Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Persia

Who's Afraid of Shariah ?

1,007 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

shadowhive

This whole topic of homosexuality has been waaaay OVER discussed...but I can finish it in one short saying ' Adam and EVE not Adam and STEVE'

That completely covers how Muslims feel about gays. End of story. Muslims aren't going to change their minds, they cant be retaught, or relearned and they will never accept homosexuality. If that upsets you, makes you sad, forces you to be mad, or even makes you feel suicidal...oh well, get over it.

There are so many other wonderful debates that we could be reading!! For example: why Islam doesn't accept homosexuality....OH WAIT>>>> OH MY GAAAWWWD>>> WE ALREADY HAVE 62 BLOODY PAGES OF THAT!!!!

Seriously...62 pages of this is just plain riDONKulous...can we pleeeeeaseeeee NEVER go back to the subject again for the love of God/Allah/buddah/krishna/jehovah/Bhagwaan/rama/Yahweh/Shen/and of course PETE!!!

Thank you!

Since Adam and Eve never existed that's a pretty pointless thing to say.

Sorry, but maybe if someone was prejudiced against you on the basis that you were American or a woman you would want to find out why and try and change their minds. It upsets me because it's that sort of thinking that leads to prejudice and bullying and, since I was bullied by people for those reasons I want it to stop. Gay people have it pretty riugh anyway and I can imagine that for a gay Muslim it's that much rougher.

The belief gains nothing and it's pretty stupid. If we stop trying to get them to change then we may as give up. It's not as if I'm trying to say 'there's nothing wrong with killing people'.

Edited by shadowhive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

This whole topic of homosexuality has been waaaay OVER discussed...but I can finish it in one short saying ' Adam and EVE not Adam and STEVE'

Ohh that was so funny I FORGOT to laugh :rolleyes:

If that upsets you, makes you sad, forces you to be mad, or even makes you feel suicidal...oh well, get over it.

If sheer hate and ignorance was bliss...you'd be in heaven :sleepy: Edited by Beckys_Mom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

Ohh that was so funny I FORGOT to laugh :rolleyes:

If sheer hate and ignorance was bliss...you'd be in heaven :sleepy:

Oh that's funny coming from you.....you are in that bliss.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

Shadow, you saying that's it's ok to try and change muslin opinion, therefore majority religious opinion and majority of the global population. Where do you draw the line?

I am drawing the line in this now. Both views are clear on homosexuality, move on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

Oh that's funny coming from you.....you are in that bliss.

There is a differnce between my posts and posts from someone plost up sheer hate for gays and mocking them like she did....If I see anyone do it again...i''lll soon have the mods in to sort it out...for Saru ( admin) has just warned off someone else for doing what she has done.....

And further more...you may well call my knowledge on your faith / culture as ignorance meaning I am not informed right....but I have never posted any hate for it....so like I said if I see it on here again...I'll soon have it all reported.... its unfair to mock and show hateful arrogance to a member of the forum all because they are gay <---I KNOW Saru and the mods wouldn't tolerate it....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

Shadow, you saying that's it's ok to try and change muslin opinion, therefore majority religious opinion and majority of the global population. Where do you draw the line?

I am drawing the line in this now. Both views are clear on homosexuality, move on.

Since no one gains anything from it I don't see the point in it. As I said, it benefits no one. It does lead to suffering which is pretty pointless if you ask me. It says a lot about you that you're perfectly fine clinging to it.

The majority opinion is such because of religion in the first place. Religion decided it was a sin, religion bought that belief into law. As such for centuries it was, unchallenged. Only now is it being challenged and things are changing. The fact that you don't want things to change says a lot about you too and the rigidity and depth of your dogma. The fact that religion does says a lot about it's need to control above all else.

But claerly this is something you won't change on unless you have real proof. Oh wait, you'd dismiss that too if it disagreed with your faith. Ah well, guess you'll have to wait to ask god it's opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
markprice

Oh no I won't present it via PM only, I just want your criterion by PM so when I present my proof, and it complies with criterion and proves you wrong, if you change your colours then I can expose you by showing what you said you will use as criterion for judgment.

I won't hold my breath, because like said you would not know what proof is even if it was slapping you in the face.

You're just stalling. spit out the "ultimate truth" that you claim to have found in your religion or it is obvious you are lying. (the criterion being that it is the ultimate truth).

Get it slappy? Truth will judge whatever proof you provide; put up or shut up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

There is a differnce between my posts and posts from someone plost up sheer hate for gays and mocking them like she did....If I see anyone do it again...i''lll soon have the mods in to sort it out...for Saru ( admin) has just warned off someone else for doing what she has done.....

And further more...you may well call my knowledge on your faith / culture as ignorance meaning I am not informed right....but I have never posted any hate for it....so like I said if I see it on here again...I'll soon have it all reported.... its unfair to mock and show hateful arrogance to a member of the forum all because they are gay <---I KNOW Saru and the mods wouldn't tolerate it....

Hollow accusation becky. You don't get a dialogue of 62 pages on homosexuality if one is being offensive, so don't BS for sake of further your own argument agenda. If you accuse me falsely one more time I will report you!

I have not shown any offence to any homosexuals or anyone for that matter. If showing that you lack sufficient knowledge on Islam is offensive, then I'm sorry but it's still factual. Plus your admitted it yourself, yet you have mocked, made outrageous statement with no substantiations at all. The sheer audacity to accuse me of homophobia is baseless. 62 pages to show where I have been offensive. You have called many people ignorant and righly so about evolution and other scientific phenomena, just further up you have implied another member is ignorant. So please apply your own standards fairly, you have made several attempts to derail the thread and make it about you or homosexuality but it's not, so stick to the topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

You're just stalling. spit out the "ultimate truth" that you claim to have found in your religion or it is obvious you are lying. (the criterion being that it is the ultimate truth).

Get it slappy? Truth will judge whatever proof you provide; put up or shut up.

What is your criterion, PM me it and I will do the rest. How will you judge and determine the truth value of what I provide. When you do this I will provide proof but not on this thread I will create one, I know you are trying to derail the thread.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

Hollow accusation becky. You don't get a dialogue of 62 pages on homosexuality if one is being offensive, so don't BS for sake of further your own argument agenda. If you accuse me falsely one more time I will report you!

I have not shown any offence to any homosexuals or anyone for that matter. If showing that you lack sufficient knowledge on Islam is offensive, then I'm sorry but it's still factual. Plus your admitted it yourself, yet you have mocked, made outrageous statement with no substantiations at all. The sheer audacity to accuse me of homophobia is baseless. 62 pages to show where I have been offensive. You have called many people ignorant and righly so about evolution and other scientific phenomena, just further up you have implied another member is ignorant. So please apply your own standards fairly, you have made several attempts to derail the thread and make it about you or homosexuality but it's not, so stick to the topic.

I think she was saying that to rationalchaos as opposed to you though.

I can say you've not gone out of the way to be intentionally offensive, which is better then some people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

Since no one gains anything from it I don't see the point in it. As I said, it benefits no one. It does lead to suffering which is pretty pointless if you ask me. It says a lot about you that you're perfectly fine clinging to it.

The majority opinion is such because of religion in the first place. Religion decided it was a sin, religion bought that belief into law. As such for centuries it was, unchallenged. Only now is it being challenged and things are changing. The fact that you don't want things to change says a lot about you too and the rigidity and depth of your dogma. The fact that religion does says a lot about it's need to control above all else.

But claerly this is something you won't change on unless you have real proof. Oh wait, you'd dismiss that too if it disagreed with your faith. Ah well, guess you'll have to wait to ask god it's opinion.

I suppose it's the religious values of the atheists and secularists in our own current society that don't accept it too, tolerate it yes. Even in your own way of life and system you struggle to change opinion, sort your own doorstep first before you go around the world imposing your view.

As for proof, that's it real proof may change my mind, real proof.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beckys_Mom

Hollow accusation becky. You don't get a dialogue of 62 pages on homosexuality if one is being offensive, so don't BS for sake of further your own argument agenda. If you accuse me falsely one more time I will report you!

I have not shown any offence to any homosexuals or anyone for that matter. If showing that you lack sufficient knowledge on Islam is offensive, then I'm sorry but it's still factual. Plus your admitted it yourself, yet you have mocked, made outrageous statement with no substantiations at all. The sheer audacity to accuse me of homophobia is baseless. 62 pages to show where I have been offensive. You have called many people ignorant and righly so about evolution and other scientific phenomena, just further up you have implied another member is ignorant. So please apply your own standards fairly, you have made several attempts to derail the thread and make it about you or homosexuality but it's not, so stick to the topic.

I have read your defences on homosexuality.. and I don't class it as hate...therefor I see no need to report it....you may act like a wag and get on peoples nerves ..but you are not posting sheer hate for the sake of it and I havent seen you mock people for their life style.... trust me I speak my mind and i'll call it how I see it...... What she did was sheer mocking and ignorance poking fun at gays... the adam and steve joke is an old homophobic joke...only ever told out of spite to annoy gays...and her words on how Shaddow may feel sucidal ect was just OTT...uncalled for................so like I said if I see it again..I wont say a word on here...i'll just report it, for I know it is not tolerated on here...some would just report it and say nothing...I don't I at least let the person know 1st to see if they will pipe down on their arrogant posts....

Put it this way ...If I came on here mocking religious people showing hate for them..out of sheer badness... I wouldn't expect anyone to tolerate it..... I can joke around and post away, even if you think my info is misinformed... I am not breaking any rules.......I just can't stand hate towards others for no good reason

Edited by Beckys_Mom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
markprice

What is your criterion, PM me it and I will do the rest. How will you judge and determine the truth value of what I provide. When you do this I will provide proof but not on this thread I will create one, I know you are trying to derail the thread.

cri·te·ri·on   /kraɪˈtɪəriən/

–noun,

a standard of judgment or criticism; a rule or principle for evaluating or testing something.

TRUTH is my CRITERION.

If you can't handle the truth I would not be surprised.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

I suppose it's the religious values of the atheists and secularists in our own current society that don't accept it too, tolerate it yes. Even in your own way of life and system you struggle to change opinion, sort your own doorstep first before you go around the world imposing your view.

As for proof, that's it real proof may change my mind, real proof.

Like I said it's getting there. Compared to just a century ago things have improved greatly so I'm certain it's only amount of time.

Yeah, which is why I hope for it.

Of course it'd be a double edged sword. If there is (for example) a gay gene then religions would soon change opinions on abortion. And, of course, the religious would could just as easily say 'look it has a cause! It's a disease! Let's get rid of it'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

cri·te·ri·on   /kraɪˈtɪəriən/

–noun,

a standard of judgment or criticism; a rule or principle for evaluating or testing something.

TRUTH is my CRITERION.

If you can't handle the truth I would not be surprised.

What is your truth? How will you evaluate and test that truth to determine the truth value?

I'm still waiting on the writing of Moses hermes and Thoth and their accuracy on origin of the universe.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

Like I said it's getting there. Compared to just a century ago things have improved greatly so I'm certain it's only amount of time.

Yeah, which is why I hope for it.

Of course it'd be a double edged sword. If there is (for example) a gay gene then religions would soon change opinions on abortion. And, of course, the religious would could just as easily say 'look it has a cause! It's a disease! Let's get rid of it'.

You lost me now?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

You lost me now?

Ok I'll say it again. Again, this is an example.

If there's a gay gene discovered then that would be proof that homosexuality is natural.

So basically on of three things would happen in religious terms.

1: Religions accept this as natural and all the dogmatic 'being gay is a sin' starts to truly go away.

2: Religion will ignore it (you've said Islam will do this) and act like nothing's changed.

3: Religion will take and use it.

It's option three that is the thing that worries me. At the moment Christianity is against abortion unless there's some sort of complication. Christians then could use science and do dna tests of babies in the womb. If the kid has the gay gene, abort it.

Alternately they could say 'well, there's diseases which are genetic so that proves nothing'. In that case they'd hijack science and search for something to eradicate the gay gene. You don't have to accept homosexuals if you destroy them after all.

Those are, of course worst case scenarios but I think it demonstrates my point.

I'm optimistic that religion would have the common sense not to do that and would accept it, however religion isn't often known for that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lion6969

Ok I'll say it again. Again, this is an example.

If there's a gay gene discovered then that would be proof that homosexuality is natural.

So basically on of three things would happen in religious terms.

1: Religions accept this as natural and all the dogmatic 'being gay is a sin' starts to truly go away.

2: Religion will ignore it (you've said Islam will do this) and act like nothing's changed.

3: Religion will take and use it.

It's option three that is the thing that worries me. At the moment Christianity is against abortion unless there's some sort of complication. Christians then could use science and do dna tests of babies in the womb. If the kid has the gay gene, abort it.

Alternately they could say 'well, there's diseases which are genetic so that proves nothing'. In that case they'd hijack science and search for something to eradicate the gay gene. You don't have to accept homosexuals if you destroy them after all.

Those are, of course worst case scenarios but I think it demonstrates my point.

I'm optimistic that religion would have the common sense not to do that and would accept it, however religion isn't often known for that.

I think it would be sad if that happened, but no 2 is incorrect. It's not that I would ignore it, it's the fact that I don't think it will ever be proven. That's my opinion only.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

I think it would be sad if that happened, but no 2 is incorrect. It's not that I would ignore it, it's the fact that I don't think it will ever be proven. That's my opinion only.

I agree. To be honest I think it's pretty sad that it needs that level of proof to change things to begin with.

Like I said, I'm optimistic it will happen. The fact is that because the natural cause could be anything from a gene to something in the brain to a homone imbalance there's all these different things that have to be covered.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
markprice

What is your truth? How will you evaluate and test that truth to determine the truth value?

I'm still waiting on the writing of Moses hermes and Thoth and their accuracy on origin of the universe.

See now you are just BSing about truth semantics etc. to avoid the issue...endless deflections(for circular arguments) or why not just back up your claims without unnecessary preconditions(you can't do it; it was all BS wasn't it?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rationalchaos

There is a differnce between my posts and posts from someone plost up sheer hate for gays and mocking them like she did....If I see anyone do it again...i''lll soon have the mods in to sort it out...for Saru ( admin) has just warned off someone else for doing what she has done.....

And further more...you may well call my knowledge on your faith / culture as ignorance meaning I am not informed right....but I have never posted any hate for it....so like I said if I see it on here again...I'll soon have it all reported.... its unfair to mock and show hateful arrogance to a member of the forum all because they are gay <---I KNOW Saru and the mods wouldn't tolerate it....

If you read what I wrote with more of an open mindand a bit less anger- you would see that I am not hating on anyone. But it's funny that YOU would accuse me of such a thing when I write a post that was done in humour, while you write posts that are done in anger and resentment. But I reckon you'll find an excuse for yourself...as you, and others on here often do.

It amazes me that you can say all sorts and show your hatred towards anyone of your choice, and I do believe that you were the one that used the word 'bashing' when referring to this entire thread (Forgive me if I'm wrong) and yet I refer to the ENTIRE subject in humour...and now I'm arrogant, racist, ignorant and hateful.

Awww...I forgot, it must be because I'm muslim that you would make THOSE kind of comments! (the same shoe YOU wear fits fine on me when I want to make a baseless point!)

So let me make it a bit more simple for those of you (who say I'm ignorant)- YOU CAN ARGUE ALL YOU WANT- YOU CAN DENY IT ALL YOU WANT- YOU CAN BE UPSET- YOU CAN DISAGREE- YOU CAN TRY TO CONVINCE OTHERWISE>>>>> BUT THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT ISLAM, AND THEREFORE MUSLIMS WILL NEVER ACCEPT, BELIEVE, APPRECIATE, ENCOURAGE, RECOGNIZE, ALLOW OR CONDONE HOMOSEXUALITY.

If we lived in a Shariah state, which we dont,then you are fully aware of the punishment for it. But beings how I suspect that you will NEVER live in a shariah state or country- then you have NOTHING to worry about!

After 40+ pages of evidence, links, words of wisdom as well as stupidity, arguing, attempted humour, accusations, anger and every other emotion...I agree with Lion, it needs to end. In fact I would go so far as to say the entire thread needs to end, because it seems obvious that nothing to gain is being sought by very few people who want to prove that Islam is a horrible religion, with horrible people who follow it that are either ignorant beyond the point of rescue, or have been brainwashed, or who just follow blindly because 'we dont get it'.

And feel free to contact the mods love, might be better to get them involved and get us all banned...as I wont be the only one!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rationalchaos

I have read your defences on homosexuality.. and I don't class it as hate...therefor I see no need to report it....you may act like a wag and get on peoples nerves ..but you are not posting sheer hate for the sake of it and I havent seen you mock people for their life style.... trust me I speak my mind and i'll call it how I see it...... What she did was sheer mocking and ignorance poking fun at gays... the adam and steve joke is an old homophobic joke...only ever told out of spite to annoy gays...and her words on how Shaddow may feel sucidal ect was just OTT...uncalled for................so like I said if I see it again..I wont say a word on here...i'll just report it, for I know it is not tolerated on here...some would just report it and say nothing...I don't I at least let the person know 1st to see if they will pipe down on their arrogant posts....

Put it this way ...If I came on here mocking religious people showing hate for them..out of sheer badness... I wouldn't expect anyone to tolerate it..... I can joke around and post away, even if you think my info is misinformed... I am not breaking any rules.......I just can't stand hate towards others for no good reason

Well lets set this straight Becky's mom...beings how you seem to be the speaker for Shadow now...At NO POINT did I see a post from Shadow saying that he felt suicidal, it could have been easily overlooked in the many many many posts relating to this subject. If in fact that is how Shadow feels, then my sincere apologies to SHADOW for an offhand comment that was only trying to bring a bit of humour to a subject that has gone way overboard. Suicide is not something to be joked about, and is not taken lightly in Islam. It would have been better to leave it completely off my previous comment.

Don't accuse me of something that was not intended Beckys mom, and dont make it a bigger deal than it is in order to feel righteous. And just because you KNOW an admin personally, or indicate that you do, doesn't give you the right to swing that info like a judgmental hammer.

Once again, SHADOW, my apologies for making such an off hand remark about suicide. If you truly feel suicidal then I would honestly seek some advice- debating in here with people who don't agree with you might make you feel worse, but I hope not. I am not shallow enough not to care when someone is hurt by my comments.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

If you read what I wrote with more of an open mindand a bit less anger- you would see that I am not hating on anyone. But it's funny that YOU would accuse me of such a thing when I write a post that was done in humour, while you write posts that are done in anger and resentment. But I reckon you'll find an excuse for yourself...as you, and others on here often do.

It amazes me that you can say all sorts and show your hatred towards anyone of your choice, and I do believe that you were the one that used the word 'bashing' when referring to this entire thread (Forgive me if I'm wrong) and yet I refer to the ENTIRE subject in humour...and now I'm arrogant, racist, ignorant and hateful.

Awww...I forgot, it must be because I'm muslim that you would make THOSE kind of comments! (the same shoe YOU wear fits fine on me when I want to make a baseless point!)

So let me make it a bit more simple for those of you (who say I'm ignorant)- YOU CAN ARGUE ALL YOU WANT- YOU CAN DENY IT ALL YOU WANT- YOU CAN BE UPSET- YOU CAN DISAGREE- YOU CAN TRY TO CONVINCE OTHERWISE>>>>> BUT THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT ISLAM, AND THEREFORE MUSLIMS WILL NEVER ACCEPT, BELIEVE, APPRECIATE, ENCOURAGE, RECOGNIZE, ALLOW OR CONDONE HOMOSEXUALITY.

If we lived in a Shariah state, which we dont,then you are fully aware of the punishment for it. But beings how I suspect that you will NEVER live in a shariah state or country- then you have NOTHING to worry about!

After 40+ pages of evidence, links, words of wisdom as well as stupidity, arguing, attempted humour, accusations, anger and every other emotion...I agree with Lion, it needs to end. In fact I would go so far as to say the entire thread needs to end, because it seems obvious that nothing to gain is being sought by very few people who want to prove that Islam is a horrible religion, with horrible people who follow it that are either ignorant beyond the point of rescue, or have been brainwashed, or who just follow blindly because 'we dont get it'.

And feel free to contact the mods love, might be better to get them involved and get us all banned...as I wont be the only one!

If there's one thing I've learned it's that the punishment isn't as clear cut as we're led to believe. As Lion himself would say, those states that we consider to be under shariah dole out the punishments of hanging and stoning far easier then they should. Under a true shariah state they'd be given the option of leaving the country which, while I don't particularly agree with it, it's an option much preferable to death and a person would take it given the option.

The fact that homosexuality does exist, even in places where it is illegal or death is the punishment, says a lot for it though.

I won't say it never will though. If you said even a century ago that homosexuality would be legal anywhere most people would have said never to that too and yet here we are. Although it is established that it'd take some natural cause to be found to get them to change their minds, which I find pretty sad to begin with, because I know exactly where the 'homosexuality is a sin' way of thinking leads.

But hey, that doesn't matter really right?

Well lets set this straight Becky's mom...beings how you seem to be the speaker for Shadow now...At NO POINT did I see a post from Shadow saying that he felt suicidal, it could have been easily overlooked in the many many many posts relating to this subject. If in fact that is how Shadow feels, then my sincere apologies to SHADOW for an offhand comment that was only trying to bring a bit of humour to a subject that has gone way overboard. Suicide is not something to be joked about, and is not taken lightly in Islam. It would have been better to leave it completely off my previous comment.

Don't accuse me of something that was not intended Beckys mom, and dont make it a bigger deal than it is in order to feel righteous. And just because you KNOW an admin personally, or indicate that you do, doesn't give you the right to swing that info like a judgmental hammer.

Once again, SHADOW, my apologies for making such an off hand remark about suicide. If you truly feel suicidal then I would honestly seek some advice- debating in here with people who don't agree with you might make you feel worse, but I hope not. I am not shallow enough not to care when someone is hurt by my comments.

You're right of course, suicide is nothing to joke about. Just consider yourself lucky I've not lost anyone I care about to it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
saifallah

What is your truth? How will you evaluate and test that truth to determine the truth value?

I'm still waiting on the writing of Moses hermes and Thoth and their accuracy on origin of the universe.

bro i think i have the truth here, this is a qoute from a medical magazine, " *spam filter* is the sine qua non of sex for many gay men. Yet human physiology makes it clear that the body was not designed to accommodate this activity." I think this pretty much explains it, homosexuality is not normal and it should not be accepted by society today. There are so many dieses linked to homosexuality its not funny. have a look at this link. http://www.corporateresourcecouncil.org/white_papers/Health_Risks.pdf

For me this proves it all. This is why in islam homosexuality is not allowed. After you read this how can anyone debate it, IT IS NOT RIGHT!!! The anus is used to expel fecal matter not to accomodate any part of anyones body, there is an exit only system in place here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shadowhive

bro i think i have the truth here, this is a qoute from a medical magazine, " *spam filter* is the sine qua non of sex for many gay men. Yet human physiology makes it clear that the body was not designed to accommodate this activity." I think this pretty much explains it, homosexuality is not normal and it should not be accepted by society today. There are so many dieses linked to homosexuality its not funny. have a look at this link. http://www.corporateresourcecouncil.org/white_papers/Health_Risks.pdf

For me this proves it all. This is why in islam homosexuality is not allowed. After you read this how can anyone debate it, IT IS NOT RIGHT!!! The anus is used to expel fecal matter not to accomodate any part of anyones body, there is an exit only system in place here.

Considering Lion was on about the truth value of Islam in the quote you're using what you're saying has no point.

It's also both irrelevent and quite stupid. Again it's caught up on the act and missing the point entirely.

Edited by shadowhive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.