl. geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from P.Gmc. *gatan (cf. O.N. gat "opening, passage," O.S. gat "eye of a needle, hole," O.Fris. gat "hole, opening," Du. gat "gap, hole, breach," Ger. Gasse "street"),

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=gate

Frisian gat - Old English geat

Meaning, all-open (mouth) imo.

I don't know how many big lizards you have there but I'm quite familiar with them including crocodiles, large lizards have huge mouths, they can appear to be all mouth as they hiss loudly, especially frill lecked lizards, who have developed frilled necks that frill out to make their heads and mouths appear even larger. Let alone crocs, I can see how this kind of animal could be called an 'all-open/gate, mouth passage'.

Alligators (and crocs) even rest in this manner, with an open mouth. It's mouth is actually 'hinged' as well.

Interesting ...

Al-Gaet-Dur could be a perfect Goropism :-)

All Goes Through

Sounds from

Al: Overal (Anywhere)

Gaet: Ga aht , Gahan (Go)

Dur: Duer, Door (Through), deurgat

Geographicly it goes through water and land.

Figurative: If you look at his mouth, you are willing to believe that anything goes through it

[Abramelin]

Interesting ...

Al-Gaet-Dur could be a perfect Goropism :-)

All Goes Through

Sounds from

Al: Overal (Anywhere)

Gaet: Ga aht , Gahan (Go)

Dur: Duer, Door (Through), deurgat

Geographicly it goes through water and land.

Figurative: If you look at his mouth, you are willing to believe that anything goes through it

THe OLB etymology explains it as an animal biting ("getting") in anything,ie. dead and floating or still living cattle:

tha aldergrâtesta âdiska sind al_gaettar hêten, thrvchdam se yvin grûsich bitte an thet rotte kwik, that mith-a strâma fon boppa nêi tha delta dryweth as an thet lêvande kwik that se bigâna müge.

de allergrootste eidechsen zijn 'al_gaettar' geheten, doordat zij even gretig bijten aan het rotte vee dat met-de stroom van boven naa de delta drijft als aan het levende vee, dat ze passeren ("(voor)bijgaan") mogen.

the largest are called alligators, because they bite as greedily at the putrid cattle that float along the stream from above down to the delta as well as at the living cattle they may pass.

.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

I know the gharial is NOW called an alligator by some, and that's by Americans and Australians, and Indians who love to sound 'cool' or 'western', lol.

Well, that's your view.

Only the salt water croc is bigger than a Gharial. The name itself is Nepalese: The Nepali word घड़ा ghaṛā means earthenware pot, pitcher, watervessel

Stats: Gharials once thrived in all the major river systems of the Indian subcontinent, spanning the rivers of its northern part from the Indus in Pakistan across the Gangetic floodplain to the Irrawaddy in Myanmar. Today their distribution is limited to only 2% of their former range.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gharial

Keeping that in mind, they used to thrive in all the major river systems and included is exactly where is described in the OLB, the Gangetic flood plain, their distribution is limited to only 2% of what they use to be, they are critically endangered.

Also mentioned is that they scavenge carcasses. However, the gharial may have swallowed this jewelry while scavenging corpses or as gastroliths used to aid digestion or buoyancy management.

[The Puzzler]

THe OLB etymology explains it as an animal biting ("getting") in anything,ie. dead and floating or still living cattle:

tha aldergrâtesta âdiska sind al_gaettar hêten, thrvchdam se yvin grûsich bitte an thet rotte kwik, that mith-a strâma fon boppa nêi tha delta dryweth as an thet lêvande kwik that se bigâna müge.

de allergrootste eidechsen zijn 'al_gaettar' geheten, doordat zij even gretig bijten aan het rotte vee dat met-de stroom van boven naa de delta drijft, als aan het levende vee, dat ze passeren ("(voor)bijgaan") mogen.

the largest are called alligators, because they bite as greedily at the putrid cattle that float along the stream from above down to the delta as the living cattle they may pass.

.

Think of opening and shutting a gate really quickly.

Snap, snap, snap with your hands like a croc - the motion of the grabbing and snapping is the gate also, 'getting'.

That's how I see it, they basically just had their mouths open, in the rivers, snapping at the putrid carcasses.

[Abramelin]

Well, that's your view.

Only the salt water croc is bigger than a Gharial. The name itself is Nepalese: The Nepali word घड़ा ghaṛā means earthenware pot, pitcher, watervessel

Stats: Gharials once thrived in all the major river systems of the Indian subcontinent, spanning the rivers of its northern part from the Indus in Pakistan across the Gangetic floodplain to the Irrawaddy in Myanmar. Today their distribution is limited to only 2% of their former range.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gharial

Keeping that in mind, they used to thrive in all the major river systems and included is exactly where is described in the OLB, the Gangetic flood plain, their distribution is limited to only 2% of what they use to be, they are critically endangered.

Also mentioned is that they scavenge carcasses. However, the gharial may have swallowed this jewelry while scavenging corpses or as gastroliths used to aid digestion or buoyancy management.

If you can show me an account or even a photo of a gharial attacking live cattle, then you may have a point. But I also told you a gharial doesn't have enough power in its jaws to do that.

"The Nepali word घड़ा ghaṛā means earthenware pot, pitcher, watervessel"

Great, and the Dutch word "gaar" means "well-done"".

So?

++++

Young gharials eat insects, larvae, and small frogs. Mature adults feed almost solely on fish, although some individuals have been known to scavenge dead animals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gharial

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Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

throughgatrum or some such word is in the OLB for daughters - I'll give you a Goropism then.

through gate space. ie; give birth

I said it once before as well. I do remember that. lol

I haven't checked it - I just went to open up the Oera Linda book site on angelfire and this message came up on my computer:

This website has been reported as unsafe

oeralinda.angelfire.com

We recommend that you do not continue to this website.

Go to my home page instead

This website has been reported to Microsoft for containing threats to your computer that might reveal personal or financial information

Just in case any of you try to open it, I have had that warning for some unknown reason.

Edited January 23, 2012 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

If you can show me an account or even a photo of a gharial attacking live cattle, then you may have a point. But I also told you a gharial doesn't have enough power in its jaws to do that.

"The Nepali word घड़ा ghaṛā means earthenware pot, pitcher, watervessel"

Great, and the Dutch word "gaar" means "well-done"".

So?

++++

Young gharials eat insects, larvae, and small frogs. Mature adults feed almost solely on fish, although some individuals have been known to scavenge dead animals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gharial

.

Live cattle - why?

The OLB says 'putrid cattle' - I hardly think they are alive and kicking...

Nothing with word Gharial, just sayin...

and I showed you they do scavenge carcasses: However, the gharial may have swallowed this jewelry while scavenging corpses or as gastroliths used to aid digestion or buoyancy management

[Abramelin]

Live cattle - why?

The OLB says 'putrid cattle' - I hardly think they are alive and kicking...

Nothing with word Gharial, just sayin...

and I showed you they do scavenge carcasses: However, the gharial may have swallowed this jewelry while scavenging corpses or as gastroliths used to aid digestion or buoyancy management

Again:

tha aldergrâtesta âdiska sind al_gaettar hêten, thrvchdam se yvin grûsich bitte an thet rotte kwik, that mith-a strâma fon boppa nêi tha delta dryweth as an thet lêvande kwik that se bigâna müge.

de allergrootste eidechsen zijn 'al_gaettar' geheten, doordat zij even gretig bijten aan het rotte vee dat met-de stroom van boven naa de delta drijft, als aan het levende vee, dat ze passeren ("(voor)bijgaan") mogen.

the largest are called alligators, because they bite as greedily at the putrid cattle that float along the stream from above down to the delta as well as at the living cattle they may pass.

[The Puzzler]

Yeah yeah, I see it - as the living cattle they pass...give me 5.

[Otharus]

"The Nepali word घड़ा ghaṛā means earthenware pot, pitcher, watervessel"

Great, and the Dutch word "gaar" means "well-done"".

The dutch verb (ver-) garen means to collect...

[Abramelin]

The dutch verb (ver-) garen means to collect...

Yeah, we had that already, "gather".

But crocs and gators are not just 'collectors', right?

[The Puzzler]

I concede I can't actually locate any info about whether they (Gharials or larger different extinct alligators) sometimes ate living cattle in India over 2000 years ago, I'd think it could happen though. The largest grow to around 6 metres.

Nevertheless, everything else points to this al-gatter imo being some kind of Gharial that lived at that time.

[Otharus]

... thet rotte kwik... thet lêvande kwik.

... het rotte vee... het levende vee

... the putrid cattle... the living cattle

KWIK = vee/ cattle is a free interpretation

IMO the word just means animals (big or small).

Not only the word cow (dutch koe) might be derived from it, but also kuiken (baby chicken).

[Abramelin]

KWIK = vee/ cattle is a free interpretation

IMO the word just means animals (big or small).

Not only the word cow (dutch koe) might be derived from it, but also kuiken (baby chicken).

No, I already posted from a 19th century Old Frisian dictionary that "kwik" comes from "kuic" and it means quadrupedal cattle (= not fowl).

I found the meaning of the word "KWIK" :

Idioticon Frisicum. Friesch Latijnisch-Nederlandsch woordenboek, uit oude HSS

http://www.archive.org/stream/idioticonfrisic00hettgoog#page/n2/mode/1up

http://www.archive.org/stream/idioticonfrisic00hettgoog#page/n14/mode/1up

"kuic", pecus, vee. A.7.22: Fiarfote kuie, Viervoetig vee. (in English: "kuic", pecus, cattle. A.7.22: four-feeted cows/cattle, quadrupedal cattle).

"kuic" is "kwik".

It's on page 310 of the book, or page 172 of the online version I linked to.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

Gather.

All this etymology. I have said for ages now that gate is a very basic word, gat - hole, opening, that becomes gate, this word is used extensively in mythology and places like Troy, the gate, Garden of Eden, I think garden, garter and many other words all come from gate, hole. Gotland even. Labyrinths and such, they all have entrances, gates. Hades, another gatekeeper, I said it all before too.

The gathering of the 2 ends of the garter makes the hole, entrance by the gate. To collect the ends and join them.

It's like this: you pull something around and make a circle but it always has a gate, a gap, a closure that can open, think of a garter, a leg strap that you can flip open. Inside this is the leg, which is actually filling a round hole, the garden. The garden has a gate. Often circular, a wall goes around, inside this is the hole, the gap, even the castle/tower, surrounded by a moat and drawbridge, the concept is the same all through imo.

I am still convinced the word Gades/Gadir is gate. This area was the gate to the inside of the Med. Sea, which was a kind of harbour, as said by Plato, it's the garden - each time the concept is seen over and over imo.

Edited January 23, 2012 by The Puzzler

[Abramelin]

Here something from Latin:

latin quadrum [square], from quattuor [four]

Cadre: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cadre

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Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin

[Otharus]

No, I already posted from a 19th century Old Frisian dictionary that "kwik" comes from "kuic" and it means quadrupedal cattle (= not fowl).

But in the OLB the meaning is more general as in the creation myth:

JRTHA BÀRDE ... ALLET DJARA KWIK ÀND ALLE.T ÀRGE KWIK

Earth gave birth to all animals, dear and noxious.

It surely doesn't mean cattle here.

[Abramelin]

the glyph for crocodile is a picture of a crocodile and also represents the sound "msh". When writing the word for crocodile, the Ancient Egyptians combined a picture of a crocodile with the glyphs which spell out "msh".

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/egyptian.htm

And then this, from Sanskrit:

http://spokensanskrit.de/index.php?tinput= &direction=ES&script=&link=yes

( EDIT: the link doesn't direct to the page I got the list from, but simply enter "crocodile")

Recent entries into the dictionary:

मकरी makarI f. crocodile

नक्र nakra m. crocodile

गुंभीर guMbhIra m. crocodile

गोमुख gomukha m. crocodile

कुम्भीर kumbhIra m. crocodile

मकर makara m. crocodile

आलास्य AlAsya m. crocodile

कुम्भील kumbhIla m. crocodile

कुम्भिन् kumbhin m. crocodile

कुटिचर kuTicara m. crocodile

गिलग्राह gilagrAha m. crocodile

ग्रह graha m. crocodile

जलजिह्व jalajihva m. crocodile

जलकण्टक jalakaNTaka m. crocodile

जलसूकर jalasUkara m. crocodile

तालुजिह्व tAlujihva m. crocodile

महामुख mahAmukha m. crocodile

मायाद mAyAda m. crocodile

शङ्कुमुख zaGkumukha m. crocodile

ह्रदग्रह hradagraha m. crocodile

द्विधागति dvidhAgati m. crab or crocodile

गजनक्र gajanakra m. elephant-crocodile

नरग्राह naragrAha m. murdered-crocodile

अपहार apahAra m. shark or a crocodile

दीर्घवच्छिका dIrghavacchikA f. crocodile or alligator

दीर्घवर्छिका dIrghavarchikA f. crocodile or alligator

कुम्भीर kumbhIra m. crocodile of the Ganges

अम्बुसूकर ambusUkara m. kind of porcine crocodile

ग्राह grAha m. rapacious animal living in water [ crocodile , shark , serpent , alligator ]

ग्राही grAhI f. female marine animal or crocodile

मातंगनक्र mAtaMganakra m. crocodile as large as an elephant

.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Abramelin